Collymore unloads on Wrighty for great teeth and elite banter (seriously)

by & filed under News Review.

Screen Shot 2018-06-10 at 22.11.07

YES HECTOR.

I cannot love this guy any more than I already do. Sure, he had a shite season, but next year will be different. I’m very much enjoying his excellent attire here. The Arsenal tinted sunglasses are a deep metaphor for outlook on his career at Arsenal so far, the leopard print silk shirt is how he’s planning to connect with his inner animal next season, and after that, I run out of fashion metaphors.

Hector, never stop being you. A true champion and a fashion pioneer.

Stan Collymore doesn’t quite land my full-throated praise. The ex-Oviedo striker went for the full-on nuclear option after a Guardian interview on race, that was, for the most part, pretty ok. He called out average white men landing on their feet in the game, he spoke about racism still being a problem, and then he did what Stan does best… he used his well-crafted argument to ladder back to his favourite topic of conversation… himself.

“To be a black pundit you either need to be a comedian like Chris Kamara or Ian Wright – guys who have big pearly-white smiles and everyone loves laughing at – or Jermaine Jenas and Alex Scott, who are completely inoffensive,” he says. “What you’re not allowed to do is call out the status quo, which is what I do.

“Opportunities have been denied to me and it’s got nothing to with what happened with Ulrika Jonsson because I’ve worked since then. No, it’s because I’ve become increasingly outspoken and that’s not allowed in this country if you’re not white.

“It’s not just me who is affected – look at that Sky Sports show Sunday Supplement; there are never any journalists from a BAME background on there; every week it’s a panel of all white men. That can’t be right.”

Poor old Stan, a blackballed genius paralleled only to Dalton Trumbo.

According to the enlightened one, you only make it as a black pundit if you are funny, have nice teeth, or you are totally inoffensive.

I LOVE that he thinks being offensive is what the world needs more of right now.

Stan eviscerated a whole group of fellow black professionals who have worked hard to make it to the top of their respective game.

Anyway, that wasn’t the worst of it, he had this to say to Ian Wright.

DfWTc1xU8AAjWZZ

 

What a bastard thing to tweet. He’s trying to excuse his own failures by denigrating the achievements of others and in the process shown his true colours when put under the slightest of pressures outside the safe space of an interview. It reminded me of a really shite Vidal vs Buckley blow-up.

I can totally buy into Stan’s more interesting view that black managers don’t get the same chances white managers do. I don’t think Sol Campbell is the best example of a black man who can’t land a role, but it is telling that average thinkers like Stevie G can waltz into a job at Rangers with no credentials. Same for Joey Barton, a genuine faux intellectual scumbag who coasts through football life without a problem. The game should be merit-based, but if we’re being real, that’s absolutely not the case. Football is still the old boys club. Arsenal only just broke that spell and it took 10 years of wrangling.

However, when it comes to punditry, Stan is a dated bore trying to bring back lowest common denominator talkshow formats as some sort of revolutionary thought. He famously said Guardiola wouldn’t be able to play his way to the Premier League, there are countless examples through the years of archaic backward views dressed up in passionate grassroots thinking. His talk show, back in the day, offered up next to nothing in terms of analysis of the modern game and how it’s played now. It was always about him. His experiences. His aggressively delivered views, like a horrible Sunday league team talk from someone’s weird stepbrother (Jonathan Liew has a good take on it from 2012).

He even brushed aside the wife-beater issue, citing Gazza as a person who had also beaten his wife (and is still very much loved). I mean, two wife-beatings don’t make a right for starters, but Gazza isn’t pitching himself for punditry jobs. He’s a washed-up alcoholic who tried to feed fried chicken to a dangerous fugitive murderer. The only thing he’s afforded by the public is sympathy, he certainly wouldn’t be in the mix for a job on MOTD. A closer comparison might be Rodney Marsh who was fired for being offensive on air, Keysey and Gray who were ostracized to the middle-East for being sexist pigs, or Ron Atkinson for being a racist.

Rightly or wrongly, if Gazza is loved, it’s for what he did on the pitch (Stan really can’t compete here). Sadly, we live in a society that accepts flawed characters if they offer up something magical to sport or the arts. Michael Jackson, Harvey Weinstein, Bill Cosby, Kevin Spacey, R-Kelly to name but a few… that’s a deeper issue, but it’s not predicated on race.

The irony of all of this is Stan is rallying against privilege, whilst demanding it for himself.

He is Stan. He deserves the roles others have taken from him. Society is rigged against him. A rich ex-footballer who’d earn more in a week than most would in a year, bleating on about fairness.

Fuck you, Stan. Good riddance. I hope you stay in Russia.

