Now the madness of the Super League has died down, maybe we can have a conversation about where we’re heading.
The Super League proposition was an odd one. It wasn’t good versus evil. It was bad vs evil. It was a film where every character is flawed, and you picked the lesser villain to root for.
Think about who you cheered this week.
Boris Johnson, the man that said he’d lie on the runway at Heathrow rather than expand (then expanded). Famous for the biggest lie put on a bus, ever.
Rupert Murdoch, the person that started the pillaging of football in the 90s, currently allowing his opinion presenters to shed doubt on vaccinations in a country that lost 500k to covid, just to own the libs. Climate denial as his own country burns.
Gary Neville, voice of the people… except when he played for the richest club in England that bought success year after year and had some weird thing going on with referees that the referees now admit to. Oh, he’s also financially doping his Salford FC club despite Scholes saying they wouldn’t. Oh, and there are also accusations that he uses his elite celeb powers to land special treatment with the locals. Oh, the man of the people ALSO works for Rupert Murdoch. Oh, guess which dreamboat has a 50% stake in his club? PETER LIM, the man that I wrote about who owned Valencia, who let a super agent run riot, that led fans to oust Nuno after he got them into the Champions League because they believed he was part of the team that destroyed the soul of their club. I wrote a scathing piece about Nuno when Raul was trying to hire him at Arsenal, read it, then PLEASE tell me if that’s who you’d jump into business with if you cared about the beautiful game.
…voice of the people? Fuck off.
We all fell for it in the moment though; when your world is under threat, you’d rather have the voice with you than against, but never forget, many of them were protecting their own piece of a pretty ugly pie.
Where were these voices when working-class fans were priced out of football?
Where are these people NOW on systemic racism?
Where are these people when fans get fucked around with scheduling for the global audiences?
At the trough.
The closest I’ve ever come to losing my life was on Clerkenwell Road after a night out. I had just bought an amazing kebab. I was jogging across a road that was on a red light and I dropped the kebab bag, horrified, I turned back to save the meat box, I snatched it away like a hero, not realising there was a car powering at me… the Ford Focus brushed the top of my head at 30mph. It was a near miss and a lot to put on the line for a £6.99 after-hours feast. That would have been lights out for me. I have never done something so stupid since.
Football is the kebab in the bag. The fans are my head if I’d been hit. We saved the game, we’re dreaming of the feast ahead, but we haven’t seen the car careening at us.
Did that story work? Maybe not.
Point is… what does this near-miss for UEFA mean?
‘PUNISHMENT’
Puuuuurlease. I just don’t believe there can be a punishment from the biggest clubs after this near miss. UEFA needs to have a good Champions League. Punishing mega clubs would be a weird move. They’ll take execs off their committee roles. Strip them of their board seats. But punishing the clubs is punishing the fans and their big sponsors.
Even the stripping of exec roles… Agnelli leaves the ECA Chairman role and is replaced by the guy the lobbied for the Qatar World Cup? Have you read a single thing about the build for that World Cup? Is that what saving the game was about? Fucking hell people… we’ve just let the fox into the hen house.
Back to it. You can’t have a Champions League without the big names.
I think the most likely outcome, which is rumoured to be happening, is a kick-up in revenue for the CL. $4 billion added to the pot.
It’s also rumoured that there will be a backdoor way for big clubs to get into the tournaments via coefficients.
The rumblings are that we’ll end up seeing the same format that was on show for Super League… but with competition at the heart of it.
Florentino Perez came out and added more weight to the story I wrote the other day. He literally said the big clubs don’t make money. That complaint is hilarious, he’s complaining they don’t make money because they waste it all on agents, transfers, and wages. HILARIOUS but important to compute… if big clubs feel like the game is fucking them, they will continue working to change that.
I think the Super League is dead but the drivers underpinning its appeal are not going away.
The big idea is this: How do you put more money in the pockets of clubs that bring the big money?
There’s talk of relaxing FFP so Manchester City and PSG don’t have to fret about their financial doping.
Will the big voices go to war for those unfair practices? No way. We’re baseball fans watching Sosa and McGwire slug it out for the home run record in 1998. Here for the spectacle, not the details. As long as the football is pretty, we don’t see the grimness of what it’s become.
This failed coup will not end ‘innovations for the good of the game’, it’ll just shift the way they are sold.
Financial security for the few won’t sell. But more quality? Maybe that will. Reducing the number of teams from countries that don’t sell eyeballs will happen and that might not see such a vitriolic reaction because it won’t affect the key nations in the mixer, it’ll affect the smaller ones. Is that fair? No. Will there be hashtag campaigns to protect Bate Borisov? No fucking chance.
Having the biggest brands in football in the biggest tournaments is a premise you could sell, just not at the expense of competition. But what if the new Champions League changed how you gain entry to it? What if they created backdoor entries and more wild cards. What if making the semi-finals of Europa landed you into the Champions League? It’s usually BIG teams that make the final 4, it certainly has been of late. What if they brought in a rule that if you qualified for Champions League domestically and made the semi of Europa, that extra spot was given to 5th place in the league the team was from. Would fans protest that? Doubtful.
