Paul Merson takes the jokes too far…

by .

via @t0wey (instagram)

via @t0wey (instagram)

LOLOLOLOL

Mesut Ozil’s agent, who has had a summer so bereft of positive attention, Theresa May is feeling for him… has spoken to the press about his main manz situation.

“Our contacts with Arsenal continue and are going in a positive way.”

“Ozil wants to play another two to three years in the Premier League.

I see, I see, I see, I see.

Basically, Ozil can’t land a gig anywhere else. Arsenal called his £330k-a-week bluff by inviting other clubs to bid for him, none did… now he’s crawling back to us because we’re the only team in Europe mad enough to make him our highest paid player.

I shouldn’t crow, because he’s a talent we’d struggle to replace. I just find it amusing, because it’s so clear why clubs aren’t rolling out the red carpet, yet Arsenal fans will celebrate the deal and hail him as a tortured soul no one understood outside the elite-minded fans of Arsenal as they wheeled in another season of mediocrity.

Reality is, we’ve taken one of the hottest players on the planet and made him so disinterested in the game no one wants to take a chance on him on a free transfer.

Think about that. Total madness. We break players so badly we can’t even give them away.

Still, at least he’ll give a f*ck past Christmas. Unless it’s away against a top 6 team.

On the upswing of things, we are playing Watford this weekend and we can take it to 8 games unbeaten which will be totally lovely.

We have a defence problem, but I’d imagine Per Mertesacker or Rob Holding could step in vs Watford providing we see a disciplined performance from Ramsey and whomever he’s paired with. A little less bombing forward, a lot more focus on giving balance to defence, and THREE ASSISTS, please.

Paul Merson is channelling his inner attention seeker with some world class chat on exmanagers.

“People say Redknapp’s a wheeler-dealer and it’s so disrespectful,”

“Tactically, he’s one of the best I’ve worked with.”

“If Arsene Wenger had Harry Redknapp’s tactical nous, Arsenal would win the league.”

Errrrr… what? Tactical nous? Are you sure son?

Harry Redknapp had a few good years, particularly at Spurs, but tactical nous? Really struggling there (Or maybe I’m just a hater). This is a guy who is basically the Jose Mourinho of average clubs, bar the continued success. There’s going to be a fab book that breaks about his ways one day.

‘Look, everyone was at it,’ will be the industry pardon.

ANYWAY, I’m done. Catch you all tomorrow x

129 Responses to “Paul Merson takes the jokes too far…”

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  1. Bankz

    Shit!
    The competition gets stiffer by the day.
    Well done guys….wish Arsenal and Wenger were both this competitive.

  2. TallestTiz

    I’m doing a Leicester on you guys… Albeit mine will come more often.

    Sorry Bankz
    Sorry Boomslang
    Sorry ADKB
    Sorry DM in absentia.

    Special shoutout to all my b*tches who made this possible…lol

  3. Leftsidesanch

    Genuinely don’t understand why anybody has a pen when Paul Merson speaks. The guy just says things for attention.

  4. Bankz

    Congrats TallestTiz, you’re doing something Arsenal will never taste again under wenger.
    Going hard into a competition and actually winning it.
    You deserve a golden trophy…..Lol

  5. TallestTiz

    Pedro

    Don’t you think Ozil’s agent is talking bollocks to alert teams around the globe that their potentially freebie might as well sign on if they don’t act fast…

    I don’t trust football agents

  6. freddylekgunner

    Wenger has confirmed talks are going on well with Ozil, but also not ruling out him and Sanchez in January.

  7. Park Chu-young's left testicle

    I shouldn’t crow, because he’s a talent we’d struggle to replace.
    _________________________

    Seriously?

  8. Park Chu-young's left testicle

    providing we see a disciplined performance from Ramsey
    _______________________________

    Seriously?

  9. Bamford10

    Wenger has acknowledged this morning that Sanchez and Ozil could be sold in January, that this is a possibility.

  10. Elmo

    “Wenger has acknowledged this morning that Sanchez and Ozil could be sold in January, that this is a possibility.”

    If that was ever remotely a consideration, why wasn’t Sanchez sold for £60m on deadline day when there was a final chance to get a reasonable amount of money from him?

    Wenger claims that the stars not signing is an ideal situation. The club announce that it was always their plan the star players wouldn’t be sold at any price. On deadline day, the plan suddenly is subject to change and they will sell if they can replace. Having botched deadline day, the stance returns to it having been a conscious decision to make the trade-off of losing the transfer value in order to maximum chances of making the CL. By October, Wenger is announcing that the players might be sold in January if a buyer materialises.

    As we all know, there literally is no plan and it’s all just made up as they go along in a haphazard way. You’d at least have a minimal amount of respect for the way the club is managed if they actually stuck to what they said they were going to do, rather than repeatedly expose that every plan they announce is merely a convenient PR statement to put out a fire at a particular point in time.

  11. Leedsgunner

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/41592531

    So in other words, if Alexis and and Özil are sold in January Wenger and the club have given us the worst of all worlds. If we were going to sell them we should have sold them in the summer and brought in like for like replacements. Now we are selling our two best players on the cheap.

    We have missed out in selling them at a premium in the summer and we are losing face by selling them midseason because we can’t afford to let them both go on a free.