Onto other news, Jack Wilshere is apparently being courted by Juventus. Now, I’ve no idea what’s going on here, but I have my doubts he’d get more money in Italy than he does here. I really struggle to see someone who took a loan move to Bournemouth heading to Turin to learn a new language and culture, with a young family in tow. Not just that, he offered next to nothing form wise last season, he couldn’t crack it under Eddie Howe, and Gareth Southgate dropped him. If he gets a new deal with us, I’d consider him lucky. Really can’t see him moving anywhere interesting if he leaves us.

We’re apparently going to land Sokratis very soon according to Jezza Wilson, the inside man at Camp Stan went out of his way to deny we were in for Fellaini last week dropped this bombshell at the bottom of his article.

Arsenal are aware of Marouane Fellaini’s availability but he is not currently a priority.’

Noooooo… the second time in a week. You know he’s going to join us, don’t you?

Let’s hope it’s not at the expense of Torriera or someone good! Though moves for the Uraguan aren’t looking that great as Napoli up their interest in adding him to the mix.

Right, that’s me done. See you in the comments.

x

353 Responses to “Collymore unloads on Wrighty for great teeth and elite banter (seriously)”

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  1. Samesong

    Ishola

    It’s not about winning for me though Ishola. It’s about knowing oneself. That debate was irrelevant in my eyes and I should never ever have entertained you. But we all make mistakes I know next time not to even exercise a debate about it.

  2. Marc

    Graham62

    Collymore isn’t discriminated against because he is black, he’s discriminated against because he’s a wife beating brummie sex pest cunt.

    We really should give him any air time so to speak. Same with Barton, the other factor that needs to be taken into account is the sheer level of moronity that club chairman delve to when making appointments allowing useless middle aged white men to get jobs they are either not qualified for or previous performance demonstrates they should never be hired again.

  3. Samesong

    And to answer your question

    -It shows that africans are open to new ideas
    -but lets not get it twisted the european coaches haven’t exactly elevated the african teams to new heights either.

  4. Samesong

    Anyway moving on.

    All love with Ishola et all

    I just wanted to steal some le grove time lol only joking.

  5. champagne charlie

    Ishola

    the fact you can’t see how you diminish the racism against blacks by citing other prejudices is kind of weird.

    There is absolutely no qualifying to be done when the topic of racism is raised, especially in your feeble attempts about shouting the loudest and ‘shout for those that can’t be heard’. It’s like someone saying heart disease is chronic in the country, and you come out saying yea but what about the high instances of post-natal depression – they rarely get spoken of.

    It’s an ignorant and damaging view to have towards the subject to be perfectly honest. You’re tiptoeing a very fine line with that commentary imo.

  6. KAY Boss

    Samesong, I just gave my opinion which u genuinely responded to. it seems it has generated into a whole topic altogether. irrespective of how each others point is we may all be right one way or the other. Guys can we focus on football and on arsenal. Did Tony Adams say England will bottle it bcos of the spurs players in the team? I love him for saying that but its irrelevant now. if u are African which other country will u support and if u are a westerner or american( north or south) which African country will u support. I’m African and I will be cheering on France.

  7. champagne charlie

    Marko

    Bit of a dim comment…

    Only reason Liverpool are getting a mention is because you’ve spent the best part of two weeks being their social media rep on here in relation to Arsenal.

  8. Marc

    I’ll be cheering for any team playing against England – so I’ll have to be picking a permanent team to follow quite early in the tournament.

  9. Rambo Ramsey

    Ramsey Torreira midfield should be energetic and ‘buzzing’ in theory.

    Sadly we’ve seen many a times that doesn’t translate to the field.

  10. Samesong

    Marc

    I did mate. Was so funny seeing Bellerin get blown out for that model.
    Hamilton made some interesting remarks about engines and F1 in general. Think he spoke a bit too much on that interview.

  11. Samesong

    if u are African which other country will u support and if u are a westerner or american( north or south) which African country will u support. I’m African and I will be cheering on France.

    I’m not African and I’ll be supporting England though.

  12. Marc

    Samesong

    I turned over as soon as it finished – usually the Canadian GP is a good one but yesterdays wasn’t all that.

    The Bellerin bit was brilliant – I can’t make my mind up whether he thought he was going to be interviewed or was pissed off someone interrupted whilst he was on the pull?

  13. Samesong

    I turned over as soon as it finished – usually the Canadian GP is a good one but yesterdays wasn’t all that.

    It wasn’t a great race at all. I can remember leaving the room watching it then coming back and it was like 60 laps gone lol.

    Bellboy definitely looked like he was on the pull ; )

  14. Graham62

    I always want England to do well.

