Theo, as a striker?

by .

 

Screen Shot 2014-12-03 at 09.31.39Just a quick post today, because it’s Sunday and the weather outside means you’re probably not reading this. Or reading it through squinted eyes on your mobile. Or reading it whilst driving. If you’re driving, please don’t read this.

Right, Thierry is now whoring himself out to the papers as well. Love this line.

“I am convinced we won the league at Arsenal not due to the fact I was banging in goals but because the club had a good squad. Sometimes when I was being given a rest, Sylvain Wiltord or Kanu would come in and Dennis was always there.”

Have an inkling someone is helping him to write in ‘tabloid’.

He thinks we need three strikers to win the league. I just don’t know what’s going on with Thierry at the moment. He’s like a little lost pundit trying to craft a heavily paid living without having too much talent to deliver on the promise. I hope he doesn’t go sour. Well, more sour than he has done so far.

Arsene Wenger has offered Theo a striker shaped olive branch.

‘Being 26 to 32 as a striker is the best age as a striker and I wouldn’t like to miss that golden age. He is naturally gifted to play in this position.’

I don’t really understand this angle. If he can’t be as good as Suarez, then what are we trying to achieve? He’ll just end up like Owen. We’ll turn into long ball merchants. Theo can’t play with his back to goal, he’s not overly technical on the ball and he’s quite small to play that role in our formation. Really think he’s a good wide player, but trying to convince anyone he’ll be a striker is a big ask in my opinion.

Right, really don’t have much drive today. I’ll be back tomorrow with a run down of the new community centre Arsenal have knocked up!

130 Responses to “Theo, as a striker?”

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  1. Honest Bill

    I believe that when he says ‘striker’ he doesn’t mean playing down the middle. He’s always called wing forwards that. Most foreign managers don’t tend to make that distinction. Striker just means forward.

  2. shad

    3 strikers is insane. Maybe he meant 3 players. We defo need a GK, DM and proper CF. And Theo isn’t it.

    Hearing Dybala is going to Juve so wonder what our options are..

  3. Henry Root

    Dybala to Juve?
    I thought Cavani had just agreed a four- year deal to go there. They won’t keep Morata, Tevez, Llorente, Cavani and Dybala happy especially in a defensive league like Serie A

  4. Charlie Boy

    I get the impression Arsene’s either trying to throw other teams off the scent (in that he’s after a specific striker but doesn’t want anyone else sniffing), or he genuinely believes Theo can be a striker. I suspect the latter, but very much hope for the former.

  5. Danny

    Man C’s goal difference just went crazy, what they did today we should’ve done last week against Hull.
    WENGER OUT

  6. Bankz

    But of course we need 3 strikers.

    Most title winning sides have 3 strikers who are capable of playing as centre forwards.
    Even Chelsea this season have 3 strikers.
    Take Giroud from the list & we really don’t have anyone capable of playing as a centre forward.

    Man United had 3/4 centre forwards through their EPL dominance
    Man City had 3/4 “centre forwards in their last 2 EPL title wins.
    Even Barca have 2/3 strikers despite having Messi
    Real Madrid had Benzema,Higuian & CR7 the last time they won the La liga.

    Giroud on a good day isn’t even good enough to deliver the EPL,relying solely on him won’t either.
    We need another Centre forward who’s capable of fulling in for Giroud or relegating him to the bench.

    Until recently Wenger used to have 3/4 very good strikers all a capable of playing the lone centre forward’s role to perfection but he decided to cut the numbers down the same way he chose to reduce the number of our centre defenders to 3 last season & 2 this season.. we all saw how it panned out.

    There was a time we had Henry, RVP, Adebayor. I think 2005-2006 season.

    Henry is a smart man who has won titles around Europe & I think his views/points are really valid.
    I don’t get this new obsession of trying so hard to rubbish every suggestion he makes when on the face of it, he isn’t in any way far from the truth.

  7. R.S.P.C.Arsenal

    Day by day

    Word by word

    Every time he open le mouth he takes a brick away from the legend wall!

    Loved the footballer. Hate the pundit looking to be controversional just like Paul scholes .

    Can’t understand most of what he says anyway but what I do is drivel…

    Media tart

  8. Bankz

    Another La Liga title wrapped up in the bag largely due to Barca’s front 3 of Messi-Suarez-Neymar

    I see things like this,take a look at the 2 billion Madrid have spent in the last decade & you’ve got to conclude what a success Barca’s policies especially the la maisa academy has been.

    7 titles in the last decade
    A handful of CDR
    Likely 4 Uefa champions league trophies if they get past Bayern on Tuesday

    All the while playing some of the most breathtaking attacking football the world have ever seen.

    Reason I feel real Madrid have underachieved in the last 15 yrs,not due to Incompetence or want of winning but largely due to Barcelona’s brilliance & successful policies.

    This is mainly the reason I don’t subscribe to Keyser’s theory of Chelsea’s money being the real reason why we can’t succeed in the EPL.

    Change policies a little, change the manager probably and we’d give the top 3 clubs in the EPL a run for their money.

  9. Dark Hei

    I don’t think Cavani is off from PSG. Ibra is probably going to MLS next season and he can finally take the striker slot.

    More likely Dybala is moving there.

  10. Marko

    I’m telling you Juve ain’t signing no one for 30 or 40 million euros.

    On Henry an absolute legend and will always be loved but as a pundit I don’t think he’s that good he’s lacking a bit of charisma for me.

    On Walcott I think Wenger is just saying this and much like all the times he said he valued Podolski only to get rid I see Walcott is off for me. The idea of him as a central striker has been knocking about for years now and he hasn’t proven he can be that guy

  11. vicky

    Surely, Wenger does not rate Walcott as a striker. If Sanogo was here, he would get a nod ahead of Wally for the forward role. I can’t wait for him to be sold.

