Roma show what smart change can deliver + Reiss with the good news

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GREAT news coming from the Reiss Nelson camp, the young English speed merchant is making positive noises about signing a new deal. He had this to say on his season so far.

“It is a big achievement to sign for a big club like Arsenal so I’m just delighted with the contract and hopeful can sign it soon,” he said. “I did set one target – to make my first-team debut. I have done that, I have had 15 appearances.

“A Premier League start was on the cards but I think I need to score, that is the only one I haven’t achieved, so fingers crossed I can get a cheeky goal before the end of the season.

“I think a first-team start in the Premier League at a high level like this is always a step forward. I’ve just got to thank the boss and all my team-mates around me, pushing me and making me work harder and harder.”

GOOD WORDS my friend.

I don’t think he’s quite ripped up the season Lionel Messi style like we’d hoped, but hey, he’s playing in a shitty system with a poor manager. I’d love to see how a proper coach could take his core attributes and grow them over the next few years.

One player who has clearly already made it is Aubameyang, the man from Gabon as I like to call him because Gabon as a country is new to me, fueled average dreams we all have of him pairing up with the MIGHTY Alex Lacazette.

“I hope we will have the opportunity to play together – it’s something I said when I first arrived that I hoped to play with him.

“We have different styles, but I think they’re styles that complement each other – he’s a very good player and a very kind person.

“We were once rivals in our days in France, but we’re now friends and I hope we can play well together and score lots of goals.”

YES. I’d take some of that. I think if we had a Diego Simeone as our coach, he might make something like that happen. You have to be able to instil ruthless discipline into a side for them to rock an iteration of 4-4-2, so it’s possible, but not really under Wenger. I think we’d get horribly exposed if we played that way now, so I think the only way we see those two playing together is 4-3-3, with Auba heading out wide.

This Thursday, we’ll have no such luxury when it comes to 2 top strikers. We’ll just have the one, with Danny Welbeck taking up a wide position, or maybe even taking the lead role considering the age of the CSKA backline, and how far ahead we are. Keeping the legs of Lacazette fresh is smart.

Fraudiola watched from the stands as his side slipped out of the Champions League in embarrassing fashion. Losing 5-1 to a solid Liverpool side is next level bad. It’s not the first time he’s had his arse handed to him on the biggest stage. He lost to Real 5-0 a few years with Bayern. Anyway, well played Klopp and well played Liverpool. Jurgen Klopp was my poster boy manager back in the day, it’s great to see he’s having a strong resurgence with the Scousers. Let’s see if he can do it in the league next year with a proper keeper and Naby Keita.

Also, well played Roma. They hired Monchi, Spaletti quit, Di Francesco came in, they sold 11 players, brought in 12, they shifted on their best player to Liverpool (not to mention Paredes, Rudiger and Emerson), and now they’re in the Champions semi-finali final after humiliating Barcelona.

Who said be careful what you wish for when Wenger goes? Which manager said bringing in more than 3 players damages the balance of a squad? YOU KNOW THE ANSWERS.

On that note, I bid you farewell.

Until tomorrow, when we dine in Europa Hell!

Also, jump on the pod, it’s excellent.

  • Aubameyeng: Hit or miss?
  • The case for our defence: Who stays or goes?
  • Iwobi: Hero in waiting, or another Nik B?
  • Jack Wilshere: What do you do with him?

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283 Responses to “Roma show what smart change can deliver + Reiss with the good news”

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  1. Samesong

    Pierre

    I remember Hayes 12 of those goals were penalties no? and that run against Middlesborough rounding the keeper.

    Don’t see Welbeck having a freak season at all.

  2. Vintage Gun

    I watched the 1st leg of the Seville Vs Bayern and i thought they played very well. However , i felt like they needed a two goal lead minimum to stand any chance of progressing in Germany. Tie will be over for them by 60mins i rekon

  3. Vintage Gun

    “Keeping the legs of Lacazette fresh is smart.”

    Fresh for what? The battle with Burnley for 6th?

    Play him on thursday for 94 mins

  4. HighburyLegend

    “Who said be careful what you wish for when Wenger goes? ”

    Wallace ?? Pierre ?? Champagne ?? Alexander ??
    All of them + all the usual Untold suspects ??

  5. Vintage Gun

    “Juventus to go through tonight. Heard it here first. I have €200 on it to happen. Money, come to me!”

    Who told you that? Kaylor Navas or Sergio Ramos?

  6. HighburyLegend

    @Vintage : you seems to think that the 6th spot trophy is not a big one, can I ask you why please ??

  7. raptora

    Jk ofc. Everything is possible after last night’s farcelona annihilation. But not Juve to go through.

    The biggest difference between Cronaldo and Messi. I don’t really see Cronaldo allowing last night’s freefall that Roma cause to farca if Cronaldo was on the pitch. He’d hustle, tussle and wait for that 1 cross to put the game to bed.

    Messi failed big time last night. Not his first or last failure. And yes, yes, yes. It wasn’t his fault alone, but fk me, did he do anything good? Like showing ANY leadership? Nope.

    Cronaldo > Messi when it matters the most. Reason why so many people would have him, instead of Messi, in the last 15 mins of a game and you need a goal .

  8. Vintage Gun

    @Highbury

    There’s not much bigger in world football than the “Great Battle for 6th” It’s the talk of the continent, will we/won’t we do it. I just think it’s too big of a task with Burnley around so we should concentrate an the lesser lights of an European trophy.

    Fans and sponsors won’t like the idea but hey

  9. HighburyLegend

    “Jurgen Klopp believes Liverpool beat ‘the best team in the world’ after Man City win”

    Please…
    (lol)

  10. Dissenter

    Why do people hyper focus on this “speed merchant” angle so much?
    How many times do we have to be conned by so called speedy players.
    Theo Walcott, Bellerin…and the story continues.

    Reiss Nelson burst on the big stage with his dribbling now he’s too coached to try to beat his man with a dribble.
    We need players with dribbling nous not “speedy” clowns like Bellerin. We need players that can sit a defender on his arse and can cross a ball properly.

  11. mysticleaves

    “Mystic – Yeah Busquets is amazing at playing the same ball over and over again to Messi.”