    If England had eight Spuds players, I’d still want them to win.

    Club and country are totally different.

    In the late seventies/early eighties, Juve players made up the bulk of the Italian team.

    That’s me.

  15. KAY Boss

    samesong. with all apologies, my question wasn’t directed to only u. it’s a general question I threw unto the platform. I like your energy. I will support all the African countries when they play but aside that I choose France as my ‘adopted’ country in this WC tournament.

  16. Ishola70

    I’ll be rooting for whatever team shows some refreshing expansive football in the early matches and that team has to be out of the traditional recognised favourite teams. In some cases it is not easy to replicate football shown in earlier matches because of differing quality of opponent but at least that team has shown it is capable of “good” football.

    So basically it is any team out of the top five for betting to win the World Cup. This could mean England but very unlikely to show this “good” football lol. It doesn’t include Portugal either. Not keen on Portugal and they are unlikely as well to show the “good” football. Others all possibilities.

  17. Countryboy

    Rambo

    Ramsey Torreira midfield should be energetic and ‘buzzing’ in theory.Sadly we’ve seen many a times that doesn’t translate to the field.

    True. Sometimes players need to have chemistry. My fear about the success of the duo is that one of them thinks he is Messi having no care for what is behind him. If Unai can curb his glory seeking instincts, then maybe they can develop such chemistry over time.

  18. champagne charlie

    Pedro

    Really struggle not to shake my head when you have a guy like Sol not getting the time of day in the coaching realm. On paper he’s a hell of a candidate.

  19. Jamie

    I always chuckle at being called a social justice warrior, almost exclusively by closet racists/bigots mind you, as if racial equality isn’t worth debating.. Baffling by today’s standards.

    Also, is the Jamie Lannister thing meant to be a joke/insult/clever? I don’t get it.

  20. champagne charlie

    “Also, is the Jamie Lannister thing meant to be a joke/insult/clever? I don’t get it.”

    Wouldn’t pay much mind mate considering the source…

  21. Marc

    My view of Campbell since he retired from playing is that he seems to think he’s owed a job at a PL team. Can’t remember quite when or where but there was an interview where he just moaned about everyone gets top jobs and I don’t because I’m black.

    Last if him I heard he was talking about running for London Mayor.

  22. champagne charlie

    “Chelsea and Arsenal remain interested in signing Nice midfielder Jean-Michael Seri, according to Sky sources.”

    This screams agent touting, how long is this guy going to get tenuously linked to top clubs?

    Fully expect Vieira to marry something up with City if so.

  23. Dissenter

    Ishola
    Stick to bashing Xhaka every single game.
    Your meltdown today is one for the ages, you weren’t even arguing on point.

  24. Ishola70

    Dissenter you are a fool.

    Do you want me to show you yet another recent article that states that midfield is an absolute must to address?

  25. Ishola70

    Let’s get Dissenter’s nuanced view.

    Or perhaps not lol.

    Man contradicts himself.

    Told me a few months back that he doesn’t rate Xhaka then this week thinks Xhaka is unfairly criticised and not as bad as some make out.

    All over the place. Foolish springs to mind.

  26. champagne charlie

    Ishola

    Calm down princess, nobody is against improving midfield.Your Xhaka fixation is merely a source of jest.

  27. Ishola70

    lol I’m calm as can be CC.

    I just like to point out people’s inconsistencies in their views on the team.

  28. champagne charlie

    Di Marzio (Italian gospel by all accounts) stating Arsenal and Sampdoria are still talking over Torreira – high agent fee the bone of contention – and expect a deal to be completed soon. Peng news.

    Gelson Martins has started the procedure for formal termination of his Sporting contract along with Carvalho and Bruno Fernandes. Seems the chairman of Sporting being so publicly critical of the players (leading to a 50 strong gang of hooded attackers at the training ground) has given these guys genuine legal reasoning for termination. Fucking mental.

    Good news day seemingly for the Arsenal

  29. Ishola70

    Xhaka arrived in the summer of 2016 along with the defensive giant known as Mustafi.

    In the two seasons both Xhaka and Mustafi have graced us with their presence Arsenal have conceded a total number of EPL goals totalling near 100 goals.

    Previous seasons before these two footballing greats joined the club Arsenal had significantly better reading EPL goals against.

    All a coincidence of course I’m sure. I mean they have international caps these two. Makes them fool proof don’t it.

  30. champagne charlie

    Ishola

    Yea but you’re not pointing out any inconsistency on Dissenters part. He said he doesn’t taste him, and he’s also said he’d happily sell and replace him.

