BEN WHITE DEAL AGREED – PANIC SETS IN OVER XHAKA/ODEGAARD REPLACEMENTS

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I mean, every single time I complain about slow biz, Arsenal deal that day. No sooner had I let rip that our summer was going down the pan because Captain Edu was busy sailing on the Don Shouldwebedoingthis… we signed a player. Well, kind of.

David Ornstein revealed that the Ben White deal has clocked in at £50m, making the right-sided centre back our 3rd most expensive signing in history. For a club that took made players bring packed lunches last season to save money, this is quite the statement.

As fans, we’re in ‘if Edu is involved, there’s no doubt it’s bad’ mode at the moment… but no doubt if Liverpool or Chelsea did this we’d be praising their shrewd scouting. A bit like Ryan Bertrand causing an #ArtetaOut trending topic, until Leicester went there, and it was fine.

Whatever you think about the deal, this much is true.

He’s a truly unique talent in the way that he plays. He’s been coached by Bielsa, who plays murderball at training, he’s been developed further by the excellent Graham Potter at Brighton. He carries the ball like a midfielder, he can confidently move passes between the lines like David Luiz, and he’s now capped.

Then factor in the next most important thing: he’s robust. He dropped 46 appearances at Leeds during his single season there. He played 36 of Brighton’s 38 games last season. The guy has a body that is ready for the challenge. So, so important for Arsenal this season after watching what Thomas Partey’s unusual run last season did to our campaign. Derisk is my fave new term… and this signing has it all in my opinion.

The big question marks are the same for any young centre back with a newly minted profile: Can they do it at a big club?

Harry McG was mercilessly mocked when he went to United, he’s just made the finals of the Euros conceding two goals. Same for John Stones over at Manchester City. Whenever there is a young British centre back that lands a big move, everyone doubts them, it is absolutely standard. I can even remember West Ham fans telling me Rio was great but would struggle at a big club. I think most of that comes down to branding… when you have a boring name and you look like an 18-30s Ibiza club rep, people doubt your talent.

Changing that view is down to the player. Most Arsenal fans don’t know what to make of it, so let’s hope the plan in place is one that is sharp, because boy do we need him to level us up next season. Still, at 23, if he can do it, it’ll look a bargain in a few years time.

For me, this is a massive piece of the Arteta jigsaw. There can’t be reasons this season as to why the system didn’t work. There can’t be rogue ‘but that player wasn’t quite right’ this season. We need to see the finished product. That finished product needs ball playing centrebacks. Fullbacks that can move and deliver final balls. Creative players that can move the ball at speed and be decisive. Strikers that are finishing their chances.

Even if you don’t understand Ben White, know that he’s important, otherwise they’d have put that money elsewhere. Also, Sky reporting that medical is set for when he’s back from holiday is like, exactly what Le-Grove told you.

Apparently, the club wants to reveal the Kido Hart deal as well as the Sambi Lokonga signing. Honestly, I am really quite thrilled about Lokonga. Even if it doesn’t quite work out, the idea is right. It shows that we’re leaning into the analysts behind the scenes, it shows that we have the smarts at Arsenal to fish out value, and it once again reinforces that the powers that be took note of what old players bring to the dressing room.

The Kido Hart deal is also a superb piece of news. You can keep reading all these weirdos saying the club is crashing and Emery was a better idea than Arteta… but the kids who used to leave under Wenger are now signing deals. You do not entrust your future to a coach you don’t believe in. Kido Hart could have his pick of clubs on the continent, he chose to stay at Arsenal because he sees a future here. I think that’s fucking great news.

I still think the biggest worry for Arsenal fans is where we’re putting the money for the Xhaka replacement and who we’re going to bring in to cover for the loss of Martin Odegaard. We’re not moving things forward without those two positions being filled. Our midfield is not going to be a 21 year old in his first Premier League year.

The big rumblings are that Locatelli is the player they want. Again, he’s a bit slow, but he has so much power and craft to his game. The goss from Italy appears to be that Juventus tapping Sassuolo for a 2-year loan deal with an obligation to buy. Arsenal are sitting outside the office with two suitcases full of cash worth £40m. If you run Sassuolo, who are probably bleeding hard at the moment, are you really going to let Juve pull your pants down like that? Cash is king, particularly this season. You cannot be doing mega clubs favours like that. The club might not survive. It always feels like a longshot move… but if Juve don’t have money, that is a very difficult obstacle to manoeuvre. Can you imagine the fireworks if we managed to pull that deal off?

This is another red flag issue… if you wait 4 weeks and Juve miraculously find the cash, you are fucked, because no one else will deal.

How long do you wait for your primary targets?

What does it cost you?

Can you afford to go into a season with either of those two positions vacant?

Transfer windows for clubs like Arsenal are a moving target. There are so many variables. The job of Edu is to manage them to perfection. So far, he hasn’t always delivered, so this summer is huge.

… one thing we can say about Edu though, he doesn’t sit on money, and he will find players. Not always the players you want, but he finds them.

Arsenal play Rangers today. I’m expecting a sexier performance than the one we saw in the week, but again, calm down, it’s just a friendly.

Before I go… no one told me the new home kit had hooped socks. I am absolutely going full kit on this. Imagine me rolling to a meeting near you soon, wearing these like Payne-Stewart-plus-fours.

OI OI, listen to the podcast.

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823 Responses to “BEN WHITE DEAL AGREED – PANIC SETS IN OVER XHAKA/ODEGAARD REPLACEMENTS”

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  1. Elmo

    I think that fee puts White in the top 10 most expensive defenders of all time.

    If we have all that cash for Locatelli too, why didn’t we try and sign Saul Niguez earlier in the window, who Atletico want to get rid of? Sure, he may well not be interested in a non-CL team (same as Locatelli), but at least we’d be offering a key role to a player who is pissed about not being wanted.

  2. Gunnershabz

    Pedro

    If we pull locatelli and aaour in midfield with Ben white and the youngsters

    What do you think of the season ahead

  3. Gunnershabz

    It’s obvious we looking between locatelli and neves as that deep box to box midfielder

    The biggest dream of a signing is Nicola barella that guy is the ultimate box to box in the Kante mould

  4. Gunnershabz

    It does seem arteta looking at athlete ball carriers speed and technique

    Nuno taveres is quick and explosive

    Watching him play I think he can play attacking positions as well

    Locatelli is box to box and can drive with the ball

    Tierney is ruthless on the left

    It’s the right hand side that’s a worry though

  5. Up 4 grabs now

    Morning,

    just posted this on the last post.

    Pedro the reason why most of us are on here are so pessimistic, is that we have been here before, so many times,.and so many transfer windows.We all have eyes, and witnessed how the last 18 months have gone with Arteta,

    The strange transfer decisions, the one rule for one player while others get away with murder.
    the weird tactics in crucial games.
    players being frozen out while favourites are selected regardless.

    If we have a 200 million transfer war chest (lol yeah right) order of transfers dont mean anything your right. But when have we spent that sort of money before.
    Buying white is a great move if were flush with cash or have just won the league and refreshing the squad.
    Its a terribly bad move to make a minor repair, when the midfield needs a quadruple heart by pass and all we have left is a bag of smarties and a couple of coppers left from down the back of the sofa. to get it done.

    White is the cherry on top, right now we have no cake to put it on except a dodgy packet mix with Arteta as the master baker ( so tempted to call him another type of master!)

    when it comes to transfers, why does it still take so long to sell or bring in players that other clubs do in days but take us 4-5 weeks.