‘I don’t make the rules’ shoulder shrugs from most.
Case in point: Did anyone protest Champions League teams getting a parachute reward for dropping into the Europa League for finishing 3rd in the group stages? Is that fair? It’s absolutely not. Rich teams fail, then get another crack in a lesser comp with a HUGE reward and fans don’t bat an eyelid. How can anyone tell me it’s fair that United could take our Champions League place if we get to the final of the Europa League.
‘I don’t make the rules’ shoulder shrug. Right?
The problem with all the innovations on the table NOW? They don’t help Stan. If he wants to get back to the top, he has to do it the hard way or short cut it by spending out of his own pocket, which he won’t do. That’s the desperate choice he faces now, does he have the stomach for proper investment?
If he doesn’t, what do Arsenal fans want in its place? The best owners in football tend to come with nasty baggage. Would you take wealth at Arsenal from someone that chops up journos? Newcastle fans were bang up for it, they protested FOR it. This goes back to the original point, there are no ‘we got our club back’ solutions to this mess. Every choice that would affect our future for the better is likely a moral dagger to the soul of the game and our own personal principles.
The Super League failed because it bypassed the competitive nature of the sport we love. The level of unfairness it presented was too obvious. But don’t kid yourself that football isn’t brutally unfair now. Arsenal lost our perch as the top club in Europe because billionaires whitewashed their reps in our league and purchased success at unprecedented levels. That wasn’t fair. We did things the hard way and we got absolutely nothing out of it. Our stadium was pointless. Our love affair with the idea of FFP faltered because UEFA let it slide.
Unfairness, led by the richest, will find its wicked way again, but next time, it’ll be more subtle.
Fans won the battle of the Super League, but the war goes on, the owners learned a key lesson of modern history: You cannot take over the world through brute force. The people will not tolerate it. However, that does not mean the world cannot be taken over with a softer type of raw power.
That’s the next move, keep your eyes peeled.
Right, see you in the comments and tell me how YOU would make football better.
Victory for sense
Restrict wages.
Cap at a sensible level.
And stop agents manipulating deals.
Just hope this doesn’t impact the teams motivation for this year’s europa league that it is vital we win!
#kronkeout
Let clubs have the ability to terminate a contracts.
OZIL .
Money & power corrupts.
Equality and true competition in the beautiful game is lost forever.
FFP was the answer to financial doping. The problem has been the enforcement.
Honestly this ESL thing is a little boring now and the simple fix is for UEFA to double the money and put real incentive back into the competition like 250 mil to win it and all other money doubled is not like UEFA can not afford to do that with there billion dollar TV rights deals anyway just out of curiosity anyone know where the fine money for pulling out of this ESL group that crook Perez keeps going on about Is paid too .I would not be surprised if it was paid to the Spanish government and then some… Read more »
This short article offers a rather balanced post ESL analysis with a good dose of realism
http://youaremyarsenal.com/why-change-is-inevitable-for-arsenal-and-the-sleazy-six/
It’s gloomy and in all likelihood it’d be extremely difficult to get the evil KSE out however makes sense it is …
Pedro… or one of you other guys who knows… were the government to try to push teams into a Bundesliga model, how would it work… would the club be required to float 51% by issuing shares? Or is it mutualised like a building society, where season ticket holders would have effectively bought voting rights? What is to stop ;as happened with Arsenal) bundesliga fans shares being bought up by richer investors ? I think there is a political opportunity bashing the ‘big six’ because we have a government elected mostly on xenophobia, and bashing foreign billionaires is about the most… Read more »
Sown not down
Gunner man,
The issue was the enforcement AND the incessant lobbying behind the scene. The ironic aspect is that clubs who had the most to gain from FFP were Real Madrid and Barcelona and they fighted it because of the misguided impression that it would stop them competing with bottomless pit of money clubs.
I couldn’t agree more with the following excerpt from the AC Milan supporters group statement that another Legrover shared in the last post…
“The Super League is just the latest disgusting step, but those who took football to this point are no less grotesque, so save us these ludicrous performances of rhetoric and morality.”
“Now that the money is running out, feel free to fight it out between yourselves, but don’t you dare name the fans. PIGS!”
Seems to echo the bad vs evil theme of Pedro’s post!
Restrict wages? Who the hell are the government to decide how much you can charge for your labor? You’re only worth what someone can afford to pay you, and is willing to pay you If you think the government can spend and donate our wages, better than we can spend and donate our money, then nobody is paying any attention Our bureaucrats aren’t competent enough to run a bath, let alone decide our value The same people who complain about a lack of social mobility, are the same people who complain when largely working class lads, climb their way to… Read more »
Valentin
Yup. This is where it’s UEFA’s fault. Greedy and dirty people in powerful positions.