  12. bennydevito

    BankzMay 10, 2015 15:04:22
    Why even post a new post at 3pm?
    Just push whatever you have to tell us to the next morning.

    Because that’s one of the things that separates this great blog from the others – daily posts even when there’s nothing to post.

    Afternoon Grovers.

  13. Redtruth

    Wenger acts like he’s some kind of manager guru when his football record is useless.

    He has demoted Arsenal to the second tier of football where even Arsenal fans think we are not entitled to trophies.

    I could list a whole shopping list of Wenger’s inadequacies but i shan’t bother because it is too time consuming

  14. Keyser

    “This is mainly the reason I don’t subscribe to Keyser’s theory of Chelsea’s money being the real reason why we can’t succeed in the EPL.”

    – Barcelona were a bigger club than us to begin with.
    – They only really have one team who can even try to outspend them.
    – They still spend shedloads.
    – They spent 2 decades building on a policy of youth and a certain style.
    – They negotiate their own tv deals.
    – They’ve destroyed a league doing so.

  15. kwik fit

    Still do Red , but that doesn’t stop me saying Fuck Off Mourinho!!! Its a sort of release to the system. If your ever feeling stressed out or life is getting on top of you just scream, where ever you may be, Fuck Off Mourinho!!! You’ll be amazed how good it make’s you feel . Mind you it can get some strange looks at times 😉

  16. Keyser

    “Mind you it can get some strange looks at times”

    Only because it might be inappropriate, like say in Church, not because they don’t agree with the sentiment, hence the knowing nod of agreement by Father Santi.

  17. R.S.P.C.Arsenal

    Love or loathe the muthafucker

    Maureen is a good manager …
    A modern day George graham with a sprinkling of terry venables … In a don Howe mindset …

    But more astute.

  18. Keyser

    RSPC – Wash your mouth out.

    vicky – I’ve give in, I’m dumbing down, you lot all want RedTruth as your spiritual leader, who am I to stand in his way.

  19. Redtruth

    That’s an insult comparing Mourinho to George Graham especially taking in to consideration Graham operated on a relatively small budget and turned average players in to very good team players whereas Mourinho is a total spendthrift relying on top players and a massive budget to achieve results.

  20. vicky

    LOL Keyser !! Your relentless efforts over the years are paying some dividends now. People are less venomous these days. Keep the spirit going 😛

  21. goonerble

    Love the site, have read every day now for the best part of 6 years.

    That said, just wanted to express a little bit of sadness/disappointment at the direction that’s been taken over the past year.

    With Geoff and Pedro i remember the days where blogposts would generally be out before 10am every morning and would perfectly supplement the morning journey into work.

    Nowadays there are far far too many short/quick posts and apologies, which is a real shame. At the most consistent times i remember the comments could often hit the 1,000 mark, i’m just not really sure what’s happened.

    I appreciate how hard it must be to maintain daily quality when there isn’t much going on but this is surely a problem that LG has always faced, on it’s own doesn’t explain the fall in both reliability and quality. Is it a question of effort? Hard to say i suppose- would only ever be speculation and over the years no doubt so much time has been put into this. Maybe just difficult not to let things slip over time

    I am a big fan of the writers and the style of writing/opinions generally too, this is not a personal slight on any contributor.

    Would just love to see my favourite online Arsenal haunt get back to its best

  22. Paulinho

    Painful watching Fabregas.

    Him and RVP as our ‘spinal’ attacking players were nowhere dynamic enough, physicallly, to lead us to anything major.

  23. useroz

    Walcott is not a striker whatever striker means. Hopefully Wenger just wanted to sweet-labeel Walcott to sell.

    What’s wrong with 3 strikers? One WC, Giroud and a young, hungry one… No wonder we have had no plan B. When Giroud was injured last and this seasons, we simply went busted. And Wenger tried blame Chelsea not flopping to help our cause??

  24. london gunner

    If Giroud gets injured next season can you rely on Danny Welbeck? Nope!

    He isn’t a crunch time player he turns to chicken shit in the box. If it was Cl final or semi’s fair enough, but he loses all composure against the Hull city’s of the world.

  25. Godfather

    I dont.know why.aside from Wenger, so many got upset by Henry’s comments about Giroud. He is not.good enough to start for any top team in all major leagues in.Europe.

  26. Emiratesstroller

    There are certain players at the club who Wenger is consistently loyal to particularly when they are injury prone. These have included Rosicky, Diaby and of course both Walcott and Wilshire.

    Walcott may have lightening speed and the occasional clinical finish, but you have to ask is he the quality of player we need to build a League Title winning squad?

    His lack of physicality and work ethic has been always a problem for me. At best he is a player who sits on the bench and comes on when opposing teams are tired.

    What Sanchez and for that matter Ozil has taught us is that you can be talented AND skilful, but also build into your game a ‘work ethic’ as well.

    Frankly there is no room in our squad today for “luxury players” who are costing £100,000 pw just to sit on bench and that is what we are now seeing in the case of Walcott.

    When you look at are starting eleven Messrs Sanchez,Ozil and Giroud
    are now guaranteed a place in team. That leaves one place in offensive positions to fill. Walcott is competing there with Ramsey, Welbeck, Ox
    and Wilshire.

    The other four offer more versatility than Walcott and unless he is a more productive goalscorer that is frankly the problem with him.

    Personally I would look to buy a physically stronger and more reliable
    goalscorer who can play either as a striker or on wing.

