Ozil and Sanchez. Challenges with both.

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Good morning sports fans.

It’s Tuesday morning. Last day at work for a bit. So I’ll mostly be contributing nothing today. This is my second article of the day. That’s passion for Arsenal.

Anyway, some great debate caused yesterday by all of the Ozil and Sanchez talk.

Few things I want to address. Firstly, the stats issue. Football fans are geeks. We’re given the basic tools to drill into the detail about player performance. So we draw insights from numbers and  generally, most football fans look at numbers in isolation. They also don’t interrogate the data and where it comes from.

I know that football teams data analysts at game code as they go. That’s why managers right notes on the side. If Rodgers sees a wide attack on the left on 27minutes, he’ll pen WA27. Then before half time, he’ll give his notes over and pull up the key moments. So football clubs leave details up to human eye. I don’t know how the freesites work. But you’d imagine it’s not far off that.

Here are a few things that popped up yesterday that I’d question.

> Ozil ran the most distance in the Everton game. Ok, it’s an impressive stat. Where did it come from? What was the speed? How much energy was exerted?

> Ozil contributed the most sprints out of any player that played in midweek. Again, questions would be, what constitutes a sprint (guy behind a desk scoring the game, or a computer programme), which way were the sprints, what distance were the sprints over.

> Ozil makes more defensive interceptions / tackles than Giroud. Ok, where is the stat that points to Giroud terrorising the back four of a team. Where are the defensive sprints included? Is there a stat for the amount of times Giroud closes down space and forces an error without touching the ball? Because on the face of it, it looks like Ozil defends better than Giroud when your eyes will tell you different.

I know that football clubs will have far richer data, way better technology and in the main… far superior analysts than those on the web. So they’ll be getting the data. But my big thing with amateur analysis of data is you can cut it anyway you want to tell a story. When the numbers are quite primitive, it’s really hard to draw conclusions. I guess that’s why teams hire GPS companies and on site statisticians to look at what they do. You can actually get under the skin of the data…

Also, another point I wanted to cover off is that the English can’t deal with a footballer like Ozil. Like, somehow, no one appreciates him because he doesn’t play like David Batty. I think this is totally wrong. People take issue with Ozil because the only shift he puts in is going forward. I think if you compare how he plays versus someone like Cesc (another technically gifted dreamboat) then you can see where I’m going. I know they’re not the same player. I wish they were. Because then we’d be in a better situation.

Alexis Sanchez is about as Roy of the Rovers as you get… but he’s starting to grate on people who see that he’s not much of a team player. He looks out for himself. He loses possession in important areas. He runs through players when he could play a simple pass. He’s a bit selfish. He needs to be controlled… but what I love is his intensity. That’s a Premier League trait. Santi has that as well. Ozil doesn’t, but perhaps he needs to find a bit if we’re serious about winning trophies.

Also, isn’t it about time we cut the bullshit about the Premier League not be technically supreme? Pound for pound, it’s the strongest league in the world by a margin. Don’t kid yourself it’s just a league of thugs. It’s littered with top players, smart coaches and smart systems.

Right, that’s me done. Alex will takeover tomorrow with James dropping a Thursday match report.

HAVE A GOOD DAY x

 

370 Responses to “Ozil and Sanchez. Challenges with both.”

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  1. Romford Ozil Pele

    Pedro, naturally i’d dispute your notion of Ozil RE energy. He gets back into position but occupies space rather than directly looking to lunge in and win the ball back earlier. I wouldn’t say there’s any direct formula for being astute defensively.

  2. Romford Ozil Pele

    “People take issue with Ozil because the only shift he puts in is going forward.”

    I’d dispute this to, he doesn’t. But you’d rather him channeling his efforts going back than going forward, considering he’s an attacking player primarily and we’ll be in possession of the ball more often than not.

  3. OnlyCameToSeeEboue

    I still stand by my point yesterday that if your intent is to improve your stats, you dont outrun everyone else on the pitch. Thats a pretty damn difficult thing to do.

  4. @snoekrats

    Hi Pedro

    I think the point some people might be making re the stats is that a player like Ozil can be deceiving in that he doesn’t look like he is giving everything.

    Even when sprinting it looks like he is jogging its only when he outpaces players that you realise he is sprinting.

    Just a thought. Also I can’t remember Cesc being the most defensive minded player ever.

    I think we should consider totally stopping these ozil vs desc comparisons it serves no purpose whatsoever.

    Point is would we be much higher up the league table with desc? I doubt that. We have no problem with assists we have issues putting away the chances.

  5. Romford Ozil Pele

    RE Alexis, agree with Paulinho’s points from yesterday. He did say when we signed him that he struggles unless he’s the main man. We’ve seen for Chile and Udinese that he thrives in this role. In the first half of the season he was given a free role and his talents flourished, yet our league position didn’t. Since the return of others we’ve been much more consistent and are now third but Alexis is struggling. You can see the pattern. Seems to struggle to asser himself as much when he’s not the main man. Obviously still a key player but needs to improve in combination.

  6. Wallace

    there might be an issue w/r/t Sanchez and overall team play, but i think it’s also worth taking into account that he got injured and then his form dipped a little just as the others came back. i think we need to give it a while longer before we make any definitive judgements.

  7. Bankz

    Romford & azed

    Admit it…show some love.
    I’m wenger’s “love child” you know.
    How can you both support Arsenal & not love Wenger’s love child?