    Sorry i dont buy the dead wages story either, if were spending 200 million on players why are we worried about 300,000-400,000 pounds in salary that we might have to pay because someones on holiday?

    we blew almost 1 million a week on dead salaries when ozil was here and that was only 6 months ago.
    And now were doing it with willian,
    whose probably now slower than Xhaka (didnt think that was possible) with his beer belly!

    if we have 200 million, we dont have the excuse of needing to sell before buying so if were looking at 2-3 more players (and that should be a minimum still)
    we should still have 150 million to blow now white is in the bag.

    why are we haggling with inter over bellerin who are flush with cash from there sales by the way!
    And Roma for Mr concrete boots, over 1 or 2 million.
    its taken six weeks for that to go through, thats about 800k in salary we still paid xhaka, and its still not done!

    its great being linked with the likes of locatelli but if he wants juventus how committed is he to us that hes holding out for them?
    History has shown its been done to us before, strung along by the likes of Suarez, Benzema, higuain, aouaar, the list goes on.

    If we end up on the 31st of August doing a trolley dash it will be toxic on here.
    People have no faith in Arteta, or Edu or the board, because we’ve all seen how the clubs been run over the last ten years plus.

    fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me.
    were on about the fool me 11th or 12th time.
    if we’re all wrong, we can all hold our hands up and be man enough to say we were wrong.
    but unfortunately, history has taught us we probably wont need to.

  6. Pierre

    Said all along that if white comes we could see him at right full/wing back as his physique and game are more suited for a wide position.
    This would suit the defence more as although he isn’t dominant in the air (for a centre back), having White at full back would be a bonus as besides having the energy to support the attack, he should be good at defending the back post.
    His price has no relevance to me , it’s all bout quality and performance on the pitch.

    The Holding /Mari partnership was easily our best centre back pairing in terms of goals conceded and clean sheets , so i would be inclined to start with those 2 for the opening matches, though i doubt that will happen as Arteta has a .mental block when it comes to partnerships on a football pitch.

    Arteta did his best to split the superb Smith rowe/ saka partnership last season by putting them on the opposite sides of the pitch and i fear that he looks at centre backs individually instead of as a pairing.

    The important partnerships in the side are the 2 centre backs , the 2/3 midfielders and the wide players on either side of the pitch..full backs/wingers.
    It is also vital that the no.10 has a somewhat six sense as to where his striker/wingers wants the ball.
    Bergkamp was the master of this as was Ozil
    Bergkamp with wright/Anelka/Henry is evidence of this as was the Ozil/Sanchez partnership.

    I don’t believe Smith Rowe/ Saka/Martinelli/willock have or are unlikely to build that special on field partnership with Aubameyang or Lacazette.Balogun excites me and ,if given the chance, could transform our season.
    His movement , pace , hunger , desire , strength an power are exactly what we need up top..
    Personally I would like to see Martinelli, Balogun and Eddie fighting for the striker’s position, supplemented by Willock , but that’s not going to happen as I doubt we will be able to offload Lacazette and Aubameyang due to their wage packets , plus Arteta gives no inclination that he really trusts any of of our youngsters other than Saka..

    Pity we didn t give Balogun, ,Martinelli, Azeez, Nelson Eddie some game time at the end of last season as we had a handful of meaningless games to assess them.

    Problem was, Arteta was in survival mode and was shit scared of losing his job..

  7. Rich

    Arsenal gradually assembling an exciting young group of players

    Tierney 24
    White 23
    Saliba 20
    Gabriel 23
    Smith Rowe 20
    Saka 19
    Willock 21
    Nelson 21
    Martinelli 20
    Balogun 20

    Odegaard 22?
    Locatelli 23?
    Neves 24?

    There’s no shortcuts back to the very top, but developing a group of talented young players together, for the medium to longer term, is the way to do it

    We’ve lacked continuity and cohesion as a team for a long time, whatever happens to the manager, we need to keep this group together, then build around it

    Football squads are assembled through the youth team and transfer market, but they’re built on the training ground, we need a core of brilliant young talent we can keep together for the medium to longer term, where the majority of our improvements will be internal, rather than external

  8. Gunnershabz

    The addition of Ben white means defensively we can play inverted full backs as tierney is similar player

  9. Habesha Gooner

    Well we can’t do anything about the whit deal now, Can we.

    The issues with this transfer is that we had a young CB that was at least ready to play as a bench CB. We let him leave on loan to spend 50 mil on white.

    The fee is also way overpriced. I think he is a 35 mil player. We are once again overpaying for players. He is not the finished article yet. Similar level talents like Konate are going for 30 mil +.

    And if we don’t sign a CM and a CAM after the lokonga deal, then this will look bad. I don’t believe we have enough resources to get a RB, A CAM, A CM and a GK from now on. I feel we won’t be signing a new RB for example. We haven’t fixed priority positions. That’s why this deal is dodgy.

    Anyway on white himself though, I think he will be a good player for us. He has a lot of qualities. But I don’t think we will get value for money. It will be the same as pepe. May be not that much overpriced. But we will be getting a good player at an overpriced fee. He is an improvement though. We will have to deal with mistakes that will come from his Aerial ability and Stature though.

  10. Up 4 grabs now

    Pedro,

    “For me, this is a massive piece of the Arteta jigsaw. There can’t be reasons this season as to why the system didn’t work. There can’t be rogue ‘but that player wasn’t quite right’ this season. We need to see the finished product. That finished product needs ball playing centrebacks. Fullbacks that can move and deliver final balls. Creative players that can move the ball at speed and be decisive. Strikers that are finishing their chances.

    Pedro we were all waiting for the jigsaw quote!

    So Pedro if we dont make top four is it time for arteta to go?
    what are your expectations for this season? we all keep asking what your opinion is, or are you waiting for the start of the season?

    The Kido Hart deal is also a superb piece of news. You can keep reading all these weirdos saying the club is crashing and Emery was a better idea than Arteta… but the kids who used to leave under Wenger are now signing deals.

    Pedro the kids under wenger in his last 5 years never got game time in the league, thats why players left.

    Its great that kids are signing on.
    Now all Arteta has to do is blood one or two of them.
    if its the same old faces against Brentford and with fans back in grounds the away supporters will give Arteta both Barrels

    home games against Chelsea & city could turn pretty nasty quickly if we dont show a huge improvement on last season.

  11. DivineSherlock

    Pedro

    The consensus among many is not that Ben White isnt good or we are overpaying for him. The problem is for 50million we can nab Laporte or Torres or Varane . World class defenders . The expectation will be too much on him. , just like Pepe.

  12. Rich

    Pierre

    All managers go into self preservation mode, one of the biggest problems in football is how reactionary and overemotional fans are

    What Arsenal need to get better at is using the loan market for young players, either pumping their value, or preparing them for our first team, very few youngsters come through like Saka, straight from the academy, to play in the first teams at big clubs

    Arsenal needed to renew the contracts of Saliba, Nelson, Willock, then send them out on loan to play consistently to develop, having other clubs develop our talent for our first team, will potentially save us over £100 million in 12 months time

    Balogun is another, if we can’t get rid of 1 of Aubameyang, Lacazette this summer, then there’s no value him staying to be 4th choice and waste a season of his development

    Get him a good loan to the Championship to pick up 40+ games, then when Lacazette walks out the door for free in 12 month, we’ve got a more experienced internal replacement lined up, who won’t cost us a penny in transfer fees

  13. Valentin

    Pierre,

    Ben White in a 1v1 situation against speedy, tricky wingers is a recipe for disaster. A back 3 formation hides his flaws and enhance his qualities. RB does exactly the opposite: exposes his lack of pace and his eagerness to tackle.

