To those who think arsenal can’t realistically get Bruno (if we want him) now - same was said about Rice. Arsenal outbid city surprisingly and rice preferred us as well (perhaps also surprisingly?). The rest is history
I don’t know if our links to Bruno are genuine tho or just clickbait
If they are real and his release clause expires before the euros or whatever then at least this shouldn’t be a protracted saga, I do so hate those…
This is another reason why Arteta needs to do better in cups even if we don't ultimately win, get second team some minutes. We have no idea what esr or viera capable of because they not playing or developing, they stagnant.
Only Raptora is a fan of him. There is talent there no doubt. But it hasn't worked for him at Arsenal. I would sell or loan depending on the market. I would keep ESR before I would keep him and I would sell ESR at this point. We need players Arteta can trust to rotate Odegaard.
I don't get why Rashford is coveted. I would steer clear of him. When things aren't going his way he is a sulker on the pitch. And he is nearly 27, how much more can he improve.
He is a decent dude though. Just not the level of footballer we should be going for.
I would rather Olise, even Eze tbh if we are going to sell ESR. There is so much better in the market than Rashford.
I’m open to letting ESR go, he’s played less than 700 minutes across the last 2 seasons.
If he has another season like that, then we’ll just trash any remaining value, any half decent bid and I think we should pivot, and he should move for more consistent football.
My main concern with Rashford is the level of inconsistency:
2023/24 - 8 goals + 5 assists
2022/23 - 30 goals + 10 assists
2021/22 - 5 goals + 2 assists
2020/21 - 21 goals + 13 assists
If we put him on a 4yr contract on mega money, my fear is that once the honeymoon period is over..
We have no idea the type of consistency we’ll get in either end-product, or his application.
Some of his performances must have United fans tearing their hair out… He’s beyond lazy.
There seems to be an assumption that Man City can and will outbid Arsenal in pursuit of Guimaraes.
If there is a buy out clause at let's say £100 million there is absolutely no reason that Arsenal cannot compete with Man City at that level if we pursue him.
I would remind those negativists that Arsenal have three member of the Brazil International team in
our squad plus Jorginho who is also born in Brazil. Edu is also Brazilian.
There is a large Brazilian community living in London and so that could well be a factor should Guimaraes decide to move clubs.
what I was saying. Also, we can afford him. 100M we can do. With the Prem and CL monies. The issue is salaries. City break the bank for massive salaries even tho their transfer fees are not too exorbitant
The Paqueta charges are pretty damning and serious. They think he intentionally got booked to sway the betting odds in games he had placed bets on.
"It's alleged that he [Paqueta] directly sought to influence the progress, conduct, or any other aspect of, or occurrence in these matches by intentionally seeking to receive a card from the referee for the improper purpose of affecting the betting market in order for one or more persons to profit from betting,"
The lad gets booked a lot though, he puts himself about a lot. It's mystery why he doesn't get sent off a lot. Maybe the refs need to be probed as well.
Paqueta has brought the league/west ham into disrepute if those charges are accurate and I would be surprised if he ever allowed to play professionally again in Europe at least. I agree with Guns of SF that directly influence game by getting yellow cards is about as bad as it gets.
diss, those charges if proved should be enough to remove him from EPL. Betting is one thing, betting on your team to lose is another, and influencing the game for betting purposes is the worst potentially. He gets kicked out if true
I think the best part about Ateta is that he's still a maturing manager, he's not fully formed yet. He's still actively learning and improving all the time.
It would be the height of idiocy to sign a rookie manager, stick with him through the teething phases and then through the adolescent growing pains, only to ditch him when he is approaching managerial adulthood.
Arteta gets Arsenal, he's reconnected the club back to it's values and fanbase, all the while we are getting closer to big targets
He's earned that long term contract.
He's not a Wenger who will stay on just because he can. He's the manager who will walk away when he's spent, even if he's winning everything on sight.
All the things you have said are true. The other point is the market is cooked. People trying to say fire him don't see what is going on with managers. Chelsea are having a hard time staying with one, United don't know if they are going to stay with Ten Hag or not, Bayern are close to appointing Kompany who was relegated with Burnley due to lack of managers (our fan base would have had a melt down if we did this), Juventus have appointed Thiago Motta who is just up and coming and Barcelona don't know if Xavi is staying or not. Even the smart operators Liverpool have hired Slot who is a risk coming from the Dutch league.
