ITALIAN MOVING, BUT WHERE?

by .

How are you today?

I’m in New York on a work thing, so I am going to be low on posting at the moment, but… when the post land, they land, you know what I’m saying?

I just want to clear up a couple of things from my expose on the Premier League fixtures because there were a lot of angry Spurs fans and there were a few Arsenal fans that cannot stand to see data that in any way looks like it might harm their naive view of how the sporting world works.

  1. We didn’t finish in the top 4 last season for a whole host of reasons that I have covered in some detail. If you think I was saying the only reason we failed was due to the fixtures, you are wrong and likely projecting onto the work.
  2. Marginal gains are a thing. If you don’t understand that, you don’t get modern sport. Clubs will try and edge out advantages all over the place. Liverpool don’t let key players go on international duty because of ‘injury’, Arsenal do, Liverpool end the season with Trent on the pitch, Arsenal end the season with Tavares at left-back. We had a whole conversation about the weirdos that thought removing mayo from the canteen was a marginal gain because Conte is a genius. So when we look at fixtures, don’t tell me that’s not a marginal gain opportunity.
  3. Finally, the key message: Arsenal drop out of Europe for the first time in 25 years and we didn’t face a single team that had played a European game. There’s a 3.4% chance of that happening. You have to ask questions about that, especially when you know the random fixture generator has human intervention involved. Calling it ‘luck’ is to sit on your hands. The same people telling you not to be curious about hard data were those that were telling you to put on your big boy boots when we didn’t have the Brentford game cancelled. What happened after they said the games couldn’t be cancelled? The games got cancelled when other clubs screamed louder. Everything can be influenced in football, we’ve seen it time and time again, Arsenal should be banging the table on this ‘freak’ roll of the dice and demanding it does not happen again.

Anyway, thanks to all the fans that carried that message.

ONTO STRIKER THINGS:

Arsenal are apparently kicking the Scamacca approach into overdrive. The story seems to have swung from ‘he’s angling for a move to Juve’ to ‘Dortmund and Arsenal want him.’ You would have to imagine Arsenal have more sway than Dortmund, we can pay more, give him a better profile, and we’re more prestige.

I like this striker a lot. He has all the bits we’re looking for, he fast, he can can score in lots of different ways, he has a fierce ball striker, and he’s only young. What is very interesting to me is whether we’re spending less on our main striker so we can afford someone like Jesus to give us more end product in the forward line. The interesting thing for Jesus is there’s quite a bit of competition at Arsenal for the spaces his likes to occupy. Still, we need a squad more than ever next season, so there will be loads of minutes.

Bukayo Saka is apparently on the radar of Manchester City. I think this is a familiar pattern that comes from his agent who seeded that Eddie was attracting interest from Chelsea and Liverpool. It’s all a game to get his client max money this summer. Let’s be real here, it’s absolutely deserved, we just need to make sure we’re very protected so we don’t lose him for nothing at some point.

Right, short one today. If you are Patreon contributor, Johnny has dropped a little beauty into the feed today where he talks about the next 5 players in his top 25 players. To get the exclusive good content, click below.

 

538 Responses to “ITALIAN MOVING, BUT WHERE?”

Jump to comment form ↓

  1. Tom

    Stroller, I didn’t say we were fourth at any point the club decided to stay idle in the January window.
    I said we finished the calendar year well which might’ve convinced them we had enough for top four.

  2. AFC Forever

    Dissenter

    “I don’t understand for the life of me how they can even contemplate giving it to Italy. That space belongs to a COMNEBOL national team. Chile can’t get that spot too were 7th in COMNEBOL; Peru and Colombia are ahead of them on table”

    That story was covered yesterday on the radio.

    They said the reason Chile would get the place in Qatar is that under FIFA rules the sanction would be based on points obtained with Castillo on the field during the Conmebol Qualifiers. This would mean Chile would get sufficient points because they played two matches against Ecuador with the participation of Byron Castillo which would be awarded as wins.

    How on earth can you play someone born in another Country and not know it? Just like the World Cup taking place in Qatar, it’s all a bit bonkers really.

  3. Old & Wise

    The club has never filled David Dein’s shoe’s in the boardroom and we became a F.A. cup club as time went on because of this. Stan should be looking for a modern day Dein who has the knowledge how to acquire players our clubs needs.

    Sadly, there has been no rush from the right players wanting to join us when you see through the media’s click-baiting. Clearly, Edu had nothing close to be signed or signed prior to the window opening. No plan B if we didn’t get CL? Begs questions why after he had 12 months to formulate such plans.

    I’d be more than happy to have the 78 year old David back if only to pass on his knowledge of life in football to date, to a worthy successor with the same player instincts David had.

    Sad day indeed when a diamond merchant – a carpet salesman and an aloof lord who talked utter bollocks eloquently when called upon, rather than looking after The Arsenal’s best interests, unceremoniously dumped the only footballing knowledgeable director out of the club.

    Stan courted Arsne when he should have got David reinstated then let David deal with his pal Arsne. The future would have been brighter and cost KSE less in my humble opinion.

    I’m afraid when the core is rotten the ‘whole’ becomes rotten in time. We need a couple of elite football people in the boardroom if we’re ever to live up to our history, and create more we’re proud of once again.

    Our last 3 seasons’ placings are nothing at all to be proud of nor the bad optics that emanated from Arteta and his poor man management and player fall outs. A board footballing director should be stopping such issues at source early into a manager’s tenure.

    We need change from the top down to truly become a contender with football’s elite because placing blind faith into a failed project to date with only negative records in Arteta’s wake, to look back on, after almost 3 years in charge is throwing good money after bad.

    Regardless of who joins us it’s the manager’s tactics that the players will have to adhere to and is all we have to achieve 4th against Pep, Klopp, Conte, Tuchel and Ten Hag who will have also strengthened their squads.

    We have Arteta a seasoned 8th to 5th manager. Says it all really.

    Realistically that;s

  4. Habesha Gooner

    Raptora
    I think it is 80 mil euros with 20 mil performance add ons. I know he fits Liverpool but I wouldn’t pay that for him. I would rather Jesus at 50 mil euros.

    Seeing this Roma are going to demand 80 mil euros for Abraham (the buy back clause Chelsea put in there). I would expect more than Nunez’s price for Osihmen. Johnathan David will at least go for 50 mil euros. Same for Amine Gouiri. And Jesus is a better player than all of these strikers bar Osihmen. Gouiri might go far though.

    There is a genuine shortage of Top strikers.

  5. Valentin

    Habesha,

    Real Madrid can’t register new non-European players because their 3 slots are already occupied. According to spanish rules, the earliest any of them could get a Spanish passport is January. His agent may blew smoke, but the reality is that Real Madrid is not after him this summer. Next summer on a free, they definitely be.

    Regarding Spurs finance, they need to get sell before they can buy. A striker is not their most pressing need. Also Jesus is already on higher wage than they are willing to offer to their second tier band players. The one below Kane, Son, Lucas Moura.

    Again his agent may pretend what he wants, but does anybody seriously believe that Levy will sanction a purchase at £50 millions for a Kane/Son understudy on £200kpw. That stretching the credulity to unrealistic level.

    Inter like AC Milan can’t afford premiership level wage. So again are eyeing a loan or bosman next year.

    Why would Arsenal pay £50 millions for a player where no other clubs is willing to pay more than £30 millions?

    Ramsdale is the better goalkeeper than the one I mentioned, because he is at Arsenal and Areola is at WestHam!
    Using the dame argument Leno was a better goalkeeper than Martinez and Ramsdale is better than Martinez. Ramsdale had a purple patch at the beginning of the season that was overhyped because of his enthusiasm and willingness to be vocal contrary to Leno. But he is now back to his relegation level: nervous, erratic, poor, etc.

  6. raptora

    Knowing how Liverpool work, they don’t spend crazy money for players that aren’t worth it. If they splash the cash for Nunez, then he must be one hell of a player.

    And they have to do it if they want to have a chance versus a Pep team with Haaland in it. It shows how ambitious Pool are in trying to keep in touch with City rather than sit on their hands, feel sorry for themselves and preach how unfair life is. They work hard, find solutions and just deal with it.

  7. Naija+soccer

    Italy doesn’t love Arsenal at the moment. Locatelli, Vlahovic, and now Scamacca all rejecting us. Even Fiorentina likes our player but can’t be bothered paying for him.

  8. Naija+soccer

    If we must sell our best players from time to time, then the club must find a way or a plan to keep us relevant and competing. I m not against selling Saka to Man City if that’s what must happen but make sure it comes at a cost for them and we replace immediately with similar players, so we don’t lag behind

    For example sell Saka for 100 million then Replace him with Gakpo/Gnabry and a striker like Savic. We ve got a replacement wide player AND a striker.

  9. Graham62

    Valentin

    Spuds finances are unique, in many ways.
    Interestingly though, we don’t hear too much about their “sustainable business model” quite as much as we hear about Arsenal’s. Why is that?
    Even after the opening of their new state of the art stadium and covid, we never get the same rhetoric that came out of Arsenal all those years back.
    Is it to do with the fact that Spuds plan better and didn’t hand out vast sums to average to shite players like we’ve always done?
    It seems to be our Achilles heel.
    Financial sustainability that is.