    The part you’re getting all fidgety over is him saying that he doesn’t blame all our defensive woes on Xhaka, he thinks people go OTT with him, and he’s open to the prospect of him producing more under Emery.

    The world isn’t just black and white you might say…. :)

  31. Ishola70

    Why have Arsenal got such a significantly poor EPL goals record against CC since the two giants of football Xhaka and Mustafi joined compared to previous?

    Is it all just coincidence?

  32. champagne charlie

    Ishola

    Same period of time that Cazorla has been out injured. Could make a pathetically superficial case in that direction if I so chose. Would have thought even you would be capable of appreciating how many factors are involved with a teams annual defensive numbers.

    Maybe, just maybe, Wenger declined that much we finally decided to act upon it and change the manager?

  33. qna

    Carvahlo looked a player not too long ago. Would prefer him to Xhaka. Why don’t we take all three on a free lol. Replacements for Welbeck, Xhaka and Wilshere.

    Surely they can’t escape their contracts though. Aren’t there players stuck in the Middle East not getting paid salaries and still can’t leave. Apologies if this is completely inaccurate. I just have the impression that FIFA looks after clubs and not players and this fan incident won’t be enough to get over a hundred million pounds of players out of their contracts.

  34. Ishola70

    Yeah could be Wenger.

    Could be Cazorla.

    But of course definitely not the awesome double first team signings in that summer of 2016.

    I know.

  35. Rambo Ramsey

    “I always chuckle at being called a social justice warrior, almost exclusively by closet racists/bigots mind you, as if racial equality isn’t worth debating.. Baffling by today’s standards.”

    That’s right soldier, keep up the good fight against the imaginary-sorry,closet-evil men. The World would be a terrible place if it weren’t for a self-important, over-the-top Liberal twat with his head far up his own arse.

  36. champagne charlie

    Ishola

    could be a number of things, which is why your rabid fixation with Xhaka is mildly amusing to people.

  37. Ishola70

    tbf CC I put Mustafi in the mix there as well this time.

    You rate Xhaka? I see you implied on another post that if he is dropped it will not be due to his ability or lack of but because he doesn’t fit a system.

    Surely it’s a case of the system fitting a player of Xhaka’s ilk rather than the other way around no?

    I mean where would Arsenal be without Xhaka’s promptings from deep? Doesn’t bear thinking about does it.

  38. Marc

    qna

    I believe there’s a thing where if a player gets to a certain point in their contract they can buy themselves out of it. Rumours were there was a collective agreement / gentlemen’s agreement that no club would touch a player that did this. Look’s like these 3 are going to do it after being pushed into an “intolerable position” – get ready for the flood waters to break.

  39. Cesc Appeal

    ‘Struggle to see where Lacazette fits in if we sign a genuine wideman.’

    Now you’ve done it.

  40. Chika

    Di Marzio: Torreira’s release clause must be paid in one instalment (€25m) but #AFC are willing to exceed that and offer €30m and structure the payment over a number of years.

    This seems an obstacle that can be overcome with the understanding between the clubs being ‘close’.

  41. Marc

    Rambo

    It puts even bigger questions on Welbeck – he’s down to a year left on his contract and as the guy who sits a couple of seats away from me says “he couldn’t hit a cows arse with a banjo” so he’s not a serious option as first choice backup striker.

  42. Rambo Ramsey

    Presumably we’ll be lining up like this

    Martins—-Auba—–Mkhi

    Unfortunately Ozil will take up a role in midfield……bleargh

  43. Ishola70

    lol

    I posted previously this higher fee paid over a number of years instead of the lower one release payment but that was in relation to Napoli for Torreira.

    Weird. Why pay more when you pay out his release clause.

  44. Marc

    Rambo

    If he’s properly motivated by Emery and there’s a solid two base behind him for home games and some away it could work, away at Utd, City and Stoke (just kidding but it’s fun to be reminded they’ve been relegated back to Mordor) you’d hope we’d switched things round.

  45. champagne charlie

    Ishola

    I rate Xhaka’s qualities, not necessarily his input to date with Arsenal. However a massive part of that is the “system” he’s played in for two years, or total lack of one more accurately.

    He ranked top 2 for number of completed passes last season (Otamendi the standout), same with long passes, among the top 3 or maybe 5 for passing accuracy, and registered approx 74% of those as forward passes.

    You continue to look for this fabled one thing that turns us from bad to good defensively, which is bananas imo. Xhaka is your fixation, so be it.

  46. Ishola70

    Marc
    “Are you serious – did you read the comment?”

    About what? I keep reading about Samp wanting more than his release clause but paid over a couple of years in installments.

    It’s nonsense surely. What is 5m to them over 2 seasons?