If Arteta was available today, 5 clubs would be calling to hire him. He does need to win, but the potential is clear to see. And I am convinced he will win us the league. I think he believes it as well. If he didn't he is not the sort of guy to hang around like Wenger as you said.
The problem tho, is that the brass are so taken by Arteta that he will leave when he calls time. The brass are too pussy to fire him if results start to go down after this season. He has built up enough goodwill to keep him going even if we have a worse record next season. Firing coaches is not a forte of Arsenal. Bar Emery
The problem was Wenger then because he lost his moral bearings and got drunk with all the autonomy and power that he had acquired.
He had lulled the fanbase to accept 4th place as a reasonable goal and just stayed because he could, even though he had run out of energy. He kept his back room the same and just wore us out with his mediocre sameness.
Arteta has set the bar so high - winning...that's the metric that will be used to judge him. He was crushed last sunday when it finally dawned on him that were were going to finish 2nd. Contrast it with Wenger glowing in the last minute dash to an academic 2nd place after Leicester had won the league in 2016.
When you set the bar that high, you're going to be consumed by expectations and walk away if you don't win.
Bruno won't go to city because he's got to know Pep is leaving at some point.
The Arsenal project is appealing and is more long term, forget the London factor. We have a Brazilian sporting director who worked with the Brazilian FA before coming to Arsenal so we have significant pull for any Brazilian.
That said, Rodri has been complaining loudly about being overplayed so it makes sense for city to get an established player to share minutes with him.
I think whoever gets Bruno btw Arsenal and City, gets a leg up for next season's title because he's a game changer.
That might be a factor. But I think playing for Pep sways a lot of players. And we won't know whether pep is leaving or not till the end of next season or the middle of it minimum. So Bruno G won't consider that. Van Persie moved to United not knowing Ferguson will be there for a year. So players will move to clubs for legendary coaches even if it was for a year.
We don't have Pep's pull or City's money. And that is okay. We can still compete and win if we do the right things. For priority signings like Rice we will have to pay more than City. This time though it is a release clause even if we wanted to offer more.
Pepe has been at city since 2016 and every one of those years have been utter stress, albeit successful too. It's already costing him his health- he had back surgery last season.
Given his past history of taking breaks and with the looming premier league litigation, he is going to leave next season when his contract runs out.
There's nothing left for him to do at city.
We have to stop them from getting 5 consecutive league wins.
We do need to win. And I agree that he most probably will be leaving next summer. But in the context, of Bruno G coming to us, that might not be a factor is all I am saying. He might hope Pep stays there for more years and sign for them anyway.
Paqueta charged for betting. That means City are definitely going for Bruno Guimaraes. Not likely we are going to get him now. If that is the case, we might as well go for Joao Neves now. He is 19 and will need a bit of time but the other options look very mid in comparison.
Bruno was available in Jan 2022 for a pittance compared to what his valuation is now. But Edu & Arteta said there was no talent in that TW. Doesn't look to good if he is coming to AFC now.
Bruno is not benching Rodri anytime soon. There's a pathway for him into our XI. That could make all the difference. Are you looking at him as 6 or 8 for us?
No, Bruno is an all rounder type of CM. He can definitely play further forward. He has better technical qualities than Rice with less physical qualities. So he can definitely do both. If he came to us, I would play him deeper, with Rice roaming because he would offer us what Partey used to offer us. But he definitely can play an attacking game if needed. I saw him as an 8 at Lyon, but at Newcastle he has played mostly as a 6.
If he moves to City he will be their Gundogan long term replacement with Rodri behind him and one of Debruyne, Foden, B.Silva along side him. City tried to sign a similar type of player in Kovacic and he was playing a lot at the end of the season. So they can fit in Bruno G.
And this time, we won't offer more money to rake him away because of the release clause and he doesn't care about staying in London like Rice did either. So if we are both willing to pay, he is moving to City.
Know what, that he is more probably moving to City?