    For goodness sake, remember that Wenger and Gazidas made a big show of the fact that we had kept Alexis and Özil over the summer — Gazidas even hailing the transfer window a success because of it.

    Laughable isn’t it?

    The club made the choice to keep them, stick with it… show some resolve and backbone.

    No doubt when they do get sold for £20m each, we’ll be told it was for footballing reasons.

    In an era where Neymar went for £200m and Kyle Walker went for £50m, we’re selling our crown jewels for a combined sum of £40m.

    Why?

    We failed to plan. Plan to fail.

    *Sigh*

    I have the say, whenever I think the club cannot any go any lower on the ladder of incompetence — it surprises me.

  12. HighburyLegend

    “Wenger and the club have given us the worst of all worlds.”

    Well, same shit since a decade, so we get used to it.

  13. Danish Gooner

    Why the fuck didnt we sell them in the summer where they were worth something ,now we are gonna take a massive discount on both.

  14. graham62

    Yet another ACCIDENT WAITING TO HAPPEN.

    Just how many cock ups can this man get away with?

    Not only does Wenger have limited skills and abilities when it comes to solving our on pitch frailities, he now has zero prowess when it comes to making simple business decisions.

    As for Paul Merson and his perceptions, are they really that laughable? Remember, here is a guy who has seen, first hand, how Wenger operates.

    For several years PM has openly voiced his outrage at the way things have been run at the Emirates, and although we may mock his assumptions of Harry Redknapp being tactically superior to Wenger, I think we can all agree that it wouldn’t take much to beat the Frenchman on that one.

  15. graham62

    Would you teach a group of aspiring business students the ‘Wenger principles’, when it comes to balancing the books?

  16. Cesc Appeal

    The answer to ‘why did we not sell the in the summer’ is the same as the answer to everything at Arsenal, because no one will pay for the mistake.

    Culture of complacency, cowardice and averageness.

  17. David Smith

    I thought Wenger would leave it until the end of last summers transfer window to sell Sanchez, so it was too late to replace him, wenger clearly hates being under pressure to buy, despite the embarrassing claim of a bid for Lemar.
    But, I suppose selling in Jan is an extension of this theory, no way will he be able to replace either of them this winter, that will make Wenger happy, and add to the profits come the end of the financial year.

  18. loyika

    Merson only spent one year with Arsene before he was moved on to Boro.

    Would rather hold more truth to what Dixon, Keown, Parlour and even Big Tone says than Paul Merson. Its like asking me to take whatever Craig Burley says on ESPN seriously!?

    Only thing Redknap trumps Arsene on is transfers (and this can only be said to be in recent times as Wenger got good deals when he had David Dein as his Wing man, holding his hand to cross the road) and dealing with sales and purchases of players (especially dealing with Player Agents).

  19. Leedsgunner

    The supposed Lemar bid was nothing but a face saving exercise. Something for Wenger and his supporters to point to — so that they are able to say… “See, see at least he is trying… See, see, we are still ambitious!!”

    As if anyone believes that anymore.

    I suspect that Wenger knew full well that he wouldn’t succeed with the Lemar bid, but just did it to generate headlines. In any case, if Lemar was the player that he really wanted he had plenty of chances to sign him earlier in the summer.

    I suspect Reiss Nelson will be hyped up to stratospheric levels to convince the fans that he is more than capable of replacing Sanchez.

    Just wait and see.

    However, just think about that for a moment.

    How rubbish is Wenger as a coach so that a WC player like Sanchez is interchangeable in his progress with a green behind the ears first year player? Is that really what a WC coach does?

    I suspect he irony will be beyond Wenger and his disciples.

  20. Pierre

    Leedsgunner
    Buenas tardes.

    Whether Wenger is rubbish or not as a coach is up for debate.

    Though there are players that haven’t progressed and also regressed under wenger, I do not think that Sanchez is one of them.
    For me, sanchez is better all round footballer than when he arrived here, more of a team player. His assists stats as well as his goals scored are evidence of that.
    Whether you give Wenger any credit for that is a matter of opinion I suppose.

  21. Goobergooner

    Between Leeds and Elmo’s posts, there isn’t much left to say.

    If either one of Sanchez or Ozil are sold in January, I will be sick. The club’s board and management will have lost every ounce of credibility, which is saying something as for the last few years there has been little there in the first place.

    Kroenke really knows how to ruin a club. What a piece of shit.

    And Wenger rambling on at every press conference like he is some Messiah. Once upon a time I’d have let him have it. Not anymore. All he has made me realise is that money talks on every level. Wenger sold out his own legacy for this BS.

    I still love watching the Arsenal. It’s just now there is no expectations. Even my aims with the club are dropping, like not getting pumped 10-2 again if we make it back to champs league would seem like a bloody trophy.

    The 90 minutes of football is all I care for. The rest of the bullshit aka values this club has can get bent. I haven’t seen any value for a long time, FA cups aside. Arsene has long been finished, and Kroenke is just a prick. A selfish, arrogant prick.

  22. Cesc Appeal

    Leeds

    Agreed.

    That is what is most likely to happen.

    Wenger usually gets it both ways, his lackeys hail him holding Sanchez but then will claim because we held on to Sanchez we cannot expect a big buy to replace him.

    Agree that Nelson will probably be hyped beyond belief.