FFP could also work to stop the Spanish government/banks helping Madrid and Barca. Of course they’d still be strong because they are already well established brands.
This is what Perez had to say after the cancellation:
“[Big signings] won’t exist without the Super League,” he said. “Not for Madrid or anyone. It’s impossible if the money doesn’t flow.”
Really disgusting view. If he has it his way we will see billion dollar transfers and million dollar wages in 10 years. Where does it stop?
Excellent post. Not sure how football can be improved when money/power drives everything and fairness and the supporters’ voices ae lost in the commercial free-for-all. If we could achieve a German model of ownership that would be a major step forward but seems far from likely. Am hoping that Kroenke realises that now is the time to invest heavily in the squad. FFP has been ineffective and with the losses involved with the Covid crisis, now would be an opportune moment to flex some financial muscles. The market will be depressed and ‘bargains’ should be available if Kroenke is willing… Read more »
doubt we will get a result against Everton , it’s a home game as well and in the current climate with no available striker all the ESL crap and a Friday night game as well not much chance of winning that game with the zero experienced Arteta in charge he has shown on several occasions when you would think he would take advantage get his troops roused and ready to take advantage in the PL he just can’t do it , we either really struggle or loose .weekends are horrible with Arteta in charge his arsenal really let you down… Read more »
If some good however minute changes would come from this ESL fiasco, it must be put in swiftly while the iron is hot and the fire is completely extinguished.
Ideas Valentin outlined in the last post ,plus couple of suggestions from others eg salary cap wouldn’t be impossible if the right people push for it now, supported by the fans. This feels like almost another election…
fire is *not* completely
Pedro is right, killing SL for now has not solved any of football’s current problems….
Qatar representative – under corruption investigation in Switzerland – presiding ECA now… democracy has won ?? the fans have won lol
Let’s kick out Kroenke, but frankly the worst issue is that he is a very mediocre, incompetent owner not his evilness. If people think City and Chelsea fans will kick out their evil owners they are very naive. Bringing success and injecting money will please the people enough
Cracking post Pedro. Blaster Professional football in Germany amounts to just three divisions of 56 teams in total. In England alone there are over 110 professional teams located in the PL, EFL and NL The 50%+ 1 model only came into being some 20 odd years ago prior to that it was 100% ownership by members. As recently as three years ago Bayern Munich were arguing against the rule and here’s the crunch that rule isn’t applied if the club has been in private ownership for a period of time. For instance Wolfsburg are 100% opened by VW Others like… Read more »
Great stuff again Pedro, a little difficult to find such sense at the moment. Agree that punishment is futile and a bit stupid, though sometimes, an example is made of a single party in a larger transgression. Already hearing stories Chelsea and City were “ bullied “ into this. Can’t see the authorities taking on Utd or Liverpool, and even Tottenham seem to have friends in high places. But I can see Stan getting a higher level blame for this amongst the English clubs as Murdoch lashes out, And arch twat Simon Jordan has already put the Stan as the… Read more »
The big issues with the FFP were: 1) Control 2) punishment Control because the people who were in charge of investigating it were not given the authority nor resource to do it properly. ManCity, PSG, AC Milan are in different countries so different different tax systems but more importantly different accounting reporting rules. So even when the club cooperated it was difficult to assess what was authorised and what was unauthorised. That’s why I am advocating the creation of a European Sport Legal entity that will follow the same accounting rules every where in Europe. Making it possible to compare… Read more »
Interesting read Pedro. “Money & power corrupts.Equality and true competition in the beautiful game is lost forever.” Yep that is why we have a World Cup in Qatar, a Qatari just promoted to head of the ECA and 4 semi finalists in the Champions League who aren’t there on sporting merit but purely on spend. Two clubs owned by Oil States the other accumulating around a billion euros of debt. Absolutely insane. As soon as Man City & Chelsea started plundering our players, ones we had developed, I knew the game was dead. The bad guy isn’t supposed to win… Read more »
FFP failed because it was supposed to stop clubs getting into debt but that got forgotten and tried to somehow measure things purely on income and expenditure over what a 3 year period.
It was so easy to find ways around as being comical .
The view of many was all FFP did was try to preserve the status quo and potentially did no more that protect the interests of the big boys
Manchester United training suspended with protests against the glazers.
It’s going to get messy as I predicted
Time for a clear out from the top down. If the Krankies have any sense they will throw all the executives under the bus in order to divert attention away from them. I know it will only be like rearranging the furniture on the Titanic but I would love to see that useless creature Vinai and his grovelling apologies to EPL CEOs kicked out of Arsenal and replaced by someone that can run a football club and who has a passion for the club.