Because Pep has been talking about him for years. He praises him everytime they play Newcastle. The release clause is just a fact. And Bruno G's Newcastle signing announcement years before had some shades for Arsenal. He would move to us, but we wouldn't be the first choice if it came to competing with City this time.
I was hoping their interest in Paqueta would lead to them not pursuing him. But now, they most probably will. The Brazilians are a factor I didn't think of that could work in our favor. The pep leaving thing though isn't enough. I replied to Dissenter extensively why it won't be a factor in his recent post.
One final time because the misers have been dodging the questions:
1) If arsenal get 100 points next season but city get 101, are you calling it a failure from arteta that needs sacking for not winning the title? If yes, that’s fucking laughable
2) if none of our rivals turn up next season so we won the title with only 75 points, would you consider that an achievement from arteta? If yes, that’s fucking laughable - it represents a significant decline of standards…
3) anyone saying shit like ‘arteta hasn’t won in 5 attempts is such a blatant tool. We won the cup in his first season. Meanwhile if you think we had a squad good enough to win titles with the high 90s for points in artetas first few seasons you are literally smoking meth. We just barely had a top squad last season (excellent first team with minimal depth) - and this season was the first time we had a fully competitive squad - and we competed…
There has to be a middle ground. We have to win something alongside a title challenge. 100 points and no trophies next season would be a failure. I also believe next season will be make or break for our league aspirations. If we can't win the league next season, the belief will be gone amongst players and fans. Three times in a row will be too much.
So basically we need to do much better in domestic cups and we win something and plus a points tally improvement from our points tally this season is what I wouldn't call a failure next season. But I do believe we will win the league though.
Success isn't determined by number of points bro. It is determined by silver ware. If we didn't win anything else next season, it will have been the 4th year in a row without winning anything.
A 100 points and an Fa Cup, I would call that a successful season. I don't really rate the carabao cup. But I would still would want us to take it seriously.
100 points might mean we are one of the best teams in the PL history, but we wouldn't be champions. The middle ground is we need to win things to mark the progress we have made. If we don't and make a 100 points, I wouldn't call the season a failure but I wouldn't call it success either.
The futility of this argument is that you can’t decide how many points you need to win the league because it’s not up to you, it’s up to your strongest rival. Whatever they get, you need to get one more or equal with better GD
So if your measure of quality is only who lifts the title it means your measuring stick is nothing to do with how good or bad we are, ONLY if we are marginally better than our strongest rival.
If Son scores that late one v one vs city last week we are champions right here and now. And you would say arteta had been successful. But he didn’t, and we aren’t. So arteta failed?
And by the same logic if we won every game next season apart from vs city, but they won them all, it would be a failure because city won the title by 6 points… this is seriously silly logic the more you explore it
Artea does have to take cup competitions more serious.
The season Liverpool got 96 points and still lost out to city in the league, it didn't hurt as much because they had a CL final against Spurs to look forward to.
Look, Arteta is not above criticisms. We can give him his flowers and still states our criticism with context.
How many kicks at the can does Arteta get before we try different manager?
Arteta is God awful in cup competitions and that's a problem, if mancheaty get 101 points you mention then we could try for double fa/league cup wins. Arteta hasn't exceeded expectations once since he arrived, we have top quality players so this our level, we need to win trophies or we're just repeating Wenger era but with different coach.
ESR would do well in an Emery team, just like Martinez is doing
The Spurs manager is the father figure that Rashford needs
To those who think arsenal can’t realistically get Bruno (if we want him) now - same was said about Rice. Arsenal outbid city surprisingly and rice preferred us as well (perhaps also surprisingly?). The rest is history
I don’t know if our links to Bruno are genuine tho or just clickbait
If they are real and his release clause expires before the euros or whatever then at least this shouldn’t be a protracted saga, I do so hate those…
Rich
What do you think of Viera?
It's 2 years on and we are still waiting...
Would you move him on too , since it's agreed that ESR is likely leaving.
This is another reason why Arteta needs to do better in cups even if we don't ultimately win, get second team some minutes. We have no idea what esr or viera capable of because they not playing or developing, they stagnant.