  27. Redtruth

    Arsenal fans are so spineless and are responsible for years of underachieving at Arsenal.

    Normal fans would voice their discontent from the stands and drive standards up if things were not goimg well on the pitch.

    Not Arsenal fans who stay silent and are content with mediocrity year in year out.

  28. Godfather

    When I think of the goalie gifts to Chelsea from Hull, Stoke and QPR … plus the points we choked away to Liverpool, Hull, Swansea …. Ahhh never mind, we.were the.architects of our own disaster this season.

    We justified the words that say:-” failure to prepare is preparing to fail…”

    Oh what could have been ….

  29. Chris d

    Jeez I do agree with red regarding Maureen , conned his way to making out he’s this great manager by selecting the richest clubs across Europe . I’ve said it before I’ll agree he’s this special one when he takes an Everton or a Valencia to a league title .

  30. Danny

    As Avram Grant said – “managing Chelsea is the easiest job in the world, Roman will buy for you whoever you want.”
    Mourinho great? He’s just a cunt.

  31. Bankz

    Keyser

    I still don’t subscribe to that theory of Chelsea being the main reason for our troubles.
    With smarter policies, a manager with better tactics, I think the gap is one that can be bridged.
    The gulf between us and Chelsea isn’t as insurmountable as you keep making everyone on legrove think.

    We’ve sat on our hands for a while and still don’t look like we want to push ourselves to the next level.
    Using Chelsea’s cash as an excuse is just a loser’s way of avoiding the challenge of actually challenging.

    It’s not even yet next season and from your theory,we don’t even have any hopes of challenging due to Chelsea’s cash

  32. El Tel 1

    1989

    George Graham took his team to the mighty Liverpool. They were a better team than any of Man utds title winning sides.

    It was looking like we had choked that season as we could have won the title before that final game.

    George did what NO other Manager could have done. His cheaply assembled team with many home grown players went there and beat them.

    Not only was that win the greatest ever football win of all time but it also put a stop to Liverpool who have only won one title since that day.

    Ask anyone what was the better reign Liverpool or Mancscum.

    Liverpool won all their titles against very strong opposition and without. Wait for it!

    SKY

  33. Midoki

    Theo as a CF? Why not?
    He would force the opposition to play deeper which could give our CM more space to do their magic… It isn’t all about the individual skill of a SINGLE FREAKING PLAYER!
    The real question is WHAT CAN HE DO FOR THE TEAM?
    Create space, driving runs which will draw fouls and penalties.
    Push opposition team backwards.
    Fastest counter attack in the EPL… maybe even in the world!

    TEAM over INDIVIDUAL FFS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  34. Redtruth

    Bankz

    Mindless rhetoric from Bankz.

    Smarter policies and a manager with better tactics do not exist at Arsenal.
    So that ends your pie in the sky argument!

  35. Blazer

    Chris d

    Just erase maureen and replace it with Guadiola and see what your comment looks like. You are just like people that insist that Ronaldo is better than Messi only because Messi has not played in england.

  36. Keyser

    Bankz – You’re not really saying much, you need to base your opinion on something, otherwise it’s just hollow.

    You used Barcelona as an example, it’s quite obviously a poor one, I can list differences for Arsenal if you want ?

    I use Chelsea as an example because they won the title, it’s not that I don’t think we have a chance, it’s how much of a chance we have.

    Mourinho chose to utilise a fraction of his resources, he chose to keep a small, tight and disciplined squad, he chose not to utilise loan players, he chose not to utilise award winning youth players, these are options he’ll still have available to him next year, options we don’t have.

    So compare how efficient he’s been, to how efficient we’d have to be to beat him.

    That’s before you add in United, Citeh, and then Liverpool and Tottenham.

    Do you want it in the same format as my earlier post ?

  37. roaaary

    Good post keyser. I think chelsea were at 80% this year and won quite efficiently.

    I think we are getting closer and personally im so happy with the playing style we have developed this year.

    I think our weakness is the lack of top top youth talent coming through. You need guys like that who dont demand to play but are avle to deputise. Bellerin was a revelation this year. Id have liked to have a few more ready for that step up.

    Our loanees are also on their way out the club rather than developing into potential starters

  38. roaaary

    Redruth you miserable git. You need some prozac to sort that head out. Never heard someone as downbeat as you pal

  39. bennydevito

    RedtruthMay 10, 2015 16:08:07
    That’s an insult comparing Mourinho to George Graham especially taking in to consideration Graham operated on a relatively small budget and turned average players in to very good team players whereas Mourinho is a total spendthrift relying on top players and a massive budget to achieve results.

    That’s more like it Redtruth, a sentiment I agree with and excellently summed up by El Tel 1.

    Now you’re bringing something to the table Redders.

  40. Honest Bill

    Remember the good ol’ days when we got linked to good players and we’d all just chuckle knowing full well we weren’t in for them?

    Now, you read about them and think… Well,we did buy Özil and Sanchez…

    Once again we are at the mercy of the rumour-mongers. It makes me feel dirty… Although i suppose i could just resist wanking to them… Oh who am i kidding? Kondogbia you say?

    zzzziiiiip

  41. Wallace

    pleased Fabianski’s doing so well at Swansea. go back 2yrs and Monreal, Jenkinson & Fab were 3 of le grove’s favourite whipping boys.

  42. Honest Bill

    Don’t worry. I always keep a tab open with Mongolian arse-fetish porn on it. You never know when someone might walk in… Seriously, the security at old people’s homes is virtually non-existent.

  43. london gunner

    Wallace

    Fabianski is a top lad!

    I think he is actually a very nice keeper and it looks like he has worked very hard to become the keeper he is today.

