Arsene Wenger dances around what will really make Ozil and Sanchez stay

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CaptureINSTAT

Well, it’s f*cking cold in Alaska, let me tell you that for free. Couldn’t get into the car for 10minutes because the doors and the boot were iced in.

Arsene Wenger left my hands and toes numb when I read his predictable press conference. He’s taking Alexis to Basel just in case PSG are turned over by team so poor they still consider the magic sponge part of the backroom team.

I don’t mean to be a moaner here, but let’s be real, Arsenal against a top team in the CL are very unlikely to win over two legs unless we do something drastically different this season. 1st or 2nd has marginal consequences for where we finish, we’ve not managed win out against the Barcelona’s or the Bayern’s which some say is fair (I don’t because you should be able to come up with at least a fluke every now and then), but we’re also capable of dropping out against a struggling Monaco.

I really don’t understand why Wenger doesn’t leave Alexis at home. Well, unless he plans to rest him against Stoke so he’s explosive against Everton? Then I’d be fine with his inclusion. I still don’t understand why we need to throttle him every game. The team needs to at least have a go at playing without him so we’re not full on useless if he picks up an injury, which becomes ever more likely the more we continue to persevere with him every game.

The squad is the same as it was at the weekend (if I’m reading Wenger’s comments correctly), bar Coquelin who is suspended. When I wrote the other day that this December would be decided on decisions like who he takes to Basel, this is exactly what I thought he’d do. He can’t resist. Last time took a mega squad to a terrible team away, we lost Santi Cazorla for the rest of his career. Seems a massive risk for a game he could easily rotate in the league cup disappointments who owe us a performance. Also disappointed to see Ozil heading out there a player we know dips bigly in the second half of the season (is it ok to use Trumpism’s?).

Also, what’s up with Perez. Is he a flop or what?

Talking of our star players, Wenger thinks Ozil and Sanchez care about things other than cash money.

“I believe personally, and maybe I am a bit naive, that it’s more about getting to meet the player’s needs. That’s more about the way the club has values, the way the club has ambition, the way the club respects the players.

“So I think, for me, that is more important nowadays and an important ingredient for every player to consider. The money is good everywhere for everybody.

“You know, nowadays, you negotiate with the agents more than with the player. We are in negotiations, yes. The players [Sánchez and Mesut Özil] are 18 months away from the end of their contracts, so it’s normal to be talking. But the players always come in at the end, when it’s a renewal, because with the first contract you need the players present. But after that, when you renew, 90% of the contracts are negotiated with the agents.”

DAMN STRAIGHT THEY DO

They care about that silverware. Those boys are already rich. More money is keeping up with the Jones’s, and it’s totally acceptable for both of them to think they should earn more money than Adebayor and Nasri. But the key to them staying for me, would be that they’re both able to compete for the top honours in Europe.

Do they think they can achieve that under Arsene Wenger? Maybe not. Which is a problem for two players about to hit their prime. I mean, let’s be real here, Sanchez has played under Pep G, Ozil has played under Mourinho in the good times, they both fully understand where the disparity is… so what do the club do to ensure the two are convinced the future is red and white?

If Wenger is leaving, does Ivan give them a sneak peak at his list of replacements? You’d have to doubt that… but he can’t let them leave before the new manager has had the chance to give them the once over.

I also love that Wenger thinks it’s about values. Like Sanchez is sitting there, casually dabbing lipstick on his dog, as he mulls over the unsung details of the club …

‘Geez, I admire the fact that Arsenal sent Martin Keown to open that pitch for Syrian refugees. I mean, imagine if Vladimir Putin was as deft at dealing with Aleppo as Ivan Gazidis is with the guy who asks about the price of Bovril at the AGM. Wouldn’t the world be a beautiful place? Fuck yeah it would. Where’s that contract, I’m gonna sign whatever the number.’

Values when your life is dogs and football is about having money to treat your dogs well and trophies to make your football seem purposeful.

That’s why I’m very worried about Sanchez becoming one of the best strikers in the world right now. That’s why I’m worried about rumours of Pep flirting with him. That’s why I fear the links to Juventus and Bayern. My world is caving in, SOMEONE MAKE IT STOP.

Right, enjoy the game tonight, pray for a massive rotation, and pray for the hamstrings of all our best players. We have some super important games coming up, this one is the least of our worries…

SEE YOU IN THE COMMENTS!

 

494 Responses to “Arsene Wenger dances around what will really make Ozil and Sanchez stay”

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  1. Davey

    Almost feel it was a pity we drew with PSG as they were far the better team and beating us would have meant a total dead rubber tonight then resting players a must.

  2. Rambo Ramsey

    The way Arsenal are run/ the policies they entail really makes you faceplam sometimes. All this bs about how paying one or two players significantly more than others would lead to discord..what World are these people living in I wonder.

    I mean, if dross like Wilshere et al find a problem in accepting that they are half as important to the club as Sanchez, then they should be told to fuck off, let them leave in search of other clubs that would pay them 90-100k per week.

    Can’t pay Sanchez 200+ thousand but can spunk 70-90k on jokers like Welbeck and Debuchy whose contribution to the club comes to about the square root of fuck all.

  3. reality check

    Look at Perez highlight reel. Doesn’t he look like a Wenger type Sanchez replacement.

    The type of player that if Wenger was going to replace Sanchez… It would be with a Perez?

    I’m reaching right?

  4. reality check

    Wallace December 6, 2016 09:19:26
    reality checkWenger’s been at the top of the game for 20+yrs now, so you’d expect him to be making very good money. I think it does make for a slightly strange situation if some of the players are earning more than the guy who manages them, but that’s just football. and also, there may well be a clause in Wenger’s contract whereby his salary will automatically be adjusted to match whatever the best paid player at the club is earning. but I think it’s ludicrous to suggest we won’t pay Alexis or Ozil more than 163k per week because that’s what Wenger earns.

    We won’t pay them more than whatever Wenger earns. We need Wenger to stay sign a new deal with increased wages in order for our top players to do the same or…. Wenger needs to go. Now. So that the philosophy of the manager doesn’t impact on negotiations with our top players.

    Yes Wenger deserves everything he gets. I have no issue with that. My problem is when the manager involves himself in other people’s earning potential. They all work for AFC. Wenger is not Ozils employer. The Manager and the WC stars are just as important as each other. Football is not like a normal bussiness.

  5. Louis Almeida

    Nice interview with Mesut in The Times:

    I was intensely curious to meet Mesut Özil. I have always enjoyed his expansive conception of the game, the way he finds pockets of space, the joy that he finds in orchestrating the play. At Arsenal he has made 34 assists in 97 appearances, which translates to 0.35 assists a game, the joint-highest in Premier League history alongside Eric Cantona.

    “This is what I love about football,” he says when we meet at the Quintin Kynaston school in north London. “I grew up like that. Even as a youngster playing against my older brother and his friends, I was never selfish. I didn’t want to be in focus. Even if people wanted to put me in the spotlight, I didn’t want it. I am not jealous if people are more successful than me. My passion on the pitch is to be successful not as an individual, but as a team. Often, it is my contribution that decides the game.” I mention Andrés Iniesta, another player whose covert contribution is such a joy to watch. Özil is nodding. “Iniesta is a big player. I like how he is playing, but my real idol was Zinedine Zidane,” he says. “He was not selfish. He scored, but he also made assists. He was a leader. I also admire Xavi. Barcelona was huge because of him, his calm with the ball. He was a leader, he was controlling everything. Everyone speaks about [Lionel] Messi, but if you look at the [bigger picture], it was Xavi who made the whole team work. He made Messi better. And the other players, too.”

    Özil is in the school as part of the Laureus-supported Urban Stars programme. His visit was a total surprise to the students, and he spent time chatting to four youngsters, reflecting upon his background, growing up in Germany. He also took time out on the pitch, having a kickabout with them and offering advice about the importance of resilience.

    “I can feel what they are going through,” he says. “At the end of the day, I said to them, ‘guys, I had a similar life to you. You have to go for it, believe in yourselves, always have fun. You will have bad times, difficult times, but you can get there if you really go for it . . .’ Success in life is about passion and self-belief . . . You cannot make it unless you have these ingredients.”