Sell Vieira and keep ESR subject to getting silly offers. In which case sell both
Only Raptora is a fan of him. There is talent there no doubt. But it hasn't worked for him at Arsenal. I would sell or loan depending on the market. I would keep ESR before I would keep him and I would sell ESR at this point. We need players Arteta can trust to rotate Odegaard.
move him, he gonna be the next esr . we need players who will play
Not sure if there’s any substance in the rumour but what are our feelings on a ESR/ Rashford swap?
I don't get why Rashford is coveted. I would steer clear of him. When things aren't going his way he is a sulker on the pitch. And he is nearly 27, how much more can he improve.
He is a decent dude though. Just not the level of footballer we should be going for.
I would rather Olise, even Eze tbh if we are going to sell ESR. There is so much better in the market than Rashford.
It would be a curve ball signing but I’d prefer Sesko.
I’m open to letting ESR go, he’s played less than 700 minutes across the last 2 seasons.
If he has another season like that, then we’ll just trash any remaining value, any half decent bid and I think we should pivot, and he should move for more consistent football.
My main concern with Rashford is the level of inconsistency:
2023/24 - 8 goals + 5 assists
2022/23 - 30 goals + 10 assists
2021/22 - 5 goals + 2 assists
2020/21 - 21 goals + 13 assists
If we put him on a 4yr contract on mega money, my fear is that once the honeymoon period is over..
We have no idea the type of consistency we’ll get in either end-product, or his application.
Some of his performances must have United fans tearing their hair out… He’s beyond lazy.
We get the short end of the stick; prima donna on extremely large wages for a position where we have Martinelli already
Unless we exist to mitigate United's woes, we should steer clear
There seems to be an assumption that Man City can and will outbid Arsenal in pursuit of Guimaraes.
If there is a buy out clause at let's say £100 million there is absolutely no reason that Arsenal cannot compete with Man City at that level if we pursue him.
I would remind those negativists that Arsenal have three member of the Brazil International team in
our squad plus Jorginho who is also born in Brazil. Edu is also Brazilian.
There is a large Brazilian community living in London and so that could well be a factor should Guimaraes decide to move clubs.
Sadly Bruno G not a £100m player tbh
what I was saying. Also, we can afford him. 100M we can do. With the Prem and CL monies. The issue is salaries. City break the bank for massive salaries even tho their transfer fees are not too exorbitant
Nigel
Do you know why 'Pool fans weren't so dejected about coming 2nd to city yearly?
...because they were still going to Wembley and coming back home with trophies
The Paqueta charges are pretty damning and serious. They think he intentionally got booked to sway the betting odds in games he had placed bets on.
"It's alleged that he [Paqueta] directly sought to influence the progress, conduct, or any other aspect of, or occurrence in these matches by intentionally seeking to receive a card from the referee for the improper purpose of affecting the betting market in order for one or more persons to profit from betting,"
The lad gets booked a lot though, he puts himself about a lot. It's mystery why he doesn't get sent off a lot. Maybe the refs need to be probed as well.
Paqueta has brought the league/west ham into disrepute if those charges are accurate and I would be surprised if he ever allowed to play professionally again in Europe at least. I agree with Guns of SF that directly influence game by getting yellow cards is about as bad as it gets.
diss, those charges if proved should be enough to remove him from EPL. Betting is one thing, betting on your team to lose is another, and influencing the game for betting purposes is the worst potentially. He gets kicked out if true
Guns, he's in trouble. They waited to to dot the "i's and cross the "t"s.
I think the best part about Ateta is that he's still a maturing manager, he's not fully formed yet. He's still actively learning and improving all the time.
It would be the height of idiocy to sign a rookie manager, stick with him through the teething phases and then through the adolescent growing pains, only to ditch him when he is approaching managerial adulthood.
Arteta gets Arsenal, he's reconnected the club back to it's values and fanbase, all the while we are getting closer to big targets
He's earned that long term contract.
He's not a Wenger who will stay on just because he can. He's the manager who will walk away when he's spent, even if he's winning everything on sight.
All the things you have said are true. The other point is the market is cooked. People trying to say fire him don't see what is going on with managers. Chelsea are having a hard time staying with one, United don't know if they are going to stay with Ten Hag or not, Bayern are close to appointing Kompany who was relegated with Burnley due to lack of managers (our fan base would have had a melt down if we did this), Juventus have appointed Thiago Motta who is just up and coming and Barcelona don't know if Xavi is staying or not. Even the smart operators Liverpool have hired Slot who is a risk coming from the Dutch league.