    Not to berate Ospina, but I prefer Fabianski to him.

  44. Wallace

    while nowhere near as gung ho as a few on here w/r/t what we need this summer, i think it would be wise to get any business done early. before Stoke bid 53m for Raheem Sterling and all hell breaks loose.

  45. karim

    OM come out of nowhere in the last 15 to win 2/1, sending Lyon straight to the CL, and putting pressure on Monaco for the last spot.

  46. Marko

    News we’re in for Kondogbia is brilliant. Him and Coquelin would be awesome together. Kog and Coq

  47. qna

    Marco: News we’re in for Kondogbia is brilliant. Him and Coquelin would be awesome together. Kog and Coq

    Kog? The K-dog and Coq? King Kong and his Coq. But yeah its very good news if true. Not sure who I prefer out of him and Gundagon, but I would be happy with either.

    Luke: Let’s sign Benzema, Pogba, Reus, and Cech and more too.

    I am with you there Luke. But I am not sure that it is a good idea to pay Pogba 385k/week. Not much talk of Reus moving at the moment. Thats probably a good thing really. Because if there was, we would be down the queue like we are with Pogba.

    I think we need to go in for some swap deals. Dortmund need to rebuild, so I think we should be trying to tee up a deal for Reus where we throw in some sweeteners to the pot. Gnabry, Podolski. Would Welbeck float their boat? Surely Walcott would tear it up in the Bundesliga, not to mention his marketing appeal.

    Dreaming of: Reus, Kongdogbia, Leno, Dybala and Daniele Rugani

  48. cheney10

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQS5FNfZrB8 Giroud can’t do this, nor can any of our forward line… And before we say Sanchez… He is one… As TH14 points out, we had 2 others who could fill in for him at the time… I agree that we could do with at least one out and out WC forward… Then we would use the others as and when i.e. Walcott, Welbz etc…

  49. Wallace

    Since then he(Chambers) has impressed in both positions, but Wenger feels the 20-year-old will gravitate towards the centre.

    “First, his stature [suits that position],” he said. “The fact he is intelligent and reads the game well, the fact that he’s more at ease in the middle.

    “On the flank, today you need more pace, more change of direction, more agility. He has the stamina, the power and the quality to be a central midfielder or a central defender.

    “He’s pretty much there. At the moment I have players who have more experience than he has [at centre back], but in pre-season I will play him there.”

    – i think it’s been obvious for a while that Chambers is better suited to the centre. there aren’t many players equally as comfortable at CB as they are in central midfield, but wonder if Wenger sees Chambers as cover for Coquelin, as well as back up for Mertesacker and Koscielny….

  50. qna

    Wallace. You usually post very positive Arsenal comments. Which is fine. But I dont know how you see this as positive. Its positively infuriating. This proves that Chambers was an absolutely ridiculous buy. For 16m for a 19 year old, you better be quite sure he is going to be worth at least 25m by the time he is 23, otherwise why not wait and see who develops and buy him then. When you buy a young player for big money, he better already have some proven ability in his position. Chambers had no pedigree as a CB. Right now, there are tens if not hundreds of 20 years olds that are better CBs than him and we already paid 16m for him.

    Chambers has never looked like being a modern right back.Everyone at Southampton new that Clyne was better than him and Clyne will go for more than that this season. The only thing that makes sense is he was bought as a CB. I have been waiting for the shoe to drop as to why we bought him and if this is it, its a fucking disgrace.

    So lets assume now that Wenger has decided to spend 16m on a CB. Are you kidding me? He better be the next John Terry and every club should know it. Why? Because there are tens of extremely talented CBs at that age that can be had at 10m to 12m and these guys are proven, playing first team football, 30 matches a season as CBs. Some playing in big leagues. This season we could get Rugani, Romagnoli, Dragovic, and Balanta, who would all cost less than 16m and are genuine CB talents. A guy like Rugani has numbers comparable to Koscielny already in Serie A. These guys are all about the same age as Chambers and actually likely to be the Vincent Kompany of the future that we are looking for. Last season he could have bought Laporte for what we paid for Chambers. He is now double. Anybody that saw him last season would have known for an absolute certainty that he is a stratosphere above Chambers as a CB.

    Wenger is so fucking arrogant with his, I will make a player bullshit.

  51. Wallace

    qna

    “For 16m for a 19 year old, you better be quite sure he is going to be worth at least 25m by the time he is 23, otherwise why not wait and see who develops and buy him then.”

    you’ve spent most of the past six weeks talking about getting young talents in early before their prices rocket, so the above’s a bit of a u-turn.

    the fact is when we played Chambers at CB at the beginning of the season he looked a fantastic prospect. strong, aggressive, good anticipation. good temperament…he struggled a bit at right back, partly because he’s probably a bit too big to play there, and partly i’d imagine as exhaustion set in, but i think the experience he’s gained this season will benefit him hugely in the long run.

    “So lets assume now that Wenger has decided to spend 16m on a CB. Are you kidding me? He better be the next John Terry and every club should know it. Why? Because there are tens of extremely talented CBs at that age that can be had at 10m to 12m and these guys are proven, playing first team football, 30 matches a season as CBs. Some playing in big leagues.”

    some playing in big leagues, eh? but what about Mangala at 32m, Lovren at 25m, Vermaelen – 15m…why are big clubs spending fortunes on these turkeys when, according to you, there are bucketloads of young CBs with talent to burn?

  52. Nasri's Mouth

    @qna

    I think you’re getting confused between his performances at RB where he was uninspiring and when he played at CB when he looked very good. FYI, Chambers played at CB when he was younger, so he did have a pedigree there.