    His upbringing was one of almost constant struggle. “My mum was a cleaner and my dad was a coal miner,” he says. “My grandfather came to Germany from the mining region in Turkey. Many came from that area to places like Düsseldorf and Essen to find work. There were just three rooms in our house: two bedrooms and a living room. I slept in a room with my brother. We had one bed, but they would put a mattress on the floor for me to sleep. My two sisters shared the same bedroom with my father and mother.

    “Money was scarce. I had just one pair of football boots, which I had to keep for two or three years. We played on a pitch with small stones and after two or three days the boots would be broken. I had to fix them with tape. In winter, my feet would be freezing. It was a difficult time, because I would go to matches, and see children with new boots, and I was embarrassed to take mine out. But you can have the best boots, but that doesn’t make you the best on the pitch . . . I was the best player. That gave me confidence.” Were you teased because of your poor background? “Not to my face, but the players and parents of the other team, you could hear the joking,” he says. “They had nice brands, the best boots, but there is nothing you can do about it. In my life, maybe I don’t have a lot of money, but I always had my family, always supporting me, so in this way I was very lucky. Sometimes I had to miss matches because we didn’t have a car. But my parents believed in me. They always said: ‘go for it’.”

    Özil mentions his parents frequently. He is not just grateful to them for their support, but also the values they surrounded him with. I ask about life as the grandson of an immigrant. “It was of course difficult because I lived in an area where most of the people were from Lebanon, Turkey and places like that,” he says. “It was difficult to be in contact with the [native] German people. The school was 95 per cent immigrant, so it meant that you were always one step behind with language. We spoke Turkish at home and I spoke Turkish with my friends. I only spoke German with the teachers.”

    Did you in any way feel excluded? “I had different experiences,” he says. “Some German people wanted to be with other Germans, but some were very open. But I like to see the positives in life. I don’t care about racism. If you ask the other people in my school, they will say that I always treated people with respect. If someone is racist, maybe that is because of the influence of their parents or background. If you show them respect, you make them better people . . . You show them the right way.”

    Today Özil is a World Cup winner and has amassed a sizeable fortune. I ask how difficult it is for youngsters who make it to the top in football to cope emotionally with the transformation in material circumstances. “Some people are getting crazy, going to nightclubs, having fun, you have this opportunity if you have money,” he says. “But my parents controlled it. If I went to spend lots of money, they said, ‘hey, hey, what are you doing?’ You have to learn to deal with money . . . But it helps if you have a strong family.” Religion is also clearly important. “I pray and my team-mates know that they cannot talk to me during this brief period,” he said recently. To me, he says: “It’s a big thing. You grow up with that, and you believe in that . . . It is a part of who you are.” This year, he performed a pilgrimage to Mecca.

    At a question and answer session with the youngsters, Özil was grilled on topics such as handling the media, but perhaps the most noteworthy exchange was on whether he experiences fear as a player.

    “On the pitch, I never have fear. Even if the guy is too big or too strong or wants to kick me out, or if I play badly, I never feel the fear,” he says. “What I feel on the pitch is fun, because if you don’t have fun and don’t believe in yourself, you can’t give everything. If something goes wrong, that is what makes you stronger. You learn and you go for it.”

    Özil is also emphatic on the question of a winter break for the Premier League. “I think we need one,” he says. “I had my big injury here, the first time in my life, because as a soccer player, you need rest. You need to do something else, even in your mind. Sometimes you want to take off, take time with your family, to have more energy. . . But here, if you play all year, you feel your body getting tired, especially in winter.” He said that this was a major disadvantage for English teams in the Champions League, especially as it gets to the the knockout stage.

    At the age of 28, Özil has won an impressive array of trophies, including La Liga and the Copa del Rey with Real Madrid, the FA Cup twice with Arsenal and, of course, the World Cup with Germany, but one gets the sense there is more to come.

    He is a joy to watch, a player who excels with subtlety and intelligence, and offers a signpost of how the game should be coached in this country. “I still enjoy football, and have that passion,” he says. “That is what matters most.”

  6. reality check

    GoonererisDecember 6, 2016 09:32:09

    Reality check:
    From everything we’ve heard and read over the years. Wouldn’t you agree, this list is pretty close to what would be the truth.So, if that is correct, why persist with this line that Theo is on £140k a week? He is not, but it makes the point for you, so you go ahead anyway, to make him look the more undeserving. Our longest serving player, leaving aside what you may think of his output…

    Ok fine. Shave off 10 or 20 grand here or there. As you like, ill defer to your judgement. I believe theo is on between 100-140k pw. You choose which one hes closer to. But you have to admit.. Its somewhere close to those numbers.

    I wasn’t stating exact figuers. My god man! How much money do you think these guys make. £9ph, shift and a half on weekends. WAKE UP!

    Most of the senior players earn 50K pw and up. You tell me. How much theo earns. It doesn’t change the fact that we have a wage structure and 200 or 250 or 290 breaks that wage structure.

    You believe the club want the best for AFC. Ok, so paying Sanchez 250k pw to keep him would be good for AFC right? You agree, that the club should pay Ozil and Sanchez 200k pw+?

  7. mysticleaves

    reality check

    your reply to wallace concerning Wenger and his interference on player wages is flipping awesome!!!

  8. mysticleaves

    “On the pitch, I never have fear.”

    really Mesut? what do you feel when we clearly see you fail to contest a 50-50? or turn your back on an air challenge?

  9. Wallace

    reality check

    “Yes Wenger deserves everything he gets. I have no issue with that. My problem is when the manager involves himself in other people’s earning potential.”

    everything I’ve ever read about Wenger and player salaries suggests he’s always been supportive, pushing for good deals for them. I think the perception was that we were a very miserly club before he came along.

  10. Boyd

    You sound like you got beef with Wenger mate. Arsenal were an average club before Wenger came and today Arsenal are a Top 5 team in the world. It is ok to criticise a Manager but to think that Wenger is the reason why Sanchex and Ozil wont extend their contracts is bizarre to say the least. In fact Wenger is the reason why both Sanchez and Ozil came to Arsenal instead of going to Liverfools or Manure.

    Ozil and Sanchez have 18 months left, there is enough time there to make them commit. They both look very happy in training and during game time, so what’s the panic button for?

    Your job is to be a super fan, not a super critic or wanna be coach. if you don’t like the state of the Arsenal right now, you can jump the ship and try the tottering spuds.

    As for us true Gunners, its Wengerball all the way, and both Sanchez and Ozil like the Wengerball!!

    GOONER FORWARD EVER!

  11. Wallace

    “I will make a decision on Tuesday as to who will start but, overall, the best way when a guy is in good success and confidence [is to continue picking him]. It’s more dangerous to stop him than keep him going. It is always difficult to work out what is physical and what is mental [in terms of fatigue], and predicting who is tired and who is not can be hard. So I have kept them all together as a group. We have a squad that is united.

    “All the players at the top want to play, and are keen to play. [Sánchez] is a bit more extroverted in how he shows it, but you do not get to his level if you don’t have a good passion to play the game. He just shows it in a different way….We’ll see: PSG are favourites to beat Ludogorets at home and win the group, but we can assess that scoreline at half-time and see where we go.”

  12. Igbo Amadi-Obi

    Mr. Wenger admits that negotiations for contract extension happen more with agents than players, yet he philosophizes about values and respect as being more important than money.

    How does values and respect matter to an agent who is motivated by commissions?

  13. Igbo Amadi-Obi

    In any case, I expect us to have offered all there is by way of values and respect and all those intangible things that Mr. Wenger loves to dwell on. We couldn’t be holding back on any of that. So why are they not signing the contract? Money?

  14. Cesc Appeal

    Rambo

    Completely agree.

    I find this whole idea of ‘if we pay Sanchez X then what happens when Wilshere wants a new deal or Oxlade, they will ask for massive wages’ very strange, its just more excuses and deflection.

    If we pay Sanchez £250 000 a week and then Oxlade or Wilshere walk through the door and ask for £180 000 a week to keep pace with him, you tell them to f**k off and enjoy earning £70 000 a week at Bournemouth or Watford or wherever.