  8. Romford Ozil Pele

    “i think we need to give it a while longer before we make any definitive judgements.”

    Naturally. But then these claims Paulinho made were before Alexis joined Arsenal. Primarily that Alexis struggles when he’s not the main man, as seen at Barca. Whenever there are good passing moves, he’s rarely involved. And the stark contrast between his home and away form.

  9. Wallace

    i’m fine with him trying to make things happen in the final third. i guess it impacts on Theo as you can’t have both wingers coughing up possession so frequently, but i’m sure the Cazorla/Ozil/Giroud/Sanchez combination can be effective.

  10. Muyiwa

    Romford, Banks.

    There won’t be so much noise about Özil’s work rate/defending if we had proper specialist DM’s.
    It all points back to Arsene if you ask me.
    Why shunt the world’s best #10 out wide?
    Why buy him if he doesn’t suit your style of play?

    If he doesnt last more than an hourbin Spain, how the heck is he supposed to last 40 in the EPL?

    Why buy Giroud when we could have taken Mandzukic (a far better player) off Bayern.

    Wenger seems to have a hard on for useless strikers. Cue Sir-No-Goal.
    How do you explain going from TH14 & DB10 to Chamakh, Giroud,Sanogo?
    And pls don’t quote finances.

  11. Romford Ozil Pele

    “If he doesnt last more than an hourbin Spain, how the heck is he supposed to last 40 in the EPL?”

    I don’t really get this about Ozil only playing 60 mins? It’s just another myth. Mou used to sub Ozil because the game was won more often than not so he was preserving him. Ozil played a few 120 min games in humid temps at the World Cup so the notion that he gets tired easily seems another fallacy to me.

    Muiway, agree about DMs though. I’m one of those who advocates the use of two DMs. That way if you want to play with more forwards who are likely to relinquish possession more, you need a couple mopping up behind them. I like how Saints have Schneiderlin-Wanyama. Would be interesting to see us try something similar like Kondogbia/Schneiderlin – Le Coq.

  12. Carts

    You see, the problem with stats is very simply – what the numbers tell you is in fact what has occured numerically. However, the way in which that person projects themselves can make the stats look like a pile of shit.

    In most cases Ozil is guilty of this.

    There was a time when pass completion was the way to determine a players involvement in ‘said’ minutes. Then one genious woke up one morning and was like:

    ‘Nah fuck off, that cheating cunt made not one forward pass’. ‘Right let’s start tabulating forward passes from now on’.

    Then what we found was quite intersting, I’m assuming. Certain players simply didn’t add very much to a team in the way of strategic advancement.

    So you either got more involved and moved the ball forward or a superior player would come in and take your place. *the birth of the foreign imports, me thinks*.

    Take Guillermo Rigondeaux, the guy is a pure boxer. Unbeaten; and pretty much schools his opponents into, usually, a unanimous points victory.

    He rarely wastes a punch (in Ozil’s case, a pass), he usually finds his target (as does Ozil when playing a through ball) and more so, come the end of the contest, his stats will paint a glossy picture unless you were, of course, blind (in Ozil’s case – distant allegedly covered, pass completion, key passes etc etc).

    You see, the problem with Rigondeaux is that his mass market appeal is in the same category as chick peas. You’d never go out and buy a tin of the stuff, but given to you as a complimentary starter alongside some wholemeal pitta, you wouldn’t say no.

    Rigondeaux couldn’t even sell out a 5 person tent if his upcoming fight was being advertised on Skysport. P4P best Bantamweight boxer but zero market appeal.

    Ozil is very good at what he does, but the greater issue, here, is the “entertainment” value that comes with him. This Sport. Sport is entertainment. If you are not entertained then you’ll lose interest in the sport of the player for that matter. And I think that’s what is becoming apparent with Ozil.

    Granted he didn’t decide his fate or his price tag but for £42m, based on what £42m represents in sport, Real Madrid done well.

    On a lighter note: I’ve noticed Ozil has found his shouting boots too.

    One of the main thing that used to piss me off with him was his lack of attempt on goal. Romford told me a story that Ozil isn’t the shooting type. *Fair to say he’d be a boring porn actor 0_0

  13. Romford Ozil Pele

    “Romford told me a story that Ozil isn’t the shooting type. *Fair to say he’d be a boring porn actor 0_0”

    Lol. It’s only ever been my main gripe with him. He doesn’t have the thirst for it which isn’t to say he doesn’t have the ability. He has fantastic technique as we’ve seen but generally prefers setting someone up, must be in his blood. Has shown more of a propensity for shooting at Arsenal, probably because he isn’t surrounded my people who court the glory as much.

  14. SpanishDave

    I really dont think Ozil wants to be at Arsenal. It was a last minute thing when he came as a reaction to Bale.
    Thats why sometimes ge doesnt seem interested and after Real Madrid he knows there wont be any PL medals to add to his collection.

  15. Carts

    Sanchez is an absolute beast of a player. I think he’s someone we’ve been missing for yonkers.

    But what has really pissed me of is the management of him, as an individual.

    It was inevitable that his output would slow down. Obvious to every man and his dog. It was a matter of time before a muscular injury would catch up with him too. Lucky it wasn’t an ACL or something – as we know when the body is tired the signal between the brain to the…yeah you know the rest. He, imho, played far too many minutes necessary.

