The collapse of the Super League on day two marks one of the most spectacular fails in business history.
Owners and their exec leaders spent the pandemic scheming ways to make the most of a bad situation. As I wrote yesterday, they thought they had every base covered. They believed ‘big club energy’ would make the rest of the football world bend to their will. They hoped they could ride this out with the fans.
It did not happen.
Some thought on the tipping points.
Early morning, The AST said that Boris Johnson was not only horrified, he was actively seeking to stop the Super League from happening. Politically, as the top boy, he has a lot of power. He could have interfered with taxes, messed with player temp visas, and most importantly… toy with the residences of billionaires taking up camp in England. If Boris can sniff out political opportunity with his base, you are in trouble. He is the world’s number 1 when it comes to breaking up European alliances. It’ll take a few days to find out what tipped the scales, but I wouldn’t be shocked to learn that the political system turned some screws. I also wonder how the JP Morgan piece played into this. Did someone in the government tell the bank that this was a no-go? That Boris would drag it out and make it deeply unpopular? Watch this space.
Bayern Munich said no, with Germany politely saying fuck off to the proposal. That was followed by the news that PSG wouldn’t play ball. There are rumours they were the inside man on this deal, back-channelling to UEFA where their owner is a big deal. Regardless, how can you have a Super League without those two teams?
The third and most important impact was the wall to wall vitriol spewed in the papers, social media and the sports channels. No one had a good thing to say about the Super League. Everyone hated it. It spoke to greed, it was the antithesis of what makes European sport popular, and it shone a bright light on the characters of those engaging in this act of treachery.
Chelsea bailed first. Then City. Then Spurs, United, and Arsenal. Now there is no Super League.
Ed Woodward was the first big name to resign. He’s out at United. That is huge. He burnt all his capital with the fans and his position was untenable. There are rumours doing the rounds that the Glazers are looking to sell because football doesn’t have a high enough profit ceiling and they want out.
I wrote yesterday what people inside the game were thinking about the possible threats to their ghastly vision. A few gave me pelters suggesting the post was wrong. Not sure how people came to that conclusion. The plan was built to deliver the Super League, the 12 clubs thought they had safety from all the counter-punches. Some of those execs spent yesterday trying to sell those counter-points I wrote about.
Ivan Gazidis on why it works for the little guys.
“The Super League will provide value and support to the whole football pyramid with greater financial resources.”
Florentino Perez on the lack of power to control the big 12.
‘They won’t throw Madrid out of the Champions League, for sure,” Perez said. “Not Madrid or [Manchester] City or anyone. I’m completely sure. Or La Liga either.’
Perez on ‘content’ and the new style of fan.
‘Football is the only global sport in the world with more than four billion fans and our responsibility as big clubs is to respond to the wishes of the fans.’
Barca on how they could convince the governments the influx of money would improve infrastructure (grassroots support).
‘Those clubs in power will share €3.5billion “solely to support their infrastructure investment plans and to offset the impact of the covid pandemic’
What ended up unravelling this buttoned-up plan?
EVERYTHING.
Government intervention.
The fans.
The pundits.
The sponsors.
The players.
The explayers.
The staff.
The papers.
You can’t even call this misreading the room, because I don’t believe these execs thought this was ever going to be a popular plan. They just shit their pants. Chelsea fans literally rocked their bus and it all came crumbling down.
It was a dastardly plan, enacted by folks disconnected from fan culture, who messed their pants after TWO DAYS.
I think football fans are shocked at how easy it was to win. Fan FC, gegenpressing masters, tried to win the game inside the first 10 minutes and scored 7 goals. It was over before there was an official hashtag or a banner to fly over the stadium. We were at the mean tweets phase. I thought this would go on for weeks. I thought the billionaires would plough through like they do with every other change they bring to the game.
They bottled it.
Now what for Arsenal?
Vinai is the face of this move though not the decision-maker. Regardless, he’s lost the trust of the fans, players, sponsors and the staff in one hit. How does that affect his ability to lead us this summer? How can he ever talk about our class again after trying to slip this out the door at 11pm on a Sunday night? If he stays, he’s damaged goods, if he goes, we’re starting AGAIN. It never stops for Arsenal. There is always something terrible to deal with that is of our own making. It’s not just him. Tim Lewis, Gooner on the ground, would have been part of this as well. Plenty of people who love football at Arsenal, went along with this regardless. At least the players and staff didn’t know. Auba deleted his twitter account.