    You only need to worry abut your indispensable players, those are Sanchez and Kozz, Bellerin has the potential to be but is not yet and has just signed up to a big fat deal anyway.

    The rest of the squad are replaceable, and if you call their bluff on wanting to leave and think many of them would sit back down again, players like Wilshere and Oxlade, Gibbs, Ramsey etc know how good they have it at Arsenal.

    Fingers crossed we should have a new manager next season anyway, but it would be a pretty shitty thing to do to f**k up the Sanchez situation so badly that the new manager loses his best player before he’s even in the job.

    Gazidis should be negotiating the Sanchez deal, Wenger should not be touching it, he’s not here next year (please, please, please) and so Gazidis should be doing everything in his power to keep the club’s best player.

  15. Dissenter

    Sometimes I wish someone would slap Wenger in the mouth without a feather. It’s almost like he’s invented the perfect amalgam of bullying and snake oil.
    He’s been around agents for long and knows that the good ones would have done due diligence before proceeding to start contract negotiations.
    A good agent knows
    *what Arsenal have in the bank currently.
    *what Arsenal should have in the bank in four years time
    *what Arsenal pays lesser players
    *what comparable opposition pay comparable players s like Aguero
    *what the opposition are prepared to offer.
    It’s all about the f** king money.

    Gawd I can’t st and Wenger at times.He’s such idealistic prick.
    Arsenal has to pay a 5-10% surcharge to these world class players because their chances of winning big trophies are dimmer under Wenger. The same player will be willing to take a pay cut to move to Real or Juventus because they have to share the purse with other elite players

  16. Dissenter

    Cesc,
    “Gazidis should be negotiating the Sanchez deal, Wenger should not be touching it, he’s not here next year (please, please, please) and so Gazidis should be doing everything in his power to keep the club’s best player”

    What makes you think Gazidis has a freaking clue how to negotiate with a top player.
    I believe Gazidis and many others in the club are just living off Wenger’s antiquated approaches.
    Gazidis is probably wondering if there’s a cheaper way to getting fourth place.

  17. Leedsgunner

    https://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/dec/05/alexis-sanchez-arsenal-new-contract-money-arsene-wenger

    “Arsène Wenger believes Arsenal’s hopes of securing Alexis Sánchez to a new long‑term contract will depend more upon convincing the forward of the “values” and ambition of the club than the financial package on the table.”

    Didn’t he say exactly the same thing when we were faced with Cesc, Nasri and RvP? How did those negotiations turn out?

    Everybody and their dog know we have the money to pay top dollar, in fact, just after the season ticket renewal deadline — the club trumpets how much money we have sitting in the bank.

    Remember the following from November?

    “The Gunners have revealed they have a cash balance of £226.5million – which is more than the total balances of Barcelona, Bayern Munich AND Real Madrid combined.”

    Want to save money?

    1. Jettison the likes of Debuchy and Sanogo sharpish.

    2. I personally would give Jenkinson more time but if he’s fallen so down the pecking order that he’s behind Gabriel… sell him. The same with Szczesney… yes we are not paying his wages season but if he has no future with the Arsenal… sell him and put his sale funds toward Özil and Sanchez’s wages.

    3. Stop paying top wages to inconsistent players like Theo, Ramsey and Walcott… and start paying them for what they actually produce on the pitch.

    4. Start paying top wages to our top performers like Kos, Sanchez and Özil because of the goals and assists on the pitch.

    5. Reform our training so that our players stop pick up so many injuries during training.

    6. Reform our rehab structure so that we get our stars back from injuries quicker.

    7. Let Gazidas negotiate contracts without Wenger dictating value. He is behind the times and doesn’t understand market forces.

    His job is to dictate football matters and not direct the financial welfare of the club. Wenger’s indecisiveness costs us money because negotiations are unneccesarily dragged on… until we are forced by circumstances.

    The Mustafi deal is a perfect example — had we moved quickly and boldly we would have probably acquired him for at least £5m if not £10m cheaper. By the time we were ready to move ahead with the deal the injuries to Mertesacker and Gabriel meant we were with our backs to the wall.

    We should have dealt with the Mustafi transaction like we handled the Holding deal… quietly and fast.

    It’s not Wenger’s money… but the club’s.

  18. Wallace

    Dissenter

    “A good agent knows
    ….
    It’s all about the f** king money.”

    a good agent has his client’s best interests in mind. like Wenger says, at the very top level good money is a given. Utd are the best paying club in the world. are all the world’s best players lining up to join them?

  19. Wallace

    Leeds

    “Reform our training so that our players stop pick up so many injuries during training.”

    struggling to recall any player since Jack that we’ve lost to an injury picked up in training.

  20. Leedsgunner

    Wallace

    I’m not just talking about this season. I’m looking at the bigger picture. Diaby, TR7 and Tommy V used to pick up training injuries all the time.

  21. gambon

    Fully expect us to lose Sanchez, due to us always being a few years behind the times.

    Ridiculous that you would not pay Sanchez what he’s worth in order to placate poor performers.

    Its like refusing to pay a world class surgeon £250k pa because the nurses are only on £20k pw and may ask for more.

    Dont care too much about Ozil. He’s nothing special and I would rather see us change system.

  22. Leedsgunner

    ““I believe personally, and maybe I am a bit naive, that it’s more about getting to meet the player’s needs. That’s more about the way the club has values, the way the club has ambition, the way the club respects the players.”

    Wenger is a hypocrite. If it’s not all about the money, why does he insist on being the highest paid employee at the club (as it has been reported before?)

    One of the main ways a club truly respects its star players is to pay them what they are worth.

    Ironically because Wenger has overpaid younger players who probably haven’t deserved it (in order to buy their loyalty) , he has encouraged complacency and mediocrity.

    He has no flexibility to truly reward outstanding performers like Sanchez and Özil… this salary structure is a financial straitjacket of Wenger’s own making. He has no one else except himself to blame.

  23. Rambo Ramsey

    Wallace, except good money is not a given at our club….well, not for those who actually deserve it. The substandard players have it great though.

    Nasri, van Persie moved to rival clubs and doubled their salaries. You are only kidding with yourself if you don’t think money is a big deal.

    Just compare what we pay our top level players with what players of similar caliber get at the other big clubs. Sanchez right now is probably the best player in the league, why would you expect him to come to terms with Arsenal’s stupid ‘club values’ when the likes of Aguero, Hazard are earning much more?

  24. Wallace

    gambon

    “Ridiculous that you would not pay Sanchez what he’s worth in order to placate poor performers.”

    I think it was someone on le grove first floated this idea. thought it was too stupid to be worth commenting on at the time.

  25. Alexanderhenry

    Pedro

    ‘Do they think they can achieve that under Arsene Wenger? Maybe not. Which is a problem for two players about to hit their prime. I mean, let’s be real here, Sanchez has played under Pep G, Ozil has played under Mourinho in the good times, they both fully understand where the disparity is… so what do the club do to ensure the two are convinced the future is red and white?’

    By stating that they ‘both fully understand where the disparity is’, you’re suggesting that they both think wenger is a poor manager.
    This makes no sense whatsoever. If they thought that, why did they come to arsenal?
    It’s pure conjecture on your part of course and there is no evidence whatsoever that they think this . Also, citing the examples of guardiola and mourihno as a basis for your alledged ‘disparity’ theory doesn’t hold up considering the fact that arsenal are currently doing better than both man utd and man city despite the fact that their squads cost a lot more than ours and both managers spent considerably more than wenger this summer.

    They are both top players and the gossip surrounding their contracts is to be expected.

  26. Cesc Appeal

    Gambon

    We always seem to be a step behind everyone else, talking big about ambition but living a few years behind the current ambitious clubs.

    It is all set up nicely, Sanchez ends up at City or PSG or Munich or wherever on £200 000 – 250 000 a week, all the usual suspects bleat about it not being fair we cannot compete with that (because we didn’t, not because we couldn’t) and that obviously we cannot expect anything then as we’re rebuilding again. And around and around we go.

    This is why it is so important to get rid of Wenger this season, we cannot keep having this, his values are not Arsenal’s values, Arsenal’s values are his values and they are f*****g pathetic and juvenile, always reminds me of what a dumb person would consider smart and revolutionary.