    If we play a back 4 and Ben White plays RB in the first four games of the season, he will be murdered there. He will concede a penalty and/or get sent off.

    Also everybody keep banging about the fact that Ben White had played in midfield. If they were to investigate those games, they would realise that did not fare that well in midfield.

    According to whoscored, his notes in midfield are less than stellar. In one game he was the worst player for Brighton, for another he was the worst midfielder, another he was the second worst midfielder with the worst was substituted at half time before it was revealed he was injured.

    He has above average passing for a CB, but his passing is nowhere near the quality of a specialist CM. If a player is not good enough to play CM at Brighton, then logic dictates that he is unlikely to be good enough to play there for Arsenal.

  14. China1

    Locatelli looks a bit slow but if he reads the game well that could compensate somewhat. Obviously on the ball he’s really good and a big upgrade

  15. Rich

    Divine Sherlock

    Varane would cost £400k p/w in wages, we’re not doing that

    Torres + Laporte are left footed, we invested in 2 left footed centre backs last summer

  16. raptora

    Ornstein: “#BHAFC always wanted guaranteed £50m”

    So Brighton declined a £48m + £6m in bonuses to now accept clean 50m?

    I wonder if it’s £50m and there is a bonus number that’s going to be revealed when the deal is closed.

  17. Leftside

    After Ben White comes in we will probably get another GK, CM and CAM and thats that. Cannot see a right back coming and theres no need for another striker.

  18. raptora

    Pedro: “I can even remember West Ham fans telling me Rio was great but would struggle at a big club.”

    Rio moved to Leeds in 2000 and to Manure in 2002 when you were around 10 yo. Nice memory!

  19. Rich

    Divine Sherlock

    It’s a lot of money, particularly in this market

    The hope is we’ve identified a player who’s right on the verge of crossing over into a top class defender

    Maguire at 24 signed for Leicester for £12 million, then 2 years later went to United for £80 million

    Van Dijk was still playing for Celtic until he was 25

    Mings was a bit part player until he was 26

    White certainly fits the age and experience profile I’d hoped we’d target

    It’s premature to write him off, but for £50 million he needs to significantly improve us in the immediate, and then develop into an elite performer over the next 12-18 months

    Hopefully we get one right for a change, £50million can be good value, providing he becomes an important player for the next 8 seasons

  20. CG

    A reminder.

    B. White re- joined BHA from Leeds Utd.
    Played 36 games.
    Brighton HA went from 15th to 16th.

    Leeds United now in the prem without White (who played for them in the championship) finished 2 points behind Arsenal in 9th.

    Sunmary.

    Brighton HA got worse with White
    Leeds United improved markedly without White

    Conclusion.

    White will not make a scintilla of difference to Arsenal’ s fortunes this season, except to say he is obviously a better but horrendously more expensive version of the appalling David Luiz.

    The needle aint moving with White.

  21. China1

    Re white at the end of the day none of my misgivings about the price and priority of his signing are his fault

    Now that it’s almost official, I back home as an arsenal player 100%. If the transfer doesn’t work out or we fail to fix the CM then my main blame would lie with artedu, it ain’t whites fault (provided he gives 100% on the pitch which I assume he will)

    Let’s hope he proves all my misgivings wrong. All the best to him

  22. Emiratesstroller

    Pedro

    There is always a lot of negativity amongst posters regarding the club’s gameplan. Clearly
    the club were ill prepared and under resourced last summer.

    When Stan Kroenke took control of the club Arsenal were operating a “self financing” model
    with a sizeable bank balance. What was seldom understood by most fans was why Silent Stan was unwilling to invest in the team.

    The fact is that “control” is not the same as “ownership”. Kroenke had always to look over his
    shoulder at the agendas of the other shareholders and in particular Usmanov.

    When he became finally the owner of the club the dynamics did change albeit he appointed in my view the wrong people to run the club.

    I recall vividly the announcement that Arsenal would focus on bringing through players from the Academy as well as recruiting players who were considered an upgrade and
    world class. Sadly the club failed on both counts.

    Our Academy was clearly not fit for purpose and needed total change of personnel. This was
    not popular in some quarters particularly with departure of long term coaching and scouting
    staff.

    The other major problem has been that it is difficult to shift out of club players who were on
    wages disproportionate to their true worth. The process of offloading such players only
    really started last summer and has revealed just how unsaleable most of our bloated squad
    is.

    Nevertheless in response to the question earlier today I do think that there is a gameplan at
    the club even if it is difficult sometimes to understand and implement.

    We have offloaded a lot of players and now there are only three on the books who are 30+
    and on bloated wages. One suspects that the club would like to shift out both Lacazette and
    Willian, but this is proving difficult.

    There are also several others who for a variety of reasons have not a future at club. Messrs
    Guendouzi, Torreira and Saliba are clearly not in Arteta’s future plans and whilst some
    posters and supporters may be disappointed managers have always a prerogative to pick
    their own players.

    I don’t think that Arteta wants to offload Bellerin and Xhaka, but the players themselves want to leave and if their heads are not at Arsenal then their departure serves the best
    interest of all parties.

    The club is recruiting two new defenders in White and Taveres and hopefully that will improve the error prone and limited defence.

    The real concern that Pedro and I have also raised is to recruit the right type of midfielders.
    This is a department of our squad and team which has been a problem for 3-4 years and has
    been unbalanced and limited in its creativity, assists and goalscoring potential.

    We need at least three replacements this summer to cover for Xhaka, Odegaard and Ceballos.
    The DMF position is clearcut in that we need someone to take over from Xhaka. The most
    likely candidate seems to be Neves.

    The CMF/AMF position is more problematic, because Smith-Rowe is a promising young talent and bringing in someone like Odegaard or Maddison will relegate him to bench. It
    is clearly a dilemma for Arteta particularly if he wants Smith-Rowe to sign a new contract.

    I cannot see Arsenal recruiting this summer a new forward unless Lacazette or Willian are
    shifted out of the club. Let’s be honest to offload them will not generate a transfer fee and
    most probably result in a compensation package as was clearly the case with Ozil.

    I think that the process of offloading the unwanted players will take at least one more season to complete.

    Arsenal’s horizon this summer is to proceed with rebuild process and qualify for Europe.
    Hopefully that will be achieved next season.

  23. Chris

    There’s a good read about David Platt’s managerial stint at Forest on The Athletic this morning, he left the club 20 years ago today but was using methods that are commonplace today, somewhat ahead of the times.

    His man management was a bit off at times, one story was David Johnson selling his Mercedes on the spot to Platt at he training ground. Platt didn’t even offer him a lift home, Johnson had to walk home!

  24. DivineSherlock

    Rich

    Saliba was bought for the same precise reason but thats a whole othe conversation I dont wish to get back to. 50 milliion is a lot of money for a 23yr old who has played just one season of top flight

  25. Chris

    I welcome the White signing (I mean it appears to be happening so not much one can do anyway) but not at the expense of investment in the midfield, central and attacking.

    I do not know too much about Lokonga, is he the type of precocious player who could play beyond his mere years and be a big factor for us, without breaking him ala Wilshere?

  26. Chika

    The signs may not be very convincing yet, but Arteta is clearly a coach who wants to be innovative. I reckon he sees Ben White as an important piece in how he plans to set up the team , and I’m keen to see how it pans out. For the better hopefully.