    I could not careless if Sanchez didn’t want to take the rest days etc. If a manager tell his player to go home and rest, you do it. This isn’t a fucking debate. If you decide to rest a player you do it. End of. Fuck your feelings, mate. No player, unless Messi or Ronaldo should have the weight to determine their position in a team.

    I didn’t even realise it has already been 9 games since he last scored. Not overly bothered either.

    Point of the matter is that Arsenal, with their dire injury record over the years, should take a more thorough approach towards player rotation and rest. We are in no fucking position to play any player over and over for 90 mins.

    The red zone has a penchant of “sneaking up” on our players. Oh, or is Wenger going to tell me that so-and-so was already in the red zone but I decided to keep him on till the 87th min?

    That’s negligence then, right?

    I mean, you wouldn’t continue up the M1, to Leeds, pedal to the floor, if your car was overheating would you? Thus why persist with certain players KNOWING full well that the long term effect could be severe if their not administered the kind of post match recovery needed?!

  16. Dissenter

    Surprise, surprise.

    Rumford Ozil Pele is defending Mesut Ozil no matter what.

    Rumford, you’re objective about most things here except Ozil.

  17. Emiratesstroller

    Stats can be deceptive, but there are some statistics about, which I do believe.

    1. Ozil moves around the pitch more than any other Arsenal player. You will find him during a game on either the left or right wing, deep in midfield, central position or even where the striker should be.

    2. I do believe that Ozil is one of the most effective passers of a ball. However, the work that he does is not always glamorous, but whether you are rose
    tinted about him or a critic one statistic does not lie and that he does make a
    lot of assists.

    3. I believe also that Ozil is a highly intelligent football and that is something
    lacking with a lot of other players in our squad.

    3. I accept that he does not score enough goals. Perhaps there is some validity
    in that argument, but that has a lot to do with him being an unselfish player who more often than not choses to pass to someone who isin a better position to himself.

    4. I agree also that Ozil does not put in a big enough defensive shift in many games, but that is unfortunately a criticism of a lot of other players as well.

  18. Carts

    RP – of late he’s been attempting a few shots on goal. I’m pretty sure a goal was scored on the back of Ozil forcing the keeper to parry a shot.

    And yes, he is technically sound, and I can only imagine shooting should be second nature to him. However his key passes, seem more likely to create a goal than him simply shooting – which I can understand

  19. Dissenter

    Ozil used to score from shooting when he was still playing for Bremen.

    He regressed when he was in Madrid, that was the wrong move for him football-wise. It’s earned him his mega-deal at Arsenal but he is a far cry from the player that excited the entire football planet in the 2010 world cup.

    I look at Couthino’s fantastic goals and just wonder if we will ever get goals like that from Mesut. He was scoring those type of goals for fun before he went to Madrid.

  20. Hitchy

    Interesting point about in-game coding Pedro. Makes sense to be able to change a game plan at halftime or try and keep pressurizing a certain player.

    As we saw in the Swansea match Montero ruined Chambers and they put the ball to him as many times as possible. Yet our right winger offered no extra support to counter this, you’d imagine the accuracy of setting up a game plan can hinge on seeing these moments again at halftime and reacting accordingly.

    Smart Manager + Smart use of Data = Better results.

  21. Romford Ozil Pele

    “Rumford Ozil Pele is defending Mesut Ozil no matter what.”

    Because people try to highlight him as the bulk of our problems. And you missed when I criticised him after the Monaco performance last week, but hey, agendas and all that.

    I’ve never once painted him out to be flawless. Just don’t like the way he’s picked on as an easy target. “Oh but he cost £42m” Is that his fault? Maybe you should be asking why the manager is waiting until the final day of the Transfer window before deciding to move for players. “Oh but he isn’t good enough defensively.” Not the best but not the worst either. He’s an attacking player first and foremost so it’s natural that’ll be the weaker side of his game. Maybe we should ask why these supposes hindrances weren’t exposed at Madrid. Defending was a problem for Arsenal long before Ozil joined and as long as Wenger remains, it’ll continue to be.

    He’s an easy target. Funny how when he was out of the team we were languishing in 7th/8th but we’re now 3rd. But he’s shit.

  22. Ustynobaba

    With the way this whole Ozil debacle is going am beginning to think that he will be sold sooner than later except another manager comes in,cos the look of things it seem Wenger is yet to bring out the best in him,IMHO i think Ozil problem is highlighted cos of our balance or lack of,at RM he had Kehdira and Alonzo who did the defensive thing and allowed him and the others forward players to attack and if we compare Arteta and maybe Flamini we are definitely going to have problem with the team,so what we are seeing is exactly what we will keep seeing until the balance of the team is corrected and beside that might not be with Wenger who will always leave some holes open for another transfer window

  23. Romford Ozil Pele

    “He regressed when he was in Madrid”

    Erm, while at Madrid he was the most creative player in world football mate. Regress. Yeah ok. As for Coutinho, great talent as he is. He’s just the flavour of the month. In recent times it’s been Barkley, Siggurdsson, Mata. It’ll move on again though I do rate Coutinho highly.

  24. Bigper

    The ozil stats were reported on sky sports so id say they are legit.

    Really ozil is a specialised cam so either play him there to get the best out of him or just sell him

    For me it is more wengers problem for not using ozil properly though

    I do agree he could be abit stronger on the ball and he should use his ability to accelerate quickly more as well, I feel like he holds himself back at times, think he is lacking confidence with all the pressure on him

    Anyway, gk, cb, dm, and St are all more of a problem than Ozil.