    It is amazing because if we asked ‘are you worth £160 000 a week, Wenger?’ He would likely reply with UCL qualification, consistency and the money that brings in, so in actuality, the entire operation at Arsenal is about money, the ‘values’ of the club are all about money and profit, that is why Wenger keeps his job, ditto Gazidis.

    What they actually want to say, is that they are necessarily convinced they need £500 000 a week worth of talent in Sanchez and Ozil to get to fourth every year, can probably do it for a lot less, sort of like net gains.

  27. Dissenter

    Alexis is actually the perfect player to build your team around.
    The relentless work rate, world class footballing quality and infectious love of the game. He plays with a smile on his face and won’t stop running.

    What more could you want in a player?

    Arsene is just a misguided prick.
    Why doesn’t he keep his mouth shut and let negotiations proceed privately?

    The 8.5 million p.a manager who insists on traveling to UEFA conferences on Easyjet.

  28. Cesc Appeal

    Big question outside of the convenient money debate for Wenger is, does Sanchez believe he can be successful at Arsenal?

    Most fans on here spent the last couple of days bashing Shearer and calling Sanchez world class, some even stated he’s a word class ST, so will he achieve world class results under Wenger?

    That is a more difficult question for his supporters to answer.

  29. Dissenter

    Does anyone believe that Pep didn’t make a social ” hello” call to Alexis on Saturday.

    Pep did the same to Claudio Bravo last year and vehemently do mid that story as well.

  30. Wallace

    Rambo

    “Wallace, except good money is not a given at our club….well, not for those who actually deserve it. The substandard players have it great though. ”

    when we signed them the contracts for Ozil & Alexis were good ones. that was 3yrs ago. I’m sure the new deals will be north of 200k and will put them amongst the top 10 earners in the PL.

  31. Bamford10

    I love that Alexander is still trying to defend the notion that Arsene Wenger is a top manager. This notion was killed, dead and buried here YEARS AGO.

  32. Bamford10

    Desirable starting XIs for Basel? I’d love for Wenger to use matches like this to build form in some of the peripherals. Something like the below would be nice:

    ____________Ospina
    Paulinho_Mustafi_Holding_Gibbs
    _______Elneny___Xhaka
    ___________Ramsey
    Walcott_____Lucas_______Oxlade

    Bring on Giroud with 30 minutes to go.

  33. Dissenter

    If money was tight I would actually sell one low-level player to top up the Alexis deal.

    Ozil????
    Honestly I’m not so sure he’s a 275k weekly player.
    200k weekly? Absolutely.

  34. Bamford10

    Or—

    ____________Ospina
    Paulinho_Mustafi_Holding_Gibbs
    _______Elneny___Xhaka
    ___________Ramsey
    Walcott_____Lucas________Iwobi

    or—

    ____________Ospina
    Paulinho_Mustafi_Holding_Gibbs
    _______Elneny___Xhaka
    ___________Ramsey
    Walcott_____Iwobi_______Oxlade

  35. Rambo Ramsey

    Wallace, they are currently on 140k, north of 200k would mean a 50% hike. I wish I knew where you get this confidence in the club from, can’t be based on what we’ve seen in the past.

  36. Dissenter

    Alexis should be hanging around his dogs today…same for Ozil.

    Wenger the hypocrite unfairly slammed the Chilean FA last month yet he’s the one flogging Sanchez until he breaks down.

    We are pretty much second in the group already.

  37. gambon

    I think Wenger is also being massively disingenuous with his comments about money not being so important.

    This is a guy who has held the club over a barrell before and got himself pay packets way over his market value.

    If money isnt so important, why isnt Wenger taking a pay cut to £6m pa?

    He said it himself, money isnt important.

    Its not true, of course money is important.

    Lets say Arsenal are opening with offers of £180k pw for 3 years (typical Arsenal), and Sanchez wants £250k pw for 4 years (which would probably be his market value).

    The difference between these figures is £23m.

    After 45% tax thats £12.6m extra.

    Now even if he just puts that money in a basic investment for 30 years, thats £72m extra by the time he’s 60 years old.

    That would provide his family an income of £200k per month, which im sure in Chile will look after a huge extended family for hundreds of years.

    Of course its important.

  38. Bamford10

    Many arguing at moment that Alexis more valuable than Ozil. Fair enough, the former is far, far more explosive and gives far more energy, effort and intensity when it matters. However, to what extent would people be singing a different tune following a different run of games — i.e., a run in which Alexis was ineffective & Ozil effective?

    Also, what was the game earlier in the season when the team sat deep and nullified Alexis, making Giroud necessary? I was trying to recall this yesterday.

  39. Dissenter

    Alexis will be taking a big risk staying giving them uncertainty of who the manager is next season.
    You’re asking him to commit before he knows the direction the club’s are headed to. There has to be a premium on what he’s offered just from that standpoint alone.

    It’s almost like naivete rules supreme at Arsenal.

  40. Wallace

    Rambo

    when they signed 140k was roughly what a good player was earning. now it’s 200k+.

    sorry, but I just can’t believe Wenger’s well up for giving his crap players great deals, but baulks at paying his best players what they’re worth.

  41. Al

    Would like to see Lucas start on the left today and get some game time including more involvement in the match as he has seemed isolated up top on his own.

    Would go Giroud up top with Lucas on the left , iwobi on the right and ramsey/ox behind the striker.

  42. duvee

    Ozil and Sanchez will sign, I am confident. I think things changed after the Van Persie sale. Was he the last indispensable player to be sold?

  43. Elmo

    Pedro:
    DonTrump does NOT say bigly; it’s ‘big league.’ That has been confirmed, so pls stop spreading fake news.

    Thanks to the guy who posted the Ozil interview from the Times.

  44. Dissenter

    Bamford,
    “Also, what was the game earlier in the season when the team sat deep and nullified Alexis, making Giroud necessary? I was trying to recall this yesterday”

    If that’s the standard for assessing value then Ozil is far behind Alexis because Ozil gets nullified so frequently we might have to get a GPS tracker on him to locate him in big games.

  45. Wallace

    Dissenter

    “Alexis will be taking a big risk staying giving them uncertainty of who the manager is next season.
    You’re asking him to commit before he knows the direction the club’s are headed to.”

    but when Wenger leaves isn’t the only way up?

  46. Romford Ozil Pele

    Need to keep both, the moment one leaves the other ain’t hanging about. Have you not heard the way both speak about each other? And since the formation change look how often they consistently look for each other on the pitch, their relationship etc? You can argue the merits of who deserves more, it’s futile really. We’re at a stage. Let we’re well just set ourselves back by not meeting demands. More than enough money floating about, need to stop playing the poor relative.

  47. duvee

    I can see a blockbuster signing of their contracts together. Similar to what we did with the 5 British chaps a few years ago. Camera crew etc. A statement of intent!

  48. Bamford10

    Dissenter

    That’s not why I was asking that question. Separate thought. I should’ve made that clearer. And note: I am a massive Ozil critic.

  49. Bamford10

    Potential XIs, re-formatted:

    _______Ospina
    Paul_Must__Hold__Gibb
    ____Elneny___Xhaka
    ________Ramsey
    Theo____Lucas___Oxlade

    or–

    _______Ospina
    Paul_Must__Hold__Gibb
    ____Elneny___Xhaka
    ________Ramsey
    Theo____Lucas____Iwobi

    or—

    _______Ospina
    Paul_Must__Hold__Gibb
    ____Elneny___Xhaka
    ________Ramsey
    Theo____Iwobi___Oxlade

  50. Cesc Appeal

    RP

    If I was either of them I would want to know who the next manager is as well, all well and good earning £250 000 a week, but I think, particularly for Sanchez, potential success is very important, if you hear a Simeone is coming, or even a Tuchel I think you’re more likely to sign up than hearing Howe is on his way.

    That maybe what it is you know, they are pressing for information and the club does not want to give it on the matter of manager, if I was an agent you would not want to tie your client to a club with a vague managerial situation, not knowing what kind of character was coming in next season.

    Particularly if you are success driven that is an enormous part your decision, if it is Wenger still that may form part of your decision not to sign on etc and look for a new club.