  27. Rich

    Divine Sherlock

    There’s a big difference between a centre back who’s just turned twenty, and has only played 2 half seasons

    And a centre back who’s almost 24, has played whole seasons in the PL, Championship, League 2, and half a season in league 1

    If I had to take a punt, I’d say Saliba will develop into the superior player, but he’s 2.5 seasons behind in his development, shame he decided to go to Marseille, instead of taking a loan domestically

    As we’ve seen with Saka + Smith-Rowe over the last 12 months, young players can develop a lot in that time

  28. CG

    Emirates Stroller

    One Question , please?

    Why the pay cuts last year? And the redundancies? And now this sudden splurge?

    Despite Covid, and no Europe?

    THEY ARE NOT TO FIT TO RUN A KNOCKING SHOP, LET ALONE AFC

    Stop backing these charlatans and their puppets.

  29. Pierre

    Valentin
    “RB does exactly the opposite: exposes his lack of pace and his eagerness to tackle.”

    Does white lack pace ?…is Tierney quicker than White, does Tierney lack pace…

  30. Dissenter

    Pedro
    Arteta; “We had a situation in the summer with Andreas [Georgson], where he had the possibility to leave to his country,” said Arteta. “He had different reasons to do that and I understood that situation, so we needed to recruit somebody”

    Another forced replacement of his assistant manager, not the ruthless culling that you were suggesting. You were insinuating this was Arteta firing the gig, turns out it wasn’t.
    Same way Arteta will never get rid of Inaki Cana, no matter how crappier he gets.

  31. Mark

    @Pedro ” but no doubt if Liverpool or Chelsea did this we’d be praising their shrewd scouting. ”

    I have to push back on the above statement. Paying £50m for an unproven (1 not outstanding season in the prem) player could hardly be considered shrewd! It doesn’t seem like the kind of deal Liverpool or Chelsea would make, certainly not at that price. When they spend that kind of dough it’s usually on instantly recognisable proven players.

    What’s more concerning is the rumours we may still be waiting around hoping RM decide to loan Ode. again or sell. WTF kinda plan is this!!

    It’s just so ridiculous, why consider a loan again? Putting someone else’s players above your own (ESR) to develop them and have them go back. No fuckin thanks.
    Sitting around till the end of the window, then scrambling to find last minute replacements when it falls through…
    Just move on FFS!

    It seems like this could be a reason for the dallying over Aoarr,no. I mean he’s supposed to be available at a fraction of what he was last season he was the main target etc. Do why aren’t we swooping in now and sorting it? At that price it’s a no brainer surely.

    If Aoarr is not the player we thought then it raises issues on Tets judgement of players. I mean we could have spent £50m last season on him.
    Where’s the logic or plan to all this?

  32. Habesha Gooner

    I don’t think White has weaknesses 1v1 as Valentin is alluding to. That Rashford goal made him look like he can’t deal with tricky players but he is actually very good 1v1. What I am not comfortable with is how he uses a sliding tackle as defensive option. He goes to ground a lot. Mustafi had the same problem. But white seems to win his duels when he goes to ground most of the time.

    Anyway I like the player. I just don’t think he should be priority. It is not his fault he is being signed by an incompetent leadership who don’t know where their priorities lie. In the end I will back him because we need him to work for us at that price as China said.

  33. Terraloon

    ES

    I don’t know if you post using another name on Untold but you really need to be more objective in your posts because you are coming over as someone that just isn’t able to see the confusion and poor decisions that are continuing to be made at Arsenal.

    CG is spot on when he highlights the fact that there were cuts everywhere last season and even a Pedro points to the cost saving measures .

    KSE have mortgaged everArsenal asset and future income stream to generate cash. KSE is ring fenced it’s registered elsewhere but Arsenal Holdings are vulnerable . Arsenal can’t by any sensible measure afford a transfer splurge and whist we can all look at a £50 million player and say that is ambition I am staggered that normally cautious posters can’t see the folly of spending what in effect is 50% of a seasons gate receipts of the fee alone and if comments coming from Brighton supporters are correct he is going to be on between £150&£200k a week

  34. Marc

    I’m not going to criticise Ben White – I’ve seen him play but cant’ remember him at all. He could be a fantastic player.

    What I will question is spending that amount of money on a CB when we have no midfield. The argument being put forward by Pedro is that our system HAS TO HAVE a CB who can progress the ball like David Luiz.

    That would be a perfectly reasonable viewpoint if it weren’t for the outpouring of rage on here (supported by Pedro) when we spent a net £3 million signing Luiz 2 years ago. We had people adding in his salary, NI contributions, VAT, made up numbers, made up agent fees and Christ knows what else into the cost of the deal. When have you ever seen a transfer value quoted that include anything other than the fee?

    My worry in all of this? Arteta is a defensively minded negative coach, if we ended the season with a negative goal difference but had conceded the least amount of goals in the PL he’d see that as a great season – and Pedro would put up arguments about the “process” working.

    Ultimately I won’t judge the player until I’ve seen him have a reasonable run of games for us but if we don’t fix the midfield Arteta, with fans in the ground will be lucky to see the end of October.

  35. Chika

    Leicester City are reportedly demanding an astronomical fee for Maddison. What I also like about Maddison is that he offers goals from midfield, something we painfully lack. His set piece delivery is also impressive. If indeed he’s not in good terms with Brendan, that should knock off few millions from the fee.

    Tavares, Lokonga, White, Maddison, Neves and a back up keeper would make a solid window.

  36. Emiratesstroller

    CG

    The redundancies and paycuts at Arsenal are no different from what is happening throughout the economy and everywhere on the planet.

    My daughter who is a senior manager at a FTSE 100 company with resources more than 10x
    larger than that at Arsenal went through similar processes before Christmas.

    It was at the time stressful, but she survived the cull and the company now recognise that
    they need to look after properly the staff who remain.

    You may not like what has happened but sometimes a business needs to undertake a review
    of its modus operandi. I was told long before the redundicies that Arsenal’s Academy was not fit for purpose and well below the standards of our major competitors so what happened
    is not altogether surprising.

  37. Marc

    I always considered Emiratesstroller as one of the more balanced reasonable posters on here. I didn’t always agree with him but there was always a degree of logic or common sense behind what he said.

    Lately he seems to be losing all objectivity and refuses to look at what are clear facts around the club.

  38. Champagne Charlie

    Pedro

    Re: Locatelli and the loan vs cash you talked about…

    I totally understand why Sassuolo would want to deal with us vs Juve, my issue is that ordinarily the deal would be done because the offers are such opposites. Why isn’t it done? Because Locatelli is desperate for Juve (unsurprising).

    That’s the bit I’m not in love with, is he really so good we want to strong arm him here, or wait until the last minute out of hope? Idk about that, much rather we took more control over the timeline of transfers and sought guys eager to join.

    Same story with Odegaard, I rate the player but he’s certainly not the only option, or someone to hang a summer on. Bin that and schedule a meeting with the Leicester execs Monday morning.

  39. Dissenter

    Paying £50-55 million for a central defender with one year of premier league experience cannot be considered shrewd scouting. White had a good season in the championship with Leeds but there was nothing special about him last season.
    Liverpool paying £35 million for Konate who has CL and EL experience, …that’s a sweet deal.

    We are vastly overpaying for potential.

  40. englandsbest

    Surprisingly it seems that Arteta is focusing on the defence rather than midfield. Let’s hope a more suitable GK than Leno is on his list.

    Early days yet, and no doubt a top-class midfielder will be signed or loaned. But the conclusion is that ESR, AMN and Willock will be retained. I like the idea of keeping home-rown players. I expect him to keep Nketiah.

    As to the rest, that will depends on who he can offload.

  41. Valentin

    Pierre,

    Tierney is the model Fullback, is not to talk so he can turn quickly, has pace on the ball, has stamina to go up and down for 90 minutes, and can cross.