  10. Naija+soccer

    We can’t have a repeat of the Cesc, Nasri, RVP era, selling our best players regularly making it impossible for us to be properly competitive. That road’s already been traveled and we aren’t paying off a stadium debt this time. We are club that wants to be back on top so we must do everything to make that possible.

    It’s true we aren’t as rich as City, United, Chelsea, Newcastle but we must be smart and innovative.

  11. Valentin

    Graham,

    Spurs finance are quite opaque, nobody knows what is the objective of the owner. Nobody knows whether he will fill the losses.

    However you are right that from a financial planning perspective Spurs seems to be ahead of Arsenal.
    They have controlled wage bill ‘much better with few uninterested players on very high wage.

    However going forward I wonder if their timing is wrong. I feel that their stadium debt forced their hand in going after Mourinho and Conte. Neither are the kind of managers they usually go for.

    I hope that they are like Liverpool just of the crest of a crashing wave. Financial gravity starting to catch up with them.

  12. Upstate Gooner

    “He has all the bits we’re looking for, he fast, he can can score in lots of different ways, he has a fierce ball striker, and he’s only young.”

    He fast? Has fierce ball striker? He’s only young? Ouch… Thank god, you’re not in advertising, Pedro. Oh, wait… Well, hopefully you have an editor who proofs your stuff before it goes out of the door.

  13. Emiratesstroller

    Valentin

    Centre Forwards are the one position where clubs are willing to pay an inflated transfer fee
    particularly if the club is in urgent need of a replacement as is the case with Arsenal.

    Jesus is not a brilliant CF but he is better than you suggest. He is capable of scoring 15-20
    goals a season as a regular starter and it will afford Arsenal an opportunity to rotate with
    Nketiah.

    If we pay £45 million I think that it is a realistic price particularly when you hear the grossly
    inflated prices being demanded for players like Isak and Calvert-Lewin.

  14. Terraloon

    Valentin

    The reality is Arsenal is currently an underachieving team that has not qualified for the champion League for 5 years and has not won the league in a decade.

    Fast approaching two decades!

  15. Habesha Gooner

    Okay let’s say we walked away from the deal as you said. Who would we get that is better? It is all good saying we should only pay £30 mil but every other decent striker costs more than €50 mil.

    Man city know that there isn’t any one else that is better than Jesus in the market for 50 mil. As you say, if there isn’t anyone that will bid for him then they will accept a low ball offer. But they know he will have suitors. That’s why they are asking for that price.

    In any case if Jesus wasn’t in his year, he is a €50 mil player anyway.

  16. Valentin

    Stroller,

    I think that you are the one overestimating Jesus.

    He may be a hard worker and a pressing demon, but he is not a clinical finisher. Even in the season he played as a striker, his difference between his non penalty expected goal and scored goal was negative. So either he has been extremely unlucky at ManCity, or he just missed opportunities he should have buried. Take into account that Artetaball means that he will not see the ball in the penaltybox as often as he does at ManCity. Add the fact that Arteta will demand that he drops into midfield to help out he will be knackered and less fresh and calm in front of goal. So his numbers will likely be lower rather than improve.

    In his last few years, he has consistently undershoot his xG by 2 to 4 goals.
    https://www.givemesport.com/88013577-kane-werner-lacazette-the-10-worst-premier-league-finishers-in-2021-22

    He will be an upgrade on Lacazette, but I doubt that his output will be massively above that mark. For the number mentioned, I expect more.

  17. Upstate Gooner

    Maybe this has been discussed already (apologies, I don’t frequent this blog anymore) but why are we after Jesus at all? He’s not a target man. He’s not tall, he’s not strong in the air, and he doesn’t score a lot of headers. He’s more of a fox in a box type of a striker, and we already have one of those in Eddie. So what’s the point of signing another “Eddie” when the original one just extended his contract? Shouldn’t we be looking at someone else?

  18. Valentin

    Habesha,

    Because there is a sucker willing to pay top money and big salary for a good but not brilliant player, does not mean yhat Arsenal has to be that sucker.

    It reminds me of the Pepe’s transfer a few years ago. Having seen play in the French League on TV and physically in the Stade I was one of the few who kept arguing that he was at best a £35 millions player and he would not be able to adapt to a different system.
    Everybody was trying to convince me I was wrong and that it was the going rate. Two years later, you don’t see people arguing that Pepe valuation was correct.

    My take is exactly the same. Jesus is the wrong type of striker for us because we already have a player who can play that role in Eddie and and understudy in Balogun. At the number mentioned, it is a rip off.

  19. andy1886

    Val, I’ve been saying something similar for weeks. Why on earth anyone thinks that a player who plays for City and isn’t prolific will suddenly become prolific playing at a club that creates fewer and poorer chances is beyond me. Same old story, whenever we’re linked with a player you’ll get plenty of people overestimating their potential and ending up disappointed (Xhaka was a huge favorite in the weeks leading up to him signing I recall).

  20. Mb

    Jose Mourinho gets a letter delivered to his house in Rome. Opens it, it’s an electricity bill for £17,000 forwarded on by Manchester United Football Club.

    He calls the club – I think there’s been a mistake, you have sent me a bill but I haven’t worked for Manchester United for years.

    No Jose, sorry but there’s no mistake. You were the last person in the trophy room in 2017 and you left the bloody light ON.

    #copied ofcourse

  21. raptora

    Talking about Pepe can we think for a second before we flame Raul at any given go, that when we got Pepe nobody could believe it and people were going crazy that we’ve signed the next best thing.

    Don Raul’s car was being surrounded by fans applauding him and singing his name for delivering them a top class talent in addition to Tierney, Luiz, Martinelli and Saliba.

    Hindsight is a beautiful thing but in football not everything is exact science. That’s why I believe that in case you have an incredible DoF, you have to give the manager the option to pick between couple of available players so if a transfer ends up a success or a failure he could cary the weight of the decision on his shoulder.

    It’s why Emery will always have a point of getting hard done by the Arsenal directors. When he was brought players that he didn’t rate as highly as the ones he wanted – Zaha, Nkunku, Maguire etc., he had players he wanted to keep getting sold – Ramsey, Koscielny, Monreal, and players that he wanted sold, were kept – like Xhaka for an instance.

    In that regard, it’s fine to give Arteta whomever he wants, but he should also be judged by his transfers.

    I believe it’s the way it’s supposed to be when we don’t have a top class director like Granovskaia or Edwards.

    He wants Jesus and Tielemans, give him Jesus and Tielemans just like he wanted White and Ramsdale. But let this season be the absolute last one – Top 4 or bust once and for all. So we know that if we failed to reach the top 4 goal, we can blame him and not like with Emery – Gazidis, Raul, Diamond Eye or Emery himself.

  22. Valentin

    raptora,

    I agree with most of you points except the one on Raul.

    Raul was a chancer who should never have been brought at Arsenal. As a DoF he was diabolical at Barcelona that is still paying for his uncontrolled approach to recruitment. At Arsenal he went after the shinny new thing without knowing the kind of player he was buying.

    Anybody who had followed Ligue 1 knew that Pepe was a one season wonder. Half his goals were penalties. A quarter were counter attacking tap-in or cutback goals after the wingers Johnathans (Ikoné and Bamba) had done most of work. It was not sustainable.

    Galtier the Lille manager had devised a counter attacking system where Pepe was the spearhead. It was pzrfect for youtube highlight reels. People looked at the goal scorer instead of how and who setup those goals.

    Luis Campos and Galtier could not believe their luck when Arsenal and Napoli came calling.

  23. RP7

    Raptora,
    I agree, but let him only sign Jesus on max 150k per week.
    200k will disrupt the team salary dynamic, so that even the next manager will suffer some of the consequences.

    Otherwise, I agree with Valentin and Andy,
    Jesus is a good player, but neither great nor perfect for the system.
    I mean, are we still having Tierney lumping a trillion crosses into the box?
    Because Jesus has scored 10 headed goals in 5 EPL seasons – 2 per season.
    Now factor is the number of “big chances” City create vs our output and the picture is not rosy.

    It’s true, though, that top strikers are few these days.
    I just don’t think Jesus is a top striker, more of a quite good all-round forward player. If Pepe left, and Jesus sometimes played as RW to rotate with Saka, then I guess it would make at least a little more sense.
    But we would then still need another striker if Arteta doesn’t have the ability to transform Martinelli into a CF the way Wenger did with RVP. Too bad, considering he’s actually our most talented header of the ball based on his early exploits.

  24. Killroy-TM

    First of all it is NOT England’s Best it is England’s Worst because Best would NOT spout this Arteta BS propaganda.

    Keeping that in mind Englandsworst how do you know where you will go in the future unless you consult and meditate on your past activities? You are typifying the Arteta fan boys AFBs and are aptly called out for your delusional BS about where we are heading since it is BS it still stinks up the blog.

    Do us a favor and take a reality check.