I think the whole top-flight football system is broken by money/greed. It’s disgusting how much everyone gets paid and yet because it’s something in demand they keep pushing the prices up. It hits us in the pocket, not the people at the top, capitalism at its finest. As much as I love Arsenal I hate the way my family and I have been priced out of the game. I end up taking the kids to non-league football as it more closely resembles the game that I grew up with whilst still having a good time on the terraces.
Terraloon Yes you are right. This was all predicted years ago by Wenger. He was laughed at. He coined the phrase ‘financial doping’ and accurately predicted a number of things like bankruptcy & spiralling wages, transfers & agents fees. He also warned how sponsorship was a way of circumnavigating FFP.. Years later, Man City were caught fiddling sponsorship. Of course fans just want success, so nobody was interested in the financial takeover of the game, self-sustainability, after all it was easy to compete: all you had to do was spend money. But they hadn’t calculated how much. Well we know… Read more »
AFC .
You think the Kronkes tucked up in bed in the USA will give a jot ? They successfully withstood the green and yellow demonstrators
Let’s hope that there is a big turnout on Saturday for the protest before the game with Everton. It is time for Arsenal fans to stand up and be counted! The Krankies are not fit to run an EPL club. They should stick to what they know and buy some more American sporting franchises. I hope this European Stupor League fiasco will finally push the government into action regarding the cultural heritage value of long established football clubs. They can do it for building and other areas of cultural significance, so over to you Boris!!!
Rich
I’d question some of your assertions regarding taxes and big business it is irrefutable fact that big business pay less tax than they should
Competentency , Honesty, and Government never the twain shall meet
One thing I will say that Pedro has spot-on is that Garry Neville can fucking do one. Sky’s bread and butter is the Premier League, if it fails, they fail. They were not going to allow that to happen, which was evident from their push last weekend. Garry Neville has a financial interest in the English league succeeding with Salford, his man of the people routine was an absolute smokescreen for his own greed. Also, he took shots at Arsenal any chance he could, it’s the same with all United fans, they’re delusional. At least we know we have fallen… Read more »
Worse things happen in Clerkenwell Rd.
“Let’s hope that there is a big turnout on Saturday for the protest before the game with Everton.”
God, I hope they don’t turn up on Saturday, they’ll be a day late! 😆
Jim
” Pedro brought something up that needs to be spoken about more in the media, United’s scare tactics against officials that basically won them, league, after league is tantamount to match-fixing and no one wants to speak about it.”
Neville and Rooney laughed about it. Neville said he was embarrassed at how they used to deliberately bully officials. For proof just watched the 50th game referred by Riley, now that was fixed.
@AFC – That game was a total fix, I have never seen such a blatant attempt in all my life. What is funny is at the time, it was normal, no questions were asked because it was happening week in, week out. It is when you go back and look at it now, it becomes so clear how fixed the league was. But, people don’t want to talk about it. Like “it could never happen in the English game, that’s a foreign thing”. In a just world, United would be stripped of a lot of those titles they won in… Read more »
BobN16 How’s that German fan ownership working out for the competitiveness of the Bundesliga? Bayern have won every title since 2013….. The reason the PL has been the most interesting over the last 8 seasons, is we’ve had 5 different winners, this season West Ham + Leicester could make the top 4 Even before big investment into clubs, football success always came in cycles Football is changing rapidly, we’re now beginning to see talent produced in large quantities, and that talent will filter downwards, and that trend I expect will increase with the amount of money being invested in the… Read more »
Have to hand it to Arteta, he does speak well at times in tricky situations
With the input of Rupert Murdoch with the Premier League! Le Gove is relevant around the football world, not just around Bethnal Green. So that’s good.
What are the chances of stan getting his lost esl money by insisting we sell all of our best players
Rich
By now even you should have realised is that the last thing the billionaires and hedge fund owners who own our football clubs are interested in a “truly free market “ which is “competitive”.
The whole idea of the ESL was to destroy competition and the free market you love so much.
It’s called financial capitalism.
Jim Total farce. I have shown the Youtube video to younger fans and they can’t believe it wasn’t called out for the fix it was. I don’t think I have ever seen a game with so many blatant wrong decisions and obvious ones. VAR would have had a field day, Man Utd would have had 9 men, after RVN & Ferdinand had their reds. In fact, you could argue that Gary Neville was lucky to stay on the pitch, they way the butchered Reyes was quite something, yet teh first yellow card went to Ashley Cole!! Riley did such a… Read more »
Hmm. Fair point about Bayern and also Leipzig and Wolfsburg. As the people who provide the endorsement for the players work permits, signifcant power still resides with the FA. They could pull the plug on any of the 6 being viable by messing with their work permits. Almost impossible to challenge in court as the only reason, post Brexit, they are able to work here at all is a special dispensation. FA have the clubs by the shirt and curlies in this respect. The mistake was to try to do this without having the teams, managers and ultimately fans on… Read more »
When caught with your pants down, do shake your wheelie like to convey been pissing .Same thing.