    Economically, it makes better sense to spend £16m on him now, rather than more later on, esp. as you still have to spend money on a player in that position while you don’t have Chamv

    If there are literally 100s of better 20 year CBs than him, name me 30.

    Actually, instead, give the names to ManC, ManU, and Liverpool who have all spent more on CBs who aren’t extremely talented at all.

  53. Wallace

    qna

    “A guy like Rugani has numbers comparable to Koscielny already in Serie A.”

    how many top quality Italian defenders have moved to England? of those that have, how many have been an unqualified success? why do you think PL managers are reluctant to buy Italian defenders?

  54. Nasri's Mouth

    Wallace: Vermaelen – 15m

    lol, I’d forgotten about him,

    Yeah, qna should hire himself out as a scout. He’d make millions

  55. qna

    Wallace: you’ve spent most of the past six weeks talking about getting young talents in early before their prices rocket, so the above’s a bit of a u-turn.

    I stand by this too Wallace. I am saying that the scouting system at the club has failed incredibly if this is who they scouted as a CB. 16m is not the type of prices I am advocating for players who are unproven. I am talking about spending this much on guys like Bernd Leno, Jose Gaya (before he recently re-signed), Rugani, Romagnoli, and Balanta. I wouldnt be suprised if Fekir was around the 16m mark. I have no problem with us scouting players who are unproven like Chambers – but then his fee should reflect that. Chambers is more like a 5m player at the moment. When we signed Chambers I gave due respect to our scouting network, assuming that they know what they are doing. If this was their plan, and looking at the current outcome, they have failed miserably. You are only saying this because its Arsenal. If this was a Spurs or Liverpool buy, you would be agreeing with me. You just cant admit that.

    Wallace: the fact is when we played Chambers at CB at the beginning of the season he looked a fantastic prospect. strong, aggressive, good anticipation. good temperament…

    He looked ok. But he didnt look like a 16m CB. Like I said, look around at what you can get for that much. For fuck sake Laporte’s current buyout is 20m. He is 20 years old and a dead set CB star in the making.

    Wallace: he struggled a bit at right back, partly because he’s probably a bit too big to play there, and partly i’d imagine as exhaustion set in, but i think the experience he’s gained this season will benefit him hugely in the long run.

    Well, I dont know why we bought another right back. We bought Debuchy. I was absolutely excited by the chance to bring Bellerin through after hearing of his talent and his pace. We already had Jenks on loan. So why the fuck did we buy a right back. I thought for 16m, Wenger has seen another Oxlaide or Walcott here. But far from that is what we appear to have.

    Wallace: some playing in big leagues, eh? but what about Mangala at 32m, Lovren at 25m, Vermaelen – 15m…why are big clubs spending fortunes on these turkeys when, according to you, there are bucketloads of young CBs with talent to burn?

    Who is talking about that Wallace? Why are you trying to twist the conversation into that. We are talking about young CBs who play in big leagues that are valued at or less than what we paid for Chambers.

    And I am not saying there are bucket load of CBs with talent to burn. I am saying that Chambers is nothing special as a CB (or a RB) and there are bucket loads of CBs better than him. Chambers has not been any more special than our youth team CBs like Isaac Haydens. He has been given more opportunity for sure. But, he was nothing particularly special. If Brenda or Levy had spanked 16m on Chambers they would been absolutely smashed for it – and rightly so.

  56. qna

    NM: …. when he played at CB when he looked very good. FYI, Chambers played at CB when he was younger, so he did have a pedigree there.

    No he didnt have a pedigree there. He might have played there before as a kid, but a pedigree is playing first team football in that position and being recognized for your work there.

    He hasnt been an outstanding CB for us either. Whoscored has him playing CB for us 4 times. He certainly cannot be even talked about in the same breath as Rugani, Romagnoli, Dragovic, and Balanta. I am proud to distance myself and scouting opinions from anyone who says otherwise.

    NM: Wallace: Vermaelen – 15mlol, I’d forgotten about him, Yeah, qna should hire himself out as a scout. He’d make millions

    Yeah. Wallace twists the conversation into something I didnt even remotely say and you like that. Not suprising. That is your MO isnt it NM, cant argue the point so pick something in the conversation that is beside the point and try to argue that side point.

    Wallace: how many top quality Italian defenders have moved to England?

    That is because they haven’t wanted to come to England in the past. But they have consistently produced CBs that English defenders cant hold a candle too. But in any case, it was incidental that 2 of the defenders were Italians. How about the Frenchman Laporte, his buyout is reportedly 20m and there is not much chance Chambers will ever be the CB that Laporte will be.

  57. Wallace

    qna

    “I have no problem with us scouting players who are unproven like Chambers – but then his fee should reflect that. Chambers is more like a 5m player at the moment. When we signed Chambers I gave due respect to our scouting network, assuming that they know what they are doing. If this was their plan, and looking at the current outcome, they have failed miserably.”

    he made his debut for England as a 19yr old on the back of his performances at CB at the beginning of the season. you have a very short memory.

    also, it’s very rare for a CB at that age to be starting at a big club. Varane under Mourinho was an exception, and even he’s been a bit up and down in the two seasons since. Pique at Man Utd looked promising but it was only when he went back to Barca at 22/23 that he developed into a top CB.

  58. qna

    NM: If there are literally 100s of better 20 year CBs than him, name me 30.

    We would have to first agree on Chambers level wouldnt we. I think you could pick out a 20 year old defender CB from every first division club in the world and you would be hard pressed to be able to come up with a reason as to which was better Chambers or that player. Like I said, Chambers has done nothing as a CB. 4 games in first flight football. Please mother fucker.