  51. Romford Ozil Pele

    CA, yeah you may be right. It’s probably part of the negotiation process that hasn’t been spoken about much.

    If I’m TBH my gut instinct is that Wenger will stay. He hasn’t said anything which indicates that he’s likely to leave, and I’m not really confident in the board starting succession planning early. Providing we finish top 4 which we will quite easily and threaten to challenge I think he’ll stay, would be the board’s preference. Whether that impacts Özil or Alexis’ decision to stay remains to be seen. All we can do is speculate but we do need CMs origination ASAP

  52. vicky

    It’s nauseating to think Wenger didn’t say “Money isn’t the be all and end all” when an expendable player like Theo was bullying him in contract negotiations. And now that our best player and a superstar , Alexis Sanchez, is demanding what he truly deserves, Wenger is talking about values. Pay Alexis whatever he wants. We pay Sanogo 20K who has done fuck all for our club.

  53. vicky

    Wallace

    “sorry, but I just can’t believe Wenger’s well up for giving his crap players great deals, but baulks at paying his best players what they’re worth.”

    Okay, it may well be the case that it’s not Wenger who’s baulking at the wage demands of Alexis but Wenger can get the board to accede to Alexis’s demand.

  54. Cesc Appeal

    RP

    If Wenger signs on that is it for me with Arsenal, in terms of following them in detail etc. Just locked into another cycle of Wenger’s bullshit and failure dressed up as success ‘the Arsenal way.’ F**k right off with that.

    Arsenal fans deserve a bit of excitement and unpredictability now.

    I think Ozil will stay regardless, I actually think Sanchez leaving will lead to it being even more certain, I don’t think there will be a whole lot of teams clamouring for Ozil, he’s a luxury type player, so he will be keen to stay in a club where he’s allowed to be lazy and do what he wants, fans sing about him regardless of performances etc, Wenger would just throw money at him if Sanchez departs to avoid looking totally clueless (forbid that should ever happen).

    Sanchez is the far trickier one, rare in football, but I genuinely think money is secondary to Sanchez, success is what he wants, he isn’t stupid, he knows most of the side are nowhere near his level and the team is not really developing in the years he’s been here.

    As opposes to Ozil there very much will be a whole pack of clubs chasing Sanchez.

  55. Leedsgunner

    Hilarious that Wenger is commenting on what he thinks will motivate a player to sign… is this from the same man that “tried to sign”

    – CR7
    – Zlatan
    -Xabi Alonso
    -Eden Hazard
    -Yaya Toure
    -Juan Mata
    -Louis Suarez

    … etc.

    and miserably failed?

    I wouldn’t pay any notion from him about what motivates a player to sign a contract. The truth is — as the above small list shows, he has no clue.

    Not a clue.

    If he truly did understand — every transfer window wouldn’t be a drawn out saga. Every year the same thing happens…

    Shut up Arsene.

    Stop trying to play silly mental games with Alexis and pay him the money. At least Alexis is playing out of his skin… what have you done for the past 12 years?

    Where’s our latest EPL trophy? The Champion’s League trophy?

  56. Park Chu-young's left testicle

    Did anybody else notice that dickhead Ramsey sulking after two of the goals we scored on Saturday. Instead of joining in with the rest of the team he just stood there with his hands on his hips both times. After one of the goals he even gesticulated that he should of received the ball. We bloody scored you self obsessed twat.

  57. Leftsidesanch

    One suspects that Wenger has already signed (he isn’t leaving…regular convos about fear of life after footy indicate this). On the other hand, the piece on the arsenal youtube account with Henry, Sol and Mr sulk on the pitch when the game is done did have the feel of a goodbye/testimonial.

    In any event can you imagine a scenario where one/both of sanchez leave and wenger signs on? I suspect he won’t announce his deal till they reach an agreement on our two prized assets.

    On another note, I really can’t take another season of Wenger here – it’s like watching Friends on comedy central its the same damn thing every single time.

  58. Wallace

    vicky

    “Okay, it may well be the case that it’s not Wenger who’s baulking at the wage demands of Alexis but Wenger can get the board to accede to Alexis’s demand.”

    I think if there’s a breakdown in negotiatons Wenger is consulted by whoever it is working the deal at the Arsenal end, but he’s not actively a part of the process.

  59. S Asoa

    Thank you Luis Almeida
    For a very insightful interview with our own Ozil. Bet Wenger does not know half as much about Ozil. Think Wenger reads Grove and the insight will help him to get a contract extension to Ozil

  60. Leftsidesanch

    And what kind of message would losing these two send out esp after losing our last star trio in nasri, rvp and cesc so close to each other send out to potential new signings?

  61. Alexanderhenry

    Park Chu-young’s left testicle

    No, I didn’t. I did notice that Ramsay played well when he came on though.

  62. Carts

    in all honesty, why Sanchez would even want to stay at Arsenal is anyone’s guess. Take away the fact that we’re based in London, then there really isn’t anything else to discuss.

    I mean, would Sanchez go to Munich for £200k p/w? Would he go to Manchester?? Looking at his form, I’m sure mosst managers would play and give him what he wants.

    If Wenger wants another embarrassing saga to ensue, then let him keep talking his pretentious shit. Quite frankly it’ll only end up with us selling Sanchez for a bit more than what we paid. I can even see him handing in a transfer request to push things along.

  63. Romford Ozil Pele

    CA, yeah I’m hoping Wenger moves on and we can bring in Tuchel but I’m not sure and it doesn’t look like it’ll happen to me. Hope I’m wrong though.

    I think Mesut will stay although I don’t think you can be assured of anything. His ex-Madrid team mates have already been piping up saying how they miss him etc.

    Obviously I’m a big fan of his as you know so I don’t really agree with the assertion of him being a luxury player. Wenger definitely panders to him but stylistically he’s the sort of player Wenger loves so it’s not really a surprise. Again lazy? It’s not true, especially when you see his running stats dwarf Alexis’ each game. This is also someone who’s scored against Bayern, Spurs, United x2, Chelsea, Liverpool, Everton in recent years so the big game tag isn’t really something I buy either. His style probably rubs some people up the wrong way but he starts for the world champions too so it’s not a thing of being a luxury. Sometimes he plays from the right or in CM for Germany so he’s definitely multi-functional if you want him to be. Even Griezmann today says Özil is the player he enjoys watching most in the league. This season he’s basically playing as a striker.

    Anyway I’m not really here to compare him to Alexis. You could say Alexis deserves more since he’s more of a matchwinner but my point was that both their futures are linked anyway and if one goes I think the other will follow and we’re at a point where we don’t need to uncessarily set ourselves back.

  64. Dissenter

    Wallace,
    “I think if there’s a breakdown in negotiations Wenger is consulted by whoever it is working the deal at the Arsenal end, but he’s not actively a part of the process”

    Really since you’re so intent on carrying water for Wenger on this issue, why don’t you call the main switch board number of Arsenal FC at 08435 040 844. Tell then to tell Wenger to STFU since he’s not “actively a part of the process”

  65. Dissenter

    Romford,
    I do think Ozil still doesn’t have the right set-up around him.
    Even though I/m equivocal about if Ozil is worth the same salary as Sanchez it unlikely we’ll find a better player of the same calibre that’s willing to play with midgets.
    We have most of the pieces tom help him succeed but Wenger is too slow to figure out the right combination.

  66. Romford Ozil Pele

    Dissenter, he can play in any set-up. Best in a 4-2-3-1 as the #10 with two good defensive CMs who can break lines and find him higher up the pitch. This season he’s basically playing as a striker which is why he’s never involved unless we’re building play well.

    I want to keep both players. Alexis is obviously more of a matchwinner and I think he’s enjoying this role as the #9 now, looks to be growing into it. We’d have to pay the same amount, likely more to replace Özil and Alexis so why bother when both are 28 now and in their prime? Sign them up, pay them the money and let them enjoy the best years of their careers here at The Arsenal.

  67. Cesc Appeal

    RP

    Just finding myself less and less liking Ozil, I don’t really pay a lot of attention to his running stats because they don’t mean a lot, if he runs more than Sanchez its all the more puzzling as to what he does, because he doesn’t have the impact Sanchez does.