    Ben White is very good as a wide CB in a back 3. He can intercept, be aggressive in the tackle because he has the security of somebody behind him. Because of that extra security on the ball he can step up into the midfield helping the whole team to push higher.

    As a RB he can’t do that. With his lack of pace, he will get caught on the break. He will then try to dive in to correct the issue and give away a penalty or grab a player and get sent off.

    Against England, Chiellini who is an excellent CB was caught in the LB position against Saka. The quality requires for a good CB are not the same than for FB.

  42. China1

    Arsenal may well have been right to cull some staff. Got knows we have plenty of mediocrity in the playing squad and management team. The issue is more that arsenal have a totally haphazard and dumb way of approaching it so it’s hard to believe there is any method in the madness

    Lay off gunnersaurus to save a couple of pennies whilst offering monstrous wasters like mustafi a new deal. Laying off the scouts only to want to hire scouts again several months later

    Most of the places we made cuts were to making relatively irrelevant savings in the grand scheme of things whilst the club still found massive amounts of money available to set fire to for our pot bellied Brazilian winger

    Fortune 500 companies are usually far more ruthless than that and try to make cuts where they think it will make a difference rather than cutting their monthly energy bill by £15 whilst simultaneously going on frequent binge drinking sessions at swanky bars and buying all our mates a round

  43. Dissenter

    If it’s true that Aouar is available for £20-25 million then that’s is a no-brainer since he was the desired target for last summer. We waited for him until the last moment so why hesitate to sign him now.
    He’s better value currently and needs the challenge to make a play to make the French squad for the next WC.

  44. Karsa

    I suspect business decisions made at the beginning of a pandemic, when estimates of a effective vaccine were measured in years. would differ from those made with 90% of the adult population vaccinated and 60,000 in stadiums.

  45. Emiratesstroller

    Marc

    Please explain what is my loss of objectivity?

    The club is undergoing a reorganisation which few people who support the club will disagree with.

    I have been a critic of the owner, the Board and management at the club. Kroenke has made
    changes since he took over as Owner. You and for that matter I may agree or disagree what
    has been done, but before passing judgment you need to it time to prove itself.

    Kroenke appears to have made a clear commitment to club. Time will tell whether the decisions and changes he has made will succeed.

    Arteta and Edu know very well like every other manager and director what will be the
    consequences if they fail to deliver. They will lose their jobs.

    What I do know is that Arsenal will survive. In contrast to most posters I am by nature “optimistic”. Unlike most of you I have seen good, bad and indifferent teams at the club and
    similar levels of success.

    It is part and parcel of being a supporter.

  46. CG

    ES

    ( thanks)

    ”””CG The redundancies and paycuts at Arsenal are no different from what is happening throughout the economy and everywhere on the planet

    My daughter who is a senior manager at a FTSE 100 company with resources more than 10x
    larger than that at Arsenal went through similar processes before Christmas””””””

    WRONG!

    No other club in the premier league asked for the wage cuts and if they had to – I am sure they would not have the nerve to be spending £50 000 000 on ‘whathisname’ from Brighton HA soon after.

    You think this is how you run any business?

    One moment , we are needing to sell ( Martinez) and make Bosmans signings( Cedric, William etc) and the next we are on a shopping spree?

    Arteta , is clearly out of his depth- but no one can manage Arsenal competently when the parameters change all the time. ( except for A. Wenger, off course)

    So , will the club have money next July or will it back to wage cuts?

    ps. I hope your daughter got to keep her job.

  47. China1

    I’d rather white is CB than RB. At Rb he’d be another chambers

    I also hope we’re playing 4 at the back. 3 at the back is perfectly workable but personally I don’t like the formation

    I don’t like the idea of wingbacks. Always feels like an admission that you don’t trust your CBs and also suggests a lack of willingness to have genuinely front foot wide players on the pitch

    It can work 100% but I’d much prefer a 4-2-3-1 or a 4-3-3 personally

  48. Marc

    China

    That poses an interesting question. If Mustafi had accepted the new contract offer would we have signed White?

    If the answer is no then spending that much to replace a player a bad as Mustafi is madness. If the answer is yes then clearly Arteta is stark raving mad.

  49. Dissenter

    Maybe Perriera is a better value than Aouar but it’s too obvious for Arsenal.

    I’m no longer keen on Locatelli because he isn’t keen on Arsenal. We shouldn’t have to grovel to any player. He’s not the only fish in the pond.

  50. Terraloon

    ES

    How many other PL clubs saw their players take a pay cut?

    Two , yes just two clubs borrowed £100+ million from HM government to ease cash flow . Neither of those two clubs had the cash on hand to pay back these loans so both have had to increase their commercial borrowings to pay back the Government.

    Even to the most blinkered it surely must be obvious that Arsenal can’t afford a transfer splurge. KSE aren’t injecting their money they are loading debt on the club. Now of the money was being used to fund infrastructure then maybe just maybe but what appears to be happening is they are going all in.

  51. DivineSherlock

    Rich

    Please , shrewd scouting is Leicester scouting Soyuncu . Meanwhilw we went for Sokratis . Also the left foot – right foot CB thing is overemphasised. Spain played both Laporte and Torres at CB, dont think they had any problems.

  52. Marc

    Emirates

    You don’t seem to be able to differentiate between the Kroenke’s having money and Arsenal not. It doesn’t matter how much the owner has.

    I have never suggested for a second that Arsenal will go bust but when you have a business that’s losing money hand over fist throwing money haphazardly at the problem is not a solution.

    In fact it’s likely going to make the situation worse.

  53. Valentin

    Habesha,

    As part of a Back 3, Ben White can be aggressive and on the front foot. So he has a lot of interception. When he misses, he still have somebody to cover for him.

    Against most team, Brighton is a lot more defensive than Arsenal. If Arsenal wants to score more and win more games, Arsenal will have to be a lot more attacking. Bar against top 6 teams, Arsenal will have to be a lot more on the front foot. Especially against team playing a counter attacking low bloc.

    So as a RB, often Ben White will be on recovery mode. Coming back from an attacking position and getting back into position to stop an attack. He will be a lot more exposed than as a CB in a back 3.

  54. TR7

    If I were Arteta, Maddison would be my top priority. He is PL proven, can distribute the ball well, good at long range shots, and athletic.

    I am not sure Locatelli would hit the ground running, looked ineffective in Euro although I agree he has good technical skills. Still a riskier signing than Besides he does not even want to come to Arsenal.

    Odegard just not good enough for me. Slow, little acceleration and doesn’t really change a game.

    We should absolutely focus on getting Maddison.

  55. Marc

    Karsa

    The way the media is going at the moment we’ll see a return to lockdown in the next few weeks and months if not another whole season without fans in the ground.

    It’s scaremongering of the highest order.

  56. Marc

    TR7

    I like Maddison as a player but buying talent from the PL is not an efficient use of our funds. Leicester don’t need to sell and won’t won’t to strengthen a competitor for EL places.

    He will cost a fortune.

  57. Dissenter

    If Madison was the priority then we shouldn’t have spent £50-55 million in a defender when we had Saliba.

    It’s almost impossible that we are going to pursue another big transaction this summer without selling.
    Maybe if the sell Willock, AMN and ESR, they can use the proceeds to buy Madison.

  58. Emiratesstroller

    Terraloon

    There are plenty of football clubs in England and elsewhere who have been making cuts and
    financial savings.

    The idea that mega rich footballers should not take a paycut when a club is struggling financially is frankly ridiculous. Do you seriously believe that other businesses did not adopt
    similar policies?