The club apologised, the only one to do so, which is at least a start, but the tone was purposefully naive and misleading.
The system needs to be fixed. We must work together to find solutions which protect the future of the game and harness the extraordinary power football has to get us on the edge of our seats.
We know it will take time to restore your faith in what we are trying to achieve here at Arsenal but let us be clear that the decision to be part of the Super League was driven by our desire to protect Arsenal, the club you love, and to support the game you love through greater solidarity and financial stability.
The miscalculation was the big clubs thought their global fans were different to the noisy rabble in London. They believed the new ‘casual’ fan was engaging with football like they would an algorithm suggestion in Netflix. They believed football was just another type of content like video games, TV, or music. They were not prepared for the commoners to see stability as a collective issue. They believed their own greed and desire to be part of the elite insider group would be the same for the fans. They were all wrong, the values local fans have is part of what makes the game appealing, and they want to be part of that… and are. For Arsenal to be talking about stability after they tried to spoil the game for the many, to preserve privilege for the few, makes this statement so off-key. Values our leadership talk about are marketing gimmicks, this debacle is a proof point to that.
The open letter said a few times they were trying to protect the club and its future. A great soundbite if we were Dagenham & Redbridge. We’re Arsenal. We have a billionaire owner married to into of the most successful families that has ever existed on this planet. He is supposed to be our protection. That was the point of a billionaire owner. If we weren’t getting his investment, we were better of being run privately like we were when we were successful.
Vinai said this when he started.
‘Together we will work tirelessly with the extraordinary staff we have at Arsenal to respect and enhance our unique history, heritage and values; with the overall objective to bring success to our millions of fans all around the world and make them proud of their club’
Protecting the future of our club by eliminating competition was the plan to make us proud? Sacking Gunnersaurus? Firing 52 members of staff before signing a 32-year-old on a 3 year deal for £250k a week? This ‘proud’ strategy needs a rethink because it has never been less believable.
As for ‘mistake’.. come on. This was no mistake. This has been on the agenda for longer than Vinai. No one can be shocked Ivan spoke up about it on Tuesday, this was part of the reason he moved to Milan. Imagine what this would have done for his stock options? This was a premeditated attack on European football culture. It required deep thought and planning. It’s something they knew would distress fans and they just did it anyway. The only regret Arsenal has on this is that everyone else lost their nerve and the stress and embarrassment wasn’t worth a penny.
So what becomes of Arsenal? How does this mess affect our standing in the game? How does it affect the dressing room? How does it impact our appeal this summer?
There was a rumour that Chelsea and City pulled out of this because it levelled the playing field. They exit this debacle winners regardless because they didn’t ever need the money. Arsenal? We’re back to £20m summers in a sell to buy cycle. That felt bad before, now, it feels even worse.
If the Super League is dead, why would Stan continue to keep a club that is bottom of that power league? Isn’t it time to hand it over and admit that this little stunt was the last roll of the dice for a guy that has absolutely no vision or ideas for a game that has passed him by? Isn’t it time for him to be the bigger man and end this. Give the club to someone that likes sport. Do something fair for the fans. Last time I checked, there are 150,000 people tweeting #KroenkeOut. Cash-out. A group repping a very rich family told me they wanted to buy out Arsenal for £2 billion 3 years ago. There are buyers out there. Maybe this mess might offer them a way out as they struggle with costs and focus with The Rams complex. I’m dreaming, this is about as likely as JP Morgan leaking ‘Stan is selling’ to Talksport.
Outside the consequences for Arsenal. What are the consequences for the idea? What stops this from happening again? Who intervenes? Government? FIFA? UEFA? How can the fans be secure in the knowledge this near miss will be avoided… forever. Who will protect the sanctity of the game?
This was a coup. It failed. The lessons of history tell you that if harsh consequences are not meted out, the bad guys come back for the prize again and again. Football cannot allow this culture crime to slide. UEFA let this happen by not enforcing rules, by bungling TV deals, by being average. Time for them to get tough. Time for some accountability. Time to secure the game.