Also it conveys you are pissed off
I think that the ESL concept is not dead as many had hoped. Listening to the language of Peres and Agnelli I think that they will attempt to find another route most probably involving UEFA. The project may provide some compromises, but I think that it will evolve within two seasons. It would of course be interesting to learn which English club was the reluctant participant as Peres has suggested. I am sure that it was not Arsenal. What has happened will I believe trigger some action by the Kroenke family and Senior Management, because Arsenal cannot continue to operate… Read more »
“If you think the government can spend and donate our wages, better than we can spend and donate our money, then nobody is paying any attention” Sorry Rich, that’s ideological nonsense. So everyone gets to decide what happens with their money. How many people do you think are going to willingly pay for the services we need? How many are going to want to support less worthy but necessary causes? And then complain that the streets are overrrun with druggies because no-one wants to spend their hard earned cash on rehabilitation centres? Government are elected to take these often unpopular… Read more »
Buckage There’s a difference between tax avoidance, and lower taxes Tax rises just get passed onto the consumer, which equals higher prices, and lower standards of living, it’s usually a tax of the poorest in society via the back door Higher business rates reduce your businesses competitiveness in a global market and increase prices domestically, if your businesses are less competitive, they’ll sell less stuff, create less jobs, and produce less tax revenue This effects jobs and employment levels, and increases the strain on the state with higher levels of unemployment The lower the taxes, the higher you can push… Read more »
The Blaster.
Ironically restricting work permits would probably distort matters even further.
All that would happen is the big boys would hover up the the better players and you can be sure that the players wouldn’t hesitate for one second for using rulings that are currently there and enabling them to break their contracts and walk for free.
Pedro “Arsenal lost our perch as the top club in Europe because billionaires whitewashed their reps in our league and purchased success at unprecedented levels. That wasn’t fair. We did things the hard way and we got absolutely nothing out of it. Our stadium was pointless. Our love affair with the idea of FFP faltered because UEFA let it slide. Unfairness, led by the richest, will find its wicked way again, but next time, it’ll be more subtle”. Yes. I have to give you a pat on the back for today’s article, excellent. As you will know, I am likeminded… Read more »
Jim & AFC forever.Don’t get me started on that 50th match at old toilet.The most criminal episode of refereeing I’ve ever come across.shameful.And as for Gary “ f** ng Neville.I wish DT & the boys had chinned him when they met up a couple of years ago.A hypocrite to the core.Slagging off Arsenal any half chance he gets ignoring his own clubs failures conveniently.You can put that other wanker Keane in the same boat.God I hate em.
Just drove past the training ground, a few fans and looked like press outside. I hear Josh is over here and speaking at the AST this afternoon.
Words on a blog Which is why I was against the ESL, I was in favour of the government stepping in based on anti-competitive nature of it, both corporate and state protectionism produce exactly the same results The idea Arsenal could finish 12th, and Leicester could finish 3rd, but Arsenal play in the ESL, but Leicester don’t Would be impossible to justify, wouldn’t be healthy for the game, and if it had gone ahead, it would have ultimately failed The whole point of competition, is that sometimes clever and innovative people with far less resources, completely outsmart the rest, and… Read more »
The ESL is no excuse. Arsenal should win against Everton
Andy I agree with much of that. I mean, nobody in their right mind can justify players’ earning £200,000 a week. Justifying this level of greed is exactly why the game is no longer a working-class sport. They don’t earn this because they deserve it, they earn this because of the artificial inflation that has taken place due to TV money and the foreign investment that wanted a piece of the pie. Far better to introduce a salary cap and subsidise football so that families and the future fan can actually afford to attend games. Remember Ashley Cole’s book where… Read more »
Terraloon I’m not so sure about the Kroenke’s being bomb proof. Wenger took the bullets as manager and was a shield that protected the owners. The atmosphere around that time was toxic in the stadium. 60,000 fans screaming Kroenke out week in week out is a powerful message and terrible publicity for the brand. Its not as if the team will be playing scintillating football any time soon. I’m hopeful we might be able to get rid of him. I know all owners aren’t saints but I’d like some who actually cares about Arsenal.
Rich,
The German model has to listen to the fans in a way that doesn’t exist in the PL. I’m not saying it’s perfect but there’s a good reason why tickets to matches are much cheaper in Germany for example.
Not having an owner who’s interest in Arsenal appears to be simply as another asset in his business portfolio who be good too!