  47. champagne charlie

    “Weird. Why pay more when you pay out his release clause.”

    Millions of people do it daily, it’s called credit.

    Arsenal are proposing they pay 30 mil over say 4 years vs a 25 mil lump sum. Lets Arsenal keep more powered dry for this window, and Sampdoria may be enticed by the extra 5 mil.

  48. Cesc Appeal

    Marc

    No way am I stopping every two seconds to prop Ozil up because he keeps flapping in the breeze through lack of a spine

  49. Marc

    Ishola

    “It’s nonsense surely. What is 5m to them over 2 seasons?”

    Er how about it pays £50k per week wages for a player for 2 years.

  50. Ishola70

    Again

    What is 5m more to Samp over 2 seasons? Instead of one lump sum? If you meet the release clause then Samp have to play game regardless of their so-called preferred wishes.

    I think Di Marzio is copying and pasting here.

    This exact same thing was said a few days ago but instead of the name Arsenal it was Napoli inserted.

  51. Bob N16

    Ishola, release clause has to be paid in lump sum, no instalments. More money over three years is more affordable.

  52. Marc

    Ishola

    Also – and anyone who knows about accounts etc needs to confirm this but he might be down on their books valued higher than 25 million, a single one off payment might give them a large “paper” loss.

  53. champagne charlie

    Ishola

    It would suit Arsenal to front less cash now too, it’s not hard to work out.

    What’s 5 mil to Sampdoria over X number of years? umm 5 mil mate.. They’re an Italian middler so the guaranteed income would be appealing.

  54. Paulinho

    They are still blathering on about the agent fee stuff?

    Seems like they just reheated Saturday’s story in the oven and have dished it out again to get some clicks.

  55. Ishola70

    Paulinho
    “Seems like they just reheated Saturday’s story in the oven and have dished it out again to get some clicks.”

    Yep. And as said before take away Napoli name and instead insert Arsenal.

    Et Voila! New dish of the day.

  56. Wenker-wanger

    Collymore, not your average black guy is he?
    All the black guys I’ve played in footie teams with, worked with, drank with, nearly had a best man with, are all blokes ust getting on with life.
    Ok there instill racism and I’m hard against real racism. What I won’t abide is this fantasy, paranoid racism that is creeping into our society.
    Well collymore, it’s a shame you are so bitter and jealous of people like the brilliantly personable weighty….an England fanatic, English to the core, loved by millions, respected for his dogged determination to reach the top from very poor beginnings in a council estate.
    People like collymore whine about race and use the overplayed race card. Face it collymore you are a sick bitter man with a chipmon your shoulder….99% of the population don’t give a shite what colour skin you’ve got. But yes we probably all dislike you for the horrible cnut you are.

  57. Dissenter

    Ishola
    How ya doing :-)
    You’re usually unflappable …until Xhaka gets mentioned. Just wanted to get one week of jibing in one go and is seemed to have worked.

    We all have out pet peeves. Mine used to be Giroud [loved the guy], yours is Xhaka.

  58. London gunner

    Champagne

    Xhakas passing stats read like arteta… who also wasn’t good enough.

    Both non athletic, both can’t tackle, cope with pressure, can’t beat the press and get caught out of position. However they can make a good pass when not under direct pressure. Not good enough tbh.

  59. Chika

    “Weird. Why pay more when you pay out his release clause.”

    You find this weird? Wow you do come up with some absolute nonsense and you say some stupid shit like it’s factual. Just wow

  60. Ishola70

    Dissenter

    Why all the white honkies managing African national football teams?

    Are the black Africans in deference to these pale honkies?

    I think some of them especially the French ones are on jollies.

    I ask you because I understand you originate from the mother land.

  61. London gunner

    I’m not sure about this racism stuff.

    If a player with the profile of Rio wanted to be a manager I’m sure he’d get a club in a second.

    I am Wright pr9bably could have managed and if Henry actually gave two fucks and put in the effort he would get a club to manage.

    It’s more about the profile of the player imo.

    I think Sol should be given a chance by a club but tbh he is known for being difficult to get on with. Is that a racism issue of a personality issue?

  62. Dissenter

    Stan Collymor seemed to be a good commentator when he was on BeIN sports in the states. He didn’t last long though but neither did Christian Vieri . On his US satellite radio gig, he seemed to be to careful to please which was annoying. It may be that he was a jerk to work with.

    Ian Wright can be such a jerk at times. He’s milked his Arsenal history more that any ex-player i know.

  63. Ishola70

    Oh my greatest apologies Chika.

    I made an oversight on a release clause for a football player.

    How foolish I feel now.

    Especially a copy and paste story.