  59. qna

    Wallace: he made his debut for England as a 19yr old on the back of his performances at CB at the beginning of the season. you have a very short memory.

    Are you serious? This was an absolute Joke in the first place. Its really the whole crux of the argument we are having. Arsene Wenger paid 16m for him, so he must be good. My arguments against him remain the same.

  60. Wallace

    qna

    i wasn’t twisting the conversation, you said there are lots of very talented young CBs around, and i asked if that was the case why were Barcelona spending 15m on a player who had spent most of the last 3 seasons injured.

  61. Nasri's Mouth

    qna: We are talking about young CBs who play in big leagues that are valued at or less than what we paid for Chambers.

    The problem with players who are VALUED at… is that it’s purely a subjective figure. Its all very well saying we could have bought ABC for £XXX but until the players are actually bought by another club for that fee, it’s pure speculation.

    What we do know is that big clubs like Barca, ManU, ManC and Liverpool have all spent on players who are either not as good or considerably more expensive than Chambers.

    If all these players that you cite are better options, why did none of them snap them up ?

  62. Nasri's Mouth

    qna: Like I said, Chambers has done nothing as a CB.

    But, when he played at CB he looked very good.

    Why are you ignoring this vital point ?

    He was getting excellent reviews when he played at CB

  63. qna

    Wallace/NM. Note that I have not been arguing against Chambers on this blog up until today. My argument today is in light of today’s post by Wallace which quotes Wenger of essentially saying he was bought as a CB.

    As to how the player is, I am not saying he is terrible. I am saying he is not worth a 16m punt as a CB. He may be a good player one day. I am also willing to give him time to prove himself. He is only 20 and I would say he has until 23 or 24 to make the decision NOW THAT WE HAVE BOUGHT HIM.

    But I am criticizing the decision to buy him in the first place. It is clear to me now, after seeing Chambers, that there were significantly better options in world football for a 19 year old CB with a price tag of 16m. Arsenal cannot compete with Chelsea and City if they continue to make these types of decisions.

    When we bought him I assumed, like I guess Roy Hodgson, that he was a much better player than he appears to be. I am absolutely in favour of us buying young English talent and looking for gems. But this has to be done in a way that is much smarter than what we are doing. So Wallace you are right in one of your comments today. But I am saying here they have seriously fucked up the process. Because if they are looking for a CB, then this was a stupid way to find one. Chambers was not a 16m CB.

  64. qna

    Wallace: i wasn’t twisting the conversation, you said there are lots of very talented young CBs around, and i asked if that was the case why were Barcelona spending 15m on a player who had spent most of the last 3 seasons injured.

    Because they werent looking for young CBs. They were looking for established players to go straight into the first team. It was not even close to what we were discussing. Chambers vs other young defenders is a completely different conversation to Vermaelen or Mangala.

  65. Nasri's Mouth

    qna: But I am criticizing the decision to buy him in the first place. It is clear to me now, after seeing Chambers, that there were significantly better options in world football for a 19 year old CB with a price tag of 16m.

    So lets have this list of significantly better options who went for £16m or less.

    That’s players who were actually sold, not players who you THINK would go for less.

    Because, mad as it might seem, sometimes players don’t want to move, esp. to another country when they’re young. Sometimes the club wont let them move, because they know they’re very good. Sometimes their agent tells them not to move because they know they’ll get a better deal at a bigger club in 1-2 years if they stay where they are

    30 should do it.

  66. Wallace

    qna

    he was Arsenal’s player of the month for August when he was playing at CB.

    and in October Szczesny said –

    “He looks very comfortable, whether you play him at right back or centre back. He is comfortable on the ball, he is comfortable defending and he is very strong as well. He has been a massive signing.”

    like NM said, i think you’re conveniently forgetting how good he looked the first few months.

  67. Swiss guns

    QNA
    He’s 19 and our 4th choice CB. Earlier this year everyone on this blog was pretty happy with his signing. Laughing at Manure spunking 35m up the wall on Shaw.

    Are you seriously getting upset about a perceived 11m overspend on a highly rated British talent?

    With all due respect, we can’t continually slate Wenger for not spending money and then presume to set the price on players when he does. Chambers is 99% not wasted money, nor did his purchase prevent us from get in our other business done last summer.

  68. Nasri's Mouth

    LOL,

    Mangala is only a completely different case to Chambers because a) he cost a lot more and looks rubbish and b) it disproves your argument

  69. qna

    NM: But, when he played at CB he looked very good. Why are you ignoring this vital point ?He was getting excellent reviews when he played at CB

    He played only 4 games there. Why are you ignoring that. Gibbs, Monreal and Debuchy were all preferred there when fit. Even Flamini from memory. Why are you ignoring that. Like I said, I am not calling him a donkey. I am saying he is not worth 16m for a 20yo CB. They guys that I mentioned, same age as Chambers, would have been preferred over Gibbs, Monreal and Debuchy. Same age. Same or less cost. All sames. Why are you not acknowledging this key point – my main point in the argument and giving me a counter argument to this?

    The only difference is Chambers is British. If you can agree with me on this, then we can summarise that we are prepared to take a hit in quality for the sake of him being British. Any underlying argument is that we cant afford to take these hits across the board when we are competing with Chelsea and City, who refuse to take these quality hits, AND who have more money to spend than us.

  70. Nasri's Mouth

    just seen this:

    qna: No he didnt have a pedigree there. He might have played there before as a kid, but a pedigree is playing first team football in that position and being recognized for your work there.

    He played there at youth level.

    Still, lets go with your point.

    Its interesting that our scouts are SO utterly shit that they managed to spot that a player who only had a ‘pedigree’ at RB actually turned out to be very good at CB.