    Last few games I’ve really been watching him and his inability to do anything physical really hurts us, he ducks 50/50’s and seems to get brushed off the ball with ease, developing the Wilshere trait of falling over and looking at the referee.

    I guess it is a preference thing.

    I’ve long asked for him to be moved away from CAM where I think he really weakens us, particularly with our unbalanced central midfield, if he’s moving further forward and we can add more solidity to the middle all for that.

    Would like to see try out a Xhaka, Coq base maybe, then Ramsey playing as a more advanced CM/CAM in what would essentially be a three man middle, Walcott/Oxlade/Iwobi on one flank, Ozil the other, and Sanchez through the middle, but obviously Ozil has licence to roam a bit and play beside Sanchez as he has been doing.

    Against Bournemouth when Ramsey came on and Ozil went wide I thought we were far better, against West Ham when Oxlade went CAM and Ozil went LM, again, I thought we looked much better, much more incisive.

    If we can make him work as a RM/LM I would be delighted, get Xhaka a partner, maybe Paredes who we’ve been looking at, I like Tolisso as well, give Ramsey and Wilshere a chance to fight for the third man spot in the middle, Ozil as a wide playmaker, Sanchez as ST if he keeps this up and then another wide forward. Total team.

  68. Paulinho

    We have a big, big problem with both Walcott and Ozil in the side. Both of them do a lot of one-paced jogging(which may explain running stats), but are effectively complete bystanders for the majority of a match. So defensively we’re vulnerable with them and offensively we can’ t control a match at all because they both play in bursts, and often show little inclination to receive the ball if there is congestion. They will react and look interested if someone else takes the responsibility to create space from congested areas, but they won’t initiate it.

    It’s why they are liability in fast paced games away from home against top sides. Likes of Mustafi will be looking to feed between the lines and they are hiding in plain sight.

  69. Dissenter

    We actually have a good group of players
    I hate to say this but we aren’t in need of nee signings at the moment. I would agree with Wenger that unless world class quality or world-class potential is within reach we don’t need to sign anyone in the next two transfer window.
    For one, Jack is staying healthy [finger’s crossed] so the midfield coverage is there.
    Chambers is thriving [who would have predicted this?]away on loan – central defensive coverage is secured.
    Oxlade is beginning to know where his pecker is located, he’s showing some signs that with confidence even Raheem Sterling wont be able to touch him.

    We can do something really special with this group if we can keep Sanchez and Ozil.
    We might not contend for the league this season but definitely I see us winning [or coming close to winning] next season
    #Keepthisgrouptogether

  70. Romford Ozil Pele

    CA, I mean that’s fair enough but like I said yesterday we’re basically playing a 4-4-2 this season so Özil isn’t really impacting the midfield anyway.

    His job before was to receive passes in the final third, either move it on to create an overload or fashion a chance or shoot himself. This season he’s basically playing as a striker which is why he’s already hitting numbers from a goal standpoint. Look at the runs he’s making every game off the ball. He’s not being found because a lot of players don’t see the passes early enough, Xhaka aside.

    Xhaka and Coquelin can only really work in certain games due to the matters inability to build. In a 4-4-2 it’s OK at the moment because Coquelin is acting as a disruptive presence and pressing higher up the field which is in turn leaving Xhaka a lot of space to pick passes. But against teams who won’t come out as much we’ll need two players who can take it in turns to drop and build play.

    Not a fan of Ramsey at #10, he’s nowhere near as comfortable receiving the ball with his back to goal and can’t shimmy or drop his shoulder like Özil can to get away from his marker. It works for Wales because they spend 75% of the time without the ball so whenever they win t Ramsey has space to charge into. It’s diffeeent for Arsenal where you’re spending most of the time trying to pick a lock bf space is denied.

    Even against West Ham when Ox was charging through the middle it was because space had opened up and West Ham had come out because they were chasing a result. You can like powerful players but a lot of them lack the decision making skills unless they’re playing the counter. The greatest quality with Özil is that he always makes the right decision in the final third which is why he stars for whatever team he plays for.

    Yes Paredes is quality. I know you and many others disagree but I would be looking to bring back Wilshere who is looking sharper by the week for Bournemouth.

    You can essentially get what you want and move Özil wide right. I’m not even against it, away from home I’d definitely like to see it in big games but for the most part I don’t think it’s necessary.

  71. Romford Ozil Pele

    Meh Walcott i’d agree but we all know he’s limited. When the play is too centralised, like it was with Özil last season that’s when it becomes a problem. Last season the play was too slow and one-paced but we played a pivot of Ramsey-Flamini for like three months so it wasn’t a huge shock. When you facilitate well through the CM areas most other things fall into place. You can then start experimenting with diffeeent variations up top.

  72. Paulinho

    I genuinely no difference in the way Ozil is playing now than before. His strengths have always been off the ball running rather than dropping deep like iniesta and building the game.

    Had to laugh at the compilation a few weeks ago on Sky showing the ‘new’goal hungry Ozil making runs – like for Watford goal – when in first month at the club he scored a header by making a lung bursting in the box against Norwich., and even against Napoli he showed hunger.

  73. Dream10

    I think the ideal XI for us is a back four, Xhaka at #6 as the mainstays. Then two needle players, one on each side of him (players good in tight spaces). On the left of him you can have Cazorla or another (new signing needed.). On the right of Xhaka, a player like Douglas Costa would be interesting. He’s not your typical CM like a Modric, Iniesta or Cazorla, more like a Di Maria 2014 for Real Madrid. He is decent in tight spaces, but can give you a vertical dribbling option or stretch the play out wide (Ramsey as backup).
    Then Ozil, Sanchez & one more mobile forward.

    Arsene Wenger’s best teams have been counterattacking. Speed, athleticism & fast decision making have produced the best output. Sanchez is not a RVP or Benzema. They are pivots who can bring others into play. Need to play to his strengths

  74. Romford Ozil Pele

    Well this is it as well. Like how long have people been watching him and there is still this misconception that he’s a dictator of play. We have Cazorla who does that role and now Xhaka. There’s a big difference in styles of play. What I always wanted from Özil was more goals which he’s now providing. If you’re saying that he harms us from the defensive phase then you can go 3 in midfield and play him from the right. Him being a liability has always been nothing but BS

  75. Romford Ozil Pele

    Yeah I do think we need another forward even if it’s not an out and out ST. The Firmino story last night was funny because he’s the sort of player that could complete a fluid front theee with Alexis and Özil. Reus another. But like his hero TR7, he’s a constant crock

  76. Cesc Appeal

    RP

    I’m not even thinking of Ramsey as a No.10, I’m thinking more a PSG style 4-3-3, Xhaka, then a Paredes/Tolisso and then Ramsey/Wilshere in a middle three, Xhaka the deep Motta type distributor, Paredes/Tolisso off Xhaka deeper than Ramsey/Wilshere who would then be the most advanced of the three, the middle ‘tick’ I always call it.

    Ozil then at LM/RM, Sanchez at ST and then another play at LM/RM.

    I actually think that would bring the best out of Ramsey/Wilshere as well, the problem with a lot of our players is they are too weak in their all around game to play as half of a two man middle, made worse by Ozil being the CAM who does no CM work.

    That set up eliminates that.

    Fingers crossed Simeone can set us up something like that 😉

  77. Cesc Appeal

    ‘Reus another. But like his hero TR7, he’s a constant crock’

    Reus, Sanchez, Ozil

    My word.

    But as you say, such a crock. Brief glimpses of total football, before having to have Walcott/Oxlade covering for Reus.

  78. Paulinho

    What Ozil is showing is that he can’t do both. I think Wenger said at the start of the season the elite players assist 15 and score 15 and Ozil needs to add goals to the assists. At the moment it seems he can only do one.

    Would be amazed if he remains a consistent goal threat as well and makes sort of run he made against Watford against Liverpool at Anfield or Chelsea at Stamford Bridge.

  79. ughelligunner

    Before we go on and on about wenger been pretencious with offering our best players a contract, why are we not asking ourselves this important question; how do you convince your best players to sign a contract, when you offering them the contract has not sign? This is what we should be asking, not if we would offer them the money they want.