    Paulinho – Yeah Ramsey is so amazing for consistently forgetting how to play CM and making runs into the box to score goals
    Mug

  12. Samesong

    Dissenter and then when he dribbles with the ball and loses it everytime you will have something to moan about.

    Let the Young lad find his feet. and surely he should be doing the basics first before getting into Maradona mode.

  13. Dissenter

    Two of the last four teams in the CL are owned by Americans
    It’s Kroenke’s detached and ignorant approach that’s disgraceful not his nationality.

    I’ve heard James Pallotta (the Roma owner) being interviewed, often extemporaneously. He has a proper footballing mind that can talk about the Brazilian team that won the 1962 WC to the problems with footballing in China. He spends as much as 6 months in Italy and speaks Italian like a native.

    The Fenway group had proved their sporting management nous with Boston Redsox and have made Liverpool a lot better that it was when they came on board.

    We just got the wrong American.

  14. Bob N16

    Just laughed at one of the names of the Cameroonian athletes who have ‘deserted’ their team during the Commonwealth Games:
    Arsene Fokou…. missing a ‘y’ possibly?

  15. Dissenter

    Same song
    You misread my post or probably never read it before posting.
    I was critiquing the focus of the post and many writer on legrove about the “speed merchant” angle. I wasn’t critiquing the player. Sort your self out.

    Of course dribblers are always going to lose the ball more.
    Our play is turgid already with languid sideways passing. We need variation in players.

  16. mysticleaves

    Rambo, the match against Barca was amazing for Roma and hilarious for the neutrals. That Valverde has been solid defensively is not hilarious at all, it’s quite true.

    Anyways I would take absolutely everything that’s happening to Barca this season as our next season, win the league, qualify for fa cup final and exit the UCL at qf stage

  17. alexanderhenry

    Pedro

    ‘It’s not the first time he’s had his arse handed to him on the biggest stage.’

    There was this as well- (yes I know we still got knocked out anyway, but still)

  18. Champagne Charlie

    “Believe what you want to believe but the truth of the matter is that Arsenal are, as it stands, a “rubbish” ( a nine year olds perception remember)commercial entity, as all genuine fans know.

    True Arsenal fans go on their gut feelings and don’t go on a sexed-up Google searches, to find the answers.Not just an opinion and you know it.”

    True Arsenal fans go on their gut feelings…… hahahahahaha no, that’s fucking idiots you’re thinking of.

    When you or anyone else talks about Arsenal as a commercial beast it is quantifiable. Period. There are revenue streams and sponsorship deals that identify relative trends and enable people to say where we stand a a commercial entity.

    For you to say we’re rubbish commercially based on your “gut feeling”, then talk about that approach as ‘factual’ makes you sound impressively stupid.

  19. Bamford10

    Good post, Pedro, though I think calling Guardiola “Fraudiola” is a bit much. Hopefully you were being more tongue-in-cheek than anything there.

  20. mysticleaves

    Dissenter

    I have never seen anyone call for a speed merchant, just a proper winger.

    “I’d love to see how a proper coach could take his core attributes and grow them over the next few years.” – Pedro

    Unless you are saying Pedro thinks Nelson’s “core attributes” is speed

  21. Dissenter

    Mystic
    Pedro gets too excited about the “speed merchant” issue. I’ve read enough of his post for the past 8 years to have missed on that.
    When you see Nelson, is speed the first thing that comes to you?
    Is he even that speedy?

  22. Samesong

    Dick-ssenter telling me to sort myself out. Yeah ok.

    What we require is a new manager. So wanting these types of players under Wenger is not going to happen.

  23. Chairman Gallant

    Fighting for six position is not a bad idea, that is if we want to play at least the Europa league next season, especially as burnley just keep on winning. However, winning the Europa league should be our utmost priority.

  24. Bamford10

    Dissenter

    Right, those other owners / ownership outfits would have replaced Wenger years ago. In contrast, knowing very little about football, Kroenke continued to place faith in Wenger, just like Charlie and thousands of other blinkered supporters.

    Let’s hope that Josh’s being in London means real change, though I fear they’re going to be too “respectful” of Wenger and allow him to serve out his final. That would be a mistake, so let’s hope they have something else in mind.

  25. HighburyLegend

    “though I think calling Guardiola “Fraudiola” is a bit much. ”
    Rambo Ramsey agree lol

    “winning the Europa league should be our utmost priority.”

    I think we’ll lose the final.
    Just because of the name of our great manager, who has never won any European final in his so called awesome career.

  26. Dissenter

    Samesong
    Are you a child?
    Why are you so quick to throw petty insults?
    Dick-essenter?
    Because I told you that you missed the point I was making?
    Have a good day. It’s jusy 6.45am for me and I won’t let a good day be ruined by philistine behaviors.

  27. Nw9 gooner

    Agree with WE RM’s bench is much stronger than Barca’s. Balegue (spl) has say this is worst Barca side in the last decade and is being carried by Messi and their Gk

  28. Champagne Charlie

    Banford

    Again with the lie about me saying Wenger could win titles again.

    If you think continual quips bother me you’ll have to do much better, I’m only going to respond to them to highlight your pathetic input.

    Every time you say it, I’ll focus attention into just how hard you’re trying to discredit my opinion on here.

    🙂 it’s fun to see your desperation.

  29. Samesong

    Dissenter

    No I am not a child by any means.

    But I find you telling me to sort myself out just as insulting.

  30. TR7

    Last season ‘pundits’ and detractors said Guardiola couldn’t win the EPL playing his brand of football. Next season the guy smashes numerous premiere league records, winning most games with complete domination and yet you have people saying the guy is overrated.

    Poch, Klopp, Wenger teams want to build from the back, all of them try it but when pressed they resort to long balls. Pep only manager who has remained wedded to his philosophy and successfully executed it. The sheer number of good changes his team creates is absolutely mind boggling.

  31. Bamford10

    Nelson definitely looks a talent, but so too have many young players. That he isn’t dribbling as much now as he was previously might have something to do with the level of competition and relative importance of the matches: it’s one thing to do step-overs against the Western Sydney Wanderers or Everton’s u-23 team, it’s another thing to do them against real competition in a real match.

  32. Guns of Hackney

    There isn’t anything to say about Arsenal. They are fucking shit.

    As for Roma. Well bloody played. Nothing makes me feel better when Barca lose. I absolutely detest them. The love in that surrounds that clubnis quite sickening.