    It’s almost as though they know what they’re doing isn’t it ?

  71. qna

    NM: So lets have this list of significantly better options who went for £16m or less. That’s players who were actually sold, not players who you THINK would go for less.

    I didnt have this in my mind last season NM, so I cant give you that list. But the players I have been mentioning were all available and 16m is huge, so I am confident it would have been enough for them. Last season we didnt need Chambers or any other 20yo CB. We needed a Gabriel (to replace TV5) in summer not winter and we needed a DM.

  72. qna

    Wallace: like NM said, i think you’re conveniently forgetting how good he looked the first few months.

    No I am not. I am not even saying he is a bad CB. I am saying for 16m, he should have already been a lot better than he is. This is not small money. Even Clyne who has had a season dominating at RB will likely only go for around this fee maybe 18-20m is what I am hearing. So, I am saying he looks ok, nothing special. We could have got something special, in the same age bracket as him. For example, Laporte who is also 20yo and has a buyout of 20m. If we had him in our squad, nobody would even be talking about us going out and buying another CB.

    NM: Mangala is only a completely different case to Chambers because a) he cost a lot more and looks rubbish and b) it disproves your argument

    This one is absolutely hilarious NM even from you. Pot stop being a self hating racist. Mangala is completely unrelated to the topic of buying a young player for development. Yet you have tried to pull him in to the conversation only because a) he cost a lot more and looks rubbish and b) it disproves your argument.

    Your a classic. Funny stuff mate. LOL stuff.

    NM: Its interesting that our scouts are SO utterly shit that they managed to spot that a player who only had a ‘pedigree’ at RB actually turned out to be very good at CB.

    Well, if that’s your measure of success spending 16m on a 20yo CB and he turns out to be just ok. Established CB that are proven sell for that much.

  73. Wallace

    qna

    “He played only 4 games there. Why are you ignoring that. Gibbs, Monreal and Debuchy were all preferred there when fit. Even Flamini from memory.”

    nope, he was moved to RB when Debuchy was ruled out. Monreal was playing CB when Chambers was at RB but that was only because the alternative was playing 19yr old Chambers at CB and a 19yr old Bellerin at RB. although with hindsight this might not have been such a bad idea…

  74. qna

    Wallace. And the 4 games part? This is the problem as well. These guys have a couple of good performances and they are elevated in stature beyond what they actually achieve. He is 20, so its too young for me to say he is not going to make it to the level of world class CB. But from what I have seen, he is a very rough diamond. I think its bad policy to spend 16m on a 19 year old CB who is at the level that Chambers currently is. I have not heard a single counter argument from the both of you other than he played a month of good football.

  75. Nasri's Mouth

    qna: I didnt have this in my mind last season NM, so I cant give you that list. But the players I have been mentioning were all available and 16m is huge, so I am confident it would have been enough for them.

    NO, I don’t want to hear about players YOU are confident would be sold for less than 16m.

    I want to hear about players who actually WERE SOLD for less than 16m.

    Come on, you said there were 100s earlier, you must be able to find some.

    This is getting funnier by the minute

  76. Nasri's Mouth

    qna: I think its bad policy to spend 16m on a 19 year old CB who is at the level that Chambers currently is. I have not heard a single counter argument from the both of you other than he played a month of good football.

    Before we offer a counter argument, you need to provide some evidence of your point.

    Hence why I keep asking for this list of 20 yr old (ish) players who were sold for less than Chambers.

  77. Nasri's Mouth

    qna: Well, if that’s your measure of success spending 16m on a 20yo CB and he turns out to be just ok. Established CB that are proven sell for that much.

    Ok, so which is Mangala ?

    Is he a youth prospect like Chambers or is he an established CB ?

  78. qna

    NM: Come on, you said there were 100s earlier, you must be able to find some

    I said there were hundreds playing at the level Chambers has played at. Chambers has done nothing. You could literally pick any 20 yo CB playing at a first division club in any country and argue he is better than Chambers.

    As for 19year old CBs that will sell for more than 16m. Why dont you name me some that would actually sell for that much. Practically every 19 year old CB on the planet, if and when they are sold, will sell for less than 16m. And I dont want to hear about your players dont get sold bullshit, because that is just how football works.

    NM: For the record, including the community shield, he’s played 8 games at CB this season.

    Whose record. Community shield is nothing more than a friendly. Means little more than the Emirates cup. Are you including those as well? Hey you might be able to call Sonogo a world class striker as well Nasri.

  79. Nasri's Mouth

    qna: This one is absolutely hilarious NM even from you. Pot stop being a self hating racist.

    Now you’re just losing it.

    I think it’s time you admitted you have no idea what you’re talking about

  80. Swiss guns

    The counter-argument is this:
    Using hindsight and setting arbitrary prices on players is just intellectually dishonest.

    Especially players as young as chambers, who will either progress or regress like any other player that age.
    The only argument from your side that makes sense is that we should have brought someone up from the the youth team instead of buying Chambers, but to quibble about a few million in our financial position is just weird.
    As well, holding up “magic bullet” names such as Laporte at that level is absurd. We were not signing a first teamer at all.

  81. Wallace

    qna

    “I think its bad policy to spend 16m on a 19 year old CB who is at the level that Chambers currently is.”

    i think this is where we disagree. i think the games he played at CB showed a very promising young player indeed. even at RB where he only really struggled towards the end, he showed a good understanding of when to attack, and was always a very pro-active presence. and he never hid when he was having a tough time.

  82. Nasri's Mouth

    qna: I said there were hundreds playing at the level Chambers has played at

    No you didn’t. You said better

    “Right now, there are tens if not hundreds of 20 years olds that are better CBs than him”

    qna: Chambers has done nothing.