  25. Un

    Talking of football manager
    Anyone remember D’Allesandro? Huge things expected
    Pablo aimar another
    Saviola

    All did well but not quite football manager well

  26. The Real Vieira Lynn

    Old & Wise

    I spent countless hours over the years discussing the slow yet steady decline of this club ever since the fateful day when Dein was forcibly removed from the equation…there’s no way that he would have stood idly by and watched while the stadium ruse, with it’s self-sustaining financially-contrived imperative, became the prevailing narrative…it’s clear that once Wenger was left to his own devices, albeit a managerial force of nature pre-move, cared infinitely more about maintaining his “genius” status and not allowing anyone to usurp his monopolistic control over all things club-related, than facing his fears head-on and doing whatever was necessary for us to succeed at the highest levels

    I did think that things were changing for the better when Diamond Eye was brought on board, as it appeared to be a logical course of action, if it was to be believed that there were considerable financial constraints in place…of course, we tripped over our organizational dicks once again when Gazidis left, then rebuilt AC in quick steed, and the used car salesmen, Raul, was given the nod over Sven, which led to the biggest transfer market blunder in our modern history…I guess such cock-ups are bound to occur when you have an absentee landlord in the catbird seat, thus the reason why, after all this, he proceeded to hire a couple of novice lightweights, in MA and Edu, to reinvent our organizational wheel

  27. raptora

    Valentin,
    I agree that Raul wasn’t a good director. It’s why the manager should have had a big say in who’s brought and who’s sold, unless we had a world class DoF, which we didn’t have.

    My paragraph regarding Raul is that a lot of time the fans have not much clue as most of us wanted Pepe and thought we’re buying the next Salah. You might have gotten Pepe right, but no way you’ve been 100% accurate on every player out there. What I’m saying is that we can speculate and have our preferences, but we’ll probably get surprised – pleasantly or not.

    I, myself, don’t see much better strikers that we can get for Jesus’ money, but I might be wrong. Who knows how good someone lowkey as Broja or Brereton Diaz or Jonathan David look 12 months from now.

    I don’t have a say in keeping it safe like our club/Arteta has decided to go with the likes of Odegaard, Tielemans and Jesus, but I prefer going for something with higher gains – last year’s Tchou and Gravenberch – world class talent on the verge of exploding on the big scene before the big clubs get convinced that they are the next big thing and we’re out of every race.

    Like if we wanted Vlahovic, why didn’t we go in full attack last Summer not in the Winter when he had scored 20 goals in 24 games for Fiorentina.

    Why didn’t we go for Locatelli after he was one of the stars of Euro 2020?

    So many weird fans laugh at the quality of the other European leagues, but a 20 yo Nunez was bought by a Segunda division team Almeria for £12m. Clearly they knew how good he is if a Segunda division team spent so much and he scored 16 goals in 30 games for them. After just one season there, Almeria doubled their money when Benfica broke their transfer record to buy him for £22m. After 2 seasons for them they’ll quadruple their investment this Summer.

    We have to learn to act like Benfica did. We have to learn to get the Camavinga, Tchou, Gravenberch before they explode. Emery was right about Nkunku. We need more of those blockbuster players on the cheap. Before the are worth 100m.

  28. Tom

    raptora, I think I read somewhere Almeria have a sell on clause meaning 20% or so of his transfer fee goes to them in a lump sum payment. That’s probably why Benfica are asking 80m for Nunez.

    As for Camavinga and Tchouameni, Real have been keeping tabs on these two for years, so it’s easier said than done, but yea, we should still try.

    Although we did that with Saliba and it’s still up in the air whether he extends with us or not.

    We maybe forced to sell him soon for zero gains and watch him become top CB some place else.

  29. Ernest Reed

    “ For example sell Saka for 100 million then Replace him with Gakpo/Gnabry and a striker like Savic. We ve got a replacement wide player AND a striker.”

    That’s not how you spend the money earned from selling your most prized asset. Spurs should remain the ultimate example of blatant stupidity when they sold Bale for a Kings ransom and spent it on a group of paupers – net gain of zero, zip, nada and worse.

    I would sincerely hope and trust that both Edu and Arteta are never this ridiculously dumb. Selling your most prized possession should require a plan in place to mitigate the loss of talent.

  30. The Real Vieira Lynn

    Ernest Reed

    very well-reasoned response regarding the selling of Saka…it’s one thing to follow the Pool model, when they used their acquired sell-on funds to bring VVD on board, than using monies received to buy lesser individuals…keeping in mind, that I don’t think you could get the players in question for the amount suggested, as I certainly don’t view Gnabry as a lightweight replacement…it’s like selling your house in an vastly inflated seller’s market, only to buy a shittier house for almost the same amount

  31. Ernest Reed

    Best wishes to Laca. Admittedly I am relieved that the club did not try to re-sign him as his best before date had already passed. I remain at a loss, outside of age, as to how a player can look so spent from playing as little as Laca did over the last season. Anyway, best wishes and the club moves on.

  32. EdTheREd

    If this club has ANY ambition left (apart from dumbing down supporters base) it would build everything around our only world class player – Saka.

    Everything else is just mediocrity talk. It’s enough reading posts from Arteta’s Witnesses to realise they don’t give a fcuk if we sell Saka. You’d think an elite coach would love to coach elite players, and not Cedrics, tavareses and Xhakas of this world.

    But I’m sure gaslighting from Pedro & Co will continue. What a sad state of affairs.

  33. The Real Vieira Lynn

    with the reemergence of chatter involving a move for Rashford, it appears as if either this is just more rumour mill fodder or we’re the biggest organizational who*es in the TW, who clearly don’t have a definitive plan when it comes to recruitment…maybe it’s a bit of both

    of course, I realize that we’re going to be subjected to a plethora of media-contrived nonsense, as every one and their brother is frightfully aware of our supposed off-season pursuits, but when I look around the media landscape at other teams, in a similar position, in just doesn’t match up

  34. Tom

    If Liverpool do end up with Nunez, that would make adding two young, top quality players within 6 months of each other, and probably selling one 30 something on at a decent fee ( Mane to Bayern).

    So much then for them nearing the end of the cycle talk pushed on here throughout the season by the project youth brigade.

    There’s being positive …… and there’s believing in unicorns.
    Liverpool’s end of the cycle will come with Klopp leaving.

  35. Ernest Reed

    Agreed that selling Saka is an absolute no for me. This is the one absolute untouchable player that the club should gear its future on and around. How anyone can find benefit from selling your most prized possession and he being of such a young age, is mind-numbing and just smacks of ridiculousness.

    A far better question should be fairly asked. If you can’t get said player to sign an extension then ask why that might be or is? Signing Saka to an extension makes sense on every conceivable level and if you can’t then obviously there is something not right going on at the club.

  36. Ernest Reed

    Liverpool have an excellent management structure in place Tom, they have a very real plan and remain serious about their continued success and aspirations.

    Arsenal would do well to try to emulate the formula.

  37. Ernest Reed

    Rashford is more interested in being a social and social media darling than he is being a player of anything resembling world class. His past season should raise sufficient red flags to perspective buyers.

  38. Tom

    Ernest, that they do , but Klopp is the key ingredient there.
    Just like Guardiola at City.

    These two leave and the league will instantly become way more competitive at the top.

    But Nunez to Liverpool is a bad news for Arsenal and not only because we were interested in him.
    In the last two windows Klopp signed Konate( 23), Diaz(25),……..with Nunez (22) it’s becoming abundantly clear to me the bastard is going for the quintuple next season.

    If we lose the highly coveted youngest starting Xl trophy many on here will be inconsolable.

  39. englandsbest

    Pepe is an enigma and the likelihood is that he will be gone soon enough. A disappointment at Arsenal, it will not surprise me if he is five star elsewhere, an instinctive game-changer. If so, no doubt Arteta will be blamed for not using him properly. But my mind goes back to GG who demanded players followed his rules to the letter, and created – and not inherit – a side that returned Arsenal to the elite.

  40. Zacharse

    Old & WiseJune 9, 2022 06:23:50
    “you should change your name to ‘new and insecure’”It’s why I left you out as you’re still wearing your name calling “L’ plates. Once you lose the ‘L’ you can ask for the training wheels off next.Give it a couple more seasons, though while you gat the hang of it.

    The Real Vieira LynnJune 9, 2022 04:12:13
    ZacharseI can’t even imagine being so thirsty for the wrong kind of recognition that I would actually go to the local cop shop and volunteer to be in a police lineup….you’re truly be a “special” individual

    can someone translate? L Plates? Police Lineups?

    “real viera” you can join new & insecure w your new initiate name ‘perma-teenage & joyless’

    glad to see the same old same old, thought for a second some arsenal fans might have been content to see the club end the season with overall improvement for the first time in i don’t know 10 yrs, 15 yrs???
    how lovely life is when there’s an easy scapegoat nearby

  41. salparadisenyc

    Raptora

    Only reason LG was thrilled with Pepe signing as most had very little knowledge of his abilities barring squaka and that 5 min youtube reel of Ligue 1 bangers was the price tag.

    When your club puts in its highest transfer fee, exceeding PEA by £15m for a flank man you have to have some kind of faith the system is working and the gold rush is on. I was excited by the Pepe signing this entire space was barring a very select few. Then we all gradually realised how limited he actually was matched with the meekest of mentalities. By Novemeber I was going toe to toe with Marko after calling him a shiner Sanogo.