    As for Liverpool being “solid”. Errr…they did an absolute number on the trendy, and everyone’s favourite hip manager, Pep Guardiola. Good. City are a very good team but it once again only highlights how poor the premier league is. Ironically it was a prem team that gave them a hiding.

    I’d rather be Liverpool than arsenal right now. They are moving up in the world and appear to be quite a team now. Good for them.

    As for us. Yuck. What a stink show down at the soul bowl.

    It must be really falling for the die hard arsenal idiots watching Roma and Liverpool romping about in the end game of the CL. Lol.

    Fuck off Wenger.

  33. raptora

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=11JPa0lkYOY

    Bale’s phenomenal goal, but reason I’m posting it is Ronaldo celebrating the goal like he scored it himself. When is the last time I saw a player not participating in the game, show true passion and happiness when his team scores? I don’t really remember. But yeah. Cronaldo celebrating like a kid fan of RM when they scored, also on the Euros when he got injured in the final and Portugal won it without him. He shows passion. Hunger. Devotion. Uber desire. Mega ambitiousness and never-back-down, winner’s mentality. Reasons why he is much more of a leader than Messi.

  34. Dissenter

    Bamford
    I think Kroenke bought Arsenal to just have a stake in a growing foreign market. It wouldn’t have made any difference if Arsenal was a champion horse racing stable. He knows nothing about the sports and even less about the club he was buying. I think he’s happy to leave Arsenal the same way he bought it. It’s just a PLC on his ledger.
    FSG knew Liverpool had to be improved to make the buy worthy. They poured money into it and have also made some very difficult but necessary changes. They’ve won the fan base over already.
    The Parrotta family are Italian Americans and have second citizenship in Italy as are many Americans of Italian origin. They have always been footballing people even though their background came from business.
    James Pallotta knows more about football than many football pundits. It’s no wonder Roma are doing well.

  35. Champagne Charlie

    “City are a very good team but it once again only highlights how poor the premier league is. Ironically it was a prem team that gave them a hiding.“

    Struggling to understand this one mate.

    How does City losing to Liverpool show the prem is poor?

  36. Champagne Charlie

    Dissenter

    Exactly that. Kroenke got involved with Arsenal because we were the biggest fish he could land with the least engagement asked of him.

    He’s invested and essentially given Wenger the keys, but some idiots are going to claim that because Kroenke deferred responsibility to Wenger that his share of the blame is minute. Shockingly dim.

  37. Dissenter

    TR7
    Do you think Sheikh Mansour brought in Guardiola or best the premier league? You think all that money was spent to dominate the domestic league.
    Bayern too brought him in to take over European champions and he couldn’t replicate Heynckes feat in three seasons.
    People are right to point out that he hasn’t won the CL away from Barca when he had Messi and a terrific bunch of players.

  38. Michael24

    CC

    As usual, you only see what you want to see.

    I quoted the word “rubbish” based on a nine year olds perceptions of Arsenal FC. If a nine year old won’t buy into it, why do you?

    Whether it’s our commercial standing or our on field exploits, it has become a complete and utter farce.

    The total lack of transparency in every facet of the clubs operations has become a joke. We have become the laughing stock of world football, not because of Kroenke but because we have a crap manager, who supposedly has a degree in economics, who doesn’t comprehend the negative affects his methods are having on the club.

    You,quite clearly, are not an instinctive person, reliant more on factual evidence rather than acting on the bleddin obvious.

    Your not a shareholder or AST member by any chance?

    A nine year old will never buy into a club that promotes losing as being acceptable.

    Supporters have left in droves over the past decade because of these wonderful values.

    How you and I interpret things are poles apart. You believe in theories that only someone with a blinkered knowledge of business and, in particular, Arsenal FC has. You buy into crap, I don’t.

    Wenger controls the beast. He creates the image and the product for supporters to buy into. Those fans that still buy into his philosophies and methods do so because they are either deluded or gutless.

    Take your pick.

  39. Bamford10

    Because Charlie continues to lie about what his views were just this past summer, I am pasting in one of his comments from the summer below. For context, we were all discussing (for the umpteenth time) who the principal problem at Arsenal is, ownership or Wenger. As always, I and others took the position that the problem was Wenger; in contrast, Charlie argued that the principal problem was ownership, not Wenger, and that if he were “held accountable” by new ownership, Wenger was still capable of contending for and winning titles.

    Charlie will undoubtedly do everything he can to dissemble re what he was saying below, but anyone who reviews his comment or goes back to review his comment in context will see that he was saying precisely what I (and others) have said he was saying.

    Charlie’s comment from May 2017—-

    Champagne Charlie
    May 20, 2017 11:08:09

    “I said a change in ownership with a change in ambition and accountability would lead to a different Wenger. You’ve said all along that Wenger can’t do this or that, that he’s shit here or there. Well, last time he was held accountable he was winning titles, so sorry if I don’t buy the idea a new owner would DEFINITELY NOT change Wenger’s output. It would.”

  40. Paulinho

    “Yeah Ramsey is so amazing for consistently forgetting how to play CM and making runs into the box to score goals”

    Apart from when he does and you squeak on here all quietly and through gritted teeth and say ‘Ramsey played well tonight’ like it’s some one off, despite him continually doing that when fully fit.

  41. Champagne Charlie

    Michael 24

    You stated the club was commercially “floundering”, that was you. Referencing a 9 year old to back up your initial claim isn’t that interesting to anyone.

    The fact is I challenged your claim about our commercial stance and your stock response has been your “gut”, “instinct” says we’re commercially in the toilet.

    I’ve asked all along for you to produce thee measurable data showing our relative decline. You haven’t. Really isn’t a drama, you just continue to spout “gut feelings” as fact and I challenge such stupidity.

  42. raptora

    The quote from Charlie that Bamford posted undoubtedly says it all.
    He did/does think that it’s all Kroenke’s fault.
    And he did/does think that Wenger can lead us to titles with a better owner.

    Sadly no antidote for the sickness.
    Massive amount of people still believe that Wenger is the right man for Arsenal at this very moment. This year. This month. This day. This minute.

  43. Champagne Charlie

    Banford

    Ayyyyyy finally you have the balls (stupidity) to post what I actually said. I see your thrown in a caveat about me attempting to augment what I was talking about, rest easy no need.

