TRANSFER ROUND-UP: ARSENAL BUYING A FAST START

by .

It feels like I’ve been cranking content all week and what do I have to show for it?

NOTHING.

No one sold.

No one purchased.

I am starting to lose my patience. Thinking of sending Edu a seriously firm Instagram DM about my feelings.

The Granit Xhaka story is dragging like an N’Zogbia transfer rumour of yester-window. The clubs are in the final stages of negotiations, it looks like it’s going to happen, just get it done. After watching the Italy game, I couldn’t be happier. Xhaka is solid, but you’re simply not going anywhere with a good technician with no pace in midfield. If you are going to have no pace, be Locatelli with the low-punch shots. What a talent.

The story we’re all purring over is Sambi Lokonga. We really have no idea why, other than it feels intelligent and like a Wenger singing of old. New Youtube channel Latte Firm dropped this infographic.

Do I know what it all means? No. Am I going to draw sharp conclusions that this guy is taking Arsenal back to the absolute pinnacle of European football? Absolutely.

There is business to be done this summer and I think there’s a fine balance between making sure we’re ready for next season, whilst raiding European clubs on their knees. Sambi looks like a shadow player for Thomas Partey. Both seem to boast similar features. We need squad players with levels and we need to own them. Our Madrid loan options last season gave us the worst of both worlds. Odegaard did well, we wanted him, but Madrid saw enough promise to keep him. Ceballos had an absolute shocker, stunk out our first team for the most part, so we wasted development minutes on someone else’s player.

I am diving two-footed into the Premier League talent we’re trying to sign. James Maddison, without doubt, would be an excellent signing for Arsenal. Ben White, without doubt, would be an excellent signing for what need from a defender. There’s a lot of scoffing from Arsenal fans that spent 10 years demanding we ‘spend some fucking money’, now we’re doing it on players that will settle into the first team and deliver from day one, people are complaining about fees?

Ben White is a ball-playing centre-back that has made his mistakes at other clubs, he will complement our defence and pick up the good bits of David Luiz, whilst adding what he didn’t have… pace, motivation, and focus. You do not survive a season with Bielsa if you don’t put the work in, boast high levels of fitness, and have finesses on the ball with the ability to move the ball forward. While the internet was purring over Bissouma, their fans were purring over Ben White, who was named their player of the season in the fan vote. That’s the difference between actually watching Brighton and watching comps of Brighton.

James Maddison is an unquestionable talent that we lack. He’s 18 months younger than Grealish, 5 years younger than KDB, and since his Premier League debut he’s one bested by KDB for chance creation. How am I reading Arsenal fans scoff at this name? Someone moaned that he dresses like he’s buying from Hypebeast, what sort of criticism is that? If anything, signing him feels unrealistic because he’s the sort of player that ends up going to Chelsea or United.

Moving on two players of that age and profile moves us up a level instantly. You can’t argue the impact that would have on our season. When you ask Arsenal to spend some money, this is where the pennies should be going. If we’re trying to replicate the City model, this is our attempt at KDB and Dias.

I don’t even want to start on the Calvert Lewin rumors, that’d just be far too sexy for all of us to handle right now.

There’s still smart money to be spent elsewhere. Josh Doig, the Hibernian left-back, is being heavily linked. He’s 19-years-old and 6ft2, but he’s attracting a lot of attention. The worry is if Tierney breaks down, which is likely, you’ve an untested quantity filling in, but also, the benefit is then you are building out someone with a resale value and you also have a succession plan for KT (hopefully we don’t need one). The lesson from last season is young players are hungry and tend to take their chance. I’d be excited to have a promising back-up system being built out.

There’s a good keeper out there, somewhere, that we’ll have to pick up. Aaron Ramsdale for £20m does not feel like smart money when you can pick up someone like Onana for a pittance. Arsenal has been shocking with keeper signings over the years, our best #1 was Emi Martinez and we bombed him off. I know it goes without saying, but if you want an example of why a Ben White type player needs to be signed, just look at how our playing out the back dipped when Martinez left. The best keepers in world football these days can play through the lines better than Mo Elneny, we need to find one if we want to be more effective and unpredictable in this new system.

We also need to build out the right side of our defence. Cal Chambers is a very decent player, his delivery is excellent and he’s tactically astute (everyone at Arsenal loves him as well). The worry is that he very much looks like a centre-back playing right back. I have no idea where we’ll go here, but we need to find a player with the correct athletic profile that can invert. I know, I know… Ainsley could do that role, it’s such a shame he’d rather bum around in center-midfield at Watford than make a career at a club that could take him to the top but there we are. Delusions of grandeur is a bit of a problem with some of the Hale-Enders on the fringes.

We’ve also not spoken much about the #9 position, that might be because our hands are tied. I’m not sure anyone is giving Lacazette £180k a week and Auba on £350k a week is immovable unless he decides like Willian he just doesn’t fancy the slog. To be honest, I don’t think we’ll have a year like the last one from Auba again. The pattern of players we’re bringing in all points towards freeing him up earlier with better chances.

I also think Flo Balogun is going to be a very special player, he’s the closest player we have to Aguerro in style and athletic profile. I’m not sure how Arteta is going to manage his career because there’s a real story to be told with regards to loans. Do Arsenal keep Balogun on the bench like we did Eddie? Or do we send him on a short loan at the start of the season so he can develop in a starting 11? People get absolutely hysterical about loans, but forget that players like Harry Kane went on four of them. Same could be said of William Saliba. There’s no European football next season, what is best for his development? Our bench for 4 months, or Newcastle’s first team for the same time period to adapt to the language and the pace on someone else’s dime? Who knows, but the fact people get so emotional about it is a very, very Arsenal fan thing.

Finally, let’s talk about that time we spent a load of money with Lille that looked VERY odd. Remember I told you to look at the sort of people we were dealing with? Remember the exBarca exec that was at Lille at the time? Remember that outrageous fee we paid Lille who were in deep, deep shit that summer unless they sold at a big price?

If I speak, I am in trouble.

Football is a dirty game. Genaro Gattuso lost his job at Fiorentina after two weeks because he brought his super-agent buddy to the table. It is stunning that now Spurs are negotiating with him, mainly because he’s a bang-average coach, but also because it shows their lack of ideas… if you are outsourcing your Sporting Director role to a super-agent, you are fucked.

Talking of the Spurs manager job, let’s use this moment to highlight what I told you in December… fear what comes next. Spurs, for all the banter, is a London club with an elite stadium and a squad people thought could contend the title last season. They’ve been rejected by Poch and Conte. They had to lower themselves to Fonseca, who is a good coach, but coming out from under a cloud. Now they are bumming around with passion merchants and their unsavory handlers.

I’m telling you this because it feels like there’s a pattern emerging. The Premier League is the most competitive league in the world and rockstar managers will only join if they have to tools to win. The idea that we’ll sack Arteta and get Conte or Nagelsmann is fanciful because our project lacks elite levers. Spurs are struggling because no one wants to come here and fight four Goliaths with David money.

It’s still really funny though… really funny.

On that note, remember to check out the two podcasts we produced this week. They are of fine quality. Johnny is no full-time on the team, he changed his bio to reflect the blood agreement we have. Give him a follow on the internet here.

ACAST | Spotify | Stitcher | Google Play

899 Responses to “TRANSFER ROUND-UP: ARSENAL BUYING A FAST START”

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  1. CG

    Sidney

    When Liverpool won the league- every time I watched them- they simply booted the ball up field to their front 3 every week.

    It seemed to do the trick but then they tried to be clever and play with that Thiago and then it started to slightly unravel.

    Still got in 3rd. Klopp magic.