    Losing your job is always painful. My one criticism of the decisions made at Arsenal was
    the redundancy of Goonerssaurus. That was quite unnecessary and could have been handled differently.

  59. WengerEagle

    I’m with Marc in that I am not going to talk down on White as a player, I honestly haven’t seen him nearly enough although I do seriously worry about him aerially.

    And I am going to give Artedu the rest of the window before fully passing judgement but all I can say for now is that our prospects to reconstruct CM do not look great with us already having spent £60 million without taking in any sales fees.

    Locatelli/Odegaard feels like Aouar last summer, spend all summer barking up the wrong tree only to enter the season short.

  60. Emiratesstroller

    CG

    You and I have a difference of opinion and lets leave it at that.

    Yes my daughter kept her job and is now grossly overworked. She works in Global Communications and her day starts with dealing in Asia [including China, Hong Kong, India
    and Japan] and ends with North America in the afternoon and evening.

    However, what she has learned from the experience is the importance of a secure and well
    paid job.

  61. TR7

    Tavares is good going forward from what I have seen of him on YT. He is fast and can dribble. He needs to improve his touch and balance though. Good raw ingredients for someone who was bought on cheap.

  62. WengerEagle

    A partner for Partey in the middle is a bigger priority than a CAM and should be the very next player that we are pursuing.

    We neee both but being realistic, I don’t expect to see us buy a new CAM unless we sell Willock to Newcastle.

  63. James wood.

    I have no memories of Ben White in my head.
    I have lots of Tyrone Mings.
    Half the price of WHITE.
    Perhaps when AVcAV came calling for ESR we should have countered with an offer for Mings.
    Preferred by Southgate till MAGUIRE got over his knock.?

  64. Terraloon

    ES

    You just don’t get it do you.

    Yes clubs in the EFL National League, Southern League etc etc put players on furlough but you point me in the direction of any of those clubs that will be looking to spend or should I say borrow the sort of money that Arsenal will be doing to spend on transfers.

    As Marc says you have lost objectivity. Why did the Arsenal players agree to a pay cut as opposed to say Chelsea ? It was sold to the players because of a cash crisis that was ensuing particularly at Arsenal where to support the lack of cash the club had to borrow £120 million.
    The question about mega rich employees taking a pay cut is a whole different matter but no other PL clubs saw wages cut.

  65. WengerEagle

    United will probably sign Varane for less than we paid for White is the reality.

    Already have Sancho. Heavily linked to Camavinga.

    Top 4 is going to be extremely difficult.

  66. Rich

    China1

    We play two formations in and out of possession

    2-3-4-1 in possession

    4-5-1 or 5-4-1 out of possession

    Tierney was our most creative player last season, in possession Xhaka would move to the left to cover Tierney, then Tierney would create the overload

    We played different variations of it, and sometimes we’d mirror it with our right back kicking on, and Saka would play as an inverted no8 in possession

    But the whole point is to get 5 players into the attacking third, and create territorial dominance in the opponents half, and it worked quite well at times after Xmas

    It’s why I’m not surprised we’ve signed an elite athlete, with elite recovery pace, who’s strengths seem to be attacking, as competition for Tierney

    The drop off in attacking output down our left without Tierney, was massive

    We were doing different variations of this in possession

    ………………….….Leno
    …………………Luiz Gabriel
    Chambers Partey Xhaka
    …,.,…Odegaard Smith-Rowe
    …..Saka…………………Tierney
    …………….Lacazette

    Then out of possession

    …………………..….Leno
    Chambers Luiz Gabriel Tierney
    Saka Partey Odegaard Xhaka SR
    ………………..Lacazette

  67. Terraloon

    Es

    Not sure how these two comments fit

    “It was at the time stressful, but she survived the cull and the company now recognise that
    they need to look after properly the staff who remain.”

    “ Yes my daughter kept her job and is now grossly overworked.”

  68. Habesha Gooner

    Valentin
    White isn’t slow. Have you seen him play? Pace is actually one of his attributes. I bet he is faster than every CB we have. Gabriel might give him a run for his money but no one else matches him for pace. And he seems to have done fine at Leeds in a back 4. So much so that he was one of players of the season in the championship and ultimately Brighton had to reject a 25 mil bid for him.

    His weaknesses are actually going to ground often (which isn’t good for a CB. And he lacks height so he might be beaten in the air. Other than that he is a good player.

    I get that no one thinks he should be signed and we need to look at our real priorities. I think that too. But slandering the player on what he is good at is not making a point about our priorities.

  69. Marc

    Terraloon

    Emirates is all over the place – the club will spend a fortune because we have billionaire owner but the same billionaire owner wouldn’t make sure all the staff were paid.

    There’s a world of difference between outing under performing staff and some of what we did.

  70. Rich

    Dissenter

    Yeah seen it, what an athlete, he’s absolutely rapid, and physically looks like he could become dominant

    He’s likely going to be raw positionally and tactically, most 21yr olds are, but if we’re successful in ironing out those creases, then he looks to have all the raw ingredients to become a brilliant modern day left back

    Low financial risk, with a potentially big upside, I’d much rather a signing like this, rather than another player in their thirties, looking for one last big payday

  71. China1

    If arsenal can afford to blow 100+m bet this summer we could absolutely afford to pay people’s wages in full.

    Classenal was the old term wasn’t it? Man that one always made me vom a bit in my mouth

  72. Karsa

    Marc.

    It’s scaremongering of the highest order.

    It is. Fear sells papers and grabs viewers and that’s all the media cares about.

  73. WengerEagle

    TR7

    Bench of Martial, Greenwood, Van De Beek, McTominay, Fred, Wan Bissaka, Telles, Lindelof.

    Lot of depth there. Although I would be surprised for them to give up on Wan Bissaka at RB so don’t see Trippier brought in.

  74. Rich

    WE

    White 23, £50million, reported £120k p/w

    Varane 28, £50million, reported £400k p/w

    Net spend doesn’t really mean anything, you need to take into account for wages, length of service, age profile

    One transfer is worth potentially £154million over 5 years, at which point the player will be 33 and at the end of his career

    One transfer is worth potentially £81,200,000 over 5 years, at which point the player will be 28, and should have another 4-5 years playing at the top level

    Both transfers will clock around £50 million fee, but the costs and metrics around those investments are chalk and cheese

  75. Marc

    Rich

    Your numbers don’t take into account what impact the signings will make on the clubs performance. ManU will be in the CL places at the end of the season Arsenal will not.

    It’s strange that the “positive” people on here who think we’ll spend a lot of money also think 5th will be a good achievement.

  76. WengerEagle

    Rich

    So they’re set to make a 28 year old CB in Varane their highest earner on 400k a week? I seriously doubt that.

    Pogba earns 290k a week and he has been there half a decade and is a more marquee player than Varane.

    Expect Varane’s wages to be around the 250k a week mark.

  77. TR7

    WE

    Top 4 chances look really bleak. City, Pool and Chelsea are way ahead of us. United will spend their way in to top 4 again. Leicester have added Soumare and Daka. I don’t even understand what we are doing.

  78. WengerEagle

    Just looking at some of the wages at United is eye-watering.

    De Gea is on £375k a week and he hasn’t even been starting.

    Sancho just turned 21 is on £350k a week.

    Rashford is on £200k a week, Martial is on £250k a week!

    I remember when it was a massive deal that the bery best players in the world in their positions like Henry and John Terry were on £100k a week deals, now you have not much above average players like Rashford on 2.5 times that.

    What a time to be a PL footballer.