    Apart from get picked for his country ahead of lots of other players who YOU STILL HAVEN’T LISTED

    qna: You could literally pick any 20 yo CB playing at a first division club in any country and argue he is better than Chambers.

    No, but apparently you could

    qna: As for 19year old CBs that will sell for more than 16m. Why dont you name me some that would actually sell for that much.

    LOL, I’m not the one arguing that Chambers “WAS AN ABSOLUTE RIDICULOUS BUY”

    You need to back up that statement, you have totally failed to do so. Once again you’re made yourself look stupid.

  83. qna

    NM: Before we offer a counter argument, you need to provide some evidence of your point.

    Listen to your arrogance. Hahah. Before you are willing to offer a counter…. blah blah. Who do you think you are. You were bullied a lot at school weren’t you and you think you have found a place where you are superior.

    We are just talking clown. All equals here. Your not siting high and mighty here mate.

    NM: Hence why I keep asking for this list of 20 yr old (ish) players who were sold for less than Chambers.

    Like I said. Give me this list of 19 yo CBs that have sold for more than 16m, like Chambers was. I have already given you the list of 20 year olds that are better than Chambers. I dont have to prove to you that they are worth less than 16m, because 99.999% of 20 year CBs are worth nothing close to 16m. I have even named Laporte for you who has a buyout of 20m. Varane sold for 5m when he was 18. I have gone more than half way for you here Nasri. Time to step off your high horse or just step off.

  84. Nasri's Mouth

    qna: i think this is where we disagree. i think the games he played at CB showed a very promising young player indeed.

    Indeed. He might not turn out to be world class / first class / top quality or whatever adjective you want to use, but those players go for £30m upwards.

    For £16m we’ve got a very promising young player who can be coached the way we want him to be.

    Seems a pretty decent piece of business to me to be honest.

  85. Nasri's Mouth

    qna: Listen to your arrogance. Hahah. Before you are willing to offer a counter…. blah blah. Who do you think you are. You were bullied a lot at school weren’t you and you think you have found a place where you are superior.

    LOL

    What are you on about ?

    Look, it’s basic debating principles.

    You put forward a point, so before someone needs to argue against it, you need to put forward some evidence, then I offer a counter argument.

    So, let’s have that evidence. Lets have that list of players. Put up or shut up

    Otherwise I just say you’re a fucking moron, you’ve only got a small cock, you’re ugly and your wife is shagging your best mate, and then claim it’s up to YOU to prove otherwise.

  86. Honest Bill

    So the lad only played 4 games in which he looked very good, and you think that small sample of games is enough for you to conclude that he isn’t as good as a bunch of foreign prospects you’ve most likely only read about?

    How on earth do you figure you know how good he is or isn’t if you’re only basing your opinion on 4 games wherein he looked really good?

    If he weren’t at Arsenal but some foreign team, you’d be on here telling us all how much better he is than whatever prospects we have, regardless of whether you had actually seen him play or not.

  87. Silverhawk

    qna: You could literally pick any 20 yo CB playing at a first division club in any country and argue he is better than Chambers.
    OK.. Mention the top 19yo cb in Estonia and let’s check if he’s better than Chambers or not

  88. qna

    NM: You put forward a point, so before someone needs to argue against it, you need to put forward some evidence, then I offer a counter argument.

    Again. You are talking with such arrogance. Like any poster has to put forward something to you, yet you do not have to put forward anything to them. You honestly don’t even see the narcissism of this do you.

    I always give arguments for my positions, and like our friend Keyser, I often ramble into many more paragraphs than needed to make them. If you want to argue with me then fine, but you cant set out the guidelines in which I have to argue with you.

    In any case, my position remains. If Arsenal spend 16m on a 20 yo then he better be world class, because if not, they have wasted money. As of now, he looks far from world class and it looks to be a complete failure by the scouting and recruitment network. He should already be a far superior CB than he has currently shown. By 20 many quality CBs have already demonstrated themselves to be a level above what Chambers is. But at the end of the day, arguing with you is pointless because we fundamentally disagree on what a world class player is. I say Arsenal has only Ozil, Sanchez and Cazorla remotely in this class, while you have most of our team in that category.

  89. qna

    HonestBill: So the lad only played 4 games in which he looked very good, and you think that small sample of games is enough for you to conclude that he isn’t as good as a bunch of foreign prospects you’ve most likely only read about?

    Yes, he looks an ungamely, naive CB who doesnt ooze class as say a Varane does. For 16m, I would expect this guy to be at the level of Varane.

    SilverHawk: Bro just admit that you made a mistake with that statement and let’s move on

    No. Chambers is not a CB yet. There are scores and scores of young CBs around the world that are already very good at what they do. If they got a chance at a high quality team that dominates possession and only need to perform for a handful of games, I have no doubt that we would see tens if not hundreds of performances the equal to what we have seen here. Not all of those players will go on to be great CBs. I doubt that Chambers will either. He will be like most Arsenal players another mid-tier player.

  90. Honest Bill

    Except he looked really good to everyone else. Basically you just don’t like him because Wenger bought him. He doesn’t ooze enough for you? In truth he just doesn’t have a sexy name or play for Real Madrid.

    Even if four games were a large enough sample to adequately judge a player, your evaluation is well off. He looked a great prospect. I’d fire your imaginary scouting network if i were you.

  91. Le Prof

    qna

    ‘Otherwise I just say you’re a fucking moron, you’ve only got a small cock, you’re ugly and your wife is shagging your best mate, and then claim it’s up to YOU to prove otherwise.’

    LOL Come on qna prove otherwise!!