    Always said this summer was just pure laziness and cowardice as per usual, it would have taken balls and vision to get Sanchez and Ozil out along with some others and really go out and try to build a long term, quality side, was certainly possible though, options aplenty.

    Unfortunately, balls, bravery and ambition are not words you would use when stating the qualities of Wenger or Kroenke.

    Again though, with no consequences comes great complacency.

    Wenger won’t pay, Kroenke won’t pay so why should they care?

  23. HighburyLegend

    “If either one of Sanchez or Ozil are sold in January, I will be sick. ”
    What about both of them ?? lol

    (You weren’t sick already ?? What is your secret ??)

  24. Leedsgunner

    Pierre

    You’re right it is a matter of opinion. 😉

    Yet in forming that opinion, one has to consider the evidence.

    Let’s look at the long hyped British Core.

    How far has Walcott and Wilshere, our two longest serving players under Wenger doing?

    Walcott looks like a worldbeater against Doncaster and BATE Borisov but where is he against the top sides in the EPL?

    On the bench. He’s inconsistent at best, anonymous at worst. When he came he was an one trick pony and he still looks like one.

    Wilshere, when he plays looks good… but the mere fact that people STILL refer to that game in 2011 to justify his inclusion in the squad tells me that he hasn’t done much in 6 years.

    Ramsey. If Wenger is such a good coach, why is it that Ramsey looks so much more dynamic, dangerous and disciplined when he plays with Wales than when he plays for us?

    Gibbs. Sold on because he was not good enough.

    Jenkinson. Can’t sell him because nobody wanted him in the summer. Out on loan to Birmingham.

    Plus why is it that Özil tracks back, looks enthused and energetic with Germany? Could it be because in Low he has a coach that actually cares about winning?

  25. Goobergooner

    Hahaha legend.
    It’s not being in London I’d say. And living in sunny Gold Coast Aus.
    But don’t get me wrong, Ive been fed up for years, but the whole turn around if they are sold will be the final straw in making a generally happy bloke explode haha. I wish I didn’t love this club so much. I hate seeing two rich pricks ruin it for everyone.

    Can’t say we haven’t seen it before though. Nasri and rvp are only 2 examples of shit hitting the fan.

  26. loyika

    @ Leeds

    But many on here were blaming Arsene for Rambo”s non performance in the game against Ireland? We can’t have it both ways can we.

    And Ozil does play well in a lot of games for Arsenal, only issue is he goes missing in big games and also games where he is double up on by the opposition, besides its not as if he plays brilliantly in all games for Germany (i could give a list of games Germany have played where Ozil was just normal in his game play)

    Always find it funny how people keep comparing players on Int duty with how they perform with their respective club sides (doesn’t hold water as its usually under different circumstance and with different sets of players and different instructions)

  27. Leedsgunner

    “But many on here were blaming Arsene for Rambo”s non performance in the game against Ireland? We can’t have it both ways can we.”

    Loyika

    I can only reply to that by saying “many might have been” I wasn’t one of them ;).

    I was thinking of his performances in the last Euros when I wrote the above.

    Ramsey, in my mind is a solid squad player but I can’t help but think under a another coach he would be so much more than he is for us.

  28. Pierre

    Leeds
    Ramsey and Walcott are prime examples of wengers methods not working.
    Wilshire, Impossible to say as injuries have overshadowed his development.
    Gibbs, maybe we got as much as we could out of him, time will tell.
    Jenks, same as bentner really…gave them a long contract, over paid them, and got stuck with them, cost the club millions.. Wenger to blame for that..

    Ramsey looks good for Wales because basically (apart from bale) he is playing with players from lower clubs and lower divisions and he has the licence to play anywhere on the pitch so there is no real discipline in his play. Also, the large majority of international matches are against much inferior teams and players than he would face in the Premiership so he will appear to be playing and managed better. I suppose the same reasoning could be used regarding özil as he performs consistently better for the national team.

  29. Jim Lahey

    @Goobergooner –

    Its sad to say, I have very little interest in the club at the moment… Have not been keeping up with the on goings or the scandals. Life is stressful enough without Arsenal weighing you down day to day!!

  30. Gooner63

    No mention of contract talks going well with Alexis – well no shit sherlock – why would he wanna stay, how many FA cup medals before it gets boring.

    Ozil talks going well – im sure they are, firstly ozils management arent idiots, they know Utd have been showing some interest – so why not see what Arsenal will offer and then tell Utd etc Arsenal have offered me this, pay more and im yours.

    Plus i think its ridiculous for people to think Ozil wont attract interest when Jan comes, getting a player for free or cheap will guarantee interest, just no one in summer was gonna pay £40mill for him.

    Wenger will just take us slowly into the new dawn of Arsenal FC

    Top Top Prices – Mid Table Team

  31. graham62

    Re: Sanchez and Ozil, put the ball in their court.

    Sanchez needs/wants to go. Providing reasonable offer comes along, let him go.

    Ozil should not be given increment in wages. If Arsenal cave in to his ridiculous demands, that’ll be it for me. So what if he goes to Utd (nothing new there).

    20m+ for Sanchez would offset the next two years of wasted dosh on Wenger, whilst anything received for Ozil would be better than nothing.

    Of course we all know these scenarios will never materialize, as the deluded rigime wouldn’t allow it.