  2. Terraloon

    “If we want to start capturing the hearts + minds of kids all over the world, then we need a clear identity in the way we play, and the profile players we target, have to fit into that philosophy”

    The major two hurdle# are winning things and qualifying for the CL

  3. Sid

    All that was/is needed for this team is 2 players that can dictate play/control tempo, a profile of Buendia.(Wenger knew this)

    That would get us to tr4phy, while buying us time to make necessary sale or buys.

  4. Dissenter

    Rich
    You talk or write a good game
    Yada, yada …. and more yada
    Then you want us to spend £45-50 million for a 23 year old with one good year in the championship and an average year in the premier league?

    All the while when we have Saliba who’s highly rated and has not have chance to prove himself.
    Like CG said ….’ You are falling for ‘through the lines bullshite”

    Sending a £29 million defender out on loan for the second time without giving him a chance to swim or sink, so that you can buy another not-ready defender for 45 million is proof that the lunatics are running Arsenal
    …and it INCREASES the size of our squad, making the job for the next manager harder.

  5. Sid

    “”””””When Liverpool won the league- every time I watched them- they simply booted the ball up field to their front 3 every week.”””””

    Basically have a midfield that can counterpress/gegen press, retrieve the ball as soon as the forwards lose it when its hoofed.

    Something we lack.

  6. Dissenter

    Most continental European clubs are in some type of f9nancial trouble and there re good deals to be had. That’s whY Leicester maybe about to sign Soumare for less than half his value.
    An astute management sees opportunity to go an sound in continental,Europe

    What does Arsenal do?
    We decide that this is the transfer window to waste money on premier league and British premiums on transfers.

  7. Gonsterous

    Last season we had a squad more than capable of top 6, arteta in supporters will talk about fine margins, but if we are going to spunk 250m, surely we should then have a squad capable of at least finishing 5th.

    Having a bright manager wouldn’t require us to have 50m players in each position.

  8. Mr Serge

    Gonsterous agreed but we are stuck with these guys and they know it’s sink or swim if it does not work they will be out by November

  9. Sid

    Between line creators are everything in football,
    players like Partey are only cogs that can be easily replaced.
    CBs are only the final piece to an already properly running unit.

  10. Rich

    Dissenter

    You really have a problem reading, most of the time you’re arguing with yourself

    I’m not suggesting we spend £45 million on White, I’m saying I have some concerns as well

    I’m suggesting we go with an open mind if we do sign him, and that defenders who are good on the ball, can certainly improve the way we attack

    That we judge the player on his performances, and whether he improves the team, rather than what our perceived opinion of him are

    White has 120 games on Saliba, and crucially a season of experience in a winning team in the Championship, and a season of PL football behind him, and he’s at an age where Central defenders begin maturing

    Young players can develop a lot with a season of consistent football

    If I had to take a punt, I’d say Saliba has by far the higher ceiling of the two, and I’m not against giving Saliba an opportunity next season, and you never know, we still might….

    What I’m against is keeping Saliba to warm the bench, we either play him? or loan him?

    He won’t progress as a player warming our bench, it just stalls his development, and suppresses his value, and that’s the worst possible outcome for both Arsenal + Saliba

    Your assumption that Saliba is ready, is an opinion, it’s not a fact, just because you repeat something enough times, that doesn’t make it true

    I’m open to the idea that he’s fallen foul of Arteta, I’m also open to the idea he’s not quite ready yet

    You just seem to be looking to confirm your own biases, and refuse to contemplate alternative possibilities, your obsession with a teenage centre back not getting an opportunity this season, is completely nuts

    Clubs buy players and loan them out to develop all the time, it’s really not a big deal

  11. Tom

    With White in their line up Brighton conceded 8 goals less this season than the last without him.
    Whether that’s down to him alone is highly questionable but that’s a fact.

    Arsenal won’t be able to dangle the “ hey, we’ll quadruple your wages “ carrot before him because he’s only on 7k pwk or about what a good dentist makes in US.
    Whether Brighton sell or not that boy is up for a raise.

  12. Positive pete

    Lets face it.If we buy whitey for £45 million ish.It means Saliba more than likely is to be sold.He’s not going to become a bench warmer & see his value fall further.The other option is that he’s sent out on loan again.Risky,cos his contract runs down & he ain’t going to sign another one with us when it looks we don’t rate him .
    More concerned like most on here about midfield.Bissouma surely is a must but gone deathly quite on that front.prob a no go.Which is extremely disconcerting,especially when you’re trying to stay positive.😉

  13. Marc

    This place is becoming more and more cynical about Arteta and Edu and it’s not just a few very vocal posters it’s becoming the majority.

    In fact outside of Pedro I can’t think of a single poster who’s positive about Arteta – you’ve got a few like Rich who are in the “we’ll give him a chance” camp but it’s a shrinking pool.

  14. Dissenter

    Rich
    ‘If I had to take a punt, I’d say Saliba has by far the higher ceiling of the two, and I’m not against giving Saliba an opportunity next season, and you never know, we still might’

    That’s why I keep using ‘cowardly’ when I refer to your position regarding Saliba

    You think he has a higher ceiling, so why don’t you take a stand on that position?

    Instead you seem to waffle like a giraffe on roller skates, rather than just say what you truly believe.

    He’s used one year on his 4 year contract on loan and yet you want us to send him out on yet another loan to so that we can get a 23 year old that you just admitted may not be better.

    Next summer, back from another loan, he will have only TWO years left, do you think he will extend or just be seeking to end his nightmare experience at Arsenal.

    If we were so obsessed with ball playing defenders and had 45-50 million to spend, why don’t we go to Europe and make that money count on a proper one, similar to Ruben Diaz.

    Do you realize that our transfer leverage weakens when we have yet another defender to swell our ranks?

    Anyways have a swell day, a domani

  15. Marc

    Tom

    That’s the problem with buying in the PL – nearly all players are overpriced. If I’m a player on £7k per week who moves for £50 million I’m not going to sign up for £28k per week I’m going to want £100k per week plus.

  16. andy1886

    Marc, don’t forget EB, the one with pearls of wisdom such as ‘anyone can play FB’ (shouldn’t be too hard to replace Bellerin on the cheap then) and ‘Grealish is a bit shit’ (I’m paraphrasing).

    You can trust his/her judgement on Arteta!

  17. Mark

    @Rich ” I’m also open to the idea he’s not quite ready yet” (Saliba)

    Just curious Rich as to why you’re open to him not being ready?
    After such a successful loan what more does he need to do to be given a chance??

  18. Mb

    In Saliba and Guendouzi, we would lose two £40m players. I’m sure they can play against the likes of Brentford, Crystal Palace and Watford.

    You can keep them, play Ben White in important matches if you want but that shouldn’t be a problem to develop someone.

    Unless you decide to substitute Willian in 70th min when we are 2-0 up and let Martinelli’s rot on the bench.

  19. Mb

    No one in the right mind is asking Saliba to be a starter against City and Pool.

    The only time I miss Wenger is when I see Mikel not trying to integrate these future players.

  20. Mark

    Saliba is a ball playing CB , yet this hardly gets mentioned, as we look to add yet another defender, whilst selling Mav for a pittance.

    Why did Arteta sign Soares? If we’re going to be going into the market again so soon, what was the point of that.
    Yet we’re supposed to trust his judgement on Saliba? No thanks I’d rather use my own eyes.

  21. Marc

    Mb

    You’ve hit the nail on the head there “when I see Mikel not trying to integrate” Arteta doesn’t want to use them and doesn’t want to play them. The list of cases where he could’ve given a taste to young players is too long to ignore.