  42. Ernest Reed

    The challenge Tom is that Nunez was “mentioned “ in rumours and really nothing more. The fact that Liverpool are targeting these players and signing them is of the greater concern. The financial outlay for those players is not ridiculous, not when you consider what Arsenal have recently paid out for Pepe and White as examples. The fact that those that Pool are signing become impact and meaningful players is more telling of how far advanced their scouting and development networks are in comparison.

    Let’s face it, Arsenal have only just recently rid themselves of the Club Wenger atmosphere where players were treated as to a Country Club atmosphere for years. I remain unconvinced that Edu is a step up on having no one and Arteta truly is still learning the ropes and struggling in in unexpected and uncomplicated areas such as squad rotation as an example. Arsenal are well behind some clubs in terms of development and it has little to do with money, they in my opinion, have no real template from which to proceed – they are learning on the fly as it were.

  43. Habesha Gooner

    Valentin
    Sorry for the late post, got caught up at work.

    Pepe and Jesus are totally different players. Jesus brings something if he isn’t bringing goals. Pep has trusted him in his biggest matches because he presses, harasses and does everything else. Pepe brings nothing if he isn’t bringing goals. And I will give you that, you were totally bang on about Pepe.

    But I have watched Jesus enough times. He is a good player. He has lost some confidence because Pep wants something different from his No 9s. I have seen only Lewandowski play a traditional 9 and succeed fully under Pep. Even aguero struggled to adapt despite his scoring return in the latter years with Pep.

    I see Jesus like Alexis Samchez. A player who works hard, has obvious quality but needs love and to be the main man. I am not saying he will succeed as much as Alexis for us but €50 mil euros for Jesus isn’t a RIP off in my book. You just feel that way because you think we should get a bargain with a year left on his deal. I totally agree the wages being discussed are too much though.

    And you haven’t answered my question, if you had € 50 mil euros to spend on a striker this summer, who would you go for? And who is better value for money and a better player than Jesus?

  44. The Real Vieira Lynn

    Zacharse

    I’m not surprised whatsoever that my comments went over your head, as based on your “contributions” this seems to be a fairly regular occurrence…not sure if you could even comprehend the dumbed down Coles notes version, but here goes…your unsolicited response to Old & New’s post, saying that you were upset that you weren’t included in what was a justifiable admonishment of several posters, was akin to someone, without provocation, going to the police station and asking to be part of a police lineup, which, at best, would be stupid, and, at worst, incredibly stupid

  45. salparadisenyc

    Its pretty clear LIverpool are light years ahead of Arsenal in terms of recruitment from Klopp’s hiring on down the line to Salah, Mane, VVD, Jota etc and likely Nùnez.

    We may have the data department but certainly don’t utilise it like Ian Graham and his team. Lets hope he’s actually left the building as was rumoured mid season.

  46. Habesha Gooner

    I wish there was someone better than Jesus on the market for that price. Even for something like € 80 mil euros you get an unproven potential player in Darwin Nunez.

    We need to find a Center Forward next season. Unless we go for a totally unproven forward like Scamacca, Gouiri, Matheus Cunha (which is just as much a risk as Jesus), I don’t see better options.

    I would have waited a year more if we had decent options at CF. But we can’t go through the season with Eddie alone.

  47. The Real Vieira Lynn

    Salpara

    there’s no doubting the fact that the Pool administrative/management teams are far superior to what’s on offer here…I would suspect that this is immeasurably aided by the fact that Klopp has a definitive tactical plan which, in turn, provides those within the recruitment office with clearly defined player specs that must be properly met long before any approaches are made…whereas no one can still define our current playing style, besides the fact that it’s overtly negative, and/or definitively state our future tactical aspirations…the fact remains, if what’s presently on offer is a proper glimpse at the tactical future with MA at the helm, his reign will end with a thud

  48. Graham62

    Pepe has been mismanaged and under-utilised.
    I actually feel for the guy.
    That’s Arteta’s way though.

  49. salparadisenyc

    Habesha

    Said it yesterday its pretty clear we will / need to be bringing in two attacking options in this window, with Laca, PEA and likely Pepe out. A center forward option and goal scoring threat from the wide areas. Not lost on most here how poorly that looks in terms of recruitment planning to have to do in single window. Big ask to find necessary quality in the areas thats most in demand with inflated price tags only rising.

    Eddie finding form and getting new deal has eased the burden but only slightly if were honest.

    I like Jeuss has the versatility we need imo, lets not forget he’s posted 2x 20+ seasons at City before the formation change. Not convinced we have the horses to sign him though with competition likely to get in on him.

    Not going to be a good window for me unless we bring in a center forward option ideally bigger target man along with a Jesus/Gnabry/Leão/Diaby etc.

  50. Habesha Gooner

    Sal
    If Jesus is signing, he won’t come in as a wide player. He will come in as our No 9. We can sign a good wide player along with that.

    I am not sure what people’s expectations are but I don’t think we will get a 30 goals a season in all competitions striker anywhere in Europe right now. Those are Kane, Lewa, Salah, Benzema from the old generation and Haaland, Mbappe and Vlahovic from the younger ones.

    The best we can hope for is a striker that can get 20 to 25 goals at their best and that can aid our wide players and our attacking midfielders to score more goals.

    And Jesus is that player. He has scored 20+ goals in 2 out of the 5 seasons he has been at man city. I am not obsessed with height that much. We need quality more than height.

  51. The Real Vieira Lynn

    Valentin

    I would suspect that very few, if any, teams would be chomping at the bit to acquire Jesus at City’s supposed present valuation of 50+M, especially considering the his goal-scoring CV…I think that any interest is directly correlated to the underlying belief, rightly or wrongly, that City will be willing to sell him at a cut-rate number because of their purchases thus far and his present contractual situation…if City were to unequivocally state that this player isn’t on the market for anything less than 50M, that list would likely be reduced to one potential suitor, us

  52. Dissenter

    The Real Vierra Lynn
    “was akin to someone, without provocation, going to the police station and asking to be part of a police lineup”
    That had me quaking with belly laughter

  53. Dissenter

    Arsenal and the fanbase have a penchant for buying players who has performed admirably or excelled at specific roles in the previous club and then place undue expectations on them to generalize those performances. We buy specialist and then we want them to be generalists.
    Partey is a case study. He was very good at a somewhat restricted roile at Atletico, we bought him and then expect him to run the midfield, when he was never celebrated for controlling games. He’s no Cazorla, David Silva or Gundogan.
    We seem to be making the same assumptions that Jesus will step up to lead a top-4 premier league attack, when he didn’t do well in that role at City.

  54. The Real Vieira Lynn

    Cheers Diss, I was actually quite pleased that little man Z required a translator at the kid’s table, as it afforded me the luxury of adding a little color to my earlier commentary

  55. Dissenter

    We need to get specialist players for specialist roles at the club.
    We seem to buy them then start fiddling about to figure out what they can do.

    We need an all out attacker, not a pressing machine that sometimes scores goals [Jesus]. Jesus seems to be the type of attacker that will score most of his goals in clusters that will be followed by long barren periods.
    If we had lots of attacking minded midfielders with goal scoring instincts, then by all means buy Jesus.

  56. Dissenter

    Habesha
    “I am not sure what people’s expectations are but I don’t think we will get a 30 goals a season in all competitions striker anywhere in Europe right now. Those are Kane, Lewa, Salah, Benzema from the old generation and Haaland, Mbappe and Vlahovic from the younger ones.”

    But that’s exactly what we need
    Even if that striker will come from a lesser league and has lots of room to improve. We are targeting an efficient presserthat scores as by product, very similar to Eddie. I hope we aren’t repeating the same mistakes we made with Laca and Auba.

  57. Habesha Gooner

    Dissenter
    Okay I am fine with not signing Jesus as long as you provide a very good alternative. Who then? I would even let you pick anyone below the € 80 mil euros pool are paying for Nunez. Puck any striker that we can target who is better than Jesus and I will listen. Just saying we shouldn’t sign Jesus isn’t a discussion. Point out some players.

  58. Ernest Reed

    You can’t help but feel that the club are going to struggle in this window. Having CL on offer remains a factual enticement to any player of real value. The selling job for Edu and Arteta is immeasurably more difficult with EL as the bait of deciding factors.

    The above is not meant to diminish either Edu or Arteta but rather point out the obvious detractor of not having an ace in your deck for negotiations. My expectations are guarded if I’m being honest.

  59. Samesong

    We seem to be making the same assumptions that Jesus will step up to lead a top-4 premier league attack, when he didn’t do well in that role at City.

    For all the hype about Jesus I am expecting him if he comes to Arsenal to hit the ground running.

  60. Habesha Gooner

    The only player I don’t know much about that has scored 20 plus league goals is Martin Terrier. I have heard good things and he looks an okay player in YouTube (I haven’t watched him play).

    And Patrick Schick is also unattainable for 50 mil. And he isn’t better than Jesus at anything else besides scoring. And he will struggle in the PL.

    Moussa Dembele isn’t that great either.

    The rest haven’t broken 20 league goals in poorer leagues. There aren’t a lot of options.

  61. Samesong

    And Patrick Schick is also unattainable for 50 mil. And he isn’t better than Jesus at anything else besides scoring.

    Isn’t that exactly what we need though? Someone that puts the ball in the net.