  25. gambon

    Re Ozil – hes rubbish. people point to some mythical stuff he does, and insist only football geniuses/hipsters can appreciate his influence. Its bollocks. He gets assists, of course he does, he’s playing in a top team and he doesnt even try when he doesnt have the ball….anyone would get assists in these circumstances. He also takes a lot of set pieces.

    But as Pedro often says….at a top team you have to either put in a shift, or leave and play for Valencia/Lyon/Zenit.

    Its not just ability that sets aside big teams. Effort, fitness and desire make top teams. When you have loads of ability with little desire and appilication you get Madrid circa 2006/7/8 etc

    re Alexis. He does lose the ball but thats the price you pay for trying to be influential. The more you try to do in attack the more you will lose the ball. You can only really afford one such player in your team, but the only problem with Alexis is getting his scoring touch back again.

  26. Goondawg

    Fact is, most people here cry foul when they see Ozil and Giroud in the starting line-up, cursing Wenger and all that, but me? I quietly grow in confidence

    As ROP said when Ozil and Giroud were out, we were languishing in 7th or 8th. Now we are battling for second

  27. Romford Ozil Pele

    “people point to some mythical stuff he does”

    like what?

    “he’s playing in a top team”

    Oh, we’re a top team now?

    He’s rubbish but yet look at the teams he’s played for? He’s rubbish but yet his fellow professionals never have a bad word to say about him? Couldn’t give it a shit if he doesn’t court the limelight/want to be the main man. He improves the collective and that’s the main thing, even if it’s not direct.

    I said in November when we were struggling that if Ozil was fit, we’d have 5-10 more points. For all Alexis’ graft and effort, he doesn’t have the ability to elevate the level of his teammates. Ozil’s main strength. Lol rubbish you know.

  28. Klaus Stein

    “I’m suddenly realising that Arsenal is boring and I’ve got other things to do – anyone else feel the same?” …. Amazing quote added to an article about … well … Arsenal.

  29. Romford Ozil Pele

    Lahm: ‘Anybody who has played with Mesut knows what an exceptional player he is,’ Lahm said. ‘He has been a success wherever he has played – and he is the dream for any attacking players – because he finds space and passes that very few players in the world are able to see.

    ‘He is one of the most gifted and intelligent players in Europe – and I think his assist record says everything you need to know about him.’

  30. gambon

    “Ozil is too subtle a player for your thick head to comprehend Gambon”

    Haha….see what i mean.

    Football hipsters lol.

  31. DUIFG

    my main issue with ozil is when he stinks the place up he really stinks it up, same with og in that respect.

    at least with someone like santi you know u are going to get a base level performance, cant say that with ozil, its like he is not there.

  32. Wallace

    Madrid are the biggest, most illustrious club on the planet. they don’t buy shit players. you’ve got to be pretty ungodly just to make the match day squad. Ozil managed that easily while also having teammates with egos the size of planets who loved playing with him. and believe me – great players hate playing with average players.

  33. Goondawg

    “He doesnt try when we have the ball?”

    I’d say this is when he comes to life. He always makes runs with meanings. They always open up passing channels for his team mates even if he has no intention of receiving the ball. He covers a helluva lot of area as well, when we are in possession. Have a closer look next time, and mute the bias commentatators. Like Gary Neville against Monacco, he was bashing Ozil, yet praising Berbatovs languid style and how he always plays to his tempo. Dafuq with dat logic

  34. DUIFG

    this sanchez bollocks is so silly, if we had a payer like markovic filling in on the flank you know we would be harping on about somebody more direct like sanchez, get a top player then moan, dont get it.

  35. Wallace

    “my main issue with ozil is when he stinks the place up he really stinks it up, same with og in that respect.”

    so why have we picked up more PL points than anyone bar Liverpool since they both came back from injury?

  36. Vince

    Ozil needs runners ahead of him,
    Ozil needs better defensive midfielders behind him,
    Isn’t it about time we stop pandering to Ozil’s unending needs and build our team with standalone players who can play with or without the limitations around them?

  37. gambon

    Romford

    We are 3rd in the table, We have scored the 3rd most in the PL.

    We have the best 3 year record against shit teams (any non top 7 team)

    Of course we can be regarded as a “top team”

    Anyone can do well.

    What the “mesut is so brillian – in subtle ways” crowd dont talk about is who is actually top of the ‘Assists per PL game’ table.

  38. Romford Ozil Pele

    Mourinho is a favourite of many on here. His say on Ozil:

    “I think it’s hard to criticise him, because Ozil is Ozil,” Mourinho said.

    “If you were expecting Ozil to be super aggressive and to be running miles and miles from side to side and to show great enthusiasm and aggressiveness, this is not Mesut.

    “If you are waiting for somebody where every time he touches the ball, the ball smiles, every time he makes a pass, the ball goes with the right direction, the right speed, the right intensity, this is Ozil.

    “When he’s on the pitch, every time he touches the ball, it is beautiful. And he’ll always finds the right man on the right place.

    “He is a special player.”

  39. karaul

    gambon

    so you would sell ozil and do what? give me lazy can´t shoot can´t defend ozil over eriksen any time

  40. Romford Ozil Pele

    “Also, if Ozil is so great why did Madrid want to offload him?”