    The context was me explaining that Kroenke has done nothing good for Arsenal whereas Wenger has at east delivered titles pre-Kroenke.

    I’m clearly stating that the same effect a new manager has on players (literally used this example), a new owner would get a different tune out of Wenger. I didn’t state what tune, just said I was ridiculous to suggest there would “definitely not” (hence the caps) be any change in his output.

    Of course you don’t operate on a balanced level so you took what was said and reimagined it as me stating Wenger would win us titles again.

    That quote, which is the basis of your pathetic attempt to undermine, explains itself succinctly. The fact you’re too stupid to understand what was written within a conversation about Kroenke and Wenger is your own fault. 🙂

  44. Champagne Charlie

    Banford

    “Sure Charlie”

    So enlighten me as to where I said Wenger would win us titles again?

    I advocated ‘Kroenke out’ as a priority over ‘Wenger out’ and what you’ve quoted is my logic behind it.

    Here it is in its simplest form:

    1. Wenger out still leaves us with Kroenke who couldn’t care less about sporting success.

    2. Kroenke out means Wengers days are numbered, and the next manager/s better deliver because our owner is all about success.

    It’s teally not hard to grasp, you haven’t because of your dishonest nature as a poster on here toward people that challenge you. Get a grip of your micro-penis.

  45. Micheal

    Here’s a manual for Bamford & Co who struggle to understand the basics of how businesses are set up and operate. The names might change, but the basics remain fixed.

    Kroenke
    ( Owner)
    / /
    Gazidis Wenger
    (Chief Ex) (Manager)

  46. Bamford10

    Michael

    We are all well aware of those basic facts. Wenger should have been replaced years ago, and Kroenke is responsible for not doing so. Every other mistake at Arsenal, however, has been Wenger’s.

  47. Paulinho

    Charlie – You quite clearly implied that a new owner would get a positive output change from Wenger.

    If that the output change is not significant i.e winning league titles, champions leagues, it does beg the question, why mention it?

    Bearing in mind Wenger is already winning trophies under this regime, and the only way up after that is to be in the mix for league titles and champions leagues, and actually win one every and now then.

  48. Champagne Charlie

    Banford

    That’s your standard response when Kroenke is mentioned. It underlines your inability to be measured when discussing Wenger.

    You’re a pretty stupid “intellectual”, hope that’s apparent.

  49. mysticleaves

    Paulinho, dimwit. I like to say the way you shrug your head when replay shows you how Ramsey was jogging back as Man city were scoring their 3rd goal.

  50. HighburyLegend

    “How does City losing to Liverpool show the prem is poor?”

    You are right, Arsenal is a far better example lol

  51. Champagne Charlie

    “Charlie – You quite clearly implied that a new owner would get a positive output change from Wenger.If that the output change is not significant i.e winning league titles, champions leagues, it does beg the question, why mention it?“

    Because it was a valid argument in the context of the debate that was being had.

    I don’t remember who asked the question, it was Wallace possibly but don’t quote me. But he asked who people would rather see gone if they had to choose one of Wenger or Kroenke.

    I stated Kroenke for reasons I just outlined. Apply accountability from the very top and the rest takes care of itself.

    Under a different ownership Wenger achieved more than he has under Kroenke, so is it reasonable to suggest his output would change under an Usmanov? I think so.

    What Banford typically left out was that I wasn’t advocating Wenger, I was advocating an owner that would demand sporting success. I even stated that Wengers output would change for the better, or he’d be replaced because a new owner would have his finger on the pulse.

  52. Paulinho

    Mystic – Because no one has ever done that when being 2-0 down, outplayed, and just coming back from injury, and taken off not long after as protection.

    Twat.

  53. Micheal

    “We are all well aware of those basic facts. Wenger should have been replaced years ago, and Kroenke is responsible for not doing so. Every other mistake at Arsenal, however, has been Wenger’s.”

    Wenger is a bad manager because Kroenke’s “hands off” management style allows him to be a bad manager. The cancer at the heart of Arsenal Football Club is the owner who allows bad management to persist.
    Defending this cunt Kroenke because you happen to born on the same continent is beyond farce. I suppose Trump is not really all that bad ‘cos he’s American.

  54. mysticleaves

    If the board really cared and held wenger to a higher standard (the standard was top4) he would have adapted and produced more than he has. This would have been ensured by giving him some money, making sure he spends it, making sure he wins the league by the 3rd way etc. If he knew he didn’t have to offer himself new contracts anytime he wanted, if there was a bit of unsettling presence from the board, if the chairman didn’t say “If Wenger keeps quiet we all keep quiet”, etc etc…Wenger would have produced atleast 3 league titles over the last 10 years

  55. Marko

    Reports in Spain we’ve only got eyes for Luis Enrique and he’s giving us a wink and a flash of the thigh in response

  56. Uwot?

    U just know the mickey mousers are gonna win it this year.theyll draw Roma in semi & nick it in the final against Madrid.b****ks!

  57. Rambo Ramsey

    Fraudiola is too fun to use, thus here to stay.

    Sensitive nancies, get over it please. What the fvck is up with some people, that you can’t enjoy taking the piss out of other teams?

    Tis one of the best things that comes with being a footy fan.

  58. Champagne Charlie

    Michal, Mystic

    Precisely that. When Gazidis is commenting that our top 4 finishes are “overachieving” you know the remit is NOT premier league titles.

    When that accountability is placed on Wenger you’d see a change in output. Enough of one? Who knows. But Arsenal would be all the better for an owner that prioritises sporting success at the highest level.

    That’s the entire argument.

    ——

    I’ll point one thing out Paulinho, there’s people on here so entrenched in hating Wenger that they would prefer not to see us successful with him at the helm.

    That ideology is ridiculous to me. I want success for Arsenal, Kroenke after a decade has shown he’s not about that. Change him and if that gets Wenger back to winning ways that’s fantastic, if not then guess what? It’s fine because Mr.X who owns Arsenal is hell bent on sporting success so we can rest assured he’ll do his best to deliver it.

  59. R.S.P.C.Arsenal

    Horse running for arsenal fans pre 95
    It’s up for grabs now
    18.15 kempton

    100/1 doubt it will win maybe a place only second run

  60. Marko

    Mystic – Because no one has ever done that when being 2-0 down, outplayed, and just coming back from injury, and taken off not long after as protection.