  32. HighburyLegend

    “Hey guys, how is everyone doing?”

    Absolutely fine, like typical fans of a football club which is slowly but surely dying.

  33. TonyD

    Pierre
    Interesting take on Ramsey/Wales.

    Have only scanned his international press and what’s posted here.

    Makes a lot of sense what you say.

    I’ve always thought we were a wrong fit for Ozil. Just another panick buy for Wenger to please us.

    Goobergooner
    90+ minutes a game is all it’s worth at the moment. Try to savour the good moments like the Bridge performance and limit expectations so the disappointments don’t cut too deep.

    No point wasting good positive energy on Wenger et al.

    2 world cups to look forward to next year and the rugby in 2019. I’m sure Eddie Jones will give us a team to stir emotions where Southgate can’t.

    Any thoughts on the Watford game anyone?

  34. TonyD

    Graham62
    Totally agree but I’d go as far as only paying him on a game by game basis with bonuses for assists.

    I’d sell Sanchez in January. Put Welbeck in and when he’s injured blood Nelson for now.

  35. Leedsgunner

    Pierre

    Thanks for your considered reply @ 1610, great post by the way. It makes sense.

    I think we can both agree on this. Our club, with all its history resources and past ambitions deserve a better manager than Wenger.

    For a long time I’ve often wonder how this exact same group of players would do under a new manager — say Ancelotti or Thomas Tuchel.

    I hope we found out one day.

  36. graham62

    Those that mock and ridicule Paul Merson obviously know nothing about the guy.

    He played under one of the most astute tactical managers of the past fifty years, GG, winning two EPL trophies, the FA Cup, one League cup, as well ECWC. He also represented England 21 times. He is an Arsenal legend.

    Many of you, based on your age, will not recollect many(if any) of these things and only see Merson the pundit. He says it as he sees it, unlike some pundits/ ex-players, who have been mentally consumed by Wenger’s ideals.

    OK, so he only played for one season under Wenger, but that doesn’t mean he is ignorant to Wenger’s methods and philosophies. GG wins hands down as a coach and tactician and he knew how to get the best out of his players. Redknapp was also a better man manager, of that there is no doubt.

    The snobbery surrounding Wenger just beggars belief and what PM highlights on many occasions is only, whether you like it or not, the honest to gods truth.

  37. Pierre

    Leeds
    “For a long time I’ve often wonder how this exact same group of players would do under a new manager — say Ancelotti or Thomas Tuchel.”

    Sad to say we missed the boat with pep 3/4 years ago… I reckon we would be up there with real Madrid /bayern and Barcelona if he had made the move to us after he left Barcelona….

  38. Relieable Sauce

    Contract talks are going well. Players look happy… They could be sold in January.

    Sums this shower up really. They must be flabbergasted anyone is still listening to them, let alone trying to excuse their “incompetence”.

    Come on Watford!

  39. HillWood

    Pierre
    Sanchez may be an exception but there is no getting away from a very long list of utter dross Wenger has inflicted on us for over a decade

  40. Pierre

    Graham
    “Redknapp was also a better man manager(than Wenger), of that there is no doubt.”

    Just out of interest, who would you prefer to have as manager. Redknapp (who won one fa cup in 21 years) or Wenger (who won 3 league titles, 7 FA cups plus numerous runners up in 21 years. )

    And do you think it is better to be a great man manager (like redknapp or Pochettino) or someone who is purported to be a poor man manager (Wenger).

    Would be interesting if people regard being good man managers, , who win nothing, as more important than poor man managers who win numerous trophies.

  41. David Smith

    Wenger has his faults, they are legion, and have increased as he ages, but in terms of management, Redknapp is not fit to be mentioned in the same sentence as Wenger in terms of their achievements. Wengers biggest problem, since Dein left, there has been nobody to manage the manager, and now, Kroenke lets him run the club clearly unopposed.
    On another note, just read Online Gooner, they are speculating Conti is pissed off at Chelsea, and could be lured to Arsenal next summer, should Wenger not make the top four and fall on his sword. So an elite manager passed off with Roman Abramovich would jump ship,and work under Kroenke, right. Made me laugh anyway

  42. Carts

    Something tells me Ozil won’t sign. I find it hard to believe Ozil is prepared to hang around for another 4 years with all the scrutiny that comes with every competitive game he plays.

    If Ozil can get a hefty sign on fee and a wage in the region of, say, £150k-£200k he won’t hesitate to take it and bounce.

    If we finish outside the top 4 then there’s about 1% chance he signs an extension.

  43. WengerEagle

    Ozil’s 29 now, he’s at a weird stage in his career as he’s gone backwards these last couple of years, he’s not attracting any interest from even sideways clubs so you’d have to imagine that he takes any deal on the table we offer him or he end his prime years ala Sneijder in Turkey or some shit at a Fenerbahce/Besiktas.

    We wouldn’t miss him the way he’s performed over the years in high stakes games so I hope we rid of him, irritating little charlatan and a nothing player.

  44. Wallace

    graham62

    “OK, so he only played for one season under Wenger, but that doesn’t mean he is ignorant to Wenger’s methods and philosophies. GG wins hands down as a coach and tactician and he knew how to get the best out of his players.”

    GG was excellent with a certain kind of player. the hard-working, diligent, technically-limited player. he was pretty useless with players who possessed real ability. which was why watching his teams could be pretty hard work.