  64. champagne charlie

    “I’m not sure about this racism stuff…I think Sol should be given a chance by a club but tbh he is known for being difficult to get on with. Is that a racism issue of a personality issue?”

    Not sure in what regard?

    Scan the English top flight and you’ll see black representation is disproportionately low. Oh and none of the finest British white dudes are notoriously affable characters. Or would you consider Pulis, Fat Sam, Pardew, Hughes as good guys in the face of Sol Campbell?

  65. Ishola70

    Sol Campbell was known and seems to come across as quite a introvert fellow.

    Not always the best thing to be seen as “the gaffer”

    Absolutely nothing to do with his skin colour of course.

    And I think he himself refers to communication maybe being an obstacle in that article that was put up of his.

  66. Dissenter

    Ishola,
    You and I know that black Africans have a natural deference to Caucasian led authority. I think it’s a carryover from colonialism. it seeped into the core of the psyche of the black man in Africa. That’s the answer to your question.
    On some levels I understand what you’re trying to say- not everything is racism, there’s a lot in the gray area.
    However, racism doe s exist. There’s no discussion about this, certainly not on legrove. I wouldn’t display a half-baked knowledge of history like you did today.
    Don’t you know what the origins of the Hutu vs Tutsi dispute was in Rwanda/Burundi? Go read about how the Germans applied Hamitic hypothesis to favor Tutsi [the minority tribe]. The Belgian’s then came in after world war 1 to create laws around it.

  67. Chika

    Haha it wasn’t an oversight Ishola. It’s a common practice not just in football. it’s ok to be wrong sometimes. Surprised you didn’t add ‘lol’ to your attempt at sarcasm.

  68. Dissenter

    Westbrom would probably still be in the top flight had they looked at Darren Moore in a different light. Instead they turned to a recycled piece of garbage that is Pardew to save them from relegation.
    Sol Campbell has been widely derided for just stating the obvious. There’s a negative stereotype that needs to be overcome.

  69. Ishola70

    Of course Dissenter.

    Tutsi cuddled up to white man.

    What about appearance in all this?

    Was the white man influenced by the Tutsi appearance rather than the overall Hutu appearance?

    Or not relevant?

  70. Cesc Appeal

    Being able to get Martins on a free would do us a lot of favours, that is £35 Million we could spend on someone else.

    I still do find Pavon an interesting player, one to look at.

  71. Samesong

    Sol Campbell has been widely derided for just stating the obvious. There’s a negative stereotype that needs to be overcome.

    Dissenter This!

  72. Ishola70

    Chika

    “it’s ok to be wrong sometimes”

    I’m not a know-it-all.

    Look above.

    I’m asking questions of Dissenter re: the Tutsi and Hutu.

  73. Bamford10

    Dissenter

    Except that Ishola isn’t claiming that racism doesn’t exist. He’s saying that the identity politics left overplays the racism argument, that racism is less important in terms of social outcomes than they would have you believe, and that there are other variables at work in a lot of these cases. This is a perfectly reasonable position.

  74. DaleDaGooner

    Hey Liverpool rep, Marko, pssst you,…..

    The Telegraph reports Liverpool have also returned to the drawing board after talks with Lyon over Nabil Fekir deal collapsed on Saturday.

    I thought he was nailed on according to Marko

  75. Wenker-wanger

    I hear we have a fellow that believes in “proportionate representation. What an utter load of fabricated, manipulated bollox quotas are.
    Non-scientific makes no reference to variables, population density in an area, just hollow pseudo-inclusive absurdly sickening pandering policies.
    Give the best man the job, most would want that, don’t award anything on colour basis. If it transpires, under rigorous factual examination that racism is the root cause of low representation, then slaughter the selectors and the company they work for.

  76. Graham62

    Most of todays posts centre around one simple fact.

    Stan Collymore, irrespective of ethnic background, comes across as a nasty piece of work and needs to grow up.

  77. Marc

    How the fuck has Stan Collymore being a cunt been turned into discussing the “racism” between the Tutsi and Hutu’s. Something like 900,000 people were butchered in 3 months in just another case of genocide since the UN was set up. One of the express things it was supposed to stand up to and prevent.

  78. champagne charlie

    Marc

    That’d be because Ishola felt it necessary to diminish the subject of black discrimination in football, and western societies via mentioning more prejudices. Sort of a ‘hey there’s more than just black oppression by whites’ narrative.

    All comes across as a very hush hush style of commentary in the face of genuine white on black discrimination.

  79. London gunner

    Champagne

    You think about areta and xhaka were/are good enough for a title run.

    What pills are you taking and can I have some?

  80. London gunner

    More players are white in the premier league so statically you will have more white managers.