    Lol because they love having their dick-waving contest each summer. They’ve also sold Robben, Sneijder, Di Maria, Makele (HUGE loss) amonst many others. So Real Madrid selling someone is now indicative of their quality? baseless argument. Try harder.

  41. DUIFG

    underapreciated fact santi has the second most assists of anybody bar cesc in the time ozil has been here, we will only appreciate santi the day he leaves

  42. Dissenter

    The Ozil that burst onto the world stage at the 2010 World cup was a more rounded player that the Arsenal version we are seeing.
    He was full, of dribbling, shooting and of course assists.

    He went to Madrid where EVERYTHING has to go through Ronaldo, he had to become a “specialist” supplying Ronaldo.
    He is less of an attacking player now. I know the likes of Romford will disagree because he still gets his assists.
    I’m mot taking that away from him. He’s a master at assists, the pass to Rosicky for the second goal is the height of football intelligence. Oxlade wouldn’t have looked up before passing.

    He needs to reinvent himself again to help Arsenal. He’s intelligent enough to do it.
    The question is does he care enough with Wenger’s lack of tactical clarity?

  43. karaul

    “if Ozil is so great why did Madrid want to offload him?”

    because they have to buy new superstar player every year, no matter what is best for them?

  44. Goondawg

    It’s defending that lets him down. But I’ve noticed that while it looks like he is doing nothing. He is always positioning himself in between the man and the goal. So whilst appearing not to be doing anything, hes still preventing the ball from reaching a dangerous area simply by being in the way. He is fast enough, not to get dribbled past, and in isolated situations one on one, the attacker normally passes the ball away.

    My criticism, is sometimes he shies away from the tackle, like he is scared of contact or something.

  45. Romford Ozil Pele

    “Isn’t it about time we stop pandering to Ozil’s unending needs”

    At no point have we actually done this. Plus, I’ve never advocated building a side round him. Just because he’s played as a number 10 doesn’t mean he’s been the focal point of our attacks.

  46. OnlyCameToSeeEboue

    “Ozil is rubbish”

    My goodness. Silly season has arrived. I’m signing out for the day.

  47. Romford Ozil Pele

    Ramos on Ozil: ‘Ozil would be the very last player who I would sell from Real Madrid, if it was up to me. I don’t understand this.

    Arbeloa on Ozil: ‘He’s very different, there’s no player like him in the world. He makes the difference on the pitch.’

    But he’s rubbish.

  48. Romford Ozil Pele

    Pires: “If I had to compare Ozil with someone I played with in my career, I think I would say that he has a bit of Zinedine Zidane in him, in terms of vision, touch and genius to make others play around him.”

    Lol but he’s rubbish.

  49. Leedsgunner

    Trust me if we had a proper CF who could finish no one would be complaining about Özil. He was definitely off colour versus Monaco (and was rightly slammed for it) but our team imho is definitely stronger with him in it than out of it.

  50. Dissenter

    “Ozil needs runners ahead of him,
    Ozil needs better defensive midfielders behind him,
    Isn’t it about time we stop pandering to Ozil’s unending needs and build our team with standalone players who can play with or without the limitations around them?”.

    Vince, you’ve encapsulated my thoughts about Ozi’.
    I’m sick and tired of the lack of accountability that pervades the pro-arguments to excuse Ozil’s weaknesses.

    Like any other supposed world class player. He has to step up and reinvent himself. People here pander to him like he’s some mind of messiah.
    He’s a limited player because he only does a singular thing well. The modern game has gone beyond that.

    Ozil’s assist-only approach for an attacking midfielder is what poacher-strikers like Berbatov or Paolo Rossi are to strikers…

    They are restricted and limited in the modern game. That’s why Mourhino ditched Mata and SAF got rid of Berbatov..

  51. Wallace

    DUIFG

    “wallace, why are we out of the champions league after 1 leg?”

    have they cancelled the 2nd leg? and to be fair to Giroud he’s been excellent for the most part since he returned from injury. still think we’ll run them close in Monaco.

  52. Romford Ozil Pele

    “Ozil’s assist-only approach for an attacking midfielder”

    Lol so now a playmaker shouldn’t assist? What next? Make 5 crucial defensive interventions per game. Re-invention at its finest.

  53. Goondawg

    If Ozil played with a smile on his face no one would call him shit. If he started screaming, and was confrontational, pumping his chest, we would all be in awe of this mythical beast. He produces assists with ease, without the need of a World Class Striker. Opponents hate seeing him have the ball, as he will create attacking openings given half a chance.

    You should see him when he is waiting for the ball. His off-the-ball movement is magical. He will take 2-3 subtle little steps, but when he gets the ball he WILL always create space for himself.

    Two flaws, his defensive technique is non-existent. I’ve never seen him make a slide tackle, but we didnt buy him for that so I dont care. And the second is his demeanour, his bitch face looks like he doesnt give a shit, but that is false, and it pisses me off when commentators like Owen slate him for that. Its just his goddamn face ffs

  54. Romford Ozil Pele

    Goondwag, exactly.

    Let’s not forget that after the WC final, which player’s shirt did Michel Platini request? But he’s shit.

    Bye Gambon.

  55. karim

    .“If you are waiting for somebody where every time he touches the ball, the ball smiles, every time he makes a pass, the ball goes with the right direction, the right speed, the right intensity, this is Ozil. “When he’s on the pitch, every time he touches the ball, it is beautiful. And he’ll always finds the right man on the right place. “He is a special player.”