  45. Emiratesstroller

    Wallace

    Arsenal need to follow this season the GG philosophy of being diligent if they want to qualify for CL.

    In fact since the Liverpool debacle earlier this season we appear to be moving in that direction at least with our EPL team.

    In the last 4 games we have not conceded a goal. Whilst we have not scored as
    prolifically as Man City and United that is at least a move in right direction.

  46. Wallace

    ES

    I agree. would be delighted if Welbeck & Iwobi can play to a level that means we are not so heavily reliant on our two big names. certainly get the impression since the Liverpool game/close of the window that the rest of the squad are eager to prove we can do okay without them.

  47. Up 4 grabs now

    Morning,

    Would be ecstatic if we played like a George Graham side.
    Tight at the back win games by one or two goals.
    The odd game where we entertain and win big, but most of the time consistent and winning Three points.
    Just like how Maureen won the the first two titles at Chelsea.

    Win first, entertain second. That’s what gets you titles.

  48. Emiratesstroller

    Wallace/Up4grabsnow

    Successful teams in top division of English League are generally those who are defensively frugal.

    The League title is seldom won by clubs who concede more than 1 goal per game. It is highly unlikely that we are going to win League Title this season, but I do think that we can finish in top 4. However, that depends on maintaining a frugal defence.

    I do think that we should continue to play Sanchez, because at the end of the
    day he is a match winner. There was some evidence in last EPL game that he
    can play together with Lacazette.

    Whilst Ozil is a brilliant footballer he presents the same problem that we have
    when Walcott plays and that is a lack of work ethic. For that reason + his reluctance to sign a new contract I would bench him.

  49. graham62

    Wallace

    No disrespect but your assumptions describe most British footballers over the past 50 years-

    “diligent, hard working, technically- limited”

    So we can say of players like Ozil, for example, as being technically gifted but not diligent or hardworking? I tell you this, GG would have improved Ozil and a fair few others by giving them tactical aptitude and a competitive edge.

    Arsenal had many gifted players between 1986-96 but football was different back then. What I’ m highlighting is that GG was a far superior tactician and would, given the same resources and players at his disposal, have made Arsenal into a far more competitive outfit.

    Wenger doesn’t instil a “work ethic” into his players. Those that are born with it, like Sanchez, ultimately become frustrated and disallusioned. Wenger(thanks to Graham) had many players with this engrained work ethic already at the club in 1996 and it was only his abilities at prolonging their careers that enabled him to move the club forward.

    Unfortunately, he has been unable to follow this trend because he himself has little or no understanding of how to create a competitive playing environment.

  50. Wallace

    graham62

    “What I’ m highlighting is that GG was a far superior tactician and would, given the same resources and players at his disposal, have made Arsenal into a far more competitive outfit.”

    Wenger’s two Double-winning sides, the second one especially, played football at a level beyond GG’s wildest dreams. and you say ‘given the same resources and players’, but do you really think Bergkamp, Vieira, Anelka, Henry, Pires, Overmars, Cesc etc would have signed for GG?

  51. Pierre

    Up4grabs
    “Would be ecstatic if we played like a George Graham side.”

    Not sure about ecstatic but the George Graham team from 1988 through to 1992 were an exciting side to watch and were successful.
    After 1992 the team deteriorated year on year and the football was pretty dire, you only have to look at the attendance figures during that period. Average attendance 1991/92..30,000…….1992/93..24,000…….1993/94..30,000……..1994/95..35,000. So obviously the arsenal fans were not ecstatic about the style of football.. If Ian wright wasn’t in the side we would have consistently been a bottom half side.
    Yes we won cup winners cup, fa and league cup but that was just relying on a solid back 4/5 and hoofing the ball up to smithy to flick on for wright, Wimbledon style. I would never want arsenal to go back to that style of football.

  52. Pierre

    Graham62
    “Wenger doesn’t instil a “work ethic” into his players.”

    10 trophies and 10 runners up in 21 years, how did that happen with no “work ethic”.

    Wenger must be a genius in your eyes to achieve so much without any tactical nous, no work ethic, tippy tappy crab football, dodgy defence, woeful in the transfer window.
    How did he manage to achieve so much Graham with all these faults.

    Whereas, managers who you rate, Pochettino and redknapp have won one league cup between them during that same period.

  53. Emiratesstroller

    Wallace/Pierre/Graham 62

    First of all there was a common denominator between Graham’s teams and the early ones of Wenger. They had more or less the same defence.

    Second most of the players who played for the early Arsenal teams under Wenger were reasonably loyal to the club in the time that we were competitive and successful.

    A small number did leave, but mostly on the club’s terms. The change in culture started with Cole who left the club for money.

  54. Danny

    Superman’s horny as hell and he’s flying around Metropolis and he spots Wonder Woman sunbathing on the roof of the Justice League of America. Superman figures that he can swoop down and fuck Wonder Woman without her even realizing it because he’s Superman right? He’s faster than a speeding bullet. So he swoops down and fucks her and he’s gone in a flash! Wonder Woman gets up and says ‘what the hell was that?’ And the invisible man says, ‘I don’t know but my ass is killing me.'”

  55. HighburyLegend

    “10 trophies and 10 runners up in 21 years, how did that happen with no “work ethic”.