Before I go, Johnny mentioned an important point on the podcast and so have plenty of people that tweet me and contribute to the website. If the big 12 can plan a breakaway during work hours in a pandemic, don’t tell me they can’t do something big on racism in the game. We just played Slavia Prague and everyone in Europe was hoping we’d beat them because of their abhorrent behaviour that goes unchecked. If we can use the might of Arsenal to cut a mega deal at the expense of our soul, then we can use it to fix something that is still stinking out our game.
The fans won. What a moment. The biggest farce in business history and a win for the little guys. Unbelievable. Have a great day, I hope you’re smiling.
P.S. Special shoutout to the immense work Tim Payton and the AST Team has done on this. If you want to put your money towards a force for good in football, sign up to this link and add your voice to their growing membership.
The esl will be back in some form unless the whole of European football has a rebalance such as the German 50+1 rule being implemented across all leagues.
Not saying this would be entirely positive but now would be the time to do It if everyone is serious about having some kind of competitive leve playing field
Greed is good.
Have fans actually looked up the new CL formats? Its almost similar to ESL, example Arsenal and Tottenham would’ve have qualified for next CL if the new CL format kicked off next season.
Simply a case of lesser evil, Or maybe it was their plan all along, one would never know.
B63 – You continually espouse the idea that ‘big’ clubs should get preferential treatment, your most recent example being that ‘minnows’ should have to enter earlier and qualify while big clubs should get some kind of free pass from the early stages due to their ‘coefficent’. Just NO! Big clubs already have an advantage yet you want to widen the gap further? Sporting merit should be the ONLY determination as to who qualifies for what and when.
Then again maybe by suggesting that equality of opportunity should be paramount rather than financial firepower I’m just another ‘communist’.
The ESL failed because everyone who loves football said “no” and pushed back.
One person who did not say “no” and push back, however, is Pedro.
Shame on you, Pedro.
Backpass
Then the new CL format must be rejected as well. En masse.
Hear, hear, Andy. The rich clubs already have plenty of advantages.
As for Arsenal, Arsenal need to spend their money more intelligently. End of.
If we presume talks have been running for 2 years or so that suggests that Kroenke has been looking at a 350m injection for some time . Building it into his plans . One could guess that slush fund could flow out of Arsenal through to his US interests. He may well have seen this as his get out of jail card . Selling up could now appear a lot more beneficial for him. Let’s keep fingers crossed
Absolutely Benny. We’re better off than most, we’re on a par with Chelsea in terms of spending over the last few years it’s just that we spend what we have awfully.
Where is the incentive to improve when the answer is always more money?
Chelsea dont have a 1 billion debt.
Where did that idea cone from?
backpass
How do Spurs (7th) and Arsenal (9th) qualify for the CL?
F*ck the SuperLeague, f*ck Kroenke, and f*ucking shape up FA, FIFA and UEFA. Football is nothing without the fans, and it doesn’t matter if you’re from Norway, Nigeria, USA or London.
My old man has been a Gooner since the 60’s, my brother and I since the mid 90’s, and we’ve been to London for games against “inferior” opposition many times – the most memorable one against Hull (!) in a certain final in 2014.
So glad this didn’t go through, but at the same time ashamed of what Arsenal have become under Kroenke.
ESL would probably have worked if they had come up with a ‘Competition’ instead of a closed league and exposed how UEFA is hoarding the money from the deserving clubs. UEFA is corrupt and no saint is the general consensus. How would you counter that? Its simple. You put forward a fair competition exposing how it will benefit all the involved parties. And get the consent from all the clubs which participate in the CL and EL. Not just the 12 big bulls. What did the ESL do? They came up with an even more absurd and evil closed league.… Read more »
This is perhaps the best take I have seen on the whole issue
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/sportsnews/article-9494763/John-Barnes-insists-Big-Sixs-withdrawal-European-Super-League-NOT-victory-fans.html#comments
The bits that missing for me is the hypocrisy of the players. They talk all about the fans matter yet the biggest expense is the players wages. If they felt that strongly their wouldn’t be wages hitting the levels which of course then to a large degree accounts for how much we all have to pay to see a game.
#KronkeOut
‘The bits that missing for me is the hypocrisy of the players. They talk all about the fans matter yet the biggest expense is the players wages. If they felt that strongly their wouldn’t be wages hitting the levels which of course then to a large degree accounts for how much we all have to pay to see a game.’