    Arsenal knows they cant lose their two best players based on salary issue. The only way they are going to agree to lose them is an offering cabove 80m.

  80. Dream10

    Romford

    That Firmino clause is funny. Liverpool still angry from the Suarez ordeal & the fact that Sanchez opted for Arsenal. WengerEagle & I wanted us to sign Firmino.
    He’s performing the same role that Sanchez is for us. Not as proflic of a goal scorer though. Excellent season from him. Arsenal & Liverpool compete for players in the same price range w/ the Manchesters & Chelsea in the tier above.

  81. Rambo Ramsey

    Paulinho, perhaps the fact that Ozil has already equaled last season’s goal tally–incidentally his best ever in an Arsenal shirt– is the reason for the ‘goal hunger’ analysis?

  82. ughelligunner

    Wenger has turned Ozil and sanchez into hot goal poachers, and they would love to continue with that, knowing who the next manager will be is paramount, whether we like it or not.

    There is more to the “values of the club” wenger is alluding to. What are the values? That should be our next question. Bellerin has signed for a 100k every week, that didnt take time..i think there is more than just money sanchez want. I know ozil will sign, they are just waiting on sanchez to complete the big announcement. You dont want to put pressure on your best player about contract talks.

  83. Romford Ozil Pele

    CA, yeah I think the issue comes back to what I said yesterday. Wenger doesn’t coach positional play.

    Yeah Ramsey in a midfield three where other players are distributing is great due to his great goal scoring potential. I’m guessing you’re thinking a better iteration of the 4-3-3 Liverpool currently play. Coutinho-Firmino-Mane is a nice interchangeable front three with a lot of leg work in midfield. I still doubt their creativity in games that are not hectic/end-to-end but they have a decent basis there

  84. Romford Ozil Pele

    Lol yeah it was funny that we’re the only club banned from buying Firmino. That’s proper small club mentality that. But yeah anyway he’s a very good player who would’ve been welcome here. Like him s lot but there are a lot of good versatile forwards on the market. Probably the way to go if you can’t find a top class #9

  85. Paulinho

    Romford – Most of them are pointless goals though and will have no bearing later on in the season. Four against a crap champions league team, tap in against West Ham. There is nothing there at all to suggest he can replicate those goal stats when it matters at the business end against live opposition. Even this season performances against organised sides like United and Spurs suggest the same old, same old. He didn’t threaten the goal at all in those matches or any show any hunger or zeal to do so.

    Pundits are simply overreacting and reading too much into things like they always do.

  86. Louis Almeida

    “Would be amazed if he remains a consistent goal threat as well and makes sort of run he made against Watford against Liverpool at Anfield or Chelsea at Stamford Bridge.”

    Why does this just apply to Ozil though? You could say the same about Alexis? Big games are won on fine/small margins and it’s often someone obscure rather than the obvious names who pop up in these types of games.

  87. Dream10

    Paulinho

    If Ozil gets 10 a season, I’m happy with that. As long as he can continue to create quality chances in the final third.
    I know it’s not popular at the moment, but I’m worried about how much Sanchez will contribute in the coming few seasons. I’m not his biggest fan, but he is quality.
    He’s played a lot of football since the 2007 u20 World Cup for Chile in Canada. He’s an attacker who needs to be all action. Like a forward Steven Gerrard.
    He’ll be 28 this month. Supremely fit as well. Can he adjust his game if he lose a little burst? Ibrahimovic is still good because of his movement & technique. Lewandowski the same as well. We need to sign him because he’s producing & difficult to replace. The market isn’t ripe w/ great attacking talents.
    This isn’t the late 90’s anymore. An average forward will cost 20-25m now.

  88. Dissenter

    Arsenal has always been a CLASSY club.
    It’s so heartening to see that Arsenal is not mentioned at all in these child abuse scandals.

  89. Romford Ozil Pele

    Paulinho, but a goal is a goal right? You’ve got to play them all? Naturally it’s gonna be easier to score against a Palace than it is against a Chelsea, they aren’t as disciplined defensively and you’ll have more space to play in combinations. 8 goals at this stage of a season is a massive improvement. The fact he even netted a hattrick (a career first) is telling considering people used to say that he couldn’t score or lacked the hunger for it.

    He’s scored goals against all the teams you’ve listed in the past as well. He isn’t gonna play well against every single team every single time. That’s not just down to him, no player is greater than the sum of its parts. Naturally when we play well certain individuals will shine like Mesut did against Chelsea, albeit prior to their formation change.

    All we can do is wait and see. So while his contributions in open play have been less than in recent years his end product from a goals perspective has definitely risen. I don’t see why he can’t keep scoring providing our central midfield doesn’t collapse like last season.

  90. Paulinho

    Louis – Your right. I’ve never been a huge fan of either player, and still think Alexis will struggle against top sides as a number nine.

    I still don’t think our team is very good and whole dynamic with Ozil and Sanchez being the main men is overrated.

  91. Dissenter

    Sanchez’ problem will be that of burn out. His next three summers are all booked for international competitions.
    2017 summer- confederations cup with Chile in Russia
    2018 summer- World cup with Chile in Russia
    2019 summer – COPA America with Chile in Brazil

    He has to be slowed down at some point. It’s going to catch up with him at some point.

  92. steve

    We actually have a good group of players
    I hate to say this but we aren’t in need of nee signings at the moment. I would agree with Wenger that unless world class quality or world-class potential is within reach we don’t need to sign anyone in the next two transfer window.
    For one, Jack is staying healthy [finger’s crossed] so the midfield coverage is there.
    Chambers is thriving [who would have predicted this?]away on loan – central defensive coverage is secured.
    Oxlade is beginning to know where his pecker is located, he’s showing some signs that with confidence even Raheem Sterling wont be able to touch him.We can do something really special with this group if we can keep Sanchez and Ozil.
    We might not contend for the league this season but definitely I see us winning [or coming close to winning] next season
    #Keepthisgrouptogether

    _____________

    Expect more seasons of irrelevancy then.

  93. Dissenter

    Bystander,
    “Why then are we not six points clear in the Premier league if we have such a good group of players?”

    Yep, You’re a bystander reader, I answered your question already in the same post:
    “We can do something really special with this group if we can keep Sanchez and Ozil.
    We might not contend for the league this season but definitely I see us winning [or coming close to winning] next season”

  94. vicky

    No fan of Ozil but Ramsey as a no 10 is a complete no-no. How can you have a player who has a shoddy decision making dictate play when it’s the single-most important quality a CAM must possess. Ramsey is basically a box to box player and if he can’t make that position his own, there is nothing to be gained from playing him at other positions.

  95. Paulinho

    “but a goal is a goal right?”

    With Ozil it seems too off the cuff. Game against Bulgarian, got emboldened half through the game against the most kamikaze team I’ve seen for a while and became a bit more individualistic and got a hat trick. I think he would’ve scored that same hattrick three years ago if we had played them, say on night he scored against Napoli.

    I’m waiting for him to go to Anfield or Stamford bridge and make a run across near post and score a real big goal. Then I’d believe something had changed in him.

  96. Cesc Appeal

    RP

    Yeah, that is the problem, too many players at Arsenal seem to just have a ‘free role,’ what does Xhaka do, he has a ‘free role,’ what does Ozil do, he has a ‘free role,’ what does Sanchez do, he has a ‘free role,’ what does Ramsey do, he has a ‘free role.’

    Wenger is very much the old school of tactics don’t win matches, systems don’t win matches, players playing well wins matches, players being free to express themselves wins matches. Don’t buy that.

    As you say, at home, if we brought in a better CM to play alongside Xhaka, no reason Ozil cannot be No.10 with a more attacking front three to pick out, but I just don’t see flexibility in terms of formation with Wenger, its 4-2-3-1 and then the players over the course of the match seem to decide for themselves what shape is having the best effect.

  97. Dissenter

    Steve,
    The irrelevancy is from having a manger that’s’ set in his dated ways.
    You don’t think Chambers has done enough to come back as 3rd/4th CB next season.
    You don’t think that Jack deserves a look-in next season is he proves his fitness.

    It’s a good group.
    I also said that if there’s indeed world class quality finished material or world class potential, we need to build on the group.