Rich, Trickle down economy or as George Bush senior used to call it Vaudoo economics does not work. It has been proven by numerous Nobel prize economics that it does not. Left to their own device, deregulated markets will settle on an local optimum an oligopoly. Mathematically that optimum is likely to be a duopoly or a triopoly. More importantly, once that oligopoly is established, the market ceases to be competitive. It will not be run for the benefit of the consumer, but for the benefit of the oligopoly. Hence most countries enacting anti-trust and fair competition laws. In fact… Read more »
Our big wart on the annus succinctly described by Tim of 7amkickoff “ In Andrew’s column this morning he voiced a concern that in their open letter, Kroenke was issuing a threat and worried that the situation between the owners and the fans could boil for years. I agree with Andrew, this could potentially drag on for years, and could get extremely ugly. They mention protecting Arsenal several times in their apology to the fans. Their intent was to “protect Arsenal” and “ensure financial stability”: “the decision to be part of the Super League was driven by our desire to… Read more »
Afternoon guys. I have friend who owns lots of property. He set his heart on 1 particular address in Knightsbridge. The only problem was the owner didn’t like him and refused to sell. What he did was open up a new company, installing a lawyer as the director and she negotiated with the seller and of course the seller sold. Not knowing tgat my friend was in fact the new owner. I don’t know how this works but I wouldn’t be surprised if the wank yank after taking so much heat sells up to another company that could NEVER be… Read more »
All you keep doing when you keep diluting how evil this ploy was involving Stan Kroenke is actually enabling him and aiding him.
You may say he can’t be got rid of anyway or sell up but you are making it much more comfortable.
All this look mum these boys have been naughty too. It wasn’t just me.
Another thing that concerns me is all the clubs involved particularly the 6 here have all talked about the fans, the fans, the fans. They are misdirecting what is really going on. We are minions to these billionaires but they are giving us a false sense of security
S Asoa Take that article with a piece of salt. Football debt all over Europe has come home to roost, the cat is out of the bag. You will have seen the debt crisis Barcelona and Real face, gross debt is hovering around 1 Billion Euros but more importantly, short-term debt at Barca is around 75%. The pandemic has bought forward the inevitable consequences of the artificial inflation of wages and transfer fees caused by financial doping & the irresponsible trying to keep up. We weren’t one of the irresponsible ones, luckily. Let’s look at Tottenham. A large chunk of… Read more »
This idea was hatched by Stan Kroenke along with others. Stan Kroenke was going to lead Arsenal into the ESL. One man was going to lead the club into the ESL. It was never a case of the club as a whole joining ESL, It was a case of one man riding roughshod over the club and dragging it unawares into the ESL. All you have to do is hear about how the players and managers were not eveb notified of this to realise this. So don’t think you need to deflect the ESL disgrace in some attempt to protect… Read more »
Tony 2
“Finally to AFC your rant yesterday should be immortalised. The best piece I ever read from a contributer, straight from the heart”
Thanks, I really appreciate that Tony.
I did apologise for it being so long-winded but that’s the passion for you. I hope others enjoyed it, but as there is no like or dislike button, you assume the worst!
Unai Emery. Guess in Spanish so he does not sound as gibberish
https://metro.co.uk/2021/04/20/ex-arsenal-boss-unai-emery-gives-verdict-on-european-super-league-plans-14442272/
That this man didn’t even roll around in pigshit and apologise to the fans like many of the others says it all.
Yes empty apologies but we don’t even have the pleasure to see him rolling in the turd.
I was wondering whether Unai Bummery might pull some stunt when we play them like we saw Leeds players do against Liverpool. To try to gain some moral superiority and psychological advantage.
But then I remembered he has managed PSG.
Perez was moaning that in Spain the top 3 clubs lose money and the rest make a profit. What the self serving fool has missed is that if true this is good thing for their leagues future. The big problem would be if it was the reverse.
AFC
The driving force of ESL appear to be a pack of Clubs facing bankruptcy, all of their own making. Long ago Madrid inflated wages with a Gallacticos model. The shit rolled on , now snowballed into a billion Euro debt for Madrid. As the Galacticos got sold they brought their infectious wages into other Clubs..
The choir boys of the fiasco are the fat cat Super Agents, sucking out money 💰 out of the system and enabling manipulative payoff’s in the gravy train
Ishola The ESL Kingmakers were Man Utd, Liverpool and Real Madrid. Woodward used to work for JP Morgan, he was the one who organised their involvement, hence why he fell on his sword so quickly. That doesn’t, and shouldn’t, let Kroenke off the hook because all six English Clubs are culpable. Arsenal’s position isn’t influential enough to have led it, sadly that’s where we sit currently, we were invited along because for it to work it needed us and the value we bring to global TV rights. Financially, Stans eyes will have rolled, along with Levey (who let’s face owns… Read more »
Valentin We don’t currently have a truly free market based on free and fair competition We have a combination of corporate and state protectionism Take financial fair play, all it did was produce more of the very thing that it claimed it was trying to prevent, there was a reason the top clubs gleefully signed up for it And that reason was it protected the bigger clubs against the smaller clubs It’s the same with tariffs, all they do is protect businesses in rich countries, against business in poor countries, and a huge cost to the poorest consumers in the… Read more »
S Asoa
Yes, I agree with you.