Why would the players subsidise their wages? To line the billionaire owner’s pockets?
They have a contractual right over every penny they earn, if a ckub can’t afford that player they shouldn’t buy that player.
MarkyMark – Kroenke has been plotting with the others for some time. This was exposed in 2016 when Chelsea, Arsenal, United, Liverpool and Man City were caught holding secret talks about a breakaway league at the Dorchester Hotel.
The number one risk that no corporation or organization wants realized is Reputation. On that alone AFC’s reputation took a very severe hit, one that may take years, if ever to regain public trust. AFC and more specifically KSE did know better and if they continue to feign the same ignorance (we did it for the wake of the club), they are essentially damaged goods as it is now so very clear to them as to whom really calls the shots (the supporters). I sincerely doubt that KSE will sell the club anytime soon because as we now know they… Read more »
Andy “Absolutely Benny. We’re better off than most, we’re on a par with Chelsea in terms of spending over the last few years ” And that is why Chelsea have basically turned into Arsenal, in that they no longer challenge for the title , 4 seasons and counting. Good cup side though.. 200 million spent in 20/21 tells me that Chelsea will be pulling out all the stops to try and regain the league title in the next few years , whilst Arsenal will try and compete for the title using our academy players and the odd signing and hoping… Read more »
Sake if the club – stupid auto-fill
SAKE OF THE CLUB
CT
I am not naive enough to think that the owners will rub their hands with glee but there is. A direct link to wage costs in any business and the cost of the end product and to date other that a million or so the directors have taken minuscule sums out of the clubs.
“How do Spurs (7th) and Arsenal (9th) qualify for the CL?”
Wasi
Due to the new rule, there is space for 2 new Elite club if they don’t qualify it would be measured by Coefficient, by league table.
Arsenal
Tottenham
Borrussia Dortmund
Roma.
If Arsenal wins Europa, then Tottenham and Dortmund qualifies. I think you need to read the new CL format.
Ernest. The Arsenal way died along time ago. I completely agree the clubs credibility has taken a huge hit.My hope is that it damages Kroenke beyond repair.
Benny,
“BackpassThen the new CL format must be rejected as well. En masse”
I don’t think fans would bother, they have been adding changes almost every 5 years now, and the ESL was the perfect storm for it to go under the rader.
Classenal is an expression that always did make me throw up in my mouth a little as I’ve never known what made us any classier than 100 of the other teams in England besides a couple of trashy ones
And the clubs gone and proved what I’ve always said is the case. Just a business and no particular class
Our idea of class was throwing money at injured players and long term contracts for players well past their best. Not sure that was ever anything more than dumb waste
Almuniasaynomore
Thanks for your comments.
Wonder how this is affecting the players’ mind sets?
We’ll know soon enough Friday evening.
What the ESL has done is made Uefa looke like the hero. And the ‘dirty dozen’ as the threat to football. I have seen many people here bashing UEFA for their qualification process as well. I would like to know what they think is the better way. PL is easily the strongest league itw so it deserves to have 4 teams in the CL. Similarly Bundesliga and La liga are quite strong too. France has a comparatively weaker league so only 3 French teams qualify to CL via the league. The rest of the tournament spots are fulfilled by considerably… Read more »
Hopefully this is the beginning of the end of colonial (venture) capitalism. Some things you simply cannot year the heart out. These are nations built on the ability of the underdog to succeed, if you want a spectacle or product make a boy band, don’t strip the very essence out of a historical and deeply culturally entwined sport. These billionaires should be putting mo eh in whilst the world is on its knees not taking more out.
“Our idea of class was throwing money at injured players and long term contracts for players well past their best”
Yeah, Abou Diaby comes clearly to mind China. No wonder the vast majority of players loved Wenger, he was a Sugar Daddy personified.
Backpass
That format as I understand it hasn’t yet been introduced and at earliest if it gets voted in the earliest that it will be introduced in 2024
Diaby was injured at work, its class to compensate him.
Paying a restauranter to do nothing on the field is disgraceful.
Terraloon
“BackpassThat format as I understand it hasn’t yet been introduced and at earliest if it gets voted in the earliest that it will be introduced in 2024”
Yeah, am just giving out scenario’s if it were starting next season.