If Arteta was available today, 5 clubs would be calling to hire him. He does need to win, but the potential is clear to see. And I am convinced he will win us the league. I think he believes it as well. If he didn't he is not the sort of guy to hang around like Wenger as you said.
The problem tho, is that the brass are so taken by Arteta that he will leave when he calls time. The brass are too pussy to fire him if results start to go down after this season. He has built up enough goodwill to keep him going even if we have a worse record next season. Firing coaches is not a forte of Arsenal. Bar Emery
The problem was Wenger then because he lost his moral bearings and got drunk with all the autonomy and power that he had acquired.
He had lulled the fanbase to accept 4th place as a reasonable goal and just stayed because he could, even though he had run out of energy. He kept his back room the same and just wore us out with his mediocre sameness.
Arteta has set the bar so high - winning...that's the metric that will be used to judge him. He was crushed last sunday when it finally dawned on him that were were going to finish 2nd. Contrast it with Wenger glowing in the last minute dash to an academic 2nd place after Leicester had won the league in 2016.
When you set the bar that high, you're going to be consumed by expectations and walk away if you don't win.
nice comment
For balance, I think it's healthy to have posters who believe Arteta ought to be sacked or put on the notice on the blog.
That's why I struggle to understand why anyone would attack Mystic Leaves for his dissenting opinions.
Mystic, I got your back, don't stop being original even though I disagree with you about Arteta.
agreed
Bruno won't go to city because he's got to know Pep is leaving at some point.
The Arsenal project is appealing and is more long term, forget the London factor. We have a Brazilian sporting director who worked with the Brazilian FA before coming to Arsenal so we have significant pull for any Brazilian.
That said, Rodri has been complaining loudly about being overplayed so it makes sense for city to get an established player to share minutes with him.
I think whoever gets Bruno btw Arsenal and City, gets a leg up for next season's title because he's a game changer.
That might be a factor. But I think playing for Pep sways a lot of players. And we won't know whether pep is leaving or not till the end of next season or the middle of it minimum. So Bruno G won't consider that. Van Persie moved to United not knowing Ferguson will be there for a year. So players will move to clubs for legendary coaches even if it was for a year.
We don't have Pep's pull or City's money. And that is okay. We can still compete and win if we do the right things. For priority signings like Rice we will have to pay more than City. This time though it is a release clause even if we wanted to offer more.
Pepe has been at city since 2016 and every one of those years have been utter stress, albeit successful too. It's already costing him his health- he had back surgery last season.
Given his past history of taking breaks and with the looming premier league litigation, he is going to leave next season when his contract runs out.
There's nothing left for him to do at city.
We have to stop them from getting 5 consecutive league wins.
I think Pep stays at mancheaty because where he going to go next, PSG is about only club at the level he expects to manage at.
We do need to win. And I agree that he most probably will be leaving next summer. But in the context, of Bruno G coming to us, that might not be a factor is all I am saying. He might hope Pep stays there for more years and sign for them anyway.
Paqueta charged for betting. That means City are definitely going for Bruno Guimaraes. Not likely we are going to get him now. If that is the case, we might as well go for Joao Neves now. He is 19 and will need a bit of time but the other options look very mid in comparison.
Bruno was available in Jan 2022 for a pittance compared to what his valuation is now. But Edu & Arteta said there was no talent in that TW. Doesn't look to good if he is coming to AFC now.
Bruno is not benching Rodri anytime soon. There's a pathway for him into our XI. That could make all the difference. Are you looking at him as 6 or 8 for us?
No, Bruno is an all rounder type of CM. He can definitely play further forward. He has better technical qualities than Rice with less physical qualities. So he can definitely do both. If he came to us, I would play him deeper, with Rice roaming because he would offer us what Partey used to offer us. But he definitely can play an attacking game if needed. I saw him as an 8 at Lyon, but at Newcastle he has played mostly as a 6.
If he moves to City he will be their Gundogan long term replacement with Rodri behind him and one of Debruyne, Foden, B.Silva along side him. City tried to sign a similar type of player in Kovacic and he was playing a lot at the end of the season. So they can fit in Bruno G.