    Sorry that was Zinedine Zidane

  56. Dissenter

    Rumford,
    You really want to build a squad around Ozil.
    You build a squad around leaders not players who don’t trackback or help the team with the dirty stuff.

    Sorry, you don’t build around Ozil.
    He’s world class all right but his attributes aren’t the foundations for a proper team. He’s one that hides in big games. He’s the one that first drops his head because he misses a bloody penalty.

    Ozil is the 12 carat diamond on the gold ring that adorns the finger. He is neither the fingers nor the hand that holds the finger. He’s the cherry atop the ice cream.

  57. Vince

    Romford.
    Because people try to highlight him as the bulk of our problems.

    maybe that’s because he really is. I’m not denying he gets the odd pass right and stuffs, but he’s largely a passenger and this team can’t afford that. That is why it’s difficult or impossible to defend him when he doesn’t score a goal or makes an assist – because he does little or nothing aside those. He’s the reason why we’ll cede possession to teams like Crystal Palace. He just doesn’t have the presence. who will you rather have in your midfield between Rosicky and Ozil. For me Rosicky every single time. and that isn’t because he’s been scoring more of late but because even when he isn’t scoring you can see what he is doing. He puts himself about intelligently, tackles, harass the daylight out of the opponent, start our attacks no matter how easy it is to pass backwards. and don’t get me started on Ozil’s shooting, for a top team’s playmaker that’s simply abysmal. Ozil isn’t working for Arsenal. let’s accept that and move on.

  58. Romford Ozil Pele

    “You really want to build a squad around Ozil.”

    NO. I said above I didn’t. It’s like you just gloss past what I say. I don’t want to build around ANYBODY. What’s this infatuation with having someone as the focal point?

  59. Paulinho

    Ozil has still been disappointing(imo) when it comes to what he’s supposed to excel at. Against Monaco he ballsed up a pass to Bellerin who had gotten himself in between the full back and centre back; playing it to his left foot when Bellerin clearly wanted it ahead of him and onto his right.

    It’s things like that he should be nailing and he’s not.

  60. gambon

    Romford

    Yes, that is absolute proof of how great Ozil is.

    Sold by Madrid cos they didnt like him, couldnt hold down a central position at Arsenal.

    I think the utterly embarrassing performances in any half-tough game say a lot more than Michel Platinis shirt preference.

    Bye Romford.

  61. karim

    RP

    Said he made his decision but will only tell us soon. Yawn
    Waiting to see if Deschamps calls him for the Brazil game at the end of March imo

    Also said his father wants him here cuz he s a gooner ( Dad )

    Also said he d like to first assist Lacazette in the new stadium

  62. Romford Ozil Pele

    “maybe that’s because he really is.”

    Lol how exactly? We win more with him in the team than when he’s not in the team. He’s a passenger because he doesn’t touch the ball at every opportunity? You know there are different ways of influencing a game, right?

    “He’s the reason why we’ll cede possession to teams like Crystal Palace”
    Lord give me strength.

    “Ozil isn’t working for Arsenal.”
    Says you. Forgive me if I gloss over this opinion. He’s working fine.

  63. Dissenter

    Romford,
    ““Ozil’s assist-only approach for an attacking midfielder”

    Lol so now a playmaker shouldn’t assist? What next? Make 5 crucial defensive interventions per game. Re-invention at its finest”

    Apply your standards for a proper defensive midfielder to Ozil. You’ve said many times that your ideal DMF has to be able to move the ball in addition to being a shield for the back four.
    Don’t you think the same standard should apply to Ozil i.e multifunctional or more than just assists.

  64. Goondawg

    Its not even about building a team around Ozil. ITs just basic building of a balanced spine of our team. A GK, who preferrably doesnt smoke and has good stature to cope with the robustness of the league. Like a Cb who is also a battler and a leader, and isnt slow as shit. A competent DM who is also a leader, athletic, imposing, can tackle and distribute the ball fairly well. A world class striker, that can lead the front line. A manager with a certain degree of flexible tactical nous, but also shows ambition. You add Ozil to that mix and we are winning titles IMO, because he is a WC player. No doubt

  65. Romford Ozil Pele

    “Yes, that is absolute proof of how great Ozil is.”

    Lol so a load of great players talking about how great Ozil is, isn’t proof?

    “Sold by Madrid cos they didnt like him, couldnt hold down a central position at Arsenal.”

    “I think the utterly embarrassing performances in any half-tough game say a lot more than Michel Platinis shirt preference.”
    Your arguments are always baseless. And when I prove them wrong you just come back with this empty rhetoric. Try harder.

    Err, no. Sold by Madrid because it’s what they do. They sell stars all the time. You highlight one player when this has been happening each summer over the past decade.

  66. Wallace

    on the weekend we move to within 4pts of 2nd place after 3mths of solid results le grove has our two best players in the naughty corner taking a kicking 😉

  67. Romford Ozil Pele

    Paulinho, yeah that was poor. More the exception to the rule though. Acknowledged everything against Monaco was poor against Monaco. But more often than not, the passing is flawless. He can’t held accountable for Giroud’s geriatric nature.

    “Don’t you think the same standard should apply to Ozil i.e multifunctional or more than just assists.”
    But he does? he completes over 2 dribbles per game. He shoot (albeit not a lot). So just because it hasn’t met your requirement doesn’t mean it’s not multi-functional.