    I’m guessing in Africa most of the managers are black (on a club level)

  81. Marc

    Samesong – OK I have a habit of that.

    CC – Whilst I would never argue that racism exists in many forms I actually think that Ishola was somehow trying to make a reasonable point i.e. not ever example of a black person not getting a job is racism.

    He just did a piss poor job of saying it.

  82. champagne charlie

    “English football has always had a problem with not appointing enough black managers. There are currently just three in the 92 first team jobs in the professional game”

    Nah, 3 out of 92 is definitely proportionate. Not a race issue, ‘they’ probably were just a nightmare to work with…

  83. champagne charlie

    Marc
    That’s possible, but he rejected several sensible comments out of hand and maintained the ‘look over here’ line of commentary. He had plenty of moments to clarify his point in the face of other comments tbh, piss poor explanation or not.

    London
    I’d prefer 10 other players around them personally. Idk what you’re looking for, you don’t rate them, I do…as you were.

  84. Marc

    London gunner

    There’s also the argument of how many go onto pursue coaching badges etc.

    There is a reasonability for current black players to go for these (very few PL players need the money these days) to break the glass ceiling. If there’s only 10 potential black managers it’s easy to “overlook” them if there’s 1000 it get’s a little more difficult to write them off.

  85. Samesong

    Marc I never once called Ishola racist. But I argued there is not enough black managers in the game.

  86. Marc

    Samesong

    I didn’t say you were a racist?

    Are there enough black managers in the game? Truth is I don’t give a shit – I don’t think there are enough good managers in the game I couldn’t give a fuck what colour or religion they are, if they are good enough I want them influencing football in a positive way.

  87. Samesong

    Then I started hearing about Hutu tribes and stuff. Just admit there is a problem instead of going round and round in circles not talk about integration bla bla stuff. The a lot of these ex players have years of coaching experience got the badges etc but when a high profile job is available they never get a look in where’s the diversity? These black players back in the day had bananas chucked at them racist slurs he whole lot. And they want to do good in the game? Black players want to have someone to be inspired by.

  88. Ishola70

    No nothing of the sort Marc.

    My main point is the fixation with one type of prejudice and the certain criteria of people within that fixated prejudice.

    And despite what CC says asking these questions is not diminishing racial prejudice.

  89. Dissenter

    BamfoRD,
    Ishola was throwing half-baked defenses up in the wind like chaff.
    He’s the one that was throwing out stuff about Hutus nd Tutsi,

    I agrees with him that there’s a lot in the grey. It’s not always all or none.

  90. Samesong

    Are there enough black managers in the game? Truth is I don’t give a shit –

    Well I do care so your probably talking to the wrong person.

  91. Marc

    It’s been fucking hard work on here today Pedro. Maybe next time you could avoid giving cretins like Collymore any oxygen – hopefully he’ll go away and die.

  92. qna

    Lack of diversity in English football management is certainly worth looking into by the FA. But it certainly doesn’t need looking into at EPL level. But people of diverse backgrounds should be given opportunities to succeed at lower levels where they can prove themselves worthy of being an EPL manager.

    It’s also worth noting that English managers in general are not good enough to manage any of the top 6 clubs in the EPL. They are a minority in the EPL too with most of them coming through with promoted teams.

    I don’t see that changing anytime soon, whether they are black or white. The English FA would do well to consider how they can produce top level managers. It doesn’t just happen. With such an approach they could include more diversity as part of that.

  93. Marc

    Samesong

    You missed my point – I don’t care what colour they are, racism will always exist when the colour of someone’s skin is even noticed.

    If you told me tomorrow we’re signing a world class mid fielder who’s going to lead us to glory at what point do you think I’d care about what colour he is?

  94. Marc

    qna

    Spot on.

    I think a League 1 / 2 team would be all over Sol Campbell providing he didn’t sound like a complete dick in the interview. He’d offer a little bit of football celebrity sunshine and I’m sure if he’d done it a few years ago could’ve got Wenger to chuck him a few kids on load etc.

  95. Samesong

    Marc

    I didn’t miss none of your points. You couldn’t care less about the colour of the candidate.

    I think there needs to be more opportunities for black coaches into management. This is something even the FA acknowledges so you have your opinion and I’ll have mine. I’m sure if most of the premier league all had black managers the argument would be reversed.

  96. champagne charlie

    “And despite what CC says asking these questions is not diminishing racial prejudice.”

    You dismissed white on black prejudice and cited other prejudices within black societies as prejudices “that aren’t heard”.

    Of course it diminishes the white on black discrimination that was primarily being discussed. Bringing in other strands not immediately related to the topic at hand generalises matters and directs focus away from the issue raised in the first instance.