And this time, we won't offer more money to rake him away because of the release clause and he doesn't care about staying in London like Rice did either. So if we are both willing to pay, he is moving to City.
how do you know that?
Know what, that he is more probably moving to City?
Because Pep has been talking about him for years. He praises him everytime they play Newcastle. The release clause is just a fact. And Bruno G's Newcastle signing announcement years before had some shades for Arsenal. He would move to us, but we wouldn't be the first choice if it came to competing with City this time.
That is my opinion anyway.
we got the brazilian connection tho, Pep will not be at City past next season. There is your counter argument. lol
I was hoping their interest in Paqueta would lead to them not pursuing him. But now, they most probably will. The Brazilians are a factor I didn't think of that could work in our favor. The pep leaving thing though isn't enough. I replied to Dissenter extensively why it won't be a factor in his recent post.
One final time because the misers have been dodging the questions:
1) If arsenal get 100 points next season but city get 101, are you calling it a failure from arteta that needs sacking for not winning the title? If yes, that’s fucking laughable
2) if none of our rivals turn up next season so we won the title with only 75 points, would you consider that an achievement from arteta? If yes, that’s fucking laughable - it represents a significant decline of standards…
3) anyone saying shit like ‘arteta hasn’t won in 5 attempts is such a blatant tool. We won the cup in his first season. Meanwhile if you think we had a squad good enough to win titles with the high 90s for points in artetas first few seasons you are literally smoking meth. We just barely had a top squad last season (excellent first team with minimal depth) - and this season was the first time we had a fully competitive squad - and we competed…
There has to be a middle ground. We have to win something alongside a title challenge. 100 points and no trophies next season would be a failure. I also believe next season will be make or break for our league aspirations. If we can't win the league next season, the belief will be gone amongst players and fans. Three times in a row will be too much.
So basically we need to do much better in domestic cups and we win something and plus a points tally improvement from our points tally this season is what I wouldn't call a failure next season. But I do believe we will win the league though.
100 points would be the highest points tally ever and you’d call if a failure if city got 101. You can’t honestly be serious
So if all our rivals got 50 points and we won the league with 51 it would be success? Okay…
Success isn't determined by number of points bro. It is determined by silver ware. If we didn't win anything else next season, it will have been the 4th year in a row without winning anything.
A 100 points and an Fa Cup, I would call that a successful season. I don't really rate the carabao cup. But I would still would want us to take it seriously.
100 points might mean we are one of the best teams in the PL history, but we wouldn't be champions. The middle ground is we need to win things to mark the progress we have made. If we don't and make a 100 points, I wouldn't call the season a failure but I wouldn't call it success either.
The futility of this argument is that you can’t decide how many points you need to win the league because it’s not up to you, it’s up to your strongest rival. Whatever they get, you need to get one more or equal with better GD
So if your measure of quality is only who lifts the title it means your measuring stick is nothing to do with how good or bad we are, ONLY if we are marginally better than our strongest rival.
If Son scores that late one v one vs city last week we are champions right here and now. And you would say arteta had been successful. But he didn’t, and we aren’t. So arteta failed?
And by the same logic if we won every game next season apart from vs city, but they won them all, it would be a failure because city won the title by 6 points… this is seriously silly logic the more you explore it
Artea does have to take cup competitions more serious.
The season Liverpool got 96 points and still lost out to city in the league, it didn't hurt as much because they had a CL final against Spurs to look forward to.
Look, Arteta is not above criticisms. We can give him his flowers and still states our criticism with context.
How many kicks at the can does Arteta get before we try different manager?
Arteta is God awful in cup competitions and that's a problem, if mancheaty get 101 points you mention then we could try for double fa/league cup wins. Arteta hasn't exceeded expectations once since he arrived, we have top quality players so this our level, we need to win trophies or we're just repeating Wenger era but with different coach.
Jesus needs to go offer to Newcastle plus 60m for issak
I wonder what Kolasinac and Xhaka were gossiping about last night, Granit covering his mouth Saed leaning in to whisper something in ear.
Biereth and Nketiah offer more than Jesus.
Partey will Not be missed if he leaves
Sid gets it, about Jesus, the #9 flatterer