  68. Goondawg

    Ozil is a conductor, you dont slate him for the string quartet not turning up or cos the tuba guy shat himself

  69. Vince

    His say on Ozil:“I think it’s hard to criticise him, because Ozil is Ozil,” Mourinho said.“

    Mourinho will say Metersacker is world class just to spite Wenger for achieving nothing with the world class players he has.

    and listing people that think Oil is a football genius doesn’t help your argument. Mourinho thought Gael Kalkuta was something special. The English press, people supposedly more knowledgeable about the game thought Wilshire was Gascoigne’s reincarnation.

  70. Bamford10

    The Ozil debate still? This one will simply not go away. A couple of things:

    1. While I admire your spirited defense of him, RP, Ozil was forced to play wide in the latter days of his time at Madrid. He was no longer regarded as their best CAM.

    2. The Ozil we have seen at Arsenal is not the Ozil who dazzled the world in 2010 or who buzzed about with the ball at his feet for two years after that. Why this is, I don’t know, but no question he is not that player.

    3. Watch the runs Ozil makes carefully in our next game. You’ll see that his runs are more those of a second forward than a CAM. This helps to explain (1) why he doesn’t have the ball at his feet more often a la playmakers like Silva, Fabregas or Coutinho, (2) why his ground covered stats look as they do and (3) why he often looks tired.

    Perhaps we’re misusing him, frankly.

    4. There are things he just doesn’t do, e.g., hit 30-40 yard balls, tackle, battle, or strike the ball from 25 yards out. These are things the best players in the world can and do do.

    5. His attitude is crap at times. Watch his face in games where things aren’t going our way, and think back to his refusal to applaud the way fans after the City match last year.

    I like Ozil, but he isn’t what he was, and I think Silva, Fabregas and Coutinho are all better CAMs than he is at moment.

  71. Goondawg

    I think everyone was shit against Monacco. Sanchez especially, like when he loses the ball, you just dont do that, when the other team is relying on the counter. Mertesacker, Ospina, even Cazorla were all arguably worse or just as bad. Dont get me started on Giroud, we should have been home safe and dry at halftime if he put away those chances. But fair enough, its easy to singularly criticise when justified by a 42.5m price tag.

  72. Leedsgunner

    I appreciate Özil as a player but there is one criticism that rings true. He disappears in big games. He needs to step it up and make his mark in big games. In this regard I miss players like PV4, DB10 and Freddie. They seemed to thrive in the limelight and bigger the occasion, bigger their intensity. Therefore as they raised their game, they dragged up others with them.

    Mesut seems to retreat more into his shell when the crucial matches comes around. This needs to stop.

    Someone needs to sit down with Mesut and counsel him that because of his transfer fee, he is by financial default a target of scrutiny. It might be unfair but it is the way of the modern world. It is in the big games where fans, sponsors and pundits demand that you justify your transfer fee.

    True, he didn’t asked to be sold for the amount he was but he needs to step up and display the class that he has in the big games. The criticism might be unfair but the quickest way to silence the critics is to perform in the big games.

    For example Mesut do you want to earn the love of AFC fans everywhere? — step up and assist the team in taking down United twice this month… it would be a great start.

  73. Dream10

    Romford

    I think one of our biggest issues (along with a #1 GK and a top striker or two) is that we can’t control the midfield area. If we play a 4-3-3, we don’t have three midfielders who can patrol that area on their own. If we have three competent central midfielders who are capable of doing their job, the ones ahead can do theirs w/out having to do another role most of the time.

  74. Romford Ozil Pele

    “and listing people that think Oil is a football genius doesn’t help your argument”

    Lol why not? You think great players talking about another great player should be dispelled? Why do you think they are talking about him?

    Mourinho managed Ozil at Madrid, you think he wouldn’t know him better than anyone else?

  75. Carts

    Nice post Bamford.

    I too would take Cesc and Silva over Ozil. Coutinho is in a rich vein of form so I’m curious to see how long he’ll maintain it.

    Between Coutinho, Sterling and Lallana, they’re keeping greedy guts Sturridge on the bench.

  76. Romford Ozil Pele

    “1. While I admire your spirited defense of him, RP, Ozil was forced to play wide in the latter days of his time at Madrid. He was no longer regarded as their best CAM.”

    Erm no. In each of his 3 seasons at Madrid, he played 10 when Mou played 4-2-3-1. The only times he played wide was when Mourinho switched to a 4-3-3, mostly because he had no idea of how to beat Barca.

    “2. The Ozil we have seen at Arsenal is not the Ozil who dazzled the world in 2010 or who buzzed about with the ball at his feet for two years after that. Why this is, I don’t know, but no question he is not that player.”

    Look at the set-ups of the two former teams and look at ours. Primarly he’s always played in counter-attacking teams. That’s not to say he can’t play in a possession-based team but as you get older, things change, you adapt to situations differently.

  77. blsany

    Ozil will literally buy you hours if he is on the pitch and make the right .He is top top player.Sanchez with all his huff an puff will never make his team mates better.Ozil needs players with the same footballing inteligence as he has.Rather sell Sanchez than him.

  78. Romford Ozil Pele

    “This helps to explain (1) why he doesn’t have the ball at his feet more often a la playmakers like Silva, Fabregas or Coutinho, (2) why his ground covered stats look as they do and (3) why he often looks tired.”