  22. Rich

    Dissenter

    Having a higher ceiling is one thing, but Saliba being 2-3 seasons behind in his development, is an important factor to consider

    Throwing young players into the deep end before their ready, can cause more harm than good

    It’s about managing the trajectory of the player, would you give Arteta a season of grace, if he went with Saka 20, Smith-Rowe 21, Martinelli 20, Odegaard 22, Gabriel 23

    And then threw two inexperienced centre half’s together like Saliba + Gabriel together?

    Would you look at it, and accept this is a young team that’s unlikely to get top 4, and is really a team being development for 12-24 months time?

    Or would you still demand we get top 4, and continue calling for the managers head? In spite of the fact that he’d thrown in a 20yr old centre back, next to a 23yr old centre back, who have less than 160 games between them

    You can’t have it both ways….

    You say we should be looking at buying Leicester’s potential replacement for Maddison, rather than spending £60 million on Maddison

    But then when we target a 23yr old centre half, who has the potential and level of experience where he could develop quickly over the next 12-18months, and develop into a £80 million centre half

    You cry and whinge, rather than sitting back, and seeing how he develops

    I’ve got concerns about paying £45 million for White, but at the same time there’s nothing to say he won’t develop very quickly, and become a mainstay of our team for the next 8 seasons

  23. Tom

    Marc, true but I’d have less of a problem with White on 100kpwk, whom you could still sell on to a number of PL clubs if he’s really that good……….than, say, a Partey , who’s basically already on fuck you money in his first Arsenal season.
    At 200kpwk Partey is in his PL retirement years already, he knows that’s his ceiling and no matter what, no one pays him more.

  24. Marc

    Rich

    You argument collapses in one area.

    “t’s about managing the trajectory of the player, would you give Arteta a season of grace, if he went with Saka 20, Smith-Rowe 21, Martinelli 20, Odegaard 22, Gabriel 23”

    But spending £50 million on a CB who is not an experienced head and is same age as Gabriel means we’re going to be fine. Use Saliba as back up, play him next to Mari who has more experience there are plenty of options this just reeks of Arteta not wanting a player someone else bought.

  25. Dissenter

    Rich
    Do you see the disconnections in your lines if arguments about Saliba

    You wrote that “ Having a higher ceiling is one thing, but Saliba being 2-3 seasons behind in his development, is an important factor to consider‘

    Then you wrote “ I’ve got concerns about paying £45 million for White, but at the same time there’s nothing to say he won’t develop very quickly, and become a mainstay of our team for the next 8 seasons’

    Has it not occurred to you that Saliba too can “develop very quickly, and become a mainstay of other team for the next 8 seasons”

    Is it the England call-ups that getting people hard regarding Ben White.

    Tomori was more deserving of the invite but didn’t get that chance because he was COVID-restricted due to playing for Milan,
    Ben White is no where good enough for us to discard a blossoming talent that Saliba is

    Is Ben White even better than Cambers or Holding? I don’t think so

  26. curse

    Rich

    I wouldn’t mind paying 45m for white, given the circumstances. Plenty of players have gone for insane amounts over the years. This guy give me Koscielny vibes and I like that he’s English. Having one at centre back just seems right somehow.

  27. Marc

    Tom

    What we actually need to do is buy the Ben Whites of the world before they are being quoted at £50 million and develop them.

    A bit like we bought Saliba who we still paid a lot of money for – only problem is with Arteta in charge it’s never going to happen.

  28. Mark

    The signings we’ve been linked with White Neves, Maddison seem like lazy un-imaginative ones, given the high prices they are not smart moves. Holding out for Odegaard or paying £55-60m is a no-no as well.

    We need to buy smart and reasonable, doesn’t have to be cheap. But as mentioned we need to free up spaces 1st , so we are not lowballed.

    We could have already sold AMN, Eddie, Bellerin and Xhaka. So another trick missed there. I really don’t have much faith that Arteta Edu are suddenly going to come good.

    Happy to be proven wrong.

  29. Dissenter

    Tom
    “ Marc, true but I’d have less of a problem with White on 100kpwk, whom you could still sell on to a number of PL clubs if he’s really that good”

    Who’s going to buy Ben White on 100k weekly coming from a. 45-50 mil transfer?

    English players transfers can go awry too, go ask Chelsea about Danny Drinkwater

    A 23 year old with one excellent year in the premier league should never go for £45-50 million.

  30. Tom

    Guys, the Saliba ship has sailed. Arteta is in his make or break season and he’s not gonna start a player he doesn’t rate. Especially one who not only did not kiss his ass in public the KT style , but rather said a few unfavorable things about.
    It’s either a loan or a straight up sale at a huge loss.

  31. Rich

    Mark

    Saliba’s passing statistics are very good, and he’s elite in 1 v 1 situations

    Some of his other defensive statistics are well below average though

    We have to get top 6 next season, and with no European distraction, make an assault on top 4

    I’m looking at it as squad management, we can either play Saliba?

    Or send him out to make his mistakes, and develop further elsewhere

    We then get a more mature player back in 12 months, sell Rob Holding, and have an internal replacement

    Providing we qualify for Europe, they’ll also be more games next season

    That seems like better squad planning, than Saliba stagnating on our bench, which stalls his development, and sends his value plummeting

    I’m assuming Gabriel will be our first choice left sided central defender next season, it’s one thing to pair Fofana with the experience of Evans, it’s another thing entirely to throw two rookies together and expect to qualify for the CL

    This way we get to develop Gabriel for another 12 months, keep the experience of Holding, and have a natural progression with the team

    I really not bothered what we do, just throwing an alternative narrative out there

    Ultimately Arteta + Edu will be judged by the outcome of any decisions they make, or at least at a normal club they would be….

  32. curse

    I’d lone Saliba to a team in the league, preferably to one that has players we might want in the future.

  33. Rich

    Dissenter

    A 23yr old with White’s level of experience, is at an age and level of experience, where he’ll likely develop much quicker, than a 20yr old with 60 senior appearances

    That 100 games that White has on Saliba is massive

    There’s a big difference between being 20 + 23

  34. Dissenter

    This Ben White situation is just Arsenal seeking for an expensive solution for a problem that does not exist at the time we have massive real problems begging for fixes.

    Does anyone really think Saliba’s head will still be at Arsenal if we send him out on loan again.
    Does anyone think our squad position is made better by signing a not-ready central defender for big money in his place this season.

    Just because he’s parked out on loan doesn’t make the squad bloating better. He cost 29 million and will represent a waste for a club that leaking everywhere.

  35. Gonsterous

    Rich

    With every rule there is an exception. Wenger played cesc when he was 19, he didn’t go out to find a player with 100+ more games experience than cesc.

    If a player is good enough, he will get into the team.
    If ben white comes in, do you see him being a starting CB or is he coming as back to gabriel and mari?

    I suspect Gabriel gets dropped because I didn’t see arteta fancying him this season.
    Saliba is better than holding and chambers but they get to stay while saliba is not good enough and has to go on loan again. Everything is personal when it comes to mikeal. Bad trait in a manager

  36. Dissenter

    Rich
    What 100 games are you talking about ?
    The ones at Newport and Peterborough?
    Or the middling games at Brighton this season?
    You wrote a lot about Brighton during the season, how many times did you think Ben White was stand out……big fat ZERO
    You fancied Bissouma and Lamptey like most people

    Ben White’s standout year was away at Leeds in the championship playing for Bielsa. Unless Arteta ball

    I keep reminding you that the likes of Bellingham will never stand a chance at Arsenal with that world view, even though you once berated Edu for missing out on him.

  37. Tom

    Dissenter
    I didn’t say he’s transfer 45-50mil was a good value.
    All I said was if he’s really that good ( the generational one seems to think so) selling him on without a loss a year or two from now to the likes of United, City, or Chelsea shouldn’t be a problem if he’s on 100kpwk.

  38. CG

    Saliba has played against Mbappe and Neymar at least x4 times.

    He has survived unscathed and indeed flourished.
    (Like to see messrs White, Mari and Holding do likewise.)

    This notion he aint ready is laughable.

    Typical supporters ,just being dopey.

  39. Rich

    Dissenter

    If Saliba plays 40+ games for a team in the Championship, gets in the team of the season, and progresses quickly

    A top young centre back like that is an appreciating asset, not a declining liability

    The idea we can’t get him to take a £15-£20k p/w pay increase with a new 4yr deal, with a club option of 5th year with increases included

    Isn’t far fetched at all

    He’s a very talented young centre back, but he’s still done nothing in his career yet

    I love the look of him, we just disagree on the best way to handle his development

    I’m not against playing him, even though there’s risks, and bound to be are teething problems

    But if we do that, you have to accept that they’ll be teething problems

    Gonsterous

    Saliba has a higher ceiling than all our current central defenders, but that doesn’t equate to him being ready now, experience is important

    Players like Cesc are the exception, not the general rule

    And as we’ve seen with Saka + Smith-Rowe, 6-12 months can see young players make giant strides

    But even with those two, they’re still nowhere near the level we need them to be at, in order to challenge for the title, and they’re not suggest to be they’re 19+20, not23-24 with a 3-4 seasons of football behind them

  40. Rich

    Dissenter

    Calm your tits

    I haven’t said I want us to buy Ben White, I’m saying to give him a chance, and judge the potential transfer based on his performances, rather than whipping yourself up into a frenzy before we’ve even signed him, or he’s even kicked a ball for us

    You’re absolutely bonkers

    Experience in the first + second division, then Championship, and PL is important, and shows signs of progression

    Many a player have taken the same route, Harry Maguire being one, playing competitive football is better than being sat on the bench, or playing in the under 23s

    Not all players start at the top, and players need to play consistent football in order to develop

  41. Batistuta

    Incredible how much I’m agreeing with everything CG is saying today. Think i need to lay down a bit

  42. Mark

    Rich
    However the situation with ESR and Saka is they haven’t been mis managed. The manager needs to put it right build bridges, or we lose another top talent. That’s what’s best for the club. It shouldn’t be about Arteta’s ego.

    Not discarding assets we can ill afford at this time, due to the stubborn/pettiness of a manager, who’s done nothing to earn that right.

  43. Batistuta

    Rich tying himself in knots lol. There simply isn’t any justification for spending upwards of 40 million on Ben White, I’d have spunk that on even Tomori from Chelsea who’s clearly the better player.

    He was bad towards the end there but Wenger wouldn’t have had any problems integrating Saliba quickly. If you’re good enough we’ll figure it out on the pitch. We’re not winning the league anytime soon any way so what exactly is the harm really

  44. Dissenter

    Batistuta
    Let Rich be
    He does this wordy blisses when he can’t take a stand on a simple issue

    Rich is willing to have us disrupt Saliba to the point of no return so we can sign the defense was was great in the championship two seasons ago

  45. Mark

    Saliba doesn’t need another loan and anyone who says he’s not ready to compete against the likes of Holding, Chambers, Mari, Soares for a place in the Arsenal squad, is kidding themselves. All because deep down you know it’s about Arteta not football.

    If you can’t see how wrong this is you deserve the team Arteta gives you. But Mark my words it will not be a successful one.

  46. Tom

    “No one in the right mind is asking Saliba to be a starter against City and Pool.“

    Actually, I wouldn’t mind having Saliba start against City and Pool…….with Arteta taking a day off

    Judging how Arsenal looked against these two it could only be an improvement.

  47. CG

    “””Incredible how much I’m agreeing with everything CG is saying today. Think i need to lay down a bit””””

    Thanks Bat.

    (Little tip. Have your naps, when Rich is waffling away)

  48. Gbat

    I don’t get all the complaining about White. He’s a good, young player who improves us. Hopefully his signing means Holding is sold. Saliba is a talented, young player who had a good loan. If he’s good enough he’ll start.

  49. Dissenter

    Rich’
    Are you aware that Saliba had an excellent loan at Nice, to the extent where he made the shortlist for player of the season.

    Ezri Konsa is the players that circulating thorough your brain
    He’s the excellent defender in the championship for Brentford who transferred his wiality to the premier league
    Ben White had one good season for Leeds, that’s about it. He didn’t transfer that level of consistency to the premier league last season.

  50. Elmo

    Rich

    It shouldn’t be an embattled manager’s decision to set the medium-term course of the club based on his need for immediate self-preservation. That’s the whole point of the ‘modern structure’: someone above him planning to a longer horizon is making the strategic decisions (e.g. we want to integrate this expensive young player now, and don’t want to spend £50m+ on another prospect that is no better, just to ‘save’ 6 months of potential bedding in time; the manager is then told what he has to work with and where there’s flexibility to spend money).

    That the manager is calling all the shots tells you who is in charge of the club, and that we’ve returned to the pre-2018 hierarchy.

  51. andy1886

    Funny that we’re gettigtied down with this Saliba/White discussion when we need at least two CM/AM before we even look at another CB.

    All this nonsense that we’re going to spend £250m this summer and even then people suggesting that it might be good enough for fifth! When Chelsea spent £200m last summer (because they were under a transfer ban the previous season) everyone was claiming that spending that much they’d have to challenge for the title. Yet if we spend even more then 5th is acceptable?

    Some people seem to be living in a MA inspired fantasy world where managers can come in and buy a complete new team for hundreds of millions and not bother with developing the players that they inherit.

  52. Almuniasaynomore

    Love this song( the original,obviously) so apologies to Debbie Harry for this.
    ‘Maria’ by Blondie
    He moves like all great players
    Smooth as silk,cool as air
    Ooh it makes you wanna cry
    We’ve never seen him playing
    Arteta will make him a sub again
    Ooh it makes you wanna die

    Ooh why don’t you want this player?
    Ooh ’cause he wouldn’t kiss your bum?

    Saliba,what a player
    He’s insane,out of his mind
    Arteta,won’t play Saliba
    27 million and now he wants White

    I’ve seen this thing before
    When he brought Willian from the club next door
    Fool played him though Esr was on fire
    What’s wrong with Mikel’s brain?
    He’s pissing our money down the drain
    Now Saliba’s out for hire

    Ooh why don’t you want this player?
    Ooh ’cause he wouldn’t kiss your bum?

    Saliba,what a player……….

  53. Dissenter

    ***Ezra Konsa is the players that circulating thorough your brain
    He’s the excellent defender in the championship for Brentford who transferred his quality to the premier league

  54. andy1886

    “Saliba is a talented, young player who had a good loan. If he’s good enough he’ll start.”

    When the guy who makes that decision is a poor judge of player it’s entirely likely that he will not. Remeber the guy that decided Martinez wasn’t good enough to be our #1, the same Martinez who appears in multiple team of the season line ups.

  55. Mark

    We’ve spent money so badly for so long, that just the thought of spunking £40m + on Ben White, £40m+ on Neves £65-70m on Maddison has no appeal at all.

    £150m on 3 average players. I mean don’t we ever fuckin learn. How are we ever gonna shift them in again without making more losses.

    Also like Willian, no guarantee they will hit the ground running under Arteta’s dictate-a-ball.

    Can someone explain the logic where we wouldn’t pay £35m for Buendia but we’re happy to pay almost £50m for Ben White like he’s what we really needed!!🤔🤔

  56. Gbat

    andy1886

    I’ll take his judgement over yours.

    Martinez was happy to leave and we had a good offer for him. I’m sure we would have sold Leno instead if it was the other way around.

  57. Marc

    “It shouldn’t be an embattled manager’s decision to set the medium-term course of the club based on his need for immediate self-preservation. That’s the whole point of the ‘modern structure’”

    Pretty much says it all.

  58. Marc

    People seem to forget that we we signed Saliba a couple of summers ago the anti Sanllehi mob were telling everyone how he was a Mislintat signing etc. We should also remember that other clubs were interested.

  59. Mark

    Gbat,

    If Martinez was given the No.1 jersey that he’d just earned by winning Fa cup and community shield, he would still be here ( with Buendia) .

    He left because Fraud-eta showed shit judgement and no faith in him as a keeper.
    Shit judgement cos Emi us now starting for Argentina on the world stage, whilst Leno is only in the German squad (and wants to leave AFC)

    Emi didn’t want to leave, he was left with no choice by the clueless one.

  60. Marc

    I was happy to give Arteta the benefit of the doubt over the keeper situation last summer – the damning indictment is only a single season on and Leno wants out as well.

  61. Marc

    I’d take my Mum’s judgement over Arteta’s and her only interest in football is checking the fixture list so I can’t use Arsenal to get out of family engagements.

  62. Marc

    Mark

    My general position is you give the manager enough rope to hang himself on things like this.

    Problem is Arteta’s got so much rope we can’t get enough timber to build a gallows high enough.

  63. andy1886

    Okay Gbat, forget Emi, how was Mikel’s judgement when he campained for Willian to join? Incidentally I was very much opposed to that signing too. Better judgement?

  64. Dissenter

    Martinez was promised a 95% chance is starting the fuse game last season

    He could have stayed is he truly wanted, but I guess he saw the incoherence in our entire structure.

    Martinez instigated his exit. He got what he wanted- to exit Arsenal.

  65. Gbat

    Mark

    I wanted Martinez to stay but I understand the decision to let him go.

    I bet your were on here bemoaning Leno’s injury saying Martinez wasn’t good enough.

  66. andy1886

    Or perhaps Cedric? Probably 80% of us thought that was a pointless signing, even MA now as he preferred to play Xhaka at LB in our biggest game of the season. Good judgement?

  67. Gbat

    andy1886

    Willian hasn’t worked out. Happens sometimes. Let’s not pretend he wasn’t a quality player.

  68. Mark

    What is stopping us buying/scouting players and taking punts at around£15-25 million? People we can still sell if it doesn’t work out, or sell for big money if it does.

    Why can’t we make the smart moves?? Buy players before they blow up. Yes it’s a risk, but the rewards far outweigh this.

    Sorry, no to Going back with an improved bid for Ben White, no to Mega money Maddison (injuries) .

  69. andy1886

    Diss, much as I don’t want to spend ages going through the Emi thing if MA had told him he would be our #1 last season he would have stayed. It’s quite simple really.

  70. Gbat

    I can’t believe people are saying no to signing Maddison. And he’s missed a huge 12 games in the last 3 seasons.

  71. andy1886

    Also Gbat it doesn’t take a genius to realise that forwards tend towards deline in their 30’s. the guy will be 34 by the time his contract ends. Would Wenger have given a 31 year old a three year big money deal? DB10 got one year deals on reduced wages, Pires was let go. Both signifcantly better players than Willian.

  72. Rich

    Dissenter

    I’ve never said sign White

    I’ve never said don’t play Saliba, but the worst solution IMO, is to keep Saliba, and have him warm the bench

    In the same way White had to go to Peterborough, Newport, Leeds, and then Brighton to play, in order to develop

    Saliba needs to play consistently in order to develop, otherwise his vast potential stalls

    Conventional wisdom + group think are diseases, and people become far too comfortable in their own echo chambers,

    It’s much easier to repeat the mantras

    “Xhaka sh*t”

    “Wenger out”

    “Emery out”

    “Arteta out”

    “19yr old Saliba is our saviour”

    Rather than trying to see alternative reasons as to why something you want to happen, isn’t happening, and provide any nuance to a debate

    There’s always two sides to every story, and different ways of seeing things

    I don’t know if Saliba is ready, because it’s unknowable, unless we throw him in, but I can see reasons on why we might be reluctant to do that

    You’re convinced he’s ready, based on little evidence whatsoever, just your hunch

    It also fits perfectly into your agenda against the manager, and furthers that agenda

    The only thing I’m convinced of, is that I don’t know, and can see both sides of the debate, and sometimes it’s good to throw a different narrative into an echo chamber

  73. Gbat

    andy1886

    A poor judge of player because he signed an excellent, experienced player that didn’t work out and loaned out a youngster that people have a weird obsession with. Managers make loads of signings and believe it or not, some don’t work out.

  74. Mark

    Gbat ” bet your were on here bemoaning Leno’s injury saying Martinez wasn’t good enough.”

    You’re having a laugh mate, I’ve got eyes and use them. I wanted Leno dropped cos he made the whole defence nervous with his lack of command of his area and the hospital passes he regularly played to them.

    I never thought Leno was good enough, and was over the moon when Emi took his chance and delivered. No question in my mind he should have been made No.1.

    Only Arteta thinks players aren’t ready and defers to senior players regardless. Hence Saliba, Martinez, Balogun not getting a look in. Whilst Willian, Auba, Mustafi /Kola stink out the place.

  75. China1

    It’s like I said a day or two ago, the question we should all be asking is who would Leicester replace Maddison with and how much will they pay for him

    They are much smarter than us as a club and far more savvy in the transfer market. They buy low, sell high and are not majorly impacted by sales in the last few years. So we should be in the market for the players they want to buy not the players they want to sell

    The same would apply to teams like Leipzig and Dortmund.

  76. Gbat

    andy1886

    It’s not your money. Maddison is home grown and has performed excellently for the last 4 seasons. He’s also the perfect fit for the team going forward.

  77. Dissenter

    Rich
    That’s the problem with you
    You talk round and round in circles
    You never take a stand and you keep advocating loans as a way to hide bad judgements

    That’s why I’m having this respectful conversation with you.

    You didn’t say we sign White, but you’re happy to send Saliba away to make room for the defense you never wanted us to sign
    You’re happy to minimize Saliba’s quality and exaggerate the record of the defender you never wanted us to sign.

  78. Gonsterous

    I’m all for getting sterling, Ben white and James Madison but it has to be for a reasonable fee and wages.

    45m for ben white? No thanx, not worth more than 25m
    James Madison for 60m? More like 35-40m
    Sterling for 180k I wouldn’t mind but he’s going to want 250-300k

    It’s not about the quality of these players but the reflection of the fee we have to pay for them, which is way too much.

  79. China1

    Rich

    But xhaka is shit

    Wenger had to go

    Emery had to go

    Arteta should’ve gone

    Nobody says saliba is our savior, it’s a straw man argument used by people making excuses for the club to burn 45m on a player who is neither an established top quality PL player, not necessarily much better than saliba, if at all.

    Which part of the above is not true?

  80. China1

    Also you call this group think, it’s not.

    It’s not that someone said something and everyone decided to go along with it. It’s that a huge number of people have been watching the same bad decisions and mistakes for 10 years and have reached similar conclusions

    Thinking differently from most doesn’t make you right. I’d just as well argue that rather than celebrating disagreeing with everyone, you might want to wonder why you’re seeing something so different from what most other arsenal fans see.

  81. Gbat

    Mark

    Mustafi and Kolasinac who played a massive 43 and 90 minutes in the league. Willian barely started after xmas.

  82. Dissenter

    Even Villa are better at transfer than Arsenal these days

    They got Ezra Konsa from. Brentford for £11 million in 2019 as part of calculated gamble on young players about to take off

    You look at Villa and you see a coherence in transfer dealings. Then seem to know what they are doing. The bid for ESR was part of that plan to sign players just before they take off.

    Then you see Arsenal bidding to sign a lesser right footed central defender than Konsa for 300% more in a depressed market.

  83. Mark

    @Rich
    Saliba needs to play consistently in order to develop, otherwise his vast potential stalls.

    So why can’t Saliba do this at Arsenal. He played consistently well enough at Nice.
    It would be different if we had a defense or Diaz, Varane,. VVD, but we’re talking Holding /Chambers who’re not good enough.

  84. China1

    Yeah gonsterous exactly

    The one word that matters is value

    You can pay 130m for Halaand and it be an incredible investment when he wins you titles and moves on to Madrid for 250m in 4 years.

    And you can sign Willian of a free contract and absolutely resent the wastage.

    It’s not about the money it’s about the value. Always.

    Signing white and Maddison for a combined 100m is horrible value for money. If it’s 55m combined or something at least you can be highly confident of a return on your investment on the pitch and in future sales.

  85. Mark

    Gbat
    Mustafi and Kolasinac who played a massive 43 and 90 minutes in the league. Willian barely started after xmas.

    They were in the squad and named in Europa League.

    Willian barely started after Xmas ( despite being given undeserved chance after chance before Xmas) cos everyone was asking very loudly why he was getting starts over Pepe/Martinelli.

    It wasn’t cos he had some kinda insight, Arteta couldn’t carry on doing it.

  86. Leftside

    I’m desperate for fans back in the stadium because I’m tired of hearing Artetas annoying voice trying to control every facet of the game on the touchline.

  87. TR7

    I don’t remember a single poster talking about White in glowing terms until he was linked with us and now we have a few of them writing long paragraphs about how crucial it is for us to sign a ball playing defender for 50M to help us in ball progression.

  88. andy1886

    “It’s not your money”

    Lol, so that’s alright then.

    Actually AFC is only worth anything because people like you or I spend our hard earned cash on products and services related to the club. If we didn’t then the Kroenkies would struggle to give it away. It’s a loss making business in case you hadn’t noticed.

    Funny how so many supporters knew exactly what was likely to happen with Willian, Soares etc while the manager with his excellent judgement according to you didn’t.

  89. China1

    Ultimately the transfer fees being bandied around for these targets is more in line with the fees Chelsea, city or Utd would be paying but the difference is we don’t have deep pockets like those 3.

    But as well it’s not like spending lots of money on quality players guarantees you they will work out anyway. Look at Chelsea’s top 10 most expensive signings below and ask yourself how many of them really worked out (so far) as great additions and the club got value out of them. Less than half. How much money has Utd blown and still failed since fervor left? Unreal sums. How much has Barca blown and still moved backwards? Unreal sums. There are no guarantees in football so we should stop rolling the dice on players at top price premium as if they’re somehow low risk and sure to hit the ground running. A ‘quality’ player bought at a massive premium is not necessarily any less risky than an under the radar great talent who is still ironing out some rough edges but is improving and can be had at a much lower price. Both carry risk but I know where I’d be shopping and it ain’t Mayfair. You think you’re getting value out of that when in reality half the price is just a markup because the shop keeper has enormous rents and salaries to pay rather than it actually reflecting the true value of the asset

    Kepa 80,00 mil. €
    Kai Havertz 79 million€
    Álvaro Morata 66,00 mil. €
    Christian Pulisic 64,00 mil. €
    Fernando Torres 58,50 mil. €
    Jorginho 57,00 mil €
    Mateo Kovacic 45,00 mil. €
    Andrii Shevchenko 43,88 mil. €
    Hakim Ziyech 40,00 mil. €
    Tiemoué Bakayoko 40,00 mil. €
    Michy Batshuayi 39,00 mil. €

  90. Leftside

    I would personally be bringing in an AM, and at least two CMs before even think about bringing in a defender but I genuinely think this club is ran by madmen.

  91. Leftside

    Edu and Arteta were bland, largely forgettable players and they make for a very shit leadership team. I expect Arteta to be despatched by Christmas and that buffoon Edu in the next 12-18 months.

  92. Marc

    I think what you’re seeing on here is two very different mind sets. It’s harsh to say it but one of them is basically bonkers.

    It’s so unlikely that we’ll have £250 million to spend even with sales that it’s not even good click bait. With that in mind how much are we going to have to spend this summer? With Xhaka needing to be replaced whether he goes or not that’s one key area of the pitch, depending on what formation we’re going to play we’re going to need a couple of midfielders in one form or another unless ESR is ready to take over full time CAM duties. Will be sign a new RB? We will also need another keeper assuming Leno leaves.

    With all that in mind is it really a good idea to spend what will be a pretty big chink of our net spend on another CB when we’ve apparently had the 3rd best defence in the PL post Christmas.

    Why can’t that defence carry on? Why can’t midfield actually control a match and provide these overhyped forward passed that we’ve lost from Luiz?

    Of course it could just be that Arteta never wants us to cross the halfway line.

  93. Dissenter

    ‘ I don’t remember a single poster talking about White in glowing terms until he was linked with us and now we have a few of them writing long paragraphs about how crucial it is for us to sign a ball playing defender for 50M to help us in ball progression.

    I mentioned that to Rich, since he was fawning all season about Bissouma and Lamptef, some others liked Dunk too.
    Now he’s worthy of sending Saliba on yet another loan.

  94. Marc

    “It’s not your money. ”

    Yes it fucking is my money. It’s money from my ST, cash I spend in the stadium (not a huge amount I’ll admit) and then money through TV subscriptions.

    Right now Arsenal are providing shit value for money and I’ve every right to complain.

  95. China1

    TR7 yeah Ben white suddenly became desirable and worth 50m the moment arsenal were linked

    We talk about other teams players and possible signings all season and I bet if you cruised through the le grove comments of the past 2 years you’d not find a single mention of him until arteta started throwing cash at him and suddenly he’s just what we need

  96. Leftside

    We need at least 25 more goals in the side too, that needs to be addressed before we stockpile more CBs

  97. Leftside

    I couldn’t even tell you what Ben White looked like, and I suspect that without a google search most of you can’t either

  98. Mark

    Arteta talks about control, but doesn’t seem to understand the difference between control and possession for possession sake.

    Possessing the ball but doing nothing progressive with it is where we’re at,taking far too long to transition the ball forwards.

    Or does he think if we keep hold of the ball the opposition can’t score.

  99. Marc

    With away fans getting circa 10% of ticket allocation meaning we can expect Chelsea to have about 6,000 fans at our first home match, come half time will Arteta have more supporters amongst the Chelsea fans or Arsenal?

  100. Chris

    The way Saliba is talked of on here by some people, you would think he is actually 16 coming out of secondary school.

    He’s a big unit, fast and has had a good loan spell for a second occasion. He is very highly rated by several high profile coaches/figures in the game. What are people so afraid of? Loan him out again and it’s highly unlikely he will sign another contract when he goes down to two years.

    I cannot think of a good reason not to have him as part of the first team squad unless Arteta simply doesn’t rate him and/or has a personal issue with him. As others have said, the integration of such a young player wouldn’t have been an issue under Wenger. Saliba is exactly the type of exciting prospect we should be playing and developing to enjoy for many years and attain a sky high transfer valuation should it all go well.

    Ben White is a good player, but not £50 million good, and that money should be spent on addressing much more needed concerns in midfield. We should be signing the likes of White when we have an established 11 of high quality with him coming in as serious competition for places:rotation, not instead of signing what we truly need in a summer window like this, because it’s incredibly hard to believe Silent Stan will spend £250 million in one summer on Arsenal.

  101. Davi

    Arteta was a good player and not particularly bland. Good passer and determined tackler, especially for his size. Not a great or anything but he was a panic buy that actually worked out saving our season imo (think it was just after the 8-2?). Arteta the Arsenal player probably fits the profile of CM we actually need reasonably well.

  102. Rich

    China1

    We should have moved away from Xhaka a long time ago, but he’s still better than Elneny, Ceballos, Torreira + Guendouzi

    Xhaka isn’t sh*t, he’s just not at the level we need him to be at, I hope we clear the decks, and sign upgrades in midfield this summer

    Andre Santos was sh*t, Xhaka is slightly above average, there’s a big difference

    Emery slightly overachieved in his first season, and in spite of spending £140 million, we actually decreased the quality of our squad, instead of increasing it

    I said at the time that sacking Emery wouldn’t change much, we were 8th then, we’re 8th now….

    What we need is to improve our scouting, recruitment, squad balance, competitiveness of our squad, and our contract management

    Wenger did have to go, but it’s a shame the club didn’t put the right support structure around him, and turned him into an accountant, rather than a football manager, if he’d had more ambitious people around him, then the story could have worked out very differently

    Arteta could have been rightly sacked, but since that isn’t happening, past mistakes, don’t have to define the future

    And crying about the past or things you can’t control, is the least productive thing anyone can do

    The question is now, how quickly can he learn? Can he identify what needs to be done? Does he have the support structure around him to help him implement those changes?

    I suspect he doesn’t

    But if we can somehow implement some astute changes, we’ll be in a better place to have a much better season

    If people don’t think Saliba is the saviour?

    Then why do they think Arteta should lose his job next season, if we don’t finish top 4? And want us to play Saliba?

    Why are they so bothered by the thought of loaning him out? If they don’t think he’s ready to have a big influence? And then get us to hit the targets they set for the manager?

    If he’s not the saviour? Why are they bothered by Arteta not playing him?

  103. Rich

    Dissenter

    I’ve never suggested we sign Lamptey, in fact I was against it, he’s all about pace, and he’s just had a really bad hamstring injury

    I like Aarons from Norwich + Cash from Villa for right back

    I like Bissouma and think he’s a really good player, I wouldn’t be disappointed if we signed him, but I’d rather a press resistant technician in the mould of Cazorla, and that would be my preference

    I’ve never suggested we sign Ben White, I’m saying if we sign him, to give him a chance, and judge him on his performances and impact on the team

    Rather than condemning him before he’s kicked a ball, or before we’ve even signed him

    If you’re going to quote me, don’t make stuff up, and quote me correctly

    Otherwise I’ll start misquoting you, and see how you like it

  104. Elmo

    Away PL at Emirates I thought was 3,000. FA Cup you get the big away contingent with 9,000, with usual corner away section + all the way behind the goal Clock End lower.

  105. Rich

    Dissenter

    I seen you put Lewis Dunk in there as well, a player I’ve never even mentioned, or seen anyone else suggest we sign

    I think it was CC who liked Lamptey

    Buying speedsters with hamstring injuries is too much of a risk, take away their pace, and what you’re left with, is the player Bellerin is now

  106. Bob N16

    Marc, your comment at 12.28 suggesting ‘this place is becoming more vocal against Edu and Arteta, it’s not just a few vocal posters…’

    I would argue that many potential posters are put off by the incessant negative posters such as yourself and others I won’t bother to name. Rich, quite reasonably stacks up an argument for let’s see what happens(despite not being a fan of Arteta/ Edu.) and in the very binary times that we live in, gets criticised.

    Any positivity or facing to up to the onslaught is met with attacks usually conflating the argument, making out anybody not rampantly Arteta out as somehow being appeasers to the Arteta/ Edu regime. Dissenter, for example, implies I’m some sort of hippy type promoting peace and love; ‘If you’re not with us, you’re against us.’ type vibe.

    Meanwhile any comment, rumour, prediction is met with a scathing comment on Arteta, painting him in a terrible light.

    I could be wrong Marc but just consider that your passionate, all be it understandable take on Arteta is so constant in its’ negativity that it attracts like-minded posters and warps the stream. You then get the confirmation bias you clearly welcome.

  107. China1

    Rich dude no one said saliba is required to get us into top 4, who said this?

    Everyone has consistently said we already have a pretty good defense and he is capable of providing many of the qualities Luiz could (such as good on the ball and passing) whilst if he does make some errors as he learns, that’s no worse than watching Luiz make them every three games anyway

    People are annoyed about saliba because he’s a big prospect who has been consistently handled in a rubbish way. If we loan him out again he’s never coming back. Why would he?

    27m wasted on a very very interesting talent and absolutely no interest in giving him a fair crack. It’s all just bullshit nonsense which is what pisses people off.

    I haven’t seen one person say saliba is going to single handedly drag us to 4th. We all say he can bring something decent to the table in a back line which is already quite good. He has enormous upside and we can stomach the risks. And cunting him off to burn 50m for marginal gains (not even sure of that) on white is just amateur hour from someone who is supposed to be great at coaching

    The whole fucking argument about arteta was that he was supposed to be a great coach. The guy who made sterling go from good to great etc etc etc. and here we are with a hatful of very promising young players and we have thus fair seen absolutely fuck all positive work from arteta on 90% of them.

    Ask yourself this, if peak wenger had martinelli and saliba last season, do you think he’d have struggled to get more out of them? Not a chance in hell. Peak wenger would’ve had a field day with some of these kids. Instead we have apologists now comfortable with us cunting off big prospects so we can make room to set fire to another fat wad of cash

    It’s just shit and many of us are just tired of it.

    Saliba may or may not make the cut. But if we keep him and he doesn’t, we have 3 other good CBs to work with. What are we so worried about? If we are so stubborn about restricting chances for players like him and Martinelli there is every chance we will lose these guys on the cheap in the coming years and watch them be Serge Gnabry sorts all over again. The risk of giving them a chance isn’t that high. The risk of losing them is actually higher

  108. China1

    The way to cure the incessant negativity is for arsenal to stop be incessantly shit lol

    Fuckers like me weren’t so bitter back when there were actual reasons to be excited. Even when we weren’t winning shit, just watching cesc play and work his magic every week with TR7, van Persie etc was enough to have me very much seeing the light

    But when we are run like shit and often poor on the pitch, with outright poor decisions still seemingly on the horizon forgive me for not putting on a shit eating grin and being impressed

  109. Bob N16

    China, thank you for providing a classic example of why it’s tough on here if you bitching constantly about Arteta; ‘forgive me not putting on a shit eating grin and being impressed’.

    Who on here as said that they are impressed by the present set up? However you suggest that if one doesn’t pile on to Arteta then you must be happy with where we are right now. Ridiculous.

  110. Bob N16

    China, the TW hasn’t closed yet and the season doesn’t start for a couple of months. Maintains this level of anger has got to be unhealthy and fairly pointless.

  111. Rich

    China1

    If we fail to get top 4 next season, then there’ll be people on here screaming for Arteta’s head

    Saliba might bring something to the team? He might not be quite ready?

    We don’t know, and for all the hyperbole

    He might come back in pre-season, absolutely nail it, and go on and make a big impression this season

    I’m not taking a position either way, because I haven’t seen enough of him

    But I can understand why a manager with so little room for error, might be reluctant to throw in a 20yr old centre back, with under 60 senior appearances, into a team, that really needs to qualify for CL next season

    I also undoubtedly believe, that if we’re not going to give him consistent minutes?

    Then both Arsenal + Saliba benefit more from him playing somewhere, rather than having him warm the bench, and waste a season of his development

    There’s plenty of examples of clubs buying young players, giving them multiple loans to develop elsewhere, and then bringing them back into the team

    City + Chelsea are buying youngsters from Brazil this summer, and loaning them straight out

    Christiansen had 2 seasons on loan in Germany, and just played for the winning team in a CL final

    Zouma had 2 loans inside the PL, Mount went to Holland, and then to play for Derby in the Championship

    It’s really not the drama that some are making it out to be

    I’m not pretending to know what’s best, just offering an alternative explanation, or a different narrative to, Arteta just doesn’t like the player

    If people don’t think he can come in and make a big difference?

    Then why are they so bothered if we send him out on loan?

  112. Aussie+Gooner

    I can’t believe that there are still some on here that want the staus quo to apply – how long does Arteta get to prove if he is up to the job???? Maybe I am just too old and watch too many Youtube clips of Arsenal when they played with verve, substance and passion. As you say China, I can’t forget watching Henry, Viera, Cesc, RVP, Bergkamp, Pires, Overmars, Parlour, Wright, Adams, Rocastle, Brady, Ljundberg, Sanchez, Anelka, Kanu…..the list is endless. Who in todays team would make that list???

  113. Mb

    “27m wasted on a very very interesting talent and absolutely no interest in giving him a fair crack. It’s all just bullshit nonsense which is what pisses people off.”

    And I’m sure someone will not agree to this with reasons like we would break him, he is not enough or whatever nonsense.

  114. Mb

    I have said it earlier, the season was a write-off after Christmas. An intelligent coach would have given minutes to likes of Saliba, Azeez, Martinelli, Guendouzi and even Torriera.

    We saw Willian, Luiz, piss poor Auba(al though I believe he will be back to his form this season), Bellerin(knowing he wants out).

    Finishing up 8th discovering couple more talents like Saka, ESR would have had me supporting Arteta.

  115. Bob N16

    Aussie, nobody wants Arsenal to continue to perform on and off the pitch in the way we have been in recent years. What are you talking about ‘status quo’ ?

    Most people are hoping if not confidently, that we are going to see a major overhaul in our squad this summer. It doesn’t take an optimist to see that we have plenty of room for attainable improvement by upgrading 3/4 starting positions.

    The comment section on Legrove does not have that much influence in changing the ‘status quo’. We’re just supporters hoping for the best but maybe expecting the worst- as always the life of fan- has it ever been anything different?

  116. Mb

    And anyone saying Gabrielle is not good enough defensive forgot he was one of the best players on the pitch before Covid and being in and out affected hus form even more.

    I’m sure he will be back the beast we saw initially, unless Arteta starts dropping him every time he has a good game (like Pepe).

  117. Sid

    Le Grove 3:16
    For Supreme leader so loved Arsenal that he gave begotten Diet Pep, so that the fanboys who believe in him will have everlasting midtable.

    Brother Robert N61 lead us in a chorus of kumbaya

  118. China1

    It’s true we haven’t bought or sold anyone yet and I already seem so irked but that’s because we are actively trying to set fire to vast sums of money on players like White

    The way the club is run reminds me of parenting my toddler. You see him running towards a massive puddle. You tell him not to jump in it because he’s not wearing wellies and hates having wet feet. He jumps in it anyway and ends up crying that he has wet feet. The transfer window is open and we’ve not fucked it up yet, but arteta and edu are running fast towards that puddle and it’s so drainingly predictable how this story is going to end.

    I want to be wrong more than you know and will very gladly give them credit if they don’t fuck this up. But they’re accelerating, edu’s laces are undone and Mikel not even looking where he’s running….

  119. Guns of SF

    Happy Fathers Day to all the dads on the board, soon to be dads, grinding it out every damn day. Hope you all have a good one, and have a few pints on me…!

  120. Bob N16

    China, I get your frustration, I feel it too.

    A great mate of mine calls me the accountant when it comes to talking about Arsenal. I’ve in the past tried to appreciate how our money should be spent, in other words whether we’re getting value for money with the wages on particular players, who we should get rid of and how we should apportion our transfer budget. He’s never given a shit and mocks me, which I happily take.

    This TW I must admit, with stories that the Kroenkes are going to allow us to spend big, I’m less bothered about our finances, naive may be, but I just want to see a squad that could really impress next season. If it all goes tits up, the Kroenkes will sell or dispense with Edu and Arteta and start again. If White costs £50 m, Maddison £65m and we can still spend on 2/3 other signings, great. It’ s not my money, although I do pay for ST and subscribe to Sky Sports and BT!

  121. Rich

    China1

    I’m not overjoyed about spending £45 million on White

    But I remember when we spent £50 million on Lacazette, to sell Giroud a few months later, which was a downgrade

    I remember the euphoria when we spent £72 million on Pepe, and while I think he’ll surprise a few people next season, and looks like a player on the way up

    We’ve yet to see a return on that investment

    It doesn’t matter if fans embrace the signing of White or not, all that really matters is his performances on the pitch, and whether or not he improves the team

    For £45 million, he needs to provide an instant uplift in quality, have the capacity to progress further, and become a mainstay of our team for the next 8 seasons

    We’re all annoyed at buying over the hill mercenaries looking for one last payday

    We try and sign a hungry 23yr old, who’s potentially on the way up, and people are still complaining, before we’ve even signed him, or before he’s kicked a ball….

    We could be about to sign a player who’s right on the verge of maturing into an elite performer, we might be wasting another £45 million

    I’m willing to give the player and club the benefit of the doubt, and see how the situation develops, before condemning anyone for a decision where the outcome is unknown

    I’ve seen a few interesting theories that we’re not even signing White as a centre back

    It would be quite funny if Saliba started against Brentford, after the frenzy some have whipped themselves up into

  122. Goobergooner

    Playing out from the back isn’t our biggest problem.

    If the central midfield didn’t consist of xhaka, elneny or Ceballos and had a decent Cazorla esq player next to partey, it wouldn’t have been so difficult to progress from the back.

    You have the former three above hiding when under too much pressure. Not making themselves available, too shite to turn and face just go for an easy pass back.

    Every top team has that deeper playing cm/DM who drops back to receive the ball from CBS, but when ours is xhaka and he has to actually leave the cmf area just to be taken out of pressure to be able to play a long ball, is it really worth it.

    Defenders defend.
    Midfielders build.
    Attackers score.

    That is the game as simple as it gets, but Arteta wants to be too smart/city lite.

    Playing out from the back can work. But also utilising the central midfield gives the backline a better chance of pulling it off. When we are always looking to the wing it’s too easy to predict.

    And if xhaka is dropping into lb positions, we all know the central mid is going to be overrun. It’s bonkers to be honest.

    So yes. White may be better. But he’s still going to be passing to a rubbish cm so I really don’t see how much of a difference he will make.

    *** I would expect a few cm signings, I’m not saying we won’t.

    I just think 40+ mill on white is a bit of a kick in the teeth considering the squad deficiencies

  123. Goobergooner

    I think for me, if we buy into more potential rather than older players looking for mega moolah, as well as another marquee cm I’d be happy with that.

    If we spend big dough on CB then not properly on cm I’ll be disappointed.

    The club has a few opportunities to properly excite me this tw, but history keeps me weary hahaha.

    All I can say is we will see