All the more reason for us to win the Europa league or sack Arteta before the new season begins. I don’t want us to waste next season again, simply because some believe Arteta might come good.
I understand that the existing financial state of the 20 EPL clubs will not allow a north American style of salary cap to be implemented. The first step to improve the current system could be for the FA to implement a luxury tax on the total salary exceeding a certain limit. Another tax could also apply to excessive transfer + agent fee. The tax collected would add to the prize money for all 20 teams.
“Diaby was injured at work, its class to compensate him.”
True, but that does not mean you renew the contract whilst he is injured. There is a wide gulf between class and foolishness.
“Diaby was injured at work, its class to compensate him“
True Sid, but it becomes less so when you renew or extend a contract whilst said player remains injured.
Benny, you know I have a lot of love for you and we go back a long time. You like it here because I don’t write what I’m told. I gave a perspective yesterday that came from inside the game and I mapped out ways the fans could win. Some of those threads came to life. I didn’t back the super league… you won’t find that in my tweets, podcasts, or posts. I just gave a view of it. I am not a fan group, I’m just someone that likes writing about Arsenal. If you want action, a protest, or… Read more »
“THERE MUST BE CONSEQUENCES FOR SUPER LEAGUE FARCE” Not sure what that actually looks like, Pedro? Its likely obvious that the other 14 clubs knew the 6 were shitheads to begin with, but after this debacle two lines of thought come to mind. 1. The 6 are shitheads 2. Nothing can be done about #1 because it is those 6 that grease the very wheels that the other clubs function with In the end it will likely be some sort of financial penalty with the funds going to lower league clubs. I dont know, how do you split a mere… Read more »
Ernest, I am not sure either…
Does a head roll?
Does Stan fight us by choking off funding?
Does UEFA cave?
I don’t think we go back to life as normal.
Biggest thing… ‘you could get 10x rev?’
A ban from European competition would seem to be an appropriate sanction. As I’m sure many would point out it’s likely to impact AFC less than the likes of United, City, Liverpool and Chelsea so I’m sure we could live with it. From an Arteta perspective it would lift the pressure on him to qualify and give him the growing room that Pedro is looking for to reach his potential (the argument being about what his actual potential will turn out to be).
Andy, you are a historian… do you sanction the enemy and get something worse come back at you?
Do you forgive, reset, and go again?
Ernest not quite sure despite the desire just what the PL can do Sky are suggesting that the clubs are in breech of rule L9 but they Sky are deliberately missing the word season from the 20/21 rule book . Bear in mind there wasn’t any suggestion of a super league in season 20/21 Here’s the rule L.9. Except with the prior written approval of the Board, during the Season a Club shall not enter or play its senior men’s first team in any competition other than: L.9.1. the UEFA Champions League; L.9.2. the UEFA Europa League; L.9.3. the F.A.… Read more »
If I’ve learned anything from WW1 it’s that we should sanction the big 6 into financial ruin
Rumours abound that FSG is now trying to sell Liverpool because they won’t be able to make money and stay competitive against oil and country founded clubs such as ManCity and PSG.
Pedro, I expect that there will be a negotiation behind the scenes and they will find an agreement that everyone can live with while being seen to take action. No-one wants a football version of Versailles and round 2 somewhere further down the road (just spotted that China has made the same comparison).
Any action will come from UEFA and the PL will do everything they can to keep well out of it.
But in all honesty how the fuck are spurs even in this group and acknowledged as big 6?
They win nothing. Their history is average. They sometimes qualify for the CL in the last handful of years
Big 6 my tits
Morning all
Good post Pedro! This one is more like it compared to yesterdays white flag!
Stan needs to sell. I do not know why he would continue to deal with this headache.
Ego made him buy us, and its been nothing but drama since.
Please sell the club.
China 1 Your right that went so well didn’t it !
Leicester have achieved more than spurs. Can we call it a big 7 yet? Why didn’t they get an invite?
Guns
Sell to who ? And is there any evidence that things would be any better ?
China, did you mean ‘shouldn’t’ sanction them into financial ruin? The origins of WW2 are right there in Versailles even if the likes of the NSDAP did exagerrate the extent to which it crippled Germany (the French by contrast were gutted that it didn’t go far enough).