    This has always been his style. Look at the average amount he touched a ball per game at Madrid. It wasn’t a lot. I don’t know why people are shocked. Actually I do, it’s because they barely watched him. There is no specific blueprint for a playmaker. Because Ozil interprets it differently doesn’t make it right or wrong.

    “5. His attitude is crap at times. Watch his face in games where things aren’t going our way, and think back to his refusal to applaud the way fans after the City match last year.”

    His attitude isn’t crap. He can’t help his facial expressions can he? If his natural look is that of disdain, what can he do? He’s been on record many times saying he enjoys Arsenal and enjoys London life. Why people want to read more into it is anyone’s guess.

    Agree what he did against City was bad but he was rightly scolded for that. You move on.

  79. Romford Ozil Pele

    Leeds – it’s not really a case of retreating into his shell. Mesut is a quiet lad by nature. As Mourinho said, you can’t all of a sudden expect him to start being aggressive and run round at 100mph, it’s just not him. We’re generally turgid in big games so why we target one player is anyone’s guess, it’s a team game.

  80. Romford Ozil Pele

    Dream – I’d prefer two rather than three, that’s a bit too defensive for me. But the two would be very defensive minded and very deep.

  81. Bamford10

    Wow, Romford. Ozil is clearly a religion for you. I don’t think you’re being objective, reasonable or honest. And I watched him plenty at Madrid.

    Good luck with your missionary project. 😉

  82. Goondawg

    “4. There are things he just doesn’t do, e.g., hit 30-40 yard balls, tackle, battle, or strike the ball from 25 yards out. These are things the best players in the world can and do do.”

    Not sure Messi and Ronaldo are known for their battling and tackling skills. Jesus we bought Ozil to be our primary CAM not fucking robocop

  83. Goondawg

    Why must Ozil hit 30-40 yard hollywood balls? Just because he doesnt do it, doesnt mean he is incapable. Sometimes simpler is better. His low level ground assists are very effective, he was dubbed King of Assists at one point.. Jeez

  84. Romford Ozil Pele

    “Ozil is clearly a religion for you”

    It really isn’t. I provide answers to people’s statements and then they have nothing to come back with, it’s not my fault. I’ve never tried to paint him as the perfect player, never said he doesn’t have his flaws. But I maintain he’s a great player, Arsenal are better with him in it and he’ll be key for us going forward. I just don’t like the way football in general seems to have a distrust/no love for introverts. We paid a big amount so he’s expected to be our star but he’s not that type of player. He just likes to quietly go about his job – and it doesn’t fit the narrative because of the fee we paid for him.

  85. Ozy

    You have world class professional players and top managers praising Ozil ….

    Then you have a bunch of Le Grove readers with cheeto dust on their fingers saying he’s rubbish.

    Speaks for itself, really.

  86. Leedsgunner

    Leeds – it’s not really a case of retreating into his shell. Mesut is a quiet lad by nature. As Mourinho said, you can’t all of a sudden expect him to start being aggressive and run round at 100mph, it’s just not him. We’re generally turgid in big games so why we target one player is anyone’s guess, it’s a team game.

    RP — I’m not trying to say he needs to change his personality.

    Rather he needs to use his quiet calm personality to his advantage. In big games when we are behind and panic is starting to settle in, he needs to step up and take possession of the ball and start dictating the play in our favour by making that incisive pass to the teammate making that run in the box or pass that gives us a clear shot at goal. In terms of spotting making making passes he has it in his locker so he needs to play to his strengths.

    In this regard I think it would be good if Özil and Sanchez worked out a strategy between them — because in many ways they complement each other because their individual weaknesses are the other person’s strengths. When the ship is going down — because of their superior skill and class it is up to Alexis and Mesut to turn it around. That’s why paid what we did for them — for players like them to be game-changers when our backs are to the wall.

    I’m not picking Özil mate, I love the guy in AFC colours! 😉

  87. blsany

    When Ozil has the ball all of our players just stand 5 metres from him.no one ever makes run away from the ball.Look out for that next time.Those are the moments he craves.i hope we don’t sell him and bring in competent manager.Simeone would give him everything he needs to thrive.Wenger gives him tools get by.

  88. karim

    I’m not gutted because of his price tag but because he’s not the Ozil I used to admire.
    Maybe that s down to him not being suited to the league, end of.
    Yeah he s got a bag of assists and classy touches but I definitely expected better.
    Like that Napoli performance.

  89. Bamford10

    Right, because 30-40 yard balls that spring players or switch the field, change the point of attack are “Hollywood” passes.

    You’re clueless, mate.

  90. Dissenter

    Vince,
    Thanks for bursting the name dropping that happens when Ozil gets criticized.
    Dropping the quotes of famous personalities isn’t gonna cut it.

    Another annoying comeback for Ozil is that you cannot criticize him because he won the world cup with Germany.

    The Ozil that lost the semifinals to Spain in the 2010 world cup was a braver, more purposeful and better rounded player that the post- Madrid version we’ve got.

    I don’t think Madrid helped his development.

  91. gambon

    Ozy

    What about Michael Ballack (pretty good player) saying Ozil has lost it and needs to do much better?

    Ignore that im assuming.

  92. Ozy

    Bamford, you think you can have a discussion without insulting a person?

    “4. There are things he just doesn’t do, e.g., hit 30-40 yard balls, tackle, battle, or strike the ball from 25 yards out. