Why Arsenal fans shouldn’t covet Stan’s personal investment right now

by & filed under News Review.

Mikel Arteta explaining to Mustafi that his pay cut will be 20%

Arsenal players appear to have leaked to David Ornstein that the split in the dressing room is 13/14 in favor of rejection of the 12.5% pay cut. Mikel Arteta has apparently stepped in to try and convince players that they should do the right thing and work with the club to form a united front.

The leak looks like a defensive tactic to show the fans that the negotiations are ongoing, and they are close.

UPDATE: Players are basically there on the deal. WOOOOO!

The process has to speed up. It shouldn’t need to be handed over to the PFA. It shouldn’t need the input of the fans. Players should accept the small sacrifice for the greater good and hope the world returns to normal so we can finish the season and stop having this conversation (I do fear what the conversastion will be when this is over).

One argument that people keep sending my way is this.

‘STAN SHOULD PAY OUT OF HIS OWN POCKET’

I’m always happy to give the KSE org a textual boot up the arse. They’ve run Arsenal in uninterested fashion for many years, of that there is no doubt, but overall, they’re kind of the type of owners that we’d hoped for. They let the board spend what they earn, they don’t fuck about with the day to day, and they let the people at the club do their thing.

The problem is we’ve trusted people that have severely lacked in the vision department. Ivan G was weak for 10 years, letting Wenger do his thing while he reaped the big dollars on the sidelines. However, the club invested in a great ‘on paper’ plan when Wenger left… but again, they gave it to Gazidis who didn’t follow it through. He ducked to Milan at the first chance and left a huge power vacuum that was filled by… a two CEO type system. Sven was murdered. We scuttled about at the bottom of the barrel with a shite manager for 18months, ran a transfer window with no Technical Director, and no real leadership.

Outside that, Stan has been great.

Back on the topic of Stan forking out.

There are two ways that you can have your football club run.

The self-sustaining model. Spend what you earn. Leave the operation to work like a business.

This works for Liverpool. It’s now working for Chelsea. It works sublimely for Manchester United (cash wise).

Or, you can have the billionaire plaything model. That means your club is run like a hobby. Owners do as they please, they get involved in decisions, they pump cash into the system, they get the club banned from the Champions League, or they let a super-agent run the show. Things are run badly. Manchester City cheat. PSG are run by the players. Wolves do odd things. Both have murky ownership structures BUT the fans could not be angry if the owners took money out of the club. They did a deal with the devil. That’s their hateful pact and the consquences are theirs.

Stan runs us as a self-sustaining model. The deal is that he doesn’t put his own money in during the good times and he doesn’t take out during the bad.

In fact, he took £3m out the club for ‘fees’ during the bad times and the fans LOST THEIR SHIT. Rightly so. We are not a piggybank. He never did it again. He leaves it to run like any other property in his portfolio of businesses.

That’s why he’s not going to fund the players right now. That’s why Raul and Vinnai are reworking the operation to survive a period of very little revenue. That is how it should be.

Let’s get one thing straight, the club does not have to pay non-sport workers. They could bin them all off because they are not producing right now. Stan hasn’t allowed that, Vinnai hasn’t, Raul hasn’t. They are supporting the staff within the means of the club. That means taking from the fabulously rich (players/execs/coaches) to support the not so rich.

This is the correct approach.

Normal businesses are doing this the world over. Higher earners lose more of their pay-cheque to keep lower earners in the job. Bonuses are disappearing. Exec leadership are foregoing pay.

Arsenal is no different. The players are just employees. No one cares that they have short careers. Long careers don’t earn normal people £230m between 40 people. 12.5% is not affecting your pension plan. It’s not going to see anyone default on their mortgage. It’s a very, very small price to pay in the grand scheme of world football, and it’s a drop in the ocean compared to what players in Italy, Germany and Spain are dealing with.

I am firmly with Arsenal’s exec leadership here. This is a generous offer. Players should take it.

I think they will because they are good humans.

One piece of good news is that it seems absolute that the season will finish. It’ll be behind closed doors, but hopefully it’ll be on TV. Fingers crossed.

Right, see you in the comments. x

 

98 Responses to “Why Arsenal fans shouldn’t covet Stan’s personal investment right now”

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  1. Dissenter

    If I were Stan, I wouldn’t put a penny down to compensate well compensated players for services they didn’t render.
    In other walks of life, people are getting hair cuts whether hey like it or not. Why is football any different?
    Even billionaires have seen much of their financial worth deprecate. Emirates Airlines, one of our biggest commercial partner has 95% of her fleet parked away.
    It’s laughable reading some requesting thay Kroenke to channel his money to the club to make sure that players keep getting their 100% wages. Life doesn’t work like that.

  2. James wood

    “ I think they will because they are good human beings.”
    “Well 13 of them are.”
    A fractured squad causes problems.
    Or was it a secret squirrel vote.

  3. Andy1886

    Good news that the season will finish? Why is it good news? Would rather write this one off and get everything in place so that next season is set up & able to run more or less on schedule.

  4. Tom

    I think the players are underestimating the size of fan backlash this will create against a struggling Arsenal side when the season finally resumes, and they will struggle.
    I would imagine the group of players vetoing this wage cut are either looking to get out, are thought of as surplus to requirements, or in last year of contracts.
    Either way, the fans will let them know in due time how they feel about a bunch of entitled fuck ups that couldn’t beat a Greek club valued at 80 m.

  5. billp79

    spot on Dissenter
    even the courts would eventually rule in the owner’s favor should the players feel the need to seek legal action….

  6. Hitman

    Players (not just AFC) are a disgrace. Modern day leeches.
    Govt needs to look at employments laws pertaining to player salaries and contract. It needs to be much easier to sack players and managers who are not making it mid contract. The pay and pay offs for failure is obscene. Football industry is bleeding money.
    No one benefits other than the mercenary players managers and agents. Fans and clubs have lost out
    The gravy train has to stop.
    Leaves a bad taste in modern society.
    Many of these players are less than average.

  7. billp79

    they are toying with the owners ‘good will’….mike ashley would have sack them all already…. would have made a clean slate for the new incoming regime (who would have been appreciative of him doing the hard part for them).

  8. billp79

    All it takes is the PL governing body to tell all clubs that their contracted players need to take a 20% reduction in pay…5% to cover their support staff wages…
    reimbursable if the season continues and there is no loss in game day or tv revenue…

  9. Marc

    “All it takes is the PL governing body to tell all clubs that their contracted players need to take a 20% reduction in pay”

    That’s only legally binding if it’s part of the PL membership rulebook so to speak.

    What we will see and it could be on a PL level, European level or even wider is a standard clause integrated into all future player contracts that allows for a reduction in salary under force majeure circumstances.

  10. Dissenter

    Marc
    “What we will see and it could be on a PL level, European level or even wider is a standard clause integrated into all future player contracts that allows for a reduction in salary under force majeure circumstances.”

    I think this is largely a premier league problem
    The buiggest clubs in Europe have worked with their players to accept a pay cut; Barca, Juve, Real, Bayern.
    It’s not an issue of contractual clauses. It’s more of leadership to face players head, open the books to them and work something out. The larger business world is shut down. I just read that only 300 passengers flew out of Hong Kong’s international airport in March [more flew in]- that’s the level of depression in global commerce.
    I suspect that there are force majuere or ‘act of god’ circumstances that can be cited to force negotiations.

  11. Marc

    Dissenter

    Amazed by the numbers flying out of Hong Kong – obviously knew numbers were down but that’s only what 2 planes worth if full.

    With regard to citing circumstances I’m not sure that’d stand up in court and if the players wanted to force the issue they’ll be able to afford top legal minds and the clubs could find themselves overwhelmed by the number of claims.

    Of course it would be better for everyone if this was seen to be done in harmony etc but modern players are mercenary’s – you can’t hire mercenary’s and then be surprised by their actions.

  12. Sid

    We should expect a minimum of 60m from Ozil, Xhakalson and Mustafinovs since Arteta has “turned their fortunes”

    You heard it here 1st!

  13. Marc

    Sid

    Not sure we’ve got the money to pay someone £60 million to take them off of our hands but I’d be 100% behind the idea if we did!

  14. R.S.P.C.Arsenal

    Name n shame the fuckers..
    Got a feeling maybe some of the youngsters involved tho..

    That why I said should have been structured
    Up to 50k 2 percent
    Over 15.

  15. GunnerDNA

    Hector Bellerin is the player representative at Arsenal and Arteta is the head coach, so it’s understandable why the players are dragging their feet. An average player and a rookie coach have no clout to demand any respect. SK and Josh needs to sort this out sooner than later because it’s laughable, Arsenal is a big circus!

  16. dialsquarehank

    I dissent. You’re advocating continuing as a ‘self-sustaining model’, a part of KSE’s empire. This dooms us to continue struggling to finish in seventh or eighth place in the PL.
    I advocate encouraging KSE to sell AFC; we have never been a good match. There are Gooner billionaires out there who would relish the opportunity to own AFC. We really need a proactive, forward-thinking owner, someone who can lead us back to where we belong, at the head if the pack.
    I respectfully disagree with your well-presented argument.

  17. gnarleygeorge9

    You are my Arsenal,
    My only Arsenal,
    You make me happy,
    When skies are grey,
    You’ll never know just,
    How much I love you,
    So please don’t take my Arsenal away.

  18. Danny

    I saw another live match yesterday from Belarus. The standard’s not too bad and of course it’s a bit of a novelty to see live football nowadays. Tomorrow there are games at 17:30 and 19:30 so if you’ve nothing else to do, might as well check them out.

  19. Freddie Ljungberg

    “Even before the coronavirus pandemic, the Gunners were under significant pressure to reduce their inflated wage bill and there is a concern among the squad they are using the current climate to achieve their long-term pay plans. ”

    Probably wouldn’t be too difficult to name a couple of those with 100% accuracy.

    And no, it’s not because of Raul, or Emery, or Arteta that we have said inflated wage bill. Hint: he has a book coming out soon, that I’m guessing is going to be full of excuses.

  20. CG

    Barcelona 70% cuts agreed emphatically.
    Juventus 50% cuts agreed emphatically.
    Arsenal 12.5% cuts agreed dragging and screaming.

    Once again, illustrating the ineptitude of Arsenal ‘executive’ team( they have 14 of the buggers , remember)

    For all this fuss, these cuts just save the club a miserly £460 000 a week.

    (Which is far less than Ozil and Mikkis combined weekly wages )

    A minuscule amount in the big scheme of things, that will make no difference whatsoever- but will cause serious unforeseen consequences.

    Eg.

    A) No further player sales until players remunerated.

    B) No players receiving individual pay increasss, without causing serious internal player unrest.

    C) And proceeds of players sales to go back in the players pockets before spent on further players.

    The cuts needed had to be much more severe and similar to Juventus 50%….but our Dopes bottled it.
    Then the sacrifice would have been worth it.

    PS
    And has anyone told Saliba he is receiving a wage cut too?

    I bet he is well chuffed …

    No Champions League for the foreseeable future to aid his development and an instant pay cut on which he had no say in.

    There will be trouble Ahead!

  21. Pierre

    Fred
    “And no, it’s not because of Raul, or Emery, or Arteta that we have said inflated wage bill. Hint: he has a book coming out soon, that I’m guessing is going to be full of excuses.”

    It doesn’t take a genius to work out the reason why we went from under paying our players to over paying them.

    Losing Ashley Cole to Chelsea due to our refusal to pay him what he was worth was the start of it.
    Then city came along ( before they were successful) and took Adebayor, Nasri, Cliche , Toure.
    Barcelona took silvinio, Hleb, Song , Vermaelen on larger contracts which then led to RVP and Cesc rightfully questioning Arsenal’s ambition , so they departed.

    Losing more or less a whole team to city and Barcelona , and I haven’t included Henry and van Bronkhurst in that list, led to the decision to increase players wages so they wouldn’t be enticed away from the club and to enable us to compete and bring in top players like Sanchez and Ozil.

    To a degree the policy worked in that we brought in silverware on a regular basis when Ozil and Sanchez arrived.
    However, we awarded average players like Walcott, bentner, jenkinson , Gibbs etc larger contracts than they were worth ,plus we had a bad transfer window with the arrival of Xhaka, Mustafi and Perez who all arrived on big wages and long contracts which has hampered us at this present time.

    The club awarding Ozil his ridiculous contract has been another negative and probably led to the departure of Ramsey on a free as he was asking and maybe expecting parity or thereabouts with Ozil.

    What we need now is to find a balance in the wage structure and I do think we are improving in that area.
    However Fred, would you be prepared to lose players like Saka and Martinelli without complaint due to the club not paying their true worth.
    I can guarantee you that if we don’t pay them what they are worth , someone else will turn their heads ( if they haven’t already).

    There is also the possibility that we may pay Saka and Martinelli 150 grand a week on 5/6 year contracts and Saka becomes injury prone ( like wilshere) and Martinelli doesn’t live up to expectations ( like Walcott) and they end up costing the club fortunes.

    So Fred, just remember, no player is a certainty , you and the rest of the know nothing’s continually castigated Wenger for his loyalty to players like wilshere , Ramsey, RVP, Cazorla, Eduardo and Diaby who sadly were all beset by injuries often caused by lack of protection from referees.

    Wenger was rewarded for his loyalty with RVP and Ramsey but Wilshere and Diaby never quite managed to stay fit for any length of time.

  22. Freddie Ljungberg

    Pierre

    Showing your giant blind spot again when it comes to Wenger.

    Of course I want to pay Saka and Martinelli what they’re worth, that’s not 150k a month at this stage though. You would have a point about your whole Saka getting injury prone rant if we kept giving him new and increased contracts after he had already been injured constantly for years and years.

    CG

    You’re just an idiot. No clue whatsoever.

    456k a week for 12 months small change? That’s 23m saved you imbecile. Plus the 33+% from the execs salaries.
    Hardly peanuts.

    There are also bonus clauses in there if we qualify for Europe or CL, they will also get that money back if they get sold this summer.

    Stop pulling crap out of your crusty ass and throwing it on here to see if it sticks and try to actually understand what you’re talking about.

    I know, pipe dream.

  23. Marc

    Pierre

    Tell me how do the Spud’s keep their players when they don’t pay many anywhere like the type of money you are referring to?

    They have Kane and Ndombele on £200k per week – no other player earns over £150k per week and both of those deals are recent.

  24. Freddie Ljungberg

    Considering the fact that Arsenal so far is the only club that has agreed any wage cuts to players whatsoever (if it’s actually done) and all the other clubs players are still dragging their feet on deferrals it’s a bit moronic to to call our execs useless.

    Sure, more would have been better, but it is what it is in the PL.

    Dragging up players on loan and asking what they think about it is useless on the other hand since the loaning club pays all or most of their salary, Roma does with Mikhi at least, and there’s very little chance he’s coming back to the club so it won’t affect him.

  25. Marc

    CG once again whipping himself up into orgasmic delight at the unlikely prospect of Arsenal going bust and he calls himself a fan.

    Not so long ago Pedro was supporting CG as a poster, CG’s views haven’t changed the only thing that’s different is that he is no longer slagging off Emery.

  26. Marc

    Freddie

    What everyone needs to do with CG’s comments is to think what the response would be if they were copied and pasted into a Spud blog with the banner “been a Spur’s supporter since I was a boy”.

    You’d actually have some Spud’s supporters saying he was being extreme!

  27. Nelson

    “all the other clubs players are still dragging their feet on deferrals ”

    That’s because our wage bill is one of the highest in the league and we are not playing in the CL. Just look at our current league position, it is almost certain that we won’t be playing in the CL next season. All the star players don’t deserve their pay.

  28. Pierre

    Fred
    “Of course I want to pay Saka and Martinelli what they’re worth, that’s not 150k a month at this stage though. ”

    Slightly naive to think that they will sign for Arsenal at less than 150 grand a month when city , liverpool or united would pay them treble that amount…

    Saka is worth paying 100 grand a week now as he is potentially a £100 million player, we cannot afford to lose players of his quality.

  29. Pierre

    Fred
    “Tell me how do the Spud’s keep their players when they don’t pay many anywhere like the type of money you are referring to?”

    Eriksen….gone
    Kyle Walker…..gone
    Trippier ………….gone
    Danny Rose ……..gone
    Vertonghen …on his way , out of contract

    It starts with a slow trickle and then the damn bursts..

    It’s happening as we speak.

  30. Jamie

    £100k a week for Saka? Jesus Christ. A couple years ago we were paying Alexis £140k a week and he was banging in 30 goals a season from the left flank.

    Behave.

  31. Freddie Ljungberg

    Pierre.

    You backed away from your empty “but what if they’re injury prone” argument pretty pretty quick I see.

    Slightly naive to think we’re going to pay 150k a week to 2 19 year olds when we only have 4 players in the squad earning that or above and only Auba is actually earning it.

    Also highly doubtful Real or anyone else is going to put either on 450k a month.
    If that’s their plan we should demand a cool 200 mil from them.

    70-80k or thereabouts should be the ceiling, they both still have a lot to prove. Trickier with Saka since his contract is running down but Martinelli is on a long term contract so should be fine with a reasonable increase.

    Bob

    I think that was the collective voice of the universe you heard.

  32. CG

    “Tell me how do the Spud’s keep their players when they don’t pay many anywhere like the type of money you are referring to?”

    And tell me how one man- the peerless Arsene Wenger managed to win 3 league titles and 7 F Cups in 20 years and Spurs have won only 2 League titles and 8 F A Cups in 130 years?

    Folk question my Arsenal loyalty……

    you lot-have been undermining the club with your Wenger treachery for 15 years.

    Traitors Gate the lot of you- if you had my way,

    ( Pierre excepted off course)

  33. Tom

    Pierre
    You want to put a couple of eighteen year old prospects on 150k a week out of fear we might lose them to Liverpool or City?
    That’s crazy.

  34. Marc

    Pierre

    I agree with your comment in part but look at the players you’ve listed. How many of them were earning over £100k per week at the Spud’s? What was the age that they’ve moved on at?

    I agree that the Spud’s have under paid some of their players compared to what they could earn elsewhere but Saka (who I really rate) is in his break out season – going from zero (so to speak) to £150k per week is crazy. Players like Rose (who I’ve never rated) is / was on £60k per week, Trippier was on a similar amount.

    I don’t have the exact solution but the correct way forward is to have a gradient scheme where his salary goes up as he improves and becomes more established.

    Many of our wage issues go back to the Wenger / Gazidis axis (of evil!) and it’s telling that it was Sanllehi who stopped the humiliation of the club by a) pulling Ramsey’s contract when it was clear he was killing time to sign a pre contract over seas b) stopped the ridiculous notion of allowing a player who spends a third of every season injured from having to think about an offer in excess of £200k per week.

  35. Pierre

    Jamie
    “£100k a week for Saka? Jesus Christ. A couple years ago we were paying Alexis £140k a week and he was banging in 30 goals a season from the left flank.
    Behave.”

    It wouldnt surprise me if Saka already has a better goals and assists per minute ratio than Sanchez .

    And Saka played at LEFT BACK.

    Will add that Sanchez was quality in his time at the club before he had his head turned, something I’m sure he regrets as many have shown since they left the club.

  36. Marc

    Out of interest if Saka were to go to City or Liverpool what position would he play and would he be first choice in that position?

  37. Marc

    Pierre

    “Will add that Sanchez was quality in his time at the club before he had his head turned”

    You can’t put every player on crazy high wages because they might get their heads turned – the moment you do that I guarantee heads will be turning as a negotiating tactic.

    If a player who daft enough at 18 / 19 to risk damaging their long term career for short term gain there’s nothing you can do about it.

  38. Pierre

    Tom
    “Pierre
    You want to put a couple of eighteen year old prospects on 150k a week out of fear we might lose them to Liverpool or City?
    That’s crazy.”

    Did I say that…no

    Read my comments and I’m sure you will come to that conclusion.

    I did say I would pay Saka l00 grand a week because it’s a risk worth taking as we may lose him.
    Martinelli is already on a long contract so the need to increase is not so great.

  39. Pierre

    Marc
    “You can’t put every player on crazy high wages because they might get their heads turned”

    It’s not every player , it’s ONE player and a player who is coming into the last year of his contract and he is a player that we would be foolish to lose.

  40. Valentin

    The issue with Saka is that he and his agent know that he is an exceptional talent. There will be clubs willing to offer him any inflated salary especially if they can get him on a Bosman.
    So some may disagree that he is worth £150kpw, but the reality is that ManCity, ManUtd, Liverpool, Chelsea, Spurs do think so. He literally has the best clubs in the world ready to fight over him.
    If you were his agent, you would try to get as much money as possible from the club’s that would give the better progression prospect.
    Outside of money, the only argument in favour of Arsenal is Arteta and the proof with Sterling and Mane that he can improve players willing to do the hard graft into world beater.

  41. CG

    Jamie

    “”””£100k a week for Saka? Jesus Christ.
    A couple years ago we were paying Alexis £140k a week and he was banging in 30 goals a season from the left flank.
    Behave.”””””

    Remind me – who bought him again? And the reason a superstar like him wanted to join the club over Liverpool?

    It would not happen now that for sure.

    30 goals Alexis Sanchez goals a season.
    Only Wenger has got the best out of Sanchez.

    Remember that afternoon!

    Arsenal 3 Manchester United 0- after 10 minutes on the clock,

    Soccer played at a speed never even seen before in the UK.
    Dazzling!

    And still the Entitled Ones were not happy. ( like you)

    No wonder, we are in terminal decline….. you only have yourselves to blame.

  42. Marc

    Pierre

    I don’t want to lose the player and reports are he’s about to sign an extension (yes I know it’s the press!) but and forgetting the current situation if you put one player on a high salary it raises the bar for other offers as well.

    That’s my only point – I don’t know what our offer is but I’d offer a very good basic £70 – £80k per week that’s also heavily incentivised over 4 years with a written clause to review after 2 years.

    If Saka continues his current career trajectory he’ll be worth £150k per week in a couple of years – we’ve just got to be clever enough to balance paying him enough to keep him against suddenly finding ourselves with a one season wonder who’s got 3 or 4 years left on a contract worth £20 odd million.

  43. Freddie Ljungberg

    CG

    We’re in a temporary decline, caused by mismanagement of the squad, transfer and wages by Wenger, it will take time to fix because it permeated the whole club and nearly the whole squad needed purging, has to be done slower than we would like because of the crazy contracts and low value of many of the players though. We will get through it though because the right decisions are finally being made and the days of dithering are over.

    You just hope it’s terminal so you can feel justified in your hero worshipping of the man whose blow up doll you’re holding tight in your grubby little hands as your only friend and confidante. A bit sad really.

  44. Valentin

    Marc,

    Saka and his agent currently hold all the cards. Arsenal may offer him all you discussed, but he may demand £150kpw and refuse to sign for less.
    What Arsenal do then?
    Do nothing and hope that he sign next season?
    What would you do if ManUtd were to offer £10 millions for him in the TW?
    Is it worth losing him for nothing next season?

  45. Tom

    If Saka has his head screwed on right money will be important to him only to a certain extent at this moment.
    Having the right environment for developing his talent and adequate playing time should take priority over a huge pay increase and maximizing his salary at this moment.
    Would he get minutes at City or Liverpool right now?
    Doubtful.
    United? Maybe, but highly risky as well.
    That leaves Chelsea and Tottenham and we all know how piss poor Mourinho’s record has been developing young talent.
    That leaves Chelsea and Lampard then and Chelsea don’t throw money at players the way they used to , so why would he risk stalling his career in a sideways move when he’s got a good thing going with Arteta.
    Anything between 50k- 75k per week should probably get it done.

    Let’s not forget as talented as Saka is most of his exploits have come in the shitty Europa league.
    Let him show his ability to deliver consistently in the PL before we start talking 100k per week or more.

  46. CG

    The G

    “”””Saka and his agent currently hold all the cards. Arsenal may offer him all you discussed, but he may demand £150kpw and refuse to sign for less”””””

    How can they offer him a pay rise the precise moment all other players are taking a pay cut?

    I think you are underplaying the difficulties the Dopes have caused with this ridiculous 12.5 % pay cut.

    If you are going doing a pay cut- do The Juventus type one ( 50% ) or just don’t bother.

    Clueless the bloody lot of them.

  47. Tom

    Trent Alexander Arnold, who’s market value is five times higher than Saka’s, is on 65k per week playing for runaway PL leaders and CL holders.
    And he’s got 2 goals and 12 assists to his name vs Saka’s 3 assists and no goals in the PL.

  48. Marc

    Valentin

    I agree it’s a difficult choice – what if Saka proves to be a one season wonder and you’ve just given him a 4 year contract on £150k per week – that’s £31.2 million.

    Dele Alli at the Spud’s is only on £100k per week. I’m not sure Saka would get the minutes at City or Liverpool, ManU is a shit show and Arsenal are certainly a better environment to develop for a couple of years.

    I find it strange that Arsenal are facing financial Armageddon because of Corona but Liverpool, City (who are under FFP pressure), ManU, the Spud’s (who have a billion quid stadium to pay for and dont’ pay high wages anyway) and Chelsea (rich owners fucked off to Israel) are all going to offer a kid with half a season under his belt a £30 million contract.

  49. Valentin

    Freddie,

    You seem to have an unhealthy obsession on the wrong that Arsène Wenger did to Arsenal, while giving a pass to those who followed him.

    Since David Dein was pushed out, nobody has replaced him with the same level of competence. Wenger was spreading himself too thin and that damaged his main role which was to manage the team and not the club.
    I always thought that Gazidis was an snake oil salesman over promoted. And in view of his spectacular success at Milan, I am not going to change opinion of him.
    Emery was just the epitome of the beta manager vying for a place at the top table but who ultimately will come up short. But those still there are just the same.

    I don’t trust them to implement the plan. Even if it was the perfect plan in a perfect settings they would find a way to muck it up. And we are not, far from it, in a perfect situation.

    Contrarily to what you keep spewing, according to officially published account the Arsenal wage bill did not go down.
    Who thought that it was a good idea to give a pay rise to Xhaka, Elneny?
    Who negotiate that insane contract with Aubameyang which results in him getting £10k per appearance?
    Who said that any players with 2 years left on their contract will be sold or extended, but did an exception for the 30 years main striker?
    Who wanted to give an improve contract to Emery before the final?
    Who thought that signing an contract extension and a pay rise to David Luiz before the end of the season was a good idea?

    Who? The current management.

  50. Marc

    “Who thought that it was a good idea to give a pay rise to Xhaka, Elneny?
    Who negotiate that insane contract with Aubameyang which results in him getting £10k per appearance?”

    All done under Gazidis – Sanllehi wasn’t even at the club when we signed Auba.

    Valentin – you have your own unhealthy obsession – blaming Sanllehi for everything that goes wrong even if he wasn’t at the club when “whatever” happened.

  51. Freddie Ljungberg

    Valentin

    Unhealthy obsession? Merely some clap back to all the absurdities spewed by the village idiots.

    There is no official account published that accounts for the changes in the wage bill since last summer. There is something called maths though. Look it up.

    Can’t be bothered with the rest of that drivel tbh.
    We get it, you hate Raul. Some might even call it an unhealthy obsession, not me though, nope.

  52. Valentin

    Marc,

    Who says Arsenal is facing financial Armageddon?
    I think that both Liverpool and Spurs are in a much more precarious situation than Arsenal.
    However they just see getting Saka on the cheap or free with a high salary as an investment worthwhile. Even if the market takes 2 years to recover, they would in position to resell him for a minimum of £50 millions.

    Spurs is facing meltdown. A huge debt to be repaid and no revenue. Even if the season restart they will not be able to fully use their stadium. Behind close door means no gate/concession revenue. Partial lockdown will mean zero possibility to hire the stadium. No Champions League revenue and they have to severely cut back on players. Even before Corona Virus, they were losing most of their players.

    Liverpool have a massive cashflow problem. They have no cash reserve and were relying on their success on the pitch for revenue. There was abhugeboutcry when they put their staff on furlough, but past August they have no more cash for anybody. That means that one of the Mane, Salah will have to be sold at a high price or they will have to take a massive loan to finance that. Right when they were already trying to refinance the Kop extension.

    Paradoxically Chelsea transfer ban helped them off and in the pitch. However the days of Abramovitch bailing them via 0% loan converted into equity are gone.

  53. Marc

    Valentin

    There are many on here (beyond CG) who are talking about “football never being the same again”, “salaries dropping” and no more crazy transfer fees.

    That comment was not directed at you.

  54. CG

    Raul arrives . Arsenal 5th/6th. A constant in euro tournaments.

    two seasons later
    and £250 000 000 spent on assorted rubbish.
    and His Clown now back in the circus with his Witch.

    Arsenal 9th/10th.
    And skint.
    No euro tournaments,

    Just the person you would want to be overseeing the biggest crisis in Arsenal 134 year history.

  55. Valentin

    Freddie,

    Accounts have been published by Arsenal since Wenger departure. It’s call public record.

    You should not talk about mathematics and accounting because that make you look stupid.
    You were the one arguing that Arsenal was making lots of money and that it was stashed away when I kept saying that was not the case. Oh behold the last official numbers showed not only an operational loss but a financial loss. AST and Swiss Rambler published the same conclusion but you know better.

  56. Marc

    Valentin

    Freddie never said we hadn’t published accounts since Wenger left he said:

    “There is no official account published that accounts for the changes in the wage bill since last summer.” – Wenger had been gone a season last summer.

  57. Terraloon

    “All it takes is the PL governing body to tell all clubs that their contracted players need to take a 20% reduction in pay…5% to cover their support staff wages…
    reimbursable if the season continues and there is no loss in game day or tv revenue…”

    Ok we are in uncharted water but from what little I know about both employment contracts and indeed FIFAs rule surrounding players contracts then my take on it is that any enforced reduction in pay or conditions of a footballers contract would in mean those players current contracts would be voided.

    Players and indeed clubs honouring contracts , even when the club would love to be shot of the player, has been one of the main planks in ensuring the stability of players contracts.

    A player who wants out can’t normally hand their notice in ,there are a couple of instances that enable them to do so such as not featuring in a set % of first team games, but by and large footballers, because of their potential transfer values, don’t have the freedom to terminate their employment and as a trade off the clubs have to honour their commitments

    In the UK football creditors including money owed to players trumps all unsecured creditors and that includes a clubs tax liabilities.

    At the start of each league campaign clubs have to register bonuses that are payable to the whole team such as x amount for winning the league. These bonuses ( based on current regulations )can only be changed close season .

    Then you have bonuses payable to a specific player such as £x for every goal. These are contract /player specific and requires agreement to vary and again as things stand will require the existing contract to be torn up and a fresh contract , by agreement, put in place.

    Of course FIFA could change its rules but here in England ( unlike Spain) none of the existing employment law has been usurped by the emergency legislation that has been put in place.

    People need to forget about clubs enforcing reductions in PL players wages. If it was a simple as some seem to think it would have already happened but the reality is that players contracts afford all sorts of protections that most normal employees just don’t get .

  58. Marc

    Terraloon

    !00% spot on – you actually had someone praising Mike Ashley the other day saying “he’d make the players do it or sack them all”.

    You really makes you wonder how some of these people managed to get through life.

  59. Freddie Ljungberg

    “You were the one arguing that Arsenal was making lots of money and that it was stashed away when I kept saying that was not the case”

    Have you gone fully delusional now? Was that the voices in your head claiming that because it sure as fuck wasn’t me.

    I’m fully aware of the low value of our squad thanks. That’s being improved though.

    “Accounts have been published by Arsenal since Wenger departure. It’s call public record.”

    Yeah. The summer after he left when we still had masses of players on inflated wages that we couldn’t move and some that the new management wanted to assess. Imagine there was a reluctance to change out half the team in one go too.

    The summer I’m talking about though as you’re fully aware of, is of course last summer when most of the culling took place. The accounts are not out for that yet.

    Go check how many players we let go, what their wages was and then do the maths with the players we signed and their wages.

    =

    Pretty decent wage reduction

    Would have been even more of course if we manage to ship out everyone we wanted but that hasn’t been possible for various obvious reasons so far.

  60. Sid

    Saka is the real deal anyone can see that,

    If Arteta’s is the real deal Saka should be Messi or Mbappes levels with his coaching .

    Leroy Sane was on 90k at the same age so thats the region Saka should be aiming for

  61. Nelson

    If the situation worsens and a number of EPL teams go belly up, it would threaten the stability of the EPL. The government should have the power to pass a law to force a reduction in player salary. Since all the players are taking money out of UK, the government should have the overall power to address an emergency situation.

  62. Bob N16

    I would hope that Saka is given a healthy rise 60-70k a week with built in increases over the length of his contract. Hopefully that will happen but I would have thought that announcing a chunky contract, even if it’s justifiable, would be difficult right now!

  63. Bob N16

    Nelson, same argument could/should be applied to those billionaires who live ‘off shore’ and whose tax contributions are minimal…Branson, Barclay brothers, Ratcliffe (Ineos), Dyson, Green. Tough to get them to contribute more now that they’re out of the country’.

    What about the city based hedge fund company who announced that they had made £2.4 billion betting right on the Covid 19 slump in the markets?

    Not sure the footballers should be made out to be the ‘baddies’!

  64. Uwot?

    So the prem have decided to kick the can down the road once again in the forlorn hope that they can complete the fixtures to a) ensure the scousers grab their first prem title & b) to stave off the threat of tv money not being paid.naive & clutching at straws springs to mind.Theyve got no chance of this happening in the time frame they have planned.putting off the inevitable.

  65. Tom

    Saka is the real deal anyone can see that, If Arteta’s is the real deal Saka should be Messi or Mbappes levels with his coaching .Leroy Sane was on 90k at the same age so thats the region Saka should be aiming for

    ————-

    Sid
    Sane was on 55k per week in 2016-17 in his first season with City
    and he wasn’t 18 but 20 then.
    I’m telling you this for free.

  66. Bob N16

    Does anybody have any idea what the protocol would be if when they start playing again, a member of the team catches Covid 19?

    If they give themselves a deadline to finish fixtures, what would happen if a team has to go in quarantine for two weeks?

  67. NEEG

    Bob N16

    Insurance. Top level clubs (and lower) insure their players to the value of their contract. At the same time footballers insure themselves against injury just as top musicians do. It will be interesting how the players will respond to the demands of clubs if and when they try and complete this season – they are being paid but now possibly to a lesser amount – they may argue against the clubs.

  68. Sid

    Tom
    Sane has been on 90k per week since 2016 -2017 when he signed a 5year contract which will expire 2021.
    Saka will be 19 in september

    Im telling you for……(completing the statement)

  69. Bob N16

    NEEG not sure how your post explains how fixtures could be fulfilled in a limited timescale if a team has to go in to isolation if a player (or for that matter, coach, physio etc) tests positive for covid 19.

  70. alexanderhenry

    Pedro

    I agree, players should take the cut and Kroenke is this case shouldn’t have to make up the shortfall.
    As far as the rest of the article, I totally disagree, which won’t surprise you.

    To quote:

    ‘I’m always happy to give the KSE org a textual boot up the arse. They’ve run Arsenal in uninterested fashion for many years, of that there is no doubt, but overall, they’re kind of the type of owners that we’d hoped for. They let the board spend what they earn, they don’t fuck about with the day to day, and they let the people at the club do their thing.’

    Well, you’re not.
    When I first encountered this blog, you didn’t want to discuss kroenke at all and refused to accept that he had any influence on anything. Pretty crazy.
    Regarding kroenle and co. being ‘the type of owners that we’d hoped for’, I think you’ll find you’re in a tiny minority there.
    Also, do you mean opposed to the club’s previous owners? The ones we won titles under.

    Regarding spending, for the initial five year (or longer) period after the move Stan most certainly did not ‘let the board spend what it earned’.
    Later on they did – shouldn’t they we’re arsenal?- but wenger squandered most of it and now there’s no money.

    As far as ‘letting people people at the club do their thing’, that fine but it surely depends on who those people are. Sounds like you’re making excuses for stan’s poor recruitment and lack of interest. He is ultimately responsible.

    Moving on:

    ‘The problem is we’ve trusted people that have severely lacked in the vision department’

    Who is we? me, you, the fans?
    We don’t appoint these people.

    You make a lot of Kroenke being ‘hands off’.
    Well, he wasn’t ‘hands off’ when he flew in and personally awarded wenger a contract extension when the rest of the board allegedly opposed it. He didn’t even consult them.
    That’s about as hands on as Joe Biden at a democrat primary.

    It was Stan who allowed gazidis to restructure the club and it was him that allowed wenger to cock up the sanchez transfer, losing the club £60 million.
    He must have been aware of what was going on.
    If he did he’s an idiot, and if he didn’t he’s a bigger idiot.

    In 9 short years of full control and 5 of BOD involvement, stan has taken a top two club and whether deliberately or through sheer negligence, downsized it to become a top ten club. Now, fans are reduced to hoping against hope that we make top four, which is bitterly ironic I’m sure you’ll agree.

    You keep trotting out the ‘hands off ‘ argument but it’s flawed, untrue and over simplistic.
    A good owner is hands off when he should be and hands on when he needs to be.

    Stan has been the exact opposite.

    From way back , you called this wrong Pedro.

  71. NEEG

    BobN16

    It doesn’t really explain however players will insist insurance is in place by the clubs and by themselves. Without adequate cover I cannot see a re-start anytime soon. You can insure against any eventuality but the premiums may be prohibitive.
    Penalties anyone?

  72. Spanishdave

    It would be possible to play keeping two meters apart like table football, it would be fun and there would be a lot of goals.
    Maybe not.
    The press are making up so much stuff now it’s laughable, could this, would that, a university report from some country you’ve never heard off.
    It’s really boring.

  73. Valentin

    Regarding recouping some money from tax exiles, it is not that difficult. It is just a political decision that nobody wants to make because once implemented it opens a can of worm.

    For example, the USA have something call tax extraterritoriality. And they make full use of that principle.
    First thing if you are an American resident you have to pay tax in the USA, no US resident but foreign domiciled status.

    Secondly if you are US resident for tax perspective and have foreign revenue you have to declare it, even if you have already paid tax on it. Depending if a reciprocal agreement between the US and the country from which the revenue come, that revenue may be taxed. That means that even if the country has already taxed you on that revenue, the US reserve the right to tax you again on that revenue.

    Lastly, if you are an US citizen, you have to declare your revenue. Even if you live abroad. And again if you have revenue or live in a country without a reciprocal agreement, you may be subjected to US tax.

    Also when I said reciprocal agreement, most agreements are not symmetrical. They are heavily in favour of the US. So if an US citizen live in a Country that do not have income tax from salary, quite often the US will impose their own income tax lower than on US resident but still.

    Nowadays lot of small/medium European banks and financial institutions refuses to have US customers for anything more complex than current account and saving account, because the amount of legal declaration they must do on behalf of their client is so great.

    No British politician wants to change the tax system, because there would be winner and loser and most of the losers would be the one funding the political parties.
    Why do you think that the UK has been so vehemently opposed to a Tobin tax on financial transactions? Lobbying. The stamp duty on shares does not affect bank, pension funds and can be avoided by hedge funds and other financial speculators by using derivatives upon which there is no stamp duty taxes.

  74. Valentin

    Tom,

    You don’t take into account the financial context of the time.
    When Sané joined ManCity and then signed his contract worth £90kpw, most top players were on no more than £150kpw. So as an incredible prospective talent he was earning 60% of the top players.

    Nowadays top talents command £250kpw. I am not including extraordinary talent (Messi, Ronaldo, Griezman, Sanchez, …) or exceptional deal a la Özil or Ramsey at Juventus.
    Lacazette is on £183kpw before appearance bonus. Aubameyang is on £200kpw plus £10,000 per appearance and a further £10,000 per goal.

    60% of £200kpw is £120kpw, so that’s what Saka agent is targeting. That may sound outrageous, but will pretty close to what Arsenal will end up offering him.