  62. Dissenter

    Habesha
    I like Jesus as an addition that can play everywhere in the front line but not as specialist striker
    I think we should take a chance on the Red Bull franchise players like Brian Brobbey or Karim Adeyemi. There’s Cucho Hernández at Watford who’s looked promising.

    We are never going to get a top striker at their peak/break-out point because there are better suitors than Arsenal. We have to take a chance on a striker that’s just about to burst out, not that I trust Arteta to not satiffle their talent like he did for Eddie.

  63. Dissenter

    If AC Milan can spot Rafael Leão from Lille, why can’t we look for an enterprising 20 year old with bags of pace and technique?
    Those Red Bull Salzburg and Leipzig strikers are worthy of a look-in

  64. Habesha Gooner

    Same song
    Timo Werner was a real goalscorer in the Bundesliga. And he had more to his game than Schick. Schick is a good goalscorer because he is playing in the Bundesliga. He would really flop in the PL. He is 26 and his best seasons have been the past two seasons. I genuinely don’t believe he would do better than Jesus if he came to Arsenal. He would find it tough to score any of the goals he scores against PL defenders. Watch him on YouTube and tell me if he you think he is a top player. And I have seen him play.

    The only options I wouldn’t be too disappointed with apart from Jesus this point would be Richarlison. I also like Danjuma because he scores goals and he has more to his game but he is primarily a winger.

    The others like Toney, Abraham, DCL, David, Scamacca, Gouiri all aren’t better than jesus in my opinion. I am all for ideas if you guys have got them.

  65. The Real Vieira Lynn

    Ernest

    lowered expectations is a way of life for the typical Arsenal fan ever since we moved to the Emirates, which is probably why the Blinders crew has seemingly maintained it’s membership numbers even after our former Professor left the building…I get it though, in that if I was a path of least resistance supporter I can see why you might find it infinitely easier to simply acquiesce to whatever was on offer at any given time…unfortunately, considering our Groundhog Day existence, that abject level of complacency doesn’t jive with those of us with a fully formed spine

  66. Habesha Gooner

    Dissenter
    Adeyemi has gone to Dortmund (I would have loved him though) But Dortmund are a pull for young players to make a step up like Sancho, Haaland and Bellingham.

    Cucho Hernandez is a winger. Broberry couldn’t hack it in Germany and he is going back to Ajax. So all you have suggested is a transferred player, a winger and to gamble on a player who couldn’t hack it in Germany. That is why I wanted opinions.

  67. Samesong

    He would really flop in the PL

    Werner is not a natural finisher. Scick is. There is no evidence to suggest he would fail in the PL
    With the right service he would score a bag of goals. Reminds me of a pacier Giroud.

  68. Habesha Gooner

    Same song
    I just don’t want a list. I want options that you think are better than Jesus. For example you thought Schick is a better signing than jesus. The whole argument is can we do better than Jesus at € 55 mil euros. That is the whole point. Name players that are better than Jesus that we can sign.

  69. RP7

    Habesha, you make 2 mistakes:

    1. You forget the way we play and that Jesus has scored only 10 headed goals in 5 seasons – 2 per season. Tierney’s trillions of crosses not going to be our thing anymore? Also, Jesus is one of top 10 worst strikers in the league as per goals vs xG. (the link was posted today by someone). Now imagine him with a massively lower number of suitable big chances at Arsenal. 20 league goals my ass. We can get a 15 goal striker for less than 200k per week and avoid disrupting our new ‘culture of sustainability’.

    2. You want us, ordinary fans, to find a better prospect than Jesus? Why? We have a generational coach and we must have actual professionals scouring the world for someone like, say, Vlahovic before this season, who will explode in the following months under Mikel’s generational coaching. That’s why he was hired after all, so we don’t have to spend big to get top players. He coaches up and coming talents into stardom. If he needs a team full of established players, then what’s his fucking point?

    That said, Jesus for 45M on max. 150k, I’m fine with. Unless we have professional scouts, it might be difficult to find an already obvious top talent that’s willing to play for Arsenal and under Arteta. I mean, Auba, Laca, Pepe, Martinelli, Willian — virtually all forwards have gotten worse under him. It would take a masochist or someone desperate to want to be the next guinea pig in line.

  70. Thorough

    Raul got some right and some wrong but Noone could accuse him of inactions unlike Gazidis/Wenger. And when he bought Pepe, the 2 hottest properties in the transfer market were Pepe and Havertz. It was impossible for most of us to believe we could pull it off.

    Ironically I think Pepe and Havertz careers should have followed the same trajectory. Havertz was bought ht as a playmaker but after some weeks Chelsea realized he was more a goal threat than a creator and promptly moved him closer to the opposition’s goal. We sawafter a few weeks that Pepe wasn’t the type of winger to dribble three opponents and play a pass for the striker to tap in. But oh boy the boy could hit a ball. Yet we decided we will continue using him in a role he was not made for.

    I won’t be surprised if Pepe starts banging them in once he gets a better coach. Pepe around the opponents box is something that scared the opponents. Pepe at the corner flag or in the midfield is a total liability. We fucked this up.

  71. Valentin

    Habesha,

    I do not believe that there is currently value in the £40-£70 millions bracket for striker. Most are good decent strikers, but not game changers. At that price point, you want somebody who would guarantee 25 goals per season with 15 goals in the league.
    In his best season, Gabriel Jesus reached 14 goals in the league in a side that scored goals for fun. Gabriel Jesus may have been offered to Chelsea because everybody knows they a striker to replace Lukalu and that the new owner will want to make a marquee signing. That does not mean that this will happen and even if that happen that this would be a smart move.

    In my opinion clubs are better off with a young hungry upcoming striker worth between £20-£35 millions they can mould via coaching or an elite striker worth north of £75 millions. But very few are available.

    Height and physical presence are not crucial for strikers to ManCity because they have on average 60% possession, so they still find a way to score. But in the end even Pep had to accept that in order to win the Champions League and make life easier in the league, he needed a proper N9 with height, power and physical presence.

    Gabriel for all his quality does not offer any of that. Starting the league with short strikers and no plan B striker is exposing us to the same issue against low bloc team.

  72. Habesha Gooner

    RP7
    FFS, I am not defending Arteta.

    “””” 2. You want us, ordinary fans, to find a better prospect than Jesus? Why? We have a generational coach and we must have actual professionals scouring the world for someone like, say, Vlahovic before this season, who will explode in the following months under Mikel’s generational coaching.”””

    Why even discuss transfers if we can’t have opinions on the abilities of players?

    “I don’t want such player but the team should find someone out of their ass” is such a childish view. “Just find the next exploding talent that is going to be the main striker” is a ridiculous request.

    We aren’t looking for a backup right back FFS. They need to be better than Eddie and they need to score a decent amount of goals.

    “””::That said, Jesus for 45M on max. 150k, I’m fine with.””””
    It is €55 mil euros which is £47 mil. And 190k a week reported which I have admitted is too much.

  73. Habesha Gooner

    Valentin
    Okay fair enough. I am not going to argue the “Jesus can be a good signing” point any more.

    But which are these strikers in the 20 to 35 mil range that can improve us? And are they better than Eddie?

  74. WengerEagle

    Habesha

    I’m still a big fan of Mattheus Cunha. He has barely gotten a chance at Atleti all season with Simeone preferring pensioner Suarez but has `10 G/A contributions in about 11-12 matches worth of minutes so he has been far from a flop.

    He’s a cracking player and imo has the ability to play leading the line. Obviously a gamble given he does not have a track record as a ST but he has just turned 23. TH14 was converted into a ST at 22/23.

    Same goes for Gouri who is 22. These for me are preferable alternatives to names like David, DCL, etc.

    I’d still like Jesus but if City are asking for ridiculous money and he wants £200k a week we are best off looking elsewhere imo.

  75. Habesha Gooner

    WengerEagle
    I like Cunha. Atleti under Simeone isn’t a place for that kind of player to thrive. Could be a good punt. But he would cost at least 30 to 40 mil.

    Gouiri is very good. But I would be surprised if they didn’t ask at least 50 mil for their prized possession.

    But both these players are a huge risk when we are trying to get back in to the CL.

    Jesus isn’t a risk for me. He would probably score 20 goals in all competitions and make our forwards play better too. There is upsides to those players but there is also massive risk. If they don’t work out we will have to go through the season relying in Eddie. That is why I want Jesus. £45 mil is hardly ridiculous money when you can see Liverpool bidding €80 mil for Nunez.

    Those wage though are too much. He should be on 150 to 160 k a week.

  76. andy1886

    Aguero struggled in the striker role with Pep???

    82 PL Goals in 125 PL Games under Pep, would love a striker that struggled like that. It’s two goals in every three games.

    Gabriel Jesus’ PL figures per season (Games/Goals)
    10/7
    29/13
    29/7
    34/14
    29/9
    28/8

    So that’s around 1 in every 2.74 games overall and about 1 in 3 games over the last three seasons.

    Forget cup & European goals if we want CL football it’s the PL that counts unless he’s going to win us the Europa League.

    And let’s be honest, what kind of argument is it to say that we’d sign a striker and hope others can step up and get the goals we need?