  98. Dissenter

    Bystander,
    Graham Rix didn’t manage at Arsenal did he? He played for Arsenal.
    Arsenal is in the clear unless he was nooking his fellow players

  99. Romford Ozil Pele

    I really don’t understand when you say too off the cuff? How can a goal be off the cuff? Like he can’t score decisive goals? If that’s the case then I’d also disagree. Look at Germany this summer in the Euros when he played from the right and netted the opener against Conte’s Italy.

    Maybe you have a point as since he left Bremen he was never conditioned to be a goalscorer and spent too much time being Ronaldo’s psychic but if you’re saying it’s due to a lack of ability then I disagree.

  100. Dream10

    Cesc Appeal

    Positional play would make us a better imo. Freedom for the attackers when the ball is the final third and better defensive structure.

  101. Paulinho

    Romford – He looked goal hungry Ludo then four days later was back to being a pussycat against Spurs. When I say off the cuff I mean it was a temporary mindset he acquired, borne off playing against a ridiculously open side in a game we were winning comfortably, so he just went with it.

    So in terms of technical ability he is definitely capable of scoring those goals but we/I know mentally he will revert to his default mindset in the long term. By default he simply is not hungry to actually score.

    In terms of creation as well, he’s probably being sold short now his numbers are not as high as they were, but would still bank on him delivering an effective dead ball cross later in the season than scoring a decisive goal.

  102. Romford Ozil Pele

    CA, yeah I get you. Like Dream said, because Wenger doesn’t coach positional play, so when the style Wenger wants doesn’t work it all looks a bit too haphazard. I’m only really a fan of giving freedom to the attackers. Everything else should be a lot more structured or it becomes a bit too topsy turvy as we’ve seen in recent years.

  103. Romford Ozil Pele

    Paulinho – how much do you think is down to mentality and how much is it down to Wenger’s way of playing/building attacks which can reach a block when it comes to playing organised sides?

    Like against Spurs it took us a while to get use to their 3-5-2. It wasn’t until around 30 mins in that game that we realised the space to play was going to be down the sides of the wing backs. I saw Özil, Alexis and Moneeal all have chat while there was a break in play. It was literally the players who adjusted and then this throws up the question as to whether wenger’s lack of input from the touchline is hampering?

  104. Rambo Ramsey

    I seem to remember Ozil making a mockery of Le grove favourite Kante, run half the length of the pitch and put the ball past Courtouis.

    Funny how the goalposts have been moved to ‘He has to do it at Stamford Bridge or Anfield’

    Frankly its embarrassing stuff.

  105. Paulinho

    Romford – Definitely linked. Overall I think Wenger is neither a negative or positive for Ozil. Aspects of his management would resonate with Ozil such as keeping calm but he did seem to like Mourinho.

    Rambo – What’s embarrassing is your tabloid take on everything.

  106. Joe

    Rambo – What’s embarrassing is your tabloid take on everything.

    Agree.

    “Le grove favourite Kante”

    Think
    Any team in the world would love him playing for them

  107. Romford Ozil Pele

    Paulinho – yeah I hear you. I mean we’ve heard loads down the years from ex players about how Wenger isn’t the overly hands on type. He likes to implement a style and leave it up to the players to work out if they become stuck during a game.

    I wonder then what he makes about all these new managers who very much are hands-on and proactive. The likes of Conte, Pep, Klopp are always gesticulating but they definitely pay more attention to detail.

    Overall I’d say that Wenger’s style is definitely hampering us and I would prefer a more hands-on manager who can chop and change during games accordingly. The Özil thing is weird though. You often don’t find a player who is a fan of both Wenger and Mourinho’s style. I feel both have used Özil for their specific purpose but it would’ve been interesting to see what a Pep would’ve wanted from him.

  108. Rambo Ramsey

    “Think Any team in the world would love him playing for them”

    All the more impressive how Ozil turned him and left him for dead. Unsurprising that you fail to grasp the point.

  109. Paulinho

    Romford – Definitely think Sanchez would prefer a more animated, fiery manager who encourages frank exchanges.

    Still trying to work out whether Sanchez’s new found happiness is down to playing well/position or whether he knows he’s off, but he seems way more into it this season.

    Agree overall on Wenger, those other managers are more animated but also seem to leave him lagging in the tactical department. It’s like Wenger has got his method(limited, outdated) and knows it’s too late to change it whereas other managers have the energy to incorporate everything to get that edge.

  110. Joe

    Yeah Rambo because there isn’t a player ever who hasn’t been turned or left for dead at some
    Point by some player.

    I’m
    Sure even fucking sanago has left a player for dead at some point just like I’m sure Maldini got left for dead at some point by a player in his career.

    It’s unsurprising you don’t get the point

    It’s not surprising you think
    One swallow does a summer make as you still think Ramsey is a good player because of one 6 month hot spell

    Simpleton

  111. Romford Ozil Pele

    Paulinho – yeah Sevilla are my Spanish team and they’re coached by Sampaoli, the manager behind Chile’a two Copa America wins. Very animated manager like Conte so you can see why it’d be a fit with alexis’ personality.

    Interesting point RE Alexis. I think he likes to be the centre of attention and he’s always happy being on the ball. This is the best form he’s been in during his career. Outside of that his best club form was playing just behind Di Natalie when at Juve. So I think he enjoys his new role and how he can be more provocative with his dribbling through the middle whereas he’s more predictable from the left.

    Yeah tactically Wenger proper annoys me. You never expect anything different from him which is why it can be so easy to counter his teams. The others are more tactically flexible but also give their team’s more from the touchline which I think is quite an underrated trait actually.

  112. Paulinho

    “You never expect anything different from him which is why it can be so easy to counter his teams”

    Yeah and he never strays from it because he it will get him or keep him at a certain point. Moderate risk/moderate reward. Does a great job of not going backwards by standing still.

  113. Joe

    Dissenter.

    This squad is close.

    But would still like a out and out withdraw class striker and winger.

    And need to sell the likes of Ramsey and ox

    And of course it doesn’t mean a thing until wenger goes.

    The squad should have won the league last season But fight because of wenger.

    So it’s all just talk unless wenger goes no matter what the squad is

  114. Joe

    Vicky

    Don’t think you could slide a cunt hair between the 3 of them

    All great

    It’s like Saying who is greater. Bergkamp or Henry

  115. Joe

    Simoene should get extra points for what’s he’s done at Atletico with what he has.

    Man you could say great things about all of them and not be wrong if you think one is greater and more intelligent than the other

  116. Rambo Ramsey

    Paulinho resorted to some lame personal jibe probably because he was called out on his bizarre take on Ozil’s goals/ the situation or teams he’s scored against.

    You, well… that’s the norm for you is it not?

  117. Romford Ozil Pele

    Paulinho – good shout. Wenger never strays too far from his comfort zone. Sticks to what he knows. Like you say, fair play because he’s managed to remain relevant although we know this is pretty much his limit. So many younger and tactically more flexible managers around.

    Vicky – I like Pep because his teams are always proactive and like to play on the front foot. Likely to get caught on the counter because of that sometimes though. Liverpool and Spurs are the teams who are most high octane in this league but that could have ramifications later on in the season. Chelsea definitely look the most balanced side thus far. Conte doing very well but still a long way to go. I remember after 5 games people were already proclaiming City as Champions. I went with them at the start of the season though so will stick with it. Also Fekir back in action tomorrow!

  118. vicky

    Joe , fair enough. I take it you rate Simeone just a tad higher than the other two.

    Rom, yes got to see Fekir in action. Imagine a team with fully fit Fekir and Reus on both wings.

  119. Rambo Ramsey

    Chelsea are playing smart but you have to say City basically fell perfectly into their trap. Best way to beat Chelsea is by trying to play on the counter, that back three with Cahill in there will always give opposition attackers a chance.

  120. ughelligunner

    I use to like it when morinho gestilates on the touchline during his earlydays, now he cant even throw his hands consistently. It all reduces with age.

    What do you guys think about Erique and Zidane? People hardly talk about them. Me think managers who are all action on the touchline and are winning are talked about more.
    The more reasons Anceloti is very underated in the world of football managers.