  79. WengerEagle

    TR7

    Chelsea are a Haaland away from being title contenders, never mind top 4. I doubt Abramovich will even blink before shelling out a club record fee for Haaland.

    United will also push City.

    Liverpool have added Konate as well as having Van Dijk and Gomez back. They need to add a CM and a ST but even as they are, easily a top 4 side.

  80. Up 4 grabs now

    Honestly, if you said a year or so ago we were splurging 50 million on a centre back
    most fans would be over the moon.

    But most of us on here are so dismayed with whats happening on and off the field it barely registers.

    we havent won the league in almost 18 years, thats the length of time from the double in 71
    To, “its up for grabs now” at Anfield in 89.

    we havent really competed for the league in 10 years, (we were never competing with Leicester a few years back.)
    we’ve needed a major reboot in that time, and its always half arsed done. were always 2 or 3 players short to compete again, a year or two down the line were in the same boat, wash rinse repeat.
    we get one department sorted but are always missing in another.

    Wenger takes a huge chunk of the blame as he was here for so long and let us deteriorate so much.
    Emery had his hands tied with little time, or power. and that first transfer window he had was a joke.

    Arteta for the first six months was in the same boat, but hes had a full season now and this is his 4th transfer window.
    if we are not within 6-8 points of fourth by Christmas he’s toast.
    considering the start we have, im not holding my breath.

  81. Rich

    Marc

    I think we’ll spend, providing we can get players out, and keep our wage bill and squad size in check, I don’t for one moment expect KSE to green light deals that put our wage to turnover ratio in a completely unsustainable position

    We’re not currently operating in the same sphere as Man United, they have CL football, and revenues that completely eclipse ours

    They’ll be looking to go from second to first this season, and to at very least be competitive in the CL

    We’re at a lower ebb, what I want to see, is for Arsenal target 3-4 first team players in the 22-25 age range, who have a decent amount of experience, provide an instant uplift in quality, who we can build around for the medium to longer term, and where much of our improvement over the next few seasons, will be internal, rather than external

    Realistically we’re trying to put a team together to sneak into the top 4 this season, but who grow together and compete for the title in 2 seasons time, and who stay competitive for a few seasons after that

    Putting a squad together of young and hungry players who are growing together, is our way back to the top, signing older players on extortionate wages with no resale value has been a disaster , and there’s certain clubs we’ll never be able to compete with playing that game anyway

  82. WengerEagle

    Up 4 Grabs

    It’s been 17 years since we won the league. We used to mock Liverpool for going 30 years, would anyone really bet serious money against us going another 13+ years?

    We have never been further away. Even if every move we made from now was perfect and the top sides regressed, we are 4-5 years away at an absolute minimum.

  83. Matt

    Season starts in less than a month. So much still to do and what some people seem to be missing when they say lost of clubs haven’t done much business, is that we needed to do so much more as we were so much first get behind. It now looks like we have signed White, which could be a good signing, but where are the goals coming from? How is that fat Brazilian waste of space still making appearances for his club?

    Finally, that new kit is awful. I don’t get the love in for it at all. Of all the leaked kits that were apparently out new home shirt, i think the actual one is the worst. It’s An absolutely muddled mess of ideas. Much like the clue I suppose so in that’s respect it does suit this Arsenal team.

    Cannot feel positive whatsoever about this coming season.

  84. Up 4 grabs now

    WengerEagle,

    Have to agree mate, we look miles away from top four, let alone competing, and god forbid winning the league.

    i know people say oh we only finished six points from 4th last season. its 2 wins.
    yes thats true and we dropped plenty of stupid points last season.

    but we look weaker now than last season, and everyone else in front of us will strengthen.
    With a defensive manager as well im not holding my breath.

  85. Rich

    Arsenal starting 11 vs Rangers

    ……….….Okonkwo
    ..…..Holding Mari
    Soares …………….Tavares
    ……….Partey Elneny
    Pepe Smith Rowe Aubameyang
    …………..Balogun

  86. Habesha Gooner

    United will be a manager away from being title contenders with Camavinga, Sancho and Varane. They will do well to get all three of them.

    One positive for us though, all the players we are targeting are under 25. That means in two to three years time they will hit their peak. Saka, ESR, Martinelli, Balogun, Lokonga, Tierney, Tavarez, Gabriel, White, Saliba, Willock all under 25. Even Pepe and Holding are around 26. Which means if we make the right signings then we might become a very good team if we have the right manager. And we can sell some players that don’t work out. Rinse and repeat.

  87. englandsbest

    Practically all teams used the same set-up back then – 4 at the back. 3 in midfield, 3 up front. Arsenal was one o them. A sensible set-up that supplied width as well as depth, Two wingers and a centre forward. two wing backs, one central, two centre backs, two full backs, and, of course, a GK.

    Simple but effective. Would the system work now? Damn right it would -providing you had the right players in the right positions.

  88. raptora

    CC: “Why isn’t it done? Because Locatelli is desperate for Juve (unsurprising).”

    You were arguing that there isn’t much player power when a certain deal is higher than the other one regarding Buendia and Villa/Arsenal and how a club will not sell a player to a lower bid just because the player prefers that team compared to the higher bid. Now you are saying the opposite. Which one is it?

  89. Leftside

    United are not a shoo-in as long as Ole is in charge there. As Habesha says, if they get in a real manager then I’d be really worried. So that is our only real hope but it’s going to be incredibly difficult to get into the CL.

    I will be beyond fuming if it emerges that we have no more funds and have to sell to buy once the White transfer goes through.

  90. Up 4 grabs now

    Got the feeling that willock will be one of our “new”midfield summer signings.

    Arteta seems keen and he possibly will rotate with smith rowe.
    the fact we passed up Buendia, still surprises me, that 32 million could be a bargain.
    then Aoooar is available but we dont want to spend 25 million?

    deals that could have been done weeks ago, and we’re hanging on to see if odegaard will get a game at Madrid, if not he might deem us good enough.

    no thanks, you either want to come to arsenal or you dont, if you dont move on

  91. gatordeg

    Sign Aouar now. Price is right and Arsenal gets a creative mid. Get the Xhaka deal done and get Neves. Sell Bellerin and buy Aarons. Get backup gk and ready for season.

  92. Up 4 grabs now

    leftside,

    im confused why is united not a shoo in.
    last season they finished second, 8 points clear of fifth
    the year before they finished third 4 points clear of fifth

    they are only going to strengthen again. and ole got those finishes

    id say shoo in?

  93. Leftside

    Gatordeg, thats what you do when your serious about competing and climbing back up the table.

    When your content with mediocrity you wait around to see if Odeegard will get a game in August (because if he doesn’t start that month he will come back to Arsenal) or you pin your hopes on Locatelli who may have to be dragged in kicking and screaming.

    There is always a reason to be so slow and reactionary. We can’t do another season without CL in my view.

  94. Habesha Gooner

    I don’t get the story about loan deals involving willock. Either we have to use him or sell him. His value might not exceed than what it is now because of his goalscoring form for Newcastle.

  95. Leftside

    Up4grabs; nevermind that Chelsea started well, nose dived before rallying again, or that Liverpool had a serious injury crisis the whole season. Even City didn’t start that well, Leicester have been in contention right until latter stages before falling away.

    United’s second place finish is an artificial position, a large chunk of their fans that I unfortunately have to be around state that too but you get a lot of Arsenal fans shooting their load over them. It kind of reminds me of when we came 2nd in a two horse race between Leicester and Spurs.