    We are pretty sure now that there was a huge part of luck lol
    + incredible players who were strong and mature enough to manage themselves, so the coach role was less important.

  56. loyika

    @ Stroller

    Its like people feel they need to be revisionist to make their points valid.

    First off, regardless of what Merson won under GG, 1 season under Arsene doesn’t give him much weight to comment on inner workings of an Arsene team more than players like Ray Parlour, Lee Dixon, Martin Keown and Tony Adams (regardless of whether any of those are for or against Arsene)

    Merse (Bless him) only talks from what he feels and believes should happen or be happening (rightly or wrongly) but no way is he talking from any serious known knowledge of the happenings in the club (even Stewart Robson has more inner knowledge that Merse on how Arsenal generally operates under Wenger)

    So i can’t take whatever he says seriously beyond the normal pundit tripe.

    Secondly, comparing GG and AW doesn’t hold water for me, as with all things (in time) we look back at the past with fondness as we try to navigate the present and look forward to the future.

    I started following Arsenal in 1989 and appreciate that time for what it was and GG for the manager he was (Legend) but his time was different to Arsene’s and in the same way when Arsene is gone we will eventually appreciate his own tenure like previous Arsenal Managers that came before him.

    Saying GG would have worked wonders with this team is just speculating as we can’t say that his tactics could be adopted perfectly.

    Did GG not manage Spurs? How many trophies did he win with that lot – 1 – why didn’t he use his brilliant tactics to make Spurs win the league in the two and a half years or so he spent with them?

    But guess what, he was sacked again for almost the same silly reason as he was with Arsenal .

    Graham did his time with Arsenal and so will Arsene. We can appreciate both tenures (with all the flaws attach to both Managers as they both aren’t/weren’t saints and had their short comings) without adding stuff which we clearly can’t defend objectively.

    Right now we as a club deserve better that what Arsene is offering and we can only but hope the future (with out Wenger) will move us on to this next level we keep hearing about from the club. However we all have to hope that Stan K makes a good appointment to take over from Arsene when his contract is up, or else we will end up like Bayern (who reappointed Heynckes to steady the ship? And who knows might offer him the job full time to bring in the new set of young players and phase out the Oldies. Thought a club like Bayern would never do such a thing?)

    We are not where we want to be as a club, but definitely not as bad as we sometimes make it seem.

  57. Pierre

    Legend
    Sometimes I wonder if it was luck in the Henry, Pires, Vieira era.. Did Wenger have better scouting network in operation(probably).. Since Grimandi took over as chief scout the quality of players have definitely detiorated … .. Was David Dein the mastermind (maybe).. Did it all just fall perfectly into place by chance (probably not)..
    All I know is that team was the pinnacle for any fan to watch.. I always tell my 2 boys that they should feel blessed that they grew up watching Henry, Bergkamp, Pires, Vieira, kanu, Lauren, Campbell, toure, cole, overmars, petit, anelka, the list goes on and on and without a doubt should have won 3 titles on the bounce and should have won THE European cup and the reason we didn’t probably is down to Wengers management skills at the top end.
    The ces, rvp, cliche, nasri, adebuyor side probably played the most pleasing to the eye football and never reached their peak mainly because the money men arrived. Spurs are in exactly the same position now, if they don’t win a trophy this season then that’s it for them. The difference is Pochettino will not stay loyal to spurs, he will walk without a doubt.

  58. Up 4 grabs now

    Pierre,

    I get your point about the attendance figures but two things to consider are, the premier league was in its infancy and not the attraction it is now.
    Also the northbank was being turned all seater as was the parts of the clock end so attendance was down considerably. As fans couldn’t get a ticket.

    The team deteriorated because we never built on the success from 87-92.
    Money was tight and also the emergence of man utd didn’t help.
    George went bargain shopping instead of trying for better quality players (sound familiar) and he struggled from there.
    To think when Bruce Ricoh came in we got David Platt for 5.5million& DB10 for 7.5 million both were huge money signings at the time.

  59. Pierre

    Stroller
    ” First of all there was a common denominator between Graham’s teams and the early ones of Wenger. They had more or less the same defence.”

    Agreed, but before Wenger arrived that defence looked shot to pieces. They were all 30+ and would probably have been replaced.
    It should be regarded as good management skills to retain these players so Wenger should and has received credit from adams, bould, Dixon, winterburn and keown for prolonging their careers at the top level.

  60. Up 4 grabs now

    David Dein leaving was the turning point for me.
    No dithering with transfers. Arsene gave him a list Dein went and got them.
    When it was time for deals to be sealed they met Arsene on deins yacht and the deal got done.

  61. Pierre

    Up 4grabs
    True regarding north bank .. Maybe Wenger has fallen into the same trap as George Graham in believing that he could carry on their success with bargain buys.