Spurs involvement was based on two criteria
1) Income&
2) UEFA Co efficient
Terra
Sell to someone who actually knows how to run a club. That is 50% more than we have right there. There will be buyers no doubt. Hopefully, they will be fans as well.
We are still a major player, with a lot of potential for the right owners who can manage correctly.
This Stan is a fucker. A silent stupid fucker
Not sure what he is getting out of owning us aside from headaches and Josh saying he will take care of things over and over.
Knowing for a while they were planning this ESL and eying the funds from it knowing it’s now gone does this finally put pressure now on arteta to gain CL entry . They need that revenue now big time
https://www.hitc.com/en-gb/2021/04/20/lacazette-claims-you-have-to-maintain-6m-arsenal-players-desire-to-play/
It’s concerning when a senior player comes out and says what we’ve all been thinking. It’s not exactly rocket science. So why is it that these situations are able to occur ?
Saliba, Martinelli, Balogun… Why is it that Arteta seems unable to spot/utilise what’s right in front of his eyes?
The punishment should be able to deter them to try it again. The sanction would have zero effect since they don’t want to play in the CL anyway. I would prefer to create a more balanced playing field in the EPL so that more teams have a chance to play in the CL. This would eliminates the excuse of putting teams into two classes based on the strength of the team on the field.
Nor know how to manage them properly
Andy, it was a joke mate
Stan will sell if the right offer comes in…. I think its time for him to move on.
This potential cash cow aint doing shit for him.
Sorry China, went over my head!
Guns
Ken Bates knows how to run a club, so does Peter Risdale. Will they do ?
You can be sure that the bulk of those that will want to buy a PL club will be looking to make a £ from their involvement or perhaps another RA or SM can be found but after all the pelters their two clubs have been handed out wouldn’t it be hypocrisy to welcome what would in effect be a benefactor?
There may be plenty of buyers but knowing their true motives wouldn’t be known till after the event
Andy no worries. I think when someone these days misses a joke the kiddos all start saying *whoosh* or something but I’m not sure. I’m only 31 but already don’t know half of the shot young uns do these days
Anyway just in case I’m right on that allow me to dedicate to you this right royal *whoosh*!
Having the likes of Arsenal and Tottenham as one of the founders of anything with “ Super “ in its name would’ve been enough of a tough sell to the rest of the footballing world, but the fact the jeopardy of relegation was removed from the concept altogether made it IMO a non starter.
Arguing about merits of inclusion is one thing , guaranteeing said participation regardless of performance , quite another.
What’s next?
The Olympics Invitational , featuring athletes with biggest Instagram and Twitter following only?
China
I’m 64 and I got it !
No whoosh for me this time but that won’t last long
China – It’s got nothing to do with winning anything. It’s all about money. The ‘big six’ don’t refer to the number of trophies those clubs have won or how many supporters they have.
The ‘big six’ are the clubs with the greatest valuation and the ones which are most marketable because they currently generate the largest revenue for the TV companies.
I’m astounded that anyone thinks the ESL was anything to do with football.
Thanks China, I’ve not heard that one but get the idea! Question for ya, is it still ‘cool’ to use the word ‘cool’? In my part of the world it was de rigueur to use it in the late 60’s went out of fashion in the 70’s and probably the 80’s but then seemed to make a comeback. As there is an emoji for ‘cool’ I’m guessing it’s still okay but wtf do I know?
Aubameyang deactivated his twitter account but returned a day after
How else will he show off all those lambos?
People need to just calm down
Why would anyone punish the 12 teams that tried to break away?
All they did was attempt a break away. Had they not backed off and proceeded to try to play games then by all means “punish them”
I’m sure the people at UEFA and the FAs are breathing collective sighs of relief. Their job is quickly unify football quickly and out this behind.
Some people just want blood.
Schalke players egged after relegation !
Mustafi & Kola did the trick then !
Agnelli misses the great big elephant in the room when he believes that the Super League is the only way to retain the attention of young people and get run to follow the real thing instead of the PlayStation variety’, namely matches and season tickets are wayyyyy too expensive for young people. Who the hell apart from well paid middle aged people can drop over a grand on a season ticket? Or pay to get into matches (if they can get a ticket) every other weekend, let alone CL matches? The only people I know with season tickets are either… Read more »
“A ban from European competition would seem to be an appropriate sanction” It would only further ignite the underground fire with the Big 12 clubs, Andy. As odd as it sounds, don’t go poking the sleeping bear any further is likely the appropriate course of action – besides, the clubs will pay for this with their supporters. There was a reason for this in the first place and had UEFA paid serious enough attention to it, then perhaps a runaway league would not have been a consideration. UEFA cannot be permitted to escape attention as their bungling greed had a… Read more »
“Mustafi & Kola did the trick then !”