AFC Forever Look you are at it again deflecting. You can’t help yourself. I know it may be an natural instinct feeling to think you have to protect. Ok he may have not hatched the idea but there are many reports that he was a leading player in regards the EPL clubs. I wouldn’t even bother distinguishing one American owner from another from the rebels. They are like one group of menace. Again just to repeat. There is no need feel that you must protect Arsenal’s name in this. All you are doing in fact is protecting Stan Kroenke. This… Read more »
I can only surmise that Pedro was more than willing to join the ESL and I think this applies to quite a few of the posters on here as well which of course is not reflective of the fans of the EPL clubs involved at all.
Everyone to their own.
I say this because we have had only one blog post outright condemning the ESL and that was the very first one when we all first found out about the ESL,
Others have been apparently sidelines reporting and deflection posts.
The “big” clubs wants to maintain their status in this football business. But the expenditure is so high that they have to borrow money or lose a lot of money. In a normal business, a company would cut cost to reduce the deficit. But not for football. Business income is tied directly to winning. In the States, a solution is very easy since there is only one country. You come up with one system, one salary cap, it will apply to all. Not for Europe under a corrupted UEFA. For me, each club should fix up its own economy. They… Read more »
The problem isn’t the agents “sucking the money” out of the game, their job is to extract maximum value for their clients
The problem is an undersupply of talent, if the market produces better talent in much higher quantities, then wages , transfer and agents fees, will come down at the same time
If they want to adjust the balance, then invest heavily in the development of younger player on a larger scale and the problem will solve itself
Now that the English have decided that nationalization is the way to go in football, lets not stop there
Nationalize energy, media, transport, and NOT just in England, in each and every nation,
The hypocrisy and double standards is unacceptable.
The under supply of talent is artificially created by double standards like homegrown rule
Im telling you for free!
There is a fundamental flaw in all of this. There seems to be a belief that there is a never ending line of new consumers for football content, in markets like N America, China and India. And presumably also consumers who are willing to put cash down on cable tv packages, shirts, club johnnies and the like. This is patently bullshit. Football is an elitist sport in the US and China, and meaningless to most in India. Across other countries in APAC there is some support for clubs but little exposure to European competition which is on too late to… Read more »
I agree it is down to the agents controlling the game through player power and increasing their clients weekly salaries to 350k a week and earning a hefty commission in the process… the bottom line is that players wages need to be capped. The Bosman ruling was the worst thing to happen since it created an opportunity for agents to ensure players would be represented by them and create a significant increase in their gains which ultimately resulted in the beautiful game becoming more commercialised and the average football fan struggling to afford attendance to the games. However this is… Read more »
Nelson The problem of financial doping is now beginning to solve itself in the PL, that’s why they tried to do a runner, and fix the odds in their favour, they can see what’s coming down the road The market is about to produce better quality players, on a much larger scale, which will increase the overall level of competition, and money will become less important The bigger clubs didn’t build business models based on the malleability of football revenue, they took their participation in Europe for granted, and are now haemorrhaging money as a result, as well as chasing… Read more »
Fine, forceful article Pedro. Football, like many business has morphed into something quite different from the game older supporters grew up with and loved. I’ve recently been talking to the surviving players in the 71 Double team and one realises that they didn’t play in a different era , they are almost from a different planet . One told me that after the Final victory against Chelsea in 2017 the players got into an argument about bonuses in the dressing room . He was gobsmacked that, at that moment it even crossed their mind . We have a game where… Read more »
Sid You’re absolutely right But the reason they’ve done that, is because the free market will fix that problem all on its own, it’ll just take a little bit of time Youth development in football is vital, the rule ensures that clubs are coerced into investing into their academies, and giving young people opportunities, without that pressure they’ll continue to covet off the shelf ready made talent The 17/8 rule doesn’t go far enough for me, I’d like to see it brought down to 14/11 This will put much more pressure on clubs to invest in youth, the more pressure… Read more »
Ishola “Look you are at it again deflecting. You can’t help yourself. I know it may be an natural instinct feeling to think you have to protect.” What an earth are you prattling on about? I largely agree with you but you’re picking a fight? Have a herbal tea mate. Stan Kroenke is an American Billionaire who couldn’t give a toss about Arsenal. He gets no free pass from me, can’t stand the bloke or any foreign owners to be fair! His role in the ESL, whatever it is, is a disgrace. I want him out of the club. I… Read more »
If I was Stan, I’d float the club on the stock market but retain ownership of the stadium. Charge rent. Steady income. We’d be captive tenants, unable to do anything about it.
AFC Forever
I said already after that there are many reports that Stan Kroenke was a leading player in regards the EPL clubs. Not that he started it all.
As said before there is really not much point in distinguishing one american owner from another of those EPL clubs involved. They are one club of people.
Again no idea why we are geting these vibes of these owners are worse than our one. They had more say.
Stan K is a cunt. That’s all there is to it.
ION, supreme leader making excuses for tomorrow
Le Grove
@LeGrove
Players don’t need much to switch off, especially those at the Arsenal.