    I’ve got to say that’s quite the excuse for a player jogging back slowly into position as the opposition are about to score. Xhaka was trotting back also but let me guess he was more at fault because he’s not crocked half the time like Ramsey. It’s incredible really how many times he’s done it this season and been getting away with it. I remember the Liverpool game earlier in the season 2 or 3 nil down and he’s over talking to the bench as they score another. He got serious flack for it for about two days. Truth is none of this would be a problem if we considered him a CAM but as a CM he’s got a responsibility and he regularly fails at that responsibility

  61. James wood

    Bamfords responses yet again get more and more cloudy
    his basic understanding of Arsenal and it’s business seems to be coming from
    someone who reads to much on the internet.
    I can only imagine his understanding of the game being American
    and being based in the States is difficult for him.?
    What he must understand posters on here actually go to games and have been
    lifetime supporters there knowledge and feel for what’s happening around the club obviously outweighs the views of someone who get’s his ammunition from the web.

  62. Paulinho

    Charlie – It is true though that at the time Kroenke was being lauded because of his hands off approach, and the belief that he would let Wenger get on with it, which at the time consisted of bringing through youngsters that Wenger and the fans thought were destined for the top of the game.

    So his approach does have its positives and I’m not sure Wenger would enjoy the owner that is constantly putting pressure on him. Indeed, the reason he has stayed at Arsenal is because there is an abundance of that type in every other big club.

    Of course, If Kroenke doesn’t act this summer _ and it doesn’t look like he will – then it’s quite clear he far too extreme in terms of being hands off/passive, and that is to a detriment to the club.

  63. Rambo Ramsey

    Charlie, Wenger is past-it, has been from some time. The man couldn’t beat Leicester to the title. He isn’t winning it even if backed by Sheikh Mansour.

    Reason I want new ownership is to make sure we won’t be in this position again.

    Imagine if Arsenal’s next or any future appointment turns out a dud. I want an owner who thinks – “Fuck, I made a mistake. Time for a managerial change”, not Kroenke who’d be- “Lets give him one more year” and again and again.

  64. Marko

    I get what you were trying to say Charlie and the circumstances surrounding whether you actually thought that Wenger was still capable of winning major titles again and fair enough but for me I don’t think he could win a league title again or champions league. The last few years have proven even with more resources he still not only comes up woefully short but it had shown that he can’t be trusted with transfer kitties and perhaps most importantly for me he has shown for many years now that he lacks something in the tactics department to win major titles again. Just my opinion but the trend of embarrassing heavy defeats under him is too obvious.

  65. Marko

    Of course, If Kroenke doesn’t act this summer _ and it doesn’t look like he will – then it’s quite clear he far too extreme in terms of being hands off/passive, and that is to a detriment to the club

    I absolutely agree. Of course I think that he shouldn’t have been given new deals the last two contracts and couldn’t for the life of me figure out how he got another one last summer but this summer there can be no excuses for keeping him on. Bar a Europa league win much like last season an FA Cup win pulled the wool over people’s eyes that’s all that could possibly save him. It’d be another false dawn though

  66. Champagne Charlie

    Rambo

    You just repeated what I said mate. Only reason Wenger would get another crack under a different owner is because that was the question asked at the time. Clearly the best scenario would be a new owner and a new manager.

    But if you had to choose one this summer to replace who would it be out of Wenger and Kroenke? I’d be shot of Kroenke because as you stated, a new owner would hold the manager accountable.

    ——

    Paulinho

    Don’t think that’s entirely true. Wenger pre-Kroenke was tasked with winning us titles and still brought through incredible talents. It’s not something Kroenkes ownership approach has nurtured.

    There’s nothing positive about Kroenke ownership style imo. He’s detached, uninterested, and doesn’t have the ability to defer responsibility in a way that sees success on the pitch.

    What other owner of a major side in Europe has been in charge for a decade and not seen a league title? Simplistic question but there can’t be many, if at all besides Kroenke.

  67. Paulinho

    Marko – Pay attention to the modern game.

    Hardly anyone tracks backs or track runners anymore, hence why Ramsey frequently finds himself in incredible scoring positions all alone.

    Where was the great Alexander Golovin last week? Didn’t see him track back.

    What about the Polish guy you were raving about at West Brom? Hardly busts a gut either.

  68. Champagne Charlie

    Marko

    I didn’t state how much of an output we’d see from Wenger under a new owner, just that a new owner would have an effect on him.

    It was Banford that twisted the narrative.

    I too think it’d be too much for him to reach those levels again, but I’d be much more hopeful having an owner with sporting success firmly in the sights. The manager, whomever that is, becomes nothing more than a replaceable part of the machine – unlike the current setup we see.

  69. Bob N16

    Agree Marko. Understand the principle that changing the shit owner is ultimately more important than changing a shit manager -CC ‘S argument. I do think that Wenger is too far gone in his limited coaching of the team to be kick started by a new owner or that a new owner wouldn’t replace him in a flash.

  70. Marko

    But if you had to choose one this summer to replace who would it be out of Wenger and Kroenke? I’d be shot of Kroenke because as you stated, a new owner would hold the manager accountable.

    Wenger has to go. I get what you’re saying him under a different owner MIGHT yield different results but you could also argue that a different manager under a THIS owner MIGHT yield different results. I’d argue more than might because of how finished Wenger is. Kroenke quite clearly isn’t the owner that we all hoped he would be but I’ll be honest with you what has happened this past season and a bit with the Rams in the NFL gives me hope that he’s not as clueless as he appears

  71. HighburyLegend

    “If Kroenke doesn’t act this summer _ and it doesn’t look like he will”

    Absolutely!!
    What the hell the “IF” is doing here ???