  96. Leftside

    Main point is, with the squads that City, L’Pool and Chelsea have coupled with their managers they should have the first three places sewn up. United have some good players but there is more of a chance there as I don’t rate their manager. As much as I don’t rate Arteta I rate Ole even less.

  97. S Asoa

    Varane deal is for 50 million. Same as for er White ahem. Varane salary is 197000 pounds weekly at RM. Deal is stalled because wantsa salary of 40000 pounds demand. Likely might be finalised at 250000. So caviar and potato for around the same price

  98. Dissenter

    We spent all of last summer pursuing Aouar and letting Jean-Michel Aulas jerk us around.
    Now that he’s available at 50%discount, we went to Lyon to kick tires.

    Some one needs to tell Arteta to get over his Odegaard fetish.

  99. S Asoa

    Reading the blog one gets into psychodynamics mode. Case of Freud little Hans comes to mind and a pernicious sexuality driving the narrative. There is no other explanation for the persuasive arguments except another take.
    Was and still is my hero for achieving this successful and dynamic blog.

  100. China1

    £8 for a preseason friendly???? Are you having a larf?

    Official league match streams here vary between free and £1.

    I guess the club needs to fund white somehow lol

  101. Up 4 grabs now

    leftside,

    Two seasons in a row he got lucky, maybe he gets lucky again this year.
    i agree Chelsea, city and the bin-dippers have top three on lock-down in my opinion.
    Leicester keep fluffing there lines the last 2 seasons maybe this year they dont choke?

    united if they get the players there linked with will be mighty strong.
    even with ole in charge.

    currently i dont see anything from us to bridge that gap to 6th let alone 4th!

  102. Mb

    Champions League football is bare minimum. In Arteta’s worlds, this club deserved much more than playing in the Champions League!

  103. Leftside

    Up

    Its so depressing lol, at best 4th is a lot better than where we have been frequenting as of late but still very meh. Leicester at some point will keep their nerve, we just need to hope they don’t this season as they are now a firm rival for CL places.

    If United get Varane in along with Sancho that is a great window. I don’t think Camavinga will land there and it is also a plus if they can keep Pogba another year or get him to sign renewed terms.

    I definitely think we have an underperforming squad that are capable of more and 6th is at least within reach but thats of no consolation to nobody. We need to be dining at the big table, this baby booster seat isn’t the one.

  104. Up 4 grabs now

    Left,

    i think your right the squad is under performing, and a better manager would get more out of them.
    thats the risk of going with a rookie.

    I think of Emerys first window, after 22 plus years of Wenger we spent 68 million on 5 players
    to renew a team that had finished out the top four 2 years running.
    there were clubs like fulham west ham wolves spending double that.

    we havent fixed the problems from 3 years ago and by the time we do there will be something else

    Even if we buy another 2-3 40-50 million pound players i think under arteta we still wont hit top four.

  105. Marc

    Personally I think the biggest reason I’m struggling to get excited about Arsenal at the moment is beyond a nagging feeling that under Arteta it’s going to be same old same old the people who are “positive” not only don’t see us competing for top 4 but seem to think that’s perfectly reasonable.

    When did our minimum expectations become ho hum?

  106. Champagne Charlie

    “You were arguing that there isn’t much player power when a certain deal is higher than the other one regarding Buendia and Villa/Arsenal and how a club will not sell a player to a lower bid just because the player prefers that team compared to the higher bid. Now you are saying the opposite. Which one is it?“

    How am I saying the opposite? I said the following:

    “Champagne Charlie June 7, 2021 11:44:48
    “You are flat out refusing to believe that a player wasn’t too bothered in joining Aston Villa or Arsenal.“
    No I’m not, I’ve made no comment on whether he was bothered joining either, in fact only reference I’ve made to that was days ago to Dissenter where I said if a player is choosing Villa over Arsenal then I don’t want him because that mentality is weak as piss. I just refuted your nonsense claim about player power that would’ve forced a move through when there was absolutely nothing in favour of that for Norwich. Almost like what I said at the top of it all is true, player power is circumstantial.”

    Same applies here. Locatelli isn’t going to force Sassuolo to accept less agreeable terms on his say so, Juve want him and are trying to structure what’s acceptable to Sassuolo – entirely different to us establishing a cut off. Our situation with Buendia was that we saw him as a 30 mil player and didn’t want to go near the 40 that landed him, meaning his choice was Norwich or Villa. Locatelli’s choice is Sassuolo or Arsenal right now, but Juve want to find a solution and he wants them. Where’s the equivalence?

    Another swing and a miss in your crusade against posters on the ‘other side’. Maybe go back to insinuating Pedro is a liar.

  107. Leftside

    Up,

    Yep the investment for Emery wasn’t enough and if I’m correct we spent about £75m last year or so. It’s not enough for a club that wants to be at the top end of this league competing. I’d be amazed if we got CL because I have zero faith in Arteta, theres not anything to excite for this upcoming season. Its the nope that kills…

  108. Up 4 grabs now

    Marc

    this is what annoys the hell out of me.
    wengers remit was top four minimum.
    Emerys remit, get us back in the top four ( one penalty away in his first season, the second we will never know.
    Arteta remit is the same as Emerys get us back into the top four.

    we haven’t even come close in the 18 months he’s been here and nothing i’ve seen signing wise so far, (admittedly we still have six weeks till the window closes) is filling me with confidence.

    the only thing in our favour is maybe the lack of Europe means we concentrate on the league?

    but if Arteta fails like emery, and wenger in his last two seasons then he deserves the same fate im afraid.

  109. China1

    Oh for gods sake stop moping Marc. In just under 2 years we will be CL champions and here you are moping about the place

  110. GoonGoonerGone

    There are posters who claim that there is a lot of negativity here.
    Seriously, what did you expect?
    We have mediocre owners, a mediocre first-time manager/coach, an inexperienced DOF who deals with dodgy agents and a club that is run like a ‘has-been’ one.
    And we have had years of mismanagement in all areas.
    Sadly, we are going nowhere slowly…

  111. Tom

    Marc, I’ve said it before that Arteta’s biggest achievement to date was to lower Arsenal fans expectations to the point where I can almost guarantee missing out on CL for the next couple of seasons would be deemed acceptable by most, provided league position and points tally slightly improved year over year.

    Same people who took top four for granted under Wenger and made it the minimum requirement for Emery, are now perfectly fine with a process.

  112. China1

    Do you think Willian can take time off for paternity leave after he gives birth? How long is statutory paternity leave in England?

  113. Dissenter

    We finished last season with 61 points
    I expect that finishing this season with 62 points will be seen as some progress for Arteta
    I mean someone once said finishing 8th was a “slight underachievement ‘

    At this rate, UEFA will have to create another competition for us to play in Europe, maybe they will call it the UEFA sauce league.

  114. Goobergooner

    The youngsters were getting a fair whip under Emery also. (Just to get that one in there)

    Maybe they see an 8th place club easier to find first team football while still having that aura of arsenal as a pedestal. **
    *(I am being a massive twat there, I do NOT believe the above is the case.)*

    I am just saying Arteta, in my eyes, is not the next Wenger; and despite Arteta this club is still huge and even if tets leaves, the players will still be contracted here. Why wouldn’t you sign up as a youngster through the academy seeing all the other young guns doing so well.

    Also noone (that I can think of) considers the Ben White signing as shrewd scouting. Especially for 50m. If Chelsea did it, it’s because they can afford to top off their already quality squad. Not the same as at arsenal at all.

    He was a good pickup for Brighton’s academy in 2016.

  115. curse

    Mari showing his pedigree, White would have matched his for speed instead of purposefully taking himself out the game by going square then to ground.

    undone by a set piece. smh