On this i will never waiver, Arteta may not be the right manager for Arsenal long term, but he was so very bang on in identifying the malcontents and dealing with all of them in a meaningful way. For that Arteta will always have my respect.
Saul Niguez:
“I think having a coach like Arteta at Arsenal eased things a lot for him. He knows the language and it is a culture that suits him. Thomas Partey is incredible and if he manages to keep this consistency, he can be one of the best in the world honestly.” [Goal]
Someone didn’t tell Saul that Partey is average and it’s him that ran the whole Atletico midfield. Right Diss?
Ernest, that’s why I said I believe there may be some negotiation going on in the background so that all parties concerned could find an agreement that worked for them. The ‘big 6’ may well take a short term sanction on the chin in order to appease fans and be at least ‘seen’ to be punished. A sort of attempt at damage limitation.
A European ban would only be effective if a solid, strong FFP is put in place. It is clear those clubs and their owners/president have still not understood that their business model is obsolete and unworkable. Without FFP, those clubs will continue to be run on the same model, fail again and then falls back on the pipe dream of a European Super League to solve their problem. The constant scheming to split away from UEFA is based on the fooled belief that long term they would make more money on their own. The only thing they would is sawing… Read more »
What do you think that might look like, Andy?
Im thinking likely some monetary punishment at most. If you think about it further, if you sanction the six from say, the League Cup or FA Cup, it only hurts those competitions ultimately. Sanction them from Europe and you only further stoke the fire. Financial seems the most likely and the proceeds being delivered to lower leagues.
“Mate, you do realise what’s happened over the last 72 hours don’t you? ”
Very aware Wiglaf. Only pointing out an obvious, Owners don’t become billionaires because they give up easily. This was poorly managed (anything that Has Perez’s prints on it winds up that way), but they have not abandoned it entirely. Supporters matter, period, but even that has limitations. If the owners get their act together in a meaningful way and involve stakeholders appropriately, then this is not over.
Don
It is over.
Take your circus somewhere else. They tried a putsch, lost out and football needs to move on.
No one is binning the money makers, the sponsors won’t allow and broadcasters will want refund on their money.
What is with you and this never ending drama?
Unai/Don is asking the UEFA that could not implement FFP to bin 12 teams because of a super league that never took off.
What happened to UEFA’s newly revamped CL btw ?
What we witnessed was the first round. ESL came out swinging, a surprise attack, hoping to land a KO punch. They didn’t. Round Two will be defensive, weighing up the options, the aim a points victory. The prize? A European League run by the major Clubs. The ESL is dead because the American-owned Clubs set the agenda. Notably Man U and Liverpool. The concept of ‘irremovables’ is a no-go in European football – though in every league there are Clubs that come as close as dammit to ‘irremovable’. In the States it’s accepted that money controls sport. Money controls European… Read more »
At least now that the ESL has died a death we can go back to hating UEFA and fifa
It felt dirty as hell being on their side for once. I need a shower ffs
And Andy yeah cool is fine. But if you use the word hip or ace that’s usually a worrying sign that age has caught up with you!
Ernest, a financially penalty would be a waste of time, fans would never buy it, the likes of City or Chelsea could pay it without a second thought. As I said the big 6 in England may be prepared to miss out for a season on Europe as a PR exercise and it’s not such a big deal in the grand scheme of things if they do.
At some point in the future we may well have some form of ESL: but it will have to be negotiated with fans, other clubs, governments and governing authorities- and not imposed via a coup.
Also what must be “non-negotiable” is that there is no permanent core of super teams – there has to be competition and the principle of relegation from and promotion to the super league.
Ernest ReedApril 21, 2021 16:03:43
“Mustafi & Kola did the trick then !”On this i will never waiver, Arteta may not be the right manager for Arsenal long term, but he was so very bang on in identifying the malcontents and dealing with all of them in a meaningful way. For that Arteta will always have my respect.