  77. andy1886

    If we really can’t find a top draw striker then I would prefer to go with Eddie and a prospect that has a different style as an alternative or even as a partner with two up front. As others have said, I can’t see the point of having more of the same on the bench when ‘Plan A’ isn’t working. Also worth pointing out that if we have a decent coach he should make them better. Just buying the best players makes you a check book manager, not a good coach.

  78. The Real Vieira Lynn

    here’s the dilemma with the whole “find me a better Striker for the same price as Jesus” narrative, it’s a rather ridiculous endeavor, as it speaks to the inherent problems of allowing a particular monetary amount to be the deciding factor when it comes to footballing decisions…just think of how much time, energy and money has been lost along the way when we’ve allowed non-footballing variables to guide our recruitment process

    fact remains, if you don’t possess a world-class scouting/recruitment team, the chances of you unearthing a whole host of gems, like a Dortmund, before their market values take a steep upward climb, is slim to none…so if you don’t or can’t choose this course of action, you either groom your own talent and functionally hope for the best or you devise a hybrid model, which is where we need to be presently

    this would requires us to properly nurture and develop a collection of in-house talent, then spend a sizeable sum in the open market to get those specific positional pieces that are required in order to challenge for things…in order for this hybrid system to succeed you must act quickly while your young in-house talent is still on “cheaper” contracts, then be constantly on the make for young flyers who fit a particular tactical script, which would be defined at an organizational level and not a managerial one, so that if you change managers you don’t have to reinvent your wheel…of course, this would require you to likewise maybe groom coaches/managers in the same capacity as the on-field talent

    so for us to compete both now and in the foreseeable future we need to invest heavily on 2 seminal players in the most influential positions, one in the midfield and the other up top, which will both force MA to abandon his negative tactical script and will likewise make those around the better purely by osmosis…to try and buck every successful trend in the footballing world is a nonsensical plan that will rarely if ever lead to the “desired” results

  79. China1

    ‘ EFL clubs could be allowed to wear their away kit at home next season under a rule change designed to help colour blind players and supporters who might not be able to distinguish between kits’

    Wow nice. Finally. As someone who is colour blind myself o can’t tell you how much I appreciate that and how much of a difference it could make – especially to the actual players

    For perspective, when I am playing, my colourblindness can cost me up to 1 second of time to process who is on my team unless kits are extremely different because I often have to differentiate based on faces. That 1 second can be the differences between releasing a winger who has now just gone offside because I was marginally too late, or it can be me getting tackled or fouled for not releasing the ball quickly enough etc. 1 second is a long time and genuinely consequential.

  80. China1

    35m and 160k for Jesus is the max I would offer (I actually wouldn’t try and buy him at all, but if we are)

    City would accept that sooner or later. There are no other clubs in for him and they don’t want him and he’s leaving on a free if they don’t. As for the player that’s a 60% salary increase and nothing higher is on the table. Even if he leaves on a free next summer, only an English team could pay him more but now will take him.

    Only arsenal can be in a one horse race but make it feel like the situation is competitive lol

  81. salparadisenyc

    Habesha

    Agree I think Jesus primary role would be thru middle but his versatility enables him to play across front three if needed. Market will dictate whom were able to get, for me this window really has the vibe of year we went in for Suarez, then Higuain and came out with Ozil. Think landing Jesus going to be trickier than we think. With a few clubs playing in the elite Euro competition waiting to pounce.

    That said convinced we’re bringing two player in for the front three with Pepe out, lets hope we get it right. Some really good options looking possible to transfer, especially wide players.

    I

  82. WengerEagle

    TRVL

    Not so much a money issue as it is a desirable destination one imo.

    No matter how much Pedro and others try to sell ‘we have the best project in all of Europe’ guff, a top class player in his prime like Gnabry or Jesus even is going to take a look at us and see that we have no CL football to offer as well as having our work cut-out to even qualify next season with United and Spurs both likely to improve.

    The fact is that we are behind at least half a dozen clubs if not close to 10 total (City, Liverpool, Real Madrid, Barcelona, Man United, Chelsea, Bayern, PSG, Juventus) in our ability to attract the best talent.

    I haven’t even named clubs that are on level footing or are below us in stature but have CL Football and a better team like AC Milan, Inter Milan, Atletico Madrid and Borussia Dortmund.

    Our scouting/recruitment needs to be beyond elite to bridge the gap and I don’t have much faith in how lazy it seems to be.

    I’d like to see more pick-ups like Tomiyasu and less like White/Ramsdale where we significantly overpay as a tax for ease of landing players.

  83. WengerEagle

    Sal

    Where do you think that Pepe lands?

    My prediction is back to Lille for £15m max. They will have officially pulled off the heist of the century there getting him back aged 27 and coming into his prime years.

  84. salparadisenyc

    Eagle

    My moneys on Monaco, Sevilla or Nice with his former boss. Financially it will not be a pretty end as you’ve alluded to, £15m on his lofty wage would be good all things considered.

    Reality total car crash on and off paper.

  85. Nigel Tufnel

    Thorough,

    “I won’t be surprised if Pepe starts banging them in once he gets a better coach. Pepe around the opponents box is something that scared the opponents. Pepe at the corner flag or in the midfield is a total liability. We fucked this up.”

    Yes, anytime Pepe came more inside on either the left or right, he looked his best.

    Defenders were scared when he was running at them in the box, they couldn’t handle him.

    We should have found a way to get much more out of him.

    One disagreement.. he had a great coach in Emery who didn’t figure it out either. Arteta did have more time to observe and work on it. But he was never going to be a player that fit into the Pepteta ball with pressing, defending and slick passing. It’s why I wanted to try him more centrally.

  86. The Real Vieira Lynn

    WE

    although I somewhat agree with your destination argument, I would suggest that we’ve been notoriously poor when it comes to the art of the negotiation…whether through the submitting of an insulting bid or by trying to secure ridiculously arduous payment terms, our club never seems to be able to properly read the room…I strongly believe that if we went to the table with a “reasonable” offer, especially considering the wages on offer here, it would be difficult for any team and/or player in question to not have their respective heads turned…instead we try to play hardball, which clearly isn’t our forte, and we invariably end up with egg on our face

    as for the Tomi pickup, I don’t disagree, except his time here has been a rather mixed bag, results-wise, due to his rather lengthy injury absences…that said, within my hybrid model, there’s definitely a time and place for acquiring those with a considerable up-side, who both fit the tactical script and have a high potential for maintaining their respective resale value…this is a far more difficult balance to achieve, on the relative cheap, when it comes to those “move the needle” positions on the pitch, which is why we should be far less financially risk-adverse when it comes to pursuing those who can reshape our footballing landscape, so long as we’ve done our scouting due diligence

  87. WengerEagle

    Sal

    Top priority has to be a starting ST, a new starting CM to partner TP and a LF.

    We also could use a reliable LB cover for Tierney which Tavares is not and another CM and get rid of Xhaka.

    So 3 players minimum we need, ideally 5.

    As an example:

    ST- Jesus/Scamacca/Abraham/De Tomas

    LF- Gouri/Cunha/Brandt/Moussa Diaby/Guedes

    CM- x2 of Bissouma/Tielemans/Aouar/Sangare/Anguissa (still gettable imo, Napoli only paid €15m for him)

    LB- Hickey/Antonee Robinson/*Cucurella (Beyond our affordability and too good to be back up to Tierney), was impressed by that fella Raum for Germany vs England. He had 11 assists from LB in the Bundesliga last season for Hoffenheim and is only 24, could be one to watch.

  88. WengerEagle

    TRVL

    Derisory bids was more of a symptom of the later Wenger era, I actually believe that we have the opposite problem of late and that we are too willing to overpay for players. We have outspent Liverpool since Klopp’s arrival for context.

    You are correct though in that things are never as bleak as they appear and we are still an extremely attractive destination in Europe for talent even if we are behind 7-10 clubs in the pecking order. That still gives us a massive leg up on the rest of the clubs in Europe outside of that top 10 and there is enough talent to go around.

    We just have to be very smart and decisive in our business. I think that Tomi was a great pick-up and he has been unlucky with injuries. If you look at his history he averaged 30 Serie A games a season for Bologna so he is not injury-prone.

  89. salparadisenyc

    Ideal i’m going big: Lautaro M, Gnabry, Zinchenko, Neves.

    Alternatives: Jesus, Tammy, Leão, Diaby, Richarlson, Aouar, Bissouma, Tielemans, Jose Gaya I adore.

    Id be lying if I wasn’t thinking would it not be nice if Gundogan decided he wanted to play alongside Partey in the Red n White in the big ones. This will never happen and thats OK. So I’ve come full circle on Neves, from absolutely wanting in 2018 to thinking he’s lacks mobility to now realising he’s perfect for what we need considering Partey fitness issues.

    Bring Saliba back and loan the madness that is Tavares out I really want to like him and theirs something there it just needs more developing than we have time for at moment.

  90. WengerEagle

    Sal

    ”Ideal i’m going big: Lautaro M, Gnabry, Zinchenko, Neves.”

    Should only set us back £200m odd! 😀

    Sadly the cat is out of the bag with Leao who has already exploded and will be on the radar of the really top elite clubs. He is absolutely tailor-made for the PL given his characteristics so I’d be amazed if one of Chelsea, Pool, etc did not go in hard for him.