  72. S Asoa

    Too much credence is given to the excuse that Kroenke does not understand about football and so totallly left it in the unabled hands of Wenger. It is to be factored that Kroenke , is a billionaire, and these species are persons with nous or the hired expertise to take proper decisions.
    Apparently Kroenke hands are tied due to gentlemen agreement to let Wenger have a free hand and full unbridled control of AFC for doing the chicanery of convincing erthswhile owners to sell majority stakes to Kroenke “ who is the best for the Club, upholder of values, and without the perceived abrasive Yankee interference, take my word “.And Kroenke got the deal nicely bundled up and money raised by hypothecating an asset he still had not paid for to raise funds for the sale. Wenger should be jailed for this , which would nicely sort the entire mess we are in.
    A bonus was to keep the other 30% stakeholder firmly out of the board and no say at all. Unthinkable.
    No wonder Le Dictator is so cocky about not going anywhere .
    WengerOut

  73. Marko

    Marko – Pay attention to the modern game.Hardly anyone tracks backs or track runners anymore, hence why Ramsey frequently finds himself in incredible scoring positions all alone.

    True but that’s not what we need in midfield. We need someone who does trackback or is at least defensively aware and disciplined enough not to get caught out like he does. Using midfielders from CSKA and West Brom as examples doesn’t help your argument with Ramsey honestly. Fabinho? Dembele? Trigueros? Savic? Kovacic? How about them they track back? They get caught out of position because they’re flicking backheels in and around the box? Answer me this do we need a CM doing that or a CM who’s positionally aware and knows his role? Like I said before Ramsey isn’t a problem if he’s considered a CAM but as a CM he’s got responsibilities

  74. Champagne Charlie

    Marko

    A different manager under Kroenke would definitely improve the state of the team imo. There’s a good number out there who outperform Wenger at this point.

    But what’s clear about Kroenke is that he isn’t wise to when things aren’t going well. So a new manager can (and will) come in and do better than Wenger, but if he struggles or stagnates is Kroenke capable of replacing him? No.

    I’d rather Kroenke go this summer and see Wenger put under pressure because I know the future of the club is in safe hands. Wenger will be replaced, but I’ve no faith that Kroenke can replace him with the right man, or ensure the new guy maintains high standards.

  75. Champagne Charlie

    Marko

    Fair point re: Rams, but only calls for more questions surely. Are we Kroenkes focus? Does he care?

    Let’s be clear, Kroenke could change tact and be the owner we’ve wanted for years. I don’t rule that out, he’s just not shown anything close to it since being here and now he seems to value his Rams project over us. So it’s hard to warm to him.

  76. Marko

    hence why Ramsey frequently finds himself in incredible scoring positions all alone.

    That also generally only happens against poorer opposition. Come on now let’s not rewrite history and make him this big game player you know. My argument has always been going forward in a midfield two can we compete with Ramsey in there and no we can’t because in a midfield two he’d have to do a different job and different things than what he currently does. He could probably play CAM in a title challenging side even though his fitness and consistency would probably mean he’d be back up to Ozil and Mhiki.

  77. Michael24

    CC

    Here is some “measurable data” for you.

    In 2006, I helped run a schools sports academy. We regular held open house days ,where hundreds of kids would turn up kitted out in their teams colours.

    Many children wore Arsenal shirts. Henry #14, being the most popular. No surprise there then.

    Although I no longer help run the academy, I have assisted on numerous occasions over the past few years when I can.

    On my last visit, back in October last year, 400 kids turned up for a football clinic. Guess how many of those 400 children were wearing an Arsenal shirt?

    The answer was two!!!!! Neither shirt highlighted an Arsenal player’s name. Why do you think this was? Man U/Chelski/Man City/Liverpool, christ, even Spuds and West Ham shirts were more prevalent.

    From being a team/product that all youngsters could relate to and be proud of, we have slumped to the bottom of the “real” commercial heap.

    I wonder how many of those 2006 youngsters still have the same attachment to the club they had back then.

    As I said, you can keep coming back to me with your theoretical take on matters but, at the end of the day, you know you’ll just be hitting your head against a brick wall.

    Keep ironing your Wenger shirt!

  78. S Asoa

    Wenger has been at Arsenal for 22 years, with Fergie having a longer tenure. Normally managers are shifted by 4-6 years, for fresh ideas and for sake of evolution. So please FORGET THE EARLY 12 Years of Wenger, as another generation and different circumstances. Last 10 years Wenger has been a FAILURE , nothwithstanding the celebratory bus tours of the Fake Tro4phy

  79. Marko

    But what’s clear about Kroenke is that he isn’t wise to when things aren’t going well. So a new manager can (and will) come in and do better than Wenger, but if he struggles or stagnates is Kroenke capable of replacing him? No

    That’s fair and probably true. Even though I’m hopeful that after finally getting rid of the useless Jeff Fischer and bringing in the youthful hungry McVeigh at the Rams that he’d be less fearful of sacking people. The cunt runs Wal-Mart he shouldn’t be having a problem with shitcanning people.

    I disagree with kroenke gone before Wenger though he has got to go now new owner or not he is finished. This part of the conversation you’ll agree is pointless though because we’re not changing owner anytime soon but we can change manager

  80. S Asoa

    Hoping for Kroenke to go this year or the near future is a DAYDREAM. This fellow needs AFC solid worth asset as a guarantee to raise funds for his America Adventure. So forget these daydreams. MAKE IT UNTENABLE FOR WENGER TO STAY ON.
    Shame the Cretin out relentlessly without getting detracted by immaterial Club wins. Show maturity and resolve , not wish-washy “values”

  81. Leedsgunner

    Whilst the likes of Liverpool look forward to playing in the semi finals of the world’s best club competition (and beating the likes of Man City to do it) we have the 2nd leg versus CSKA Moscow to look forward to.

    Oh well.

    Such is life.

    When one persist with mediocrity like Wenger, we have only ourselves to blame.

    At least we can take consolation that Tottenham has to watch it from the sidelines. Liverpool (if they go all the way) winning ANOTHER European trophy is bad enough but Tottenham winning the UCL would have been UNBEARABLE.

  82. WengerEagle

    Paulinho

    Found an interesting stat which relates to what you were saying about Messi and Ronaldo yesterday and how the latter’s mentality in adversity is better.

    Goals for their teams in the UCL when their team is losing:

    Messi- 4 goals.
    Ronaldo- 22 goals.

  83. Champagne Charlie

    “I disagree with kroenke gone before Wenger though he has got to go now new owner or not he is finished. This part of the conversation you’ll agree is pointless though because we’re not changing owner anytime soon but we can change manager“

    Oh absolutely, it’s hypothetical talk carried over from last summer. The manager is in line for a change, the owner might need changing but it’s not on te horizon whatsoever. Wenger certainly needs replaced this summer though, I agree. I’d be sure it was happening under a different owner however, which is the Kroenke effect you might say lol

    ———

    Michael 24

    That’s not measurable data, that’s an anecdote you muppet hahaha

    6th in Deloitte money list and here’s how we perform according to social media (which I think trumps your school football camp).

    https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.uk.businessinsider.com/the-20-most-popular-rich-list-football-teams-on-social-media-2017-1

    So 6th in revenue thanks in large to sponsorships, and 5th globally in social media support. But our commercial appeal is “floundering” according to Michael 24 of Le Grove, who cites his school football camp as evidence of Arsenal’s global commercial decline.

    What a turnip.

  84. Marko

    Fair point re: Rams, but only calls for more questions surely. Are we Kroenkes focus? Does he care?

    I don’t think he cares about any of it to be honest. I also don’t really think you can give him any of the credit for their turnaround honestly. American sports are structured in such a way that the turnaround is obviously more to do with the chief whatever. They have different roles in different teams but I’ll use the Philadelphia eagles as an example. The ceo is some guy called Laurey I think. Years ago they had chip Kelly as coach and making all the decisions and they were awful and then they brought back Howie Mandel who oversaw all recruitment and running from a technical point and brought in a new coach with Doug Pedersen and they won a super bowl. The point I’m making is that the actual owner isn’t the reason for the success outside of being smart enough to hire the chief of operations or whatever Mandel is. It’s Howie Mandel who was given much of the credit because of how he actually ran the club and hired and all that. My point is perhaps maybe it could be more the fault of the guy who day to day runs the club more than the blind owner. Perhaps Gazidis is more to blame than people think. He’s here day to day running the club Kroenke is some fap haired twat in Texas most of the time

  85. Marko

    Oh absolutely, it’s hypothetical talk carried over from last summer. The manager is in line for a change, the owner might need changing but it’s not on te horizon whatsoever. Wenger certainly needs replaced this summer though, I agree. I’d be sure it was happening under a different owner however, which is the Kroenke effect you might say lol

    Exactly

  86. HighburyLegend

    “The cunt runs Wal-Mart he shouldn’t be having a problem with shitcanning people.”
    Makes me realize that Arsenal is runned the same way nowadays.

  87. raptora

    Reality is how often does a owner change happen? And at Arsenal?

    So cc, what you are saying that you’d like to see Kroenke go this summer, then see the new owner put pressure under Wenger sounds just like Wenger winning a big trophy again. Utopia. How can you even believe that Kroenke will leave Arsenal just like that?

    Way more real scenario is to move Wenger on, get a proper manager in, sack the new manager if we have to, then sign another one and if we still keep failing, then people could turn against Kroenke and force him out.

    All I know is that there are so, so, so, so many good managers that would dream to have all the freedom that Wenger has, to realize their ideas to the fullest of their potential, without being under heavy pressure day in, day out. To present Kroenke as some kind of owner who doesn’t give you absolutely all the tools needed to be successful if you are good is obscene. We pay top salary, we pay top money for new players, we have a top stadium with endless possibilities and millions of fans all over the world.

    Some give an example the owners of Pool. Or Spuds. Do they spend as much as we do? Do they have the structure that we do? They don’t. I’ve repeated a million times that Klopp is Wenger MK2. But Wenger’s decay is so strong that Klopp looks like a top, top, top manager compared to him. Same as Poch.

  88. raptora

    Answer me this CC. And I’m going to give as example teams who I consider haven’t achieved much recently, but have outperformed Arsenal.

    How did Pool reach this semifinal and Wenger hasn’t been able to qualify Arsenal for a UCL QUARTER for 8 years straight?

    How are we going to finish behind Pool and Spuds in the league standings if we have spend much more money than them in the last 5 years, and our salary is much higher?

    Do you think that the reason for this is Wenger underperforming or Klopp and Poch overperforming? Or maybe it is vice versa who knows?

    Chelsea with extremely similar spendings and salary in the last 5 years have won 2 titles, but we have not been even in the mix for becoming champions for around a dozen years. Why?

    And most importantly:

    Does Wenger have been given less tools in his hands by the owner than Klopp and Poch so we are falling more and more behind those two not even that successful in recent years teams?

  89. TR7

    I think the numbers are more a reflection of the way the two teams play – Barça and Real. Madrid transition swiftly from defense to attack whereas Barça generally have a slow build up. Also, Madrid are a threat aerially as well whereas Barça mostly rely on through passes and link up.

  90. Leedsgunner

    How did Liverpool get rid of their unpopular American owners Hicks and Gilette? Any lessons to learn for us?

  91. Champagne Charlie

    “So cc, what you are saying that you’d like to see Kroenke go this summer, then see the new owner put pressure under Wenger sounds just like Wenger winning a big trophy again. Utopia. How can you even believe that Kroenke will leave Arsenal just like that?“

    Pay attention, I’m not stating that’s what I want to see this summer. This discussion was from a hypothetical question raised last summer that I brought back into focus again today when discussing Kroenke.

    I’m well aware Kroenke isn’t going anywhere this summer and fully anticipating a change in manager at Arsenal. Though as I noted above speaking to Marko, the confidence I have in Kroenke delivering a favourable outcome is not sky high.

  92. tee

    @CC, go on guy. I enjoy reading from you. the more the myopics try to pull you down the more you make them look stupid. I think it will be easier for Wenger to leave than for that idiotic American called cockroach to sell his shares. I just know that one day, just one day my arsenal will be set free from the cockroach families.

  93. Paulinho

    WE – Wow, crazy stat. Now that’s sort of stat that is illuminating.

    Not surprised though. Ronaldo is the far better off the ball player and relies less on combining with a teammate with one-twos etc before looking to score from a deeper position.

    Marko, I would like a new central midfielder, and I can see the benefits of it being a deeper-lying ‘rhythm’ midfielder that looks to predominantly stay behind the ball. However, I don’t think it is a panacea either, and the way you reel off these names with such certainty that they are certain to be a nett improvement on Ramsey is something I can;’t buy into. As I said, you kept mentioning Krychowiak on these lists a couple of years back when he was at more glamorous clubs, and I don’t see you mentioning him now.

  94. Champagne Charlie

    Tee

    Thanks mate. It will certainly be a day to smile when Arsenal is out of the Kroenke clutches. Sadly not in the very near future, but one can be hopeful.

    Either that or a startling change of tact from him, but that seems incredibly unlikely.

  95. Bob N16

    RT, trying deperately to get a response. In the end tries a direct insult as nothing else is working…..

  96. Bob N16

    CC, was just reading about a behaviour called ‘validity of illusion’ and thought of Michael24. I almost felt sorry for him, when after 24 hours of thought/investigation/who knows what, he comes out with some anecdotal evidence after you’d challenged him to produce data to support his claims.

  97. N5

    Truth have you seen how many fans are currently attending? Wenger puts it down to deluded reasoning like to many games piled up or one bad result!

    He’s not paying attention or he doesn’t care!

  98. Champagne Charlie

    “For a start you can join in with the protest march instead mocking them.“

    Don’t you mean “us”? Surely you’re part of the march if you’re telling others to take part…. 🙂

    ——

    Bob n16

    Yea bit of an odd one that, goes to show how many an opinion these days is predicated on little to no substance beyond emotion. Face palms all around reading that nugget he delivered.

  99. WengerEagle

    TR7

    Not sure how that relates to the disparity between their goal tallies when their team is behind.

    Barcelona have been dumped out of the UCL in the QF now 3 seasons on the bounce, Messi hasn’t scored a goal in any of these 6 matches and he hasn’t even played well, particularly away from home where he’s been anonymous.

    He’s unusual in that the vast majority of his UCL accolades and most memorable UCL goals and moments all came in the first half dozen years of his career, from the ages of 19-23.

    2014/15 being the exceptional year in his prime.

    It’s worth pointing out.

  100. Elmo

    Leeds
    “How did Liverpool get rid of their unpopular American owners Hicks and Gilette? Any lessons to learn for us?”

    The fans didn’t get them out. RBS (which had ridiculously been allowed to become the biggest bank in the world by balance sheet size by 2008, with assets of £2.4 TRILLION, 50% larger than the UK’s entire GDP) had been bailed out to the tune of £45bn by the UK taxpayer, and refused to re-finance the loan to Hicks and Gillett, moving their loan into their ‘bad bank.’ Hicks and Gillett had borrowed in the days of easy credit pre-2008 and had little knowledge of the industry they were getting themselves into, other than that they intended to implement their usual leverage buy-out tricks while sweet talking the fans about ambition and respect for tradition. The credit market changed post-2008, the club began to falter on the field and Hicks and Gillett had no way to pay back the loans, so RBS forced the appointment of a chairman who was tasked with selling the club from under them.

    The chances of that happening to Kroenke are zero, unless we get relegated, the entire stadium gets boycotted for a couple of years, the football bubble completely bursts, or perhaps the best chance if his LA project seriously under-performs. The likelihood is he’s not going anywhere until he chooses to, on terms that suit him.

  101. HighburyLegend

    “The likelihood is he’s not going anywhere until he chooses to, on terms that suit him.”

    Reminds me of someone else, but damn, WHO ??
    (lol)

  102. Bob N16

    Nailed it Elmo. I guess we won’t give a monkeys if we get a new manager in who makes us competitive again. I’ve always felt that Kroenke has seen the attraction of Wenger taking all the crap. When W. goes, and if it’s felt that a new manager is not getting sufficient financial backing, that’s when Kroenke will be getting the hate that Wenger is getting now.

  103. Confidentgoner

    Charlie,
    Re: your comments below
    Marko
    I didn’t state how much of an output we’d see from Wenger under a new owner, just that a new owner would have an effect on him.
    —-±———————
    Questions;
    1) Wenger’s £10m salary is not sufficient to put a fire in him?
    2) His promise to take us to the next level should be discounted?
    3) His inability to win back the EPL after 15 years is not enough incentive?
    4) His club’s top of the range wage bill show he received support, but efficiency or competency is lacking in every aspect.
    5) What do you like about Wenger’s coaching? Will love to know.
    regards,
    Confident

  104. alexanderhenry

    Marko

    ‘what has happened this past season and a bit with the Rams in the NFL gives me hope that he’s not as clueless as he appears’.

    Yes, but the situation there is different. Stan knew if he moved to LA and served up the kind of dross all his other teams produce, the Rams would flop.

    At arsenal he has been doing as little as possible for ten years and yet the season tickets sell out. Until he feels some kind of financial pressure, he will continue to let arsenal drift.

  105. alexanderhenry

    To quote stan directly:

    “If you want to win championships then you would never get involved. I think the best owners in sports are the guys that sort of watch both sides a bit’.

    ..inspiring stuff

  106. alexanderhenry

    It’s a given that if Kroenke sold up, wenger would follow. No new owner would persevere with a coach who’s clearly past it and pushing 70.

    Therefore, the best thing that could happen this summer is for Kroenke to sell arsenal. The new Rams stadium is vastly expensive. Maybe he will.

  107. Champagne Charlie

    Confident

    You can point to whatever you like and make a case as to why it should motivate Wenger to do well. Doesn’t change the very real concept of underperforming when not held accountable. Something that’s demonstrated the world over in many a discipline.

    Feel free to hold up ideals about high wages and promises, but if Wenger is congratulated internally by his superiors for “overachieving” by providing top 4 football then it’s hard to dismiss the possibility for accepting a lower standard.

    Should Wenger be striving for titles? Clearly.

    Is he capable of that? Not anymore imo.

    Has Wenger been pressured to deliver titles the last decade? No.

    Has he been held accountable for not winning titles? Quite the opposite, praised for middling success in fact. That can only foster stagnation imo.

    What do I like about Wengers management now? Not a great deal frankly, hence we should be changing managers this summer without question. But there is a question….and only one man is responsible or that question. Stan

  108. Redtruth

    Champagne charlie is full of droppings.
    It was only 12 months ago he was still in full support of Wenger when it’s clear for all to see Wenger has been a busted flush for over a decade.

  109. Michael24

    CC

    Me again!

    So what part of Wenger’s management style do you still have a liking for?

    Your “not a great deal” comment obviously means you still have a soft spot for the master. Which spot would that be?

    Pray tell.

    Best wishes

    The Turnip!

  110. Marko

    Pjanic is having a good game here perpetually moving dictating never being caught out of position. Basically the anti-Ramsey