    Unless you were at some stage going to reference a correlation between African tribes and black representation at the top level in English football?

  97. Marc

    Samesong

    I’d welcome the FA bringing in a rule where if a British manager is going to be appointed to a PL club they had to be black. It’d mean fat Sam, Mark Hughes, Alan Pardew, Tony Pulis, Steve Bruce etc etc would never work again.

    The quality of PL football would improve immeasurably over night.

  98. Samesong

    Marc if you had read the article I posted you would of read this

    Football accepts that it needs to change and the Football League has introduced an optional code where clubs can be obliged to interview black candidates for managerial positions, akin to the ‘Rooney Role’ in the United States.

    You sound like your getting wound up cause you don’t like what I have to say but I don’t give a shit. I’m not asking for a takeover get over yourself I’m just asking for a little fairness. All this interview managers that’s are only black that’s you displaying your ignorance to the blog not me. Things have been quite calm today and you decided to continue on.

  99. Ishola70

    CC

    Maybe I shouldn’t have widened the discussion then.

    But it did tie in with what was said at the beginning. This fixation with one sort of prejudice over another on the wider scale of things.

    But there it is. Done. Finished.

  100. KAY Boss

    u guys still talking about racism? as I said everyone’s point is genuine so long as it’s devoid of insults n personal attacks. how true is the story regarding martins terminating his contract. can someone brief ‘us’ about the situation. how on earth is carvalho still 25. the guy never seem to grow

  101. Samesong

    How can fact be a fixation Ishola?
    Fixation is your Xhaka take

    How often is this subject of black managers brought up here? Rarely.

  102. Marc

    Samesong

    You’ve misread me -there are issue’s I accept but I can’t get that excited about them. My comment about only black managers was more about my prejudice against some of the shite that repeatedly walks into jobs after repeated abject failures. Wasn’t looking to wind you up was just being flippant which when you consider the subject isn’t something I should do.

    Anyways I’m outer here to get something to eat – just think in a few days we’ll have the world cup to all moan about!

  103. Ishola70

    Samesong

    Really as Bamford alluded to it’s identity politics that is irking some.

    Maybe this doesn’t apply so much in the case you are concerned with but some are getting sick to the back teeth of continuous identity politics stuff.

    Someone close to home for example has more than enough identity politics stuff in tweets.

    It’s not going to be as helpful in the long run as some may think. I can be a divider more than a coming together. It can be an agitator. It can be dangerous.

    But granted perhaps not in the case that concerns you.

  104. champagne charlie

    Ishola

    I dont think that’s very honest. You didn’t “widen” the argument, you pulled sourcing tenuously but ill stop short of suggesting your motives for doing so.

    As samesong says, how often is black representation in top level English football a topic here? Incredibly rare to discuss it, and your input primarily consisted of quelling the idea of race being a dominant factor in wider societal endeavours; and deconstructing the idea of identity politics trying to appropriate a much more grey space.

    You didn’t comment much on the subject of black opportunity in coaching, but anyway..

  105. Samesong

    Ishola

    I’m happy to call this a day now. Think we have discussed this to death. We all got strong opinions on the subject.

  106. Marko

    Systemic racism and prejudice is the reason for the lack of black coaches black ceo’s whatever. It’s just the way of the world. Why Mark Hughes and Alan Pardew and fat Sam get bounced around in the same jobs while no one takes a chance on Ince or Campbell is beyond me. What’s the worst that can happen

  107. Redtruth

    Ince is paranoid
    Barnes has a chip on his shoulder.
    Campbell has issues and two chips on his shoulders.
    Collymore is too clever for his own good.
    Wright is arrogant.

  108. Nw9 gooner

    CA, Martins terminating his contract means probably he has paid the release amount and we will be paying him , so he will be taking a chunk of our budget.

  109. Marko

    Manchester City assistant manager Domenec Torrent has left his position at the Etihad Stadium to become New York City FC’s new manager

    Arteta just cannot get himself a manager’s job

  110. Sancho Monzorla

    Okay Red, let’s say you’re right. No good black managers.

    So you’re saying that the lack of diversity is simply because of that fact? There’s no systemic issue at all, all the white managers got their jobs based on merit and because they were more qualified?

  111. Marko

    How many teams has Chris Hughton relegated yet still manages to get a gig in management…

    The fact that you’d ask that question but wouldn’t ask it of Pardew or whoever is exactly the point

  112. Dissenter

    The work environment at Sporting Lisbon must be utter shite.
    I hope we can profit from it. Go get the lad for less that the release clause. There will probably be legal action by the club to last for years.