    I’d have him as my no.1 LF target after Gnabry who I also believe is ungettable.

    Not as big on Neves myself and yes he’s too one-paced for my liking. Brilliant footballer don’t get me wrong but he will never be a top CM because of his athletic limitations. I’d much sooner have Anguissa, Bissouma if we are going more defensive and one of Tielemans/Aouar if more attacking.

    Ideally you’d sign Bissouma/Aouar as a pair. The latter should be cheap given his contact situation and is imo a level above Tielemans.

  91. salparadisenyc

    WE

    “Should only set us back £200m odd! 😀”

    It’s June 9 on heals of collapsing in the top four to Spurs, a man needs fantasy.

    Agree on that mid field trio, could be done for cost of Neves which then makes it the no brainer. Doubt well dip in for Bissouma with his recent issues though which is a shame considering veracity of it all.

    Gnabry everyone says wont happen, but on a deeper dive if a few things go against him he won’t have many options. Tony Soprano says Home is Home.

    Lautaro my number one, get the fuck in, I don’t care if he just signed new deal.

  92. Zacharse

    The Real Vieira LynnJune 9, 2022 20:52:36
    ZacharseI’m not surprised whatsoever that my comments went over your head, as based on your “contributions” this seems to be a fairly regular occurrence…not sure if you could even comprehend the dumbed down Coles notes version, but here goes…your unsolicited response to Old & New’s post, saying that you were upset that you weren’t included in what was a justifiable admonishment of several posters, was akin to someone, without provocation, going to the police station and asking to be part of a police lineup, which, at best, would be stupid, and, at worst, incredibly stupid

    wow thanks for explaining to dumb old me. you’re right, it is like going to a police station because you are as humorless and self absorbed as a cop. nice analogy.

  93. salparadisenyc

    Zach

    Pretty sure Zinchenko or Gaya would suffice. The latter likely put Tierney in the transfer window which won’t go down well with some here.

    Zinchenko would be such a boss signing as he could literally play alongside Partey, when Tierney shits the bed for a months or two slot in there.

  94. The Real Vieira Lynn

    Zach

    very savvy of you to repost my entire statement as it will invariably take considerable attention away from your terribly sad and totally uninventive response…maybe there’s a glimmer of hope for you yet (lol)

  95. Nigel Tufnel

    Zacharse,

    Good article about Jesus. I’ve been saying that I heard he’s not wedded to playing CF. This is why he and a bigger striker can come, especially if Pepe goes. He’d be versatile and improve us. I’d like to see him at false 9 against some tough opponents too.

  96. Gonsterous

    Anyway we can get Bernardo silva? I knoe the barca rumors are there but what a quality player. He would transform the midfield. I’d be ready to spunk 60m for him. Pepe money on a player that could be our next Cazorla

  97. The Real Vieira Lynn

    WE

    I think you might of misunderstood what I was inferring…obviously I believe that we paid above the number for Pepe, Ramsdale and White, but none of these players fit the profile for “overpayment”, according to the criteria I was suggesting, minus the fact that the latter two both play in positions which have recently seen an uptick in the open market

    now if these players were centerpiece figures, like a VVD or a Donnarumma, who both ticked all the boxes when they moved to Pool and PSG respectively, then paying a premium would fit the hybrid script,…whereas we paid above the number for a relatively unproven CB and Keeper, who checked far fewer boxes and didn’t make financial sense in light of what had positionally transpired prior to their arrivals, especially considering our far more pressing needs

    bottom-line is I would much rather that we overextended ourselves financially on a more proven “no brainer” than buying 3 different speculative reaches over a period of several years, who yielded very limited results and likely ended up “costing” us substantially more than the higher priced talent we didn’t pursue solely based on the initial financial implications

  98. Pierre

    Vera
    “although I somewhat agree with your destination argument, I would suggest that we’ve been notoriously poor when it comes to the art of the negotiation…whether through the submitting of an insulting bid or by trying to secure ridiculously arduous payment terms, our club never seems to be able to properly read the room…I strongly believe that if we went to the table with a “reasonable” offer, especially considering the wages on offer here, it would be difficult for any team and/or player in question to not have their respective heads turned…instead we try to play hardball, which clearly isn’t our forte, and we invariably end up with egg on our face”

    Though i agree with much of what Vera writes about the club’s present situation , he does tend to waffle on a little and it had me imagining what it would be like in the Vera lynne household If his wife wanted to go on holiday or “vacation” as you call it , maybe it would go something like this when his wife brought up the subject.

    Vera
    “Although i agree with your destination argument, i would suggest we as a family have been notoriously poor in the art of negotiation, through submitting an insulting opening offer to secure a holiday package by trying to pay with ridiculous arduous payment terms.
    I strongly believe if we went with a ” reasonable ” offer, especially considering our income, it would be difficult for any reputable holiday company not to have their respective head turned …instead we as a family try to play hardball , which isn’t our forte and end up with egg on our face….blah blah blah”

    At this point mrs vera lynn has fallen asleep , which is a common occurrence whenever vera has a case of verbal diarrhea .

  99. Mr Serge

    Vera it’s a football blog where we fans come together to share opinions not try and tell others they are stupid or to be obnoxious I doubt you act like this in public, why do you have to act in such a sardonic way on here ? I actually like the differences of opinions on here btw I would just prefer a little more harmony sometimes 😁

  100. Terraloon

    China

    City would accept that sooner or later. There are no other clubs in for him and they don’t want him and he’s leaving on a free if they don’t. As for the player that’s a 60% salary increase and nothing higher is on the table. Even if he leaves on a free next summer, only an English team could pay him more but now will take him.

    Think you may have missed that Chelsea seem to be going hard in on Sterling

  101. Pierre

    We already have potentially a top ( maybe elite) striker in Eddie , so it wouldn’t bother me if we didn’t bring in another striker as all that will do is restrict the opportunities for Eddie , which would be foolhardy considering his performances last season.

    I get that a large percentage on le grove fans never rated him and are finding it difficult to believe that a player they have written off for the past 2 years can actually lead the line , but we will find it very difficult to find a striker who is better than Eddie at
    1) scoring
    2) pressing
    3) linking the play
    4) running the channels
    5) hold up play
    6)finding space in the box.
    7) decision making on the ball.

    And he will only improve as he has had very limited time on the pitch, he will become more confident he will take more risks with the ball and if given the game time will easily score 20÷ goals next season …….. ……….guaranteed.

    Evidence …https://youtu.be/JgJ1XOuRHlU

  102. Pierre

    If you watch the link you will see that Eddie created 3 clear cut chances for Odegaard , all squandered ..pity Odegaard didn’t create similar chances for Eddie

  103. Samesong

    We already have potentially a top ( maybe elite) striker in Eddie , so it wouldn’t bother me if we didn’t bring in another striker

    Good points Pierre yes correct in alot of ways. However football is about squad rotation and Eddie at some point maybe will get burned out or injured, or even if he’s our number 1 to relaxed knowing that there is no pressure on him as he is the only striker for us to rely on. I said before I would bring in someone like a Toney who offers something different also.

  104. Habesha Gooner

    Zacharse
    Players always say they want to play a certain position. Gabriel Jesus isn’t coming to Arsenal to play as a backup to Saka or Martinelli. If he is coming in as a winger, I don’t want him to be honest. There are far better wingers. I think he can be a dependable striker for us. Not elite but good. Give him game time and I can see him scoring at least 20 goals a season in all competitions. I am tired of defending this point though.

    Ideal window if we can fit it in with consideration for our budget would be this.
    ST- Jesus
    LW/RW- Gnabry
    CM- Tielemans
    DM- Bissouma (if the court case isn’t serious)
    LB- any one dependable ( Grimaldo not a bad shout) or Hickey if he is dependable, Zinchenko too.
    GK- Matt Turner (already done)

    This would probably cost 170 mil before sales. And our team would hugely benefit.

    Alternatives
    ST – Abraham, Gouiri, Scamacca, Toney, David, Cunha
    RW/LW- Diaby, Raphinha, Antony, left field option ( Sinestra from PSV), Gakpo or Terrier (haven’t seen a lot of them though)
    CM- Neves, Zinchenko, Aouar, Mckennie, Renato Sanchez
    DM- Douglas Luiz, Bennacer, Sangare
    LB, Already given a lot of options but you can add Matheus Olivera and David Raum to that list.

    Those are the best options around.

  105. Zacharse

    did i miss something? what point are you ‘defending’?
    if jesus comes i’ll be unimpressed. i think there are more inspired transfers to be had….my point is that he’s not the type of CF we should be aiming at, he’s a play across the front 3 in a 433 type player who wound up in the middle for pep. he’s a top player but he’s not what would transform our side where someone like abraham, who most definitely isnt coming, i believe would.
    btw good shout on d luiz. talk of him coming to us was pretty loud a few months back and i rate him roughly on the same level as tielemans.

  106. Habesha Gooner

    ..pity Odegaard didn’t create similar chances for Eddie

    Pierre
    From the top of my head I can remember Eddie missing a one on one chance against Man United. He shot it straight at De Gea.
    This is very stupid to pick out three moments as something to prove your point.