  62. Up 4 grabs now

    Pierre,

    I think George got shafted by the board a bit.
    We never were a club that was breaking the transfer record every year. But the money for rioch appeared over night for Platt &Db10.
    I think when the opportunity to move George on arrived, the board wasn’t disappointed to get rid

  63. Goobergooner

    Hahahahaha Danny!
    Gonsterous was thinking it but you brought it back haha. Gave me a good old fashioned chuckle.
    Cheers to Friday Gooners! Love you all

  64. Goobergooner

    “Secondly, comparing GG and AW doesn’t hold water for me, as with all things (in time) we look back at the past with fondness as we try to navigate the present and look forward to the future”

    Loyika, that has to be one of the deepest things ever said on this blog.
    I very much concur none the less

  65. Goobergooner

    Pierre,
    I definitely agree with you on the prolonging of careers.
    Wenger at the time came in and changed up that philosophy and brought that nutritional and physical aspect to a new level in the english game.
    But seriously, looking at the last ten years, 3 fa cups is the absolute minimum he should have achieved. This club has been under achieving for a decade.

  66. Goobergooner

    To be honest we have been an absolute joke of a “top quality” team.
    We complain about lack of funds but fuck me, getting away with our output for yearly wages is a disgrace.

  67. Emiratesstroller

    Pierre

    I am not criticising Wenger for revitalising careers of Adams, Bould, Winterburn and Dixon, but merely pointing out the common denominator.

    The first two transfers Wenger made when he became manager were Remi Garde and Patrick Vieira. The former was an experienced pair of hands, but
    hardly inspirational and Patrick who was probably apart from Henry the best
    piece of business that Arsenal has made in Wenger era.

  68. Goobergooner

    Stroller, you’re one of those blokes, from what I read, that has gone through it all as a fan of this club. Good to see you still passionate enough to at least give your view on here.

    Also Pierre, I know you about as well as I could know a bar of soap, but I do like hearing about your feelings towards old legendary Arsenal players and how your kids should be proud.
    Makes me feel great as a young man, without children myself, knowing the young gunners have the right idols.

  69. Wallace

    ES

    “and Patrick who was probably apart from Henry the best
    piece of business that Arsenal has made in Wenger era.”

    nah, Vieira tops it for me.

  70. Jim Lahey

    @Pierre –

    ‘All I know is that team was the pinnacle for any fan to watch.. I always tell my 2 boys that they should feel blessed that they grew up watching Henry, Bergkamp, Pires, Vieira, kanu, Lauren, Campbell, toure, cole, overmars, petit, anelka”

    I was born into supporting Arsenal as my dad is a huge Arsenal fan. I have to admit I somewhat missed the Graham era as I was too young to really understand. I was 9 years old when Wenger took over. So as I grew into the sport, the potential to win major trophies seemed like a God-given right for Arsenal. Must say that I certainly didn’t appreciate the early Wenger teams as much as I should have, that level of excellence was the expectation for me. As I look back now, I wish I could have see it all again and really appreciate the teams of the late 90s early 00s.

    I have always wondered if others who are in my situation are taking the current decline worse than older fans who have seen even worse times than what we are experiencing at the moment. For me, Arsenal are those teams I mentioned, so it is so difficult to watch what they have become over the last 10 years.

  71. Pierre

    Goobergooner
    “Also Pierre, I know you about as well as I could know a bar of soap, but I do like hearing about your feelings towards old legendary Arsenal players and how your kids should be proud.”

    My eldest son, George was born the year we won the league under George Graham.. Sad I know but there you go.

    I can’t really see anyone naming their kids after ARSEne can you…

  72. Paulinho

    “It should be regarded as good management skills to retain these players so Wenger should and has received credit from adams, bould, Dixon, winterburn and keown for prolonging their careers at the top level.”

    Because they basically managed for him in many respects. Made sure there were no cliques in the dressing room and the foreign lads like Petit began to ‘get it’. Parlour said in the first few weeks and months Petit was a distant figure, and looked out of place, and it was the ‘banter’ of the english lads that softened him – and others- and led to this unique environment and fusion between the two cultures. Without the Graham back four to help settle them in, those Wenger signings were all too introspective and studious to survive the the mid-nineties premiership, and things would’ve gone pear-shaped very quickly.

    It was freakish timing for Wenger to come in when he did, with those characters and the quality they had, and although it was mutually beneficial, it’s Wenger that undoubtedly benefited the most. He’s completely made a career off them,and would’ve gone back to Japan sharpish with a tail between his legs without them.

  73. Emiratesstroller

    Interestingly George Graham was an entirely different player to the teams that he managed.

    “Gorgeous” George was a technically flamboyant footballer when he played for Arsenal and an Inside Forward.

    This contrasted to the rather dour and defensive football, which Arsenal played when he was Manager.

    My guess is that had George Graham played for Arsenal in the Wenger era he
    would have been a fan of his.

    I think that Merson is also typical of the era in which he played. A very good footballer, but no brain above the waist and thick as two planks. He falls within
    the same category as Alan Ball and Kenny Sansom.

  74. loyika

    @ Paulinho

    You can practically say that of 90% of Managers innit.

    Would Pep have been a success if he had not inherited most of Rijkaard’s team and met a “Golden Generation” of players coming through from La Masia? Jose Maureen benefited from the team Claudio left at Chelsea and just gave them that final edge that made them Champions.

    Same way Claudio did with that Leicester team (who were already drilled by Nigel Pearson) by giving them the final piece in pushing them to believe in something that was frankly impossible to fathom or predict. So in a way, all Managers are lucky in their own way right? However i don’t really see it as luck per say.