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You mean the same Arteta that offered Mustafi a new deal but got declined? What a joke. Arteta is clueless.
EnglandsBest – We only got the opening shots – there is every chance the concept you described is already on their agenda. Offer this type of league to Celtic and Rangers and they would bite your hand off. Their supporters would not be anti – they are a TV companies dream as they still fill stadia even when their team is on TV.
I think that you forgot all the pre qualifiers played by Malta, Cyprus, Irish, … Domestic League and Cup winners.
It is not realistic to have only a midweek European competition with 2 pools of 20 teams.
The newly agreed European format that will start for the 2024 season had more participants than that.
Some guy with a Twitter account named Fabulous Opera making ridiculous claims about Arsenal fans supporting ESL. Clearly, he needs his meds increasing. I’ve seen a handful of lukewarm support out of the thousands of posts exploding in the Arsenal universe. The overwhelming view is strongly against the creation of an ESL. I have not met one fan of any club that supports it, but what do I know? I’m sure that some pimple blockhead from the US of A has his finger on the pulse if true Arsenal fans…….or he’s talking shit. See below:-( Arsenal fans cannot be trusted… Read more »
That the clubs failed in their ESL scheme will be enough for UEFA. These clubs are far too big and strong in their own leagues and in europe to face serious consequences after the event. So these owners can attempt coup after coup in the knowledge that they can just slip back into the fold, slip back in line with no consequences and as if nothing had happened. This one is up to the fans as we shall see shortly no doubt with the Liverpool and Man United fans. UEFA are not going to help after the event. They are… Read more »
With Lacazette + Aubameyang out, anyone else think it might be worth giving Pepe a run down the middle?
Bill “Arsenal fans cannot be trusted on the question of the #ESL, as many of them see this as a way to get back among Europe’s top teams. Arsenal are shit at the moment and it will be years before they’re a top team again otherwise.” This is just the beginning. As said before we will be ridiculed and vilified going forward by other EPL clubs. More ridiculed really. Other supporters are not going to forget this in a hurry. We have a big monkey on our backs now. The only way to free ourselves of this big monkey on… Read more »
Haven’t seen Paulinho around for a while now. I hope everything is okay with him.
NO, to pepe down the middle, he cannot play lone striker, he cannot bring others into play, he is better at playing off others and being created for.
The Big Six rebels have lost tens of millions between them in their disastrous attempts to set up a European Super League, which ended in a humiliating defeat, Sportsmail can reveal
The 12 Founding Clubs who announced the venture on Sunday evening purchased equity stakes of around £8million each in the Super League, which its creators ultimately hoped to turn into global competition that would dominate club football.
It emerged yesterday that the English clubs could also face financial penalties for pulling out as the ESL contract signed last week contained clauses committing them for at least three years.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/sportsnews/article-9494797/amp/Rebel-clubs-forced-pay-heavy-price-backing-Super-League-insist-lawyers.html?__twitter_impression=true
Funnily enough we ourselves may get to feel how those EPL clubs not in this ESL scheme feel right now in the future.
One of the main criticisms of it was that it had nothing to do with sporting merit.
So these rebels may in the future attempt their coups more in line with sporting merit as well as having some sort of competitiveness in the league itself i.e repercussions for failure in it.
So there is every possibility that we don’t get invited onto their next coup attempt.
For many of course that is a great thing the non-invitation.
Rich
Would like to see martinelli given a go there , Pepe left , saka right and ESR in the 10 . There’s serious pace there
Ishola
That’s Banford.
Which just about tells you everything you need to know about his position as an “Arsenal fan”.
CC
In what sense is this “Banford”?
I don’t quite undrestand your post.
Martinelli down the middle is a decent shout, thought he was the best of a bad bunch against Fulham
Time to rant: Anyone who thinks Arsenal aren’t top six is a moron of substantial proportions. Never ceases to amaze me how much shit gets fired at The Arsenal by its so-called own fans. Mostly the young fans who think football started at the start of the millenium when the Oligarch Abramovich and the Sultans of the UAE started ripping apart the whole ethos of football and the integrity of fair play. Mind you, they probably think a sultan is a soft squidgy fruit resembling a raisin that comes out of the end of your nose. Not the sharpest this… Read more »