Very interested to see if all this commotion has rattled anyone this Friday
This would make William Orpen envious
Rich, You forget big components of economy and physics: entropy and external forces. If we see football as a closed system, Football did not suddenly become organically richer, external forces (TV broadcasters) injected money into that close system. In doing so it attracted external forces (agents, hedge funds, vulture funds, …). That’s the equivalent of the first law of thermodynamics. If there money to be extracted from a system, then money will be taken until the system collapse or there is no more money to be taken out. The financialisation of the world is one of the biggest issues the… Read more »
Sid You’re out of your mind if you think the government can provide better value than a competitive market place Take Corbyn’s offer of “Free internet” There’s no such thing as free I pay £20 p/m for my Internet, I signed an 18 month contract, which is now rolling You’re gambling that the government can provide the service cheaper than £20 p/m, which without market pressure is extremely unlikely, because they can be as wasteful as they want, but there’s nobody to challenge them You’re gambling that the government can run the internet, better than the people who are trained… Read more »
Now that we fans are The Heroes Who Saved Football, lauded by owners, politicians and FIFA/UEFA, something else will have to give if the non-oil self-appointed. If clubs are gonna be rescued from the consequences of their own excessive expenditures.
Prepare for a move/moves to curb:
A) agent fees
B) transfer fees
C) most importantly, player wages
Valentin
I agree with you that football is pretty much a closed system.
Within that system, leakages (agents fees) have to be dramatically removed.
And player wages have to be capped, otherwise a significant proportion of clubs will face bankruptcy in the next couple of years.
Rich “You’re out of your mind if you think the government can provide better value than a competitive market place.” Most politicians haven’t even had a proper job. I hate politics, a very bad idea getting them involved to run anything other than a bath. Who was that pretty dim female politician who went out wearing two left shoes that didn’t even match? (How is that even possible, must have been uncomfortable FFS). I mean, all jokes aside, that is hardly the sign of anyone who should be running anything, including the bath. Imagine her and Mike Riley involved in… Read more »
I posted this in the previous section unaware there was a new post! Did anyone see the proposal on a graded transfer system? It was an interesting take, a way of circumventing the system of teams being able to overload their teams with the best players. How it works: Clubs are restricted on the number of ‘top graded’ players they can have in their squad. This is combined with a homegrown and academy incentive to ensure young players have the opportunity. The reason for the grading was because spending limits based on turnover was easy to fiddle with sponsorship arrangements… Read more »
“State and corporate monopolies provide higher prices, no consumer choice, worse service, followed by stagnation and then regression” Hmm, the postal service then. Sold off at a below market price, a significant number of shares acquired by Tory lackies, no competition, poorer service, staff reductions, but profits for investors. Or the energy sector where price fixing to keep profits up meant that state regulation was required. A system where the poorest were charged more to have prepayment meters (because having heating and electricity is a luxury of course). Then of course we have all the denationalised industries like cars, steel… Read more »
AFC
It’s important to try to control transfer values – that relates to fair competition and limiting the impact of rich clubs with rich owners ability to use financial doping. But ultimately transfer funds (excluding agents’ fees) stay within the system and if a rich club wants to spend £72m for a player like Pepe, anothe less rich club will benefit.
For all clubs’ financial health it’s more important to limit agents’ fees (which flow out of the system) and player wages (which have now become unsustainable)
Rich, ‘competitive market place’ is such a falsehood. Look no further than tech for that. Big firms get in, control the data, squash competition, and change the rules to work in their favour.
Amazon control the selling platform, they look at small biz data, if they see something banging, they copy it and resell it at a lower price.
In nearly all areas of big business, competition is crushed, small guys get fucked.
Back to football… Just wanted to pick on this from the post: “‘PUNISHMENT’ Puuuuurlease. I just don’t believe there can be a punishment from the biggest clubs after this near miss. UEFA needs to have a good Champions League. Punishing mega clubs would be a weird move. You can’t have a Champions League without the big names. I think the most likely outcome, which is rumoured to be happening, is a kick-up in revenue for the CL. $4 billion added to the pot. It’s also rumoured that there will be a backdoor way for big clubs to get into the… Read more »
The government should never be in a position to cap your earning potential, who are they to decide your value If we don’t own our own time, and the vast majority of the fruits of our own labor, then can we ever really claim to be free people Fans one minute are crying about a lack of investment, then the next their crying about inflationary wages and fees You fix the lack of competitiveness, the high agent fees, high player wages, and high transfer fees, in exactly the same way Invest in grassroots footballers on and off the pitch, and… Read more »
Andy1886
The German model is based on creating a single European currency that is 40-45% undervalued for the German economy
And massively overvalued for the rest of the Mediterranean
They’ve crippled half a continent, just so they can sell within the single market tariff free, use the customs union to lock out competition
But that doesn’t matter because any tariffs applied, have already been wiped out by having a currency devaluation of 40-45%