  107. Habesha Gooner

    Zacharse
    Okay. I understand you want a different profile of striker. A big bully to be exact. But these types of players don’t have a transformative scoring records either. Tammy Abraham, in his best ever season in Serie A , scored 17 league goals. 23 over all and half of the 6 goals he scored came in the conference league. Scamacca hit 16 goals, David hit 15 goals and Toney hit 12 goals playing as a striker all season.

    Those are the big bully type of strikers and none of them hit more than 17 in poorer leagues. I genuinely believe Jesus can do that at any of those teams. And they aren’t better in pressing, holding the ball up and dribbling either. That is the point I am defending. They aren’t as transformative because they are tall. If you gave me someone like Vlahovic though I would take it.

    I like Douglas Luiz. But if we are signing only 1 CM, I want that CM to be creative. That is why I like Tielemans so much. He would instantly increase the number of goals we score because of sheer creativity from deep. But if we are signing two then I would be happy with someone like Douglas Luiz.

  108. Pierre

    If Martinelli is the player that many think he is , then surely he ( and Balogun ) can be the reserve striker

  109. raptora

    Pierre,
    You’re missing the fact that Arteta has shown firmly that he will not play Martinelli in the #9 position. Can’t be the reserve striker if he’s not considered a striker by the manager.

  110. Valentin

    Great article on the Athletic that explain the importance of proper metrics in football and how they can help identify really decisive player.

    Irrespective of the formation in which they play, central midfielders need to be able to make line breaking passes without resorting hollywood passes that never come up.
    Players who instinctively choose the right option when presented with a set of passes with different risk/rewards are worth their weight in gold.

    https://theathletic.com/3355520/2022/06/10/stats-perform-football-analytics?source=user-shared-article

    It show exactly why Xhaka who always choose the safe option especially when under pressure is not the right player for a team with Champion’s League aspiration.

    The big question that is untouched by the article is whether coaching can dramatically improve the decision making of footballers. I am not talking of margin improvement, but deep, real, permanent improvement and not just in a specific system.
    Situational coaching has already demonstrating to be effective in that players can be taught to always follows the same moves when facing a specific situation. Pepe is a case in point. Galtier devised a system where he did not had to think, just follow the same 5 moves and there will be goals.

    My question is more akin to what kind of coaching do you need to make a player answer more intelligently whatever the situation. Maybe none can exists, because football intelligence cannot be taught. The romantic in me hopes that Great footballers will always be artists. That the part of their brain that inspire their magical moves cannot be replicated by a computer.

  111. TR7

    I know Jesus has a lot of experience for a 25 year old striker but honestly for me he doesn’t offer anything that Eddie can’t. There’s no point in having two strikers who are very very similar.

  112. CG

    Looking like Tielesman and Jesus for circa £70 million will be this seasons summer signings.

    Very similar feel to the Ramsdale and White uninspiried signings of last summer.

    £150 million for x 4′ decent’ /”above average’ premier league players but hardly needle movers and players the CL clubs have ignored.

    (Sort ot players , Spurs / West Ham used to buy,.)

    Although , the young Brazillian winger, seems an imaginative purchase at a sensible fee.

  113. Terraloon

    Not sure if many are still watching the Nketiah contract situation because here we are just 20 days before his contract expires and still no official announcement re his new deal indeed you just have to wonder what the hold up is ?

    If the suggestion of £100k a week is close to being correct I think most will agree that if probably more than he is worth so what could be the problem?

    I know some are banging big drums but sorry I just don’t see it . Ok he had a good three or four games at seasons end but do any really see that he is proven enough for Arteta to accept his starting place is close to being guaranteed? I don’t nor does he have enough credit in the bank to suggest a barren spell would just be something all proven strikers have to accept.

    The chatter is still that Arsenal are looking for two strikers and if that’s correct it certainly won’t have been missed by him or indeed his agent.

  114. Leftside

    We are in a precarious position though in my opinion. Jesus and Eddie are not dissimilar but we can’t go into the season with Eddie as our option up top solely. Balogun is likely to get more games but would possibly benefit from another option so we will definitely need another capable striker of some sort.

    Can’t help but feel underwhelmed with the transfer links, but I do recognise our standing in the game in June 2022 and players would have to be willing to come and play drab football under Arteta.

  115. bacaryisgod

    Pedro’s point is reasonable that the small % outcome on the random generator to have us play no teams after Europe might have been a contributing factor to our 5th place finish. However, as a poker player, I can tell you that 3l4% outcomes happen all the time and I think it’s wrong to cast doubt on the integrity of the company without clear proof of malfeasance. Not saying Pedro is stating thatb ut I would put it down to raw bad luck over anything else unless evidence of badintentions was uncovered..

  116. RP7

    Zinchenko wants to play midfield now.

    The position he’s played a total of 3 (!) times in his career vs 117 times as a left back.

    But Arsenal should make his dream come true and see what happens LOL

    Get a grip Sal.

  117. Pierre

    Terraloon
    “I know some are banging big drums but sorry I just don’t see it . Ok he had a good three or four games at seasons end but do any really see that he is proven enough for Arteta to accept his starting place is close to being guaranteed? ”

    Actually he scored 10 goals in 12 starts , and you “don’t see it” because you refuse to believe what you see with your own eyes.

    All the Eddie doubters repeatedly said that Eddie couldn’t do it in the prem, if his performances away to west ham and chelsea, in which he caused havoc in their defences, haven’t convinced the doubters that Eddie can do it in the prem , then nothing will convince you.

    And yes he scored 5 goals in the league cup , and very accomplished finishes they were , and apparently it is easy to perform in the domestic cup comps , and yet Martinelli played 460 mins in the cup comps without registering either a goal or an assist, plus Odegaard player 320 mins in cup comps and registered one assist and no goals , so either Martinelli and Odegaard are not as good as many think or the domestic cup comps are not as easy to perform in as some think.

    The one and only reason Eddie has hardly played is down to the manager , who has admitted he made a mistake not to trust Eddie more

  118. InsideRight

    The issue for all of us is that we don’t know what is going on.

    Sure there’s plenty of media clickbait. I’ve mentioned before all the hype last summer about Maddison. Then after the window closed, Brenda quietly explained Arsenal never bid for him and there was never any negotiation for him. It was all media bollocks. We can expect the same this year.

    But if some of the media speculation has any basis in reality, I’m concerned because the names being dropped do not strike me as fitting in with a particular style of play, where they can be inserted into the line up to complement an approach and improve its implementation. It feels more scattergun than that. So I’m hoping it’s crap and nothing more than guesswork.

    People have been saying if we signed Jesus he might bring up to 20 goals a season and we would need other attacking players to weigh in with goals. Unless Arteta changes the style of play, that simply won’t happen. Jesus is not a target man who will convert crosses from wide and unless the approach play is changed, we are not going to see more goals coming from Martinelli, Odegaard, or even Saka.

    So while we don’t know what Arteta is doing, I’m concerned that him and Edu don’t either. I want to be proved wrong because I want the side to thrive and challenge for Top 4. But if past performance is any guide to what we can expect next season, the omens don’t fill me with hope.

  119. Pierre

    What’s happened to le grove’s faith in Martinelli , he is the “talent of the century” according to klopp, and yet le groaners refuse to believe he has the quality to play up top , a position that he scored a number of goals ( in cup comps) when he was used by Emery as a striker.

    Let’s show some trust in our kids because the likes of Saka,Eddie, Smith rowe and Martinelli are our best players.

  120. Samesong

    What is it with Arsenal and the lack of physical players. We need a bruiser up top not some pretty boy.

    Players like Martinelli and Smith rowe get injured more often.

    Toney is the man.

  121. Samesong

    I don’t think Eddie is going to stay at Arsenal. Maybe wrong. But he would of signed da ting by now.

  122. benkind

    Luis Campos now at PSG. For the complaint about Edu and the lack of serious football men in the club’s hierarchy I am surprised we didn’t try (based on rumours of course) for him.

    Arteta In or Arteta out, I am just concerned that if Arteta leaves today we will most likely start another process with another coach. Someone mentioned that dortmund (who we are copying their project youth, though badly with player sales) fire managers that don’t meet objective but still stay true to their approach. I feel we are building around Arteta and not for the club. Someone should have called Aretat to play Eddie long before (since we are running project youth). How are the u23, u18 playing? Is it similar to the senior team?

    Everytime I think about it I just don’t see any top manager we can attract that comes in and plays the same Arteta system. If all our eggs is on Arteta becoming like Wenger with a specific style of playing then that is crazy risky and we should really talk more about this style, future (win or fail), objective for the club.
    Arteta spoke about crosses being the game plan and yet Eddie or Martinelli who are better headers of the ball than Laca didn’t play centrally. There are so many questions about Arsebal that is not a good thing that 2.5 years into the job we still discuss Arteta more than we discuss the club.

  123. The Bard

    There is a fair amount of delusional thinking about our transfer targets. If Jesus signs for us it will be because other bigger clubs dont want him on the wages he is demanding not because he wants to come to Arsenal. We are in the second tier regarding transfers. Its my view that our signings may be a bit last minute as players hold out for better clubs and more money. If they dont come through then they will consider us.