    Saying Arsene was lucky doesn’t do justice to the fact that he just came in and saw the need to preserve what was already on ground, which he felt would help him and the future players settle down (as he was also trying to learn the English League himself)

    He (like some Managers do) could have come in with a broom and swept away the Old Guard (and no one would have stopped him) but he was wise enough to see that some still had it in them to push ahead and get back their winning mentality.

    As you said it was mutually beneficial to all (and the club and supporters as well) I don’t attribute that to Luck, it was just a New Manager coming in and taking time to blend what he met with what he wanted to achieve and with the up and coming talents from France and Africa, he was able to build what he had as a template culminating in the “Invincibles” (which was his creation alone).

    The travesty with Arsene is the fact that they were not able to win back to back titles and also not one European trophy (and that is where his flaws as a Manager clearly gets exposed).

    Funny enough, i feel if we had won in Paris on that fateful evening in 2006, Arsene would have walked a long time ago (probably giving him to much of a benefit of doubt here)

    However, all things are based one’s perspective of the situation.

  75. Paulinho

    Loyika – Disagree.

    Wenger’s biggest weakness was the greatest strength of the George Graham-bred players.

    All managers inherit favourable or unfavourable conditions, but nowhere near to the same extent as Wenger at Arsenal.

  76. loyika

    So the “Invincibles” was down to GG as well?

    Pep was not fortunate to get that base of players to launch his career at Barca?

    Answer this, do you think anyone could have stopped Arsene if he wanted to clear house as soon as he came in (whether he would have lasted or not if he did that is up for debate)

    So basically he was lucky or stumbled on the decision to keep the back four and work with them to extent thier careers making them Champions again?

    Well lets just agree to disagree.

    Whether we feel he was lucky or not, his history with the club is his history.

  77. Ughelligunner

    Peire, Why do you feel pep would have changed or improved Arsenal players? No Arsenal player has left the club to become a player better than when he played under wenger. for what is worth, pep has shown nothing of note in man city that he can improve players rather he bin the average and young players and bought in every department. I dont think he would have that much cash if he was managing Arsenal. Pep and Mourhino are just the same type of managers to me. Great Players makes the tactics easy on the eyes. Klopp Would like to spend 200m on his defence and his goal kepper dont you think so?

  78. loyika

    @ Red

    Thats season they were the best side in the country by a mile (and one of the best in Europe) The fact they didn’t win more than the EPL is down to the roll of the dice and the Manager not getting them to fulfil their potential, like say Pep got his Barca team to win a clean sweep of trophies, same as Heynckes at Baryern or SAF with his 1999 team and the back to back trophies.

    Regardless, they were a joy to watch (especially as an Arsenal fan)

  79. Pierre

    Ughelligunner
    “, Why do you feel pep would have changed or improved Arsenal players? No Arsenal player has left the club to become a player better than when he played under wenger”

    Its nothing to do with changing or improving players that were already at the club, it’s more to do with who pep would bring in to improve the side. He would have spot where our weaknesses are and acted. Something that Wenger has failed to amend.

    He has started to do that at city now by bringing in top class full/wing backs and signed superb young players in Jesus and Sane. Of course you need money to bring in class Players but I believe if he had come to the Arsenal he would have convinced the owners to spend big to achieve success.

  80. Redtruth

    Pierre
    “Not sure about ecstatic but the George Graham team from 1988 through to 1992 were an exciting side to watch and were successful.
    After 1992 the team deteriorated year on year and the football was pretty dire, you only have to look at the attendance figures during that period. Average attendance 1991/92..30,000…….1992/93..24,000…….1993/94..30,000……..1994/95..35,000.”

    Highbury capacity was 38.000 and Pierre (AKB’s) also neglected to mention the North Bank Mural which reduced the capacitiy by 10.000 in 1992/93 season..

    After 1992 Arsenal went on to become the first club to achieve a Domestic Cup Double and also experienced glory in Europe in 1994.

  81. Redtruth

    loyika

    Too many draws in the Invincible season shows it wasn’t the champagne football you like to portray.

    The fact is if Chelsea had done the Double over Arsenal they would have been Champions in Abramovich’s first season in charge.

  82. Redtruth

    We couldn’t even break the 100 points barrier in the unbeaten season.
    Like i said great feat but not a great team.

    Just like Celtic who managed to go the entire season unbeaten in all domestic competitions. A great feat but not a great team.

  83. loyika

    If Chelsea had done the double? If Henry had taken his chance against Barca? If Maradona had not used his hands against England? If Ghana had slotted their pen away against Uraguay?

    Not trying to convince you Red (God forbid the thought) We all know how you feel about that team, so you ain’t saying anything new on that front.

    I accept that there were draws, but those games (draws) were not boring games (far from it) Your decision/choice to not have any affinity with that team.

  84. loyika

    @ Red

    Keep telling yourself that mate.

    Not getting into a further back and forth with you on the 2003/04 team. You say; great feat, I say great team (that season) in England.

    In the end we both hold on to our views.

  85. Emiratesstroller

    Pierre

    The comparison between Merson, Ball and Sansom was ‘the grey matter’ or
    lack of it.

    I was told the story by someone at the top of the club several years ago that in the era “pre agents” contract negotiations at Arsenal were conducted between the Club Secretary and the Players.

    In the case of both Ball and Sansom there was contract impasse, because neither had the intelligence to work out what the financial offer being made to them or the nous to understand the difference between wages and income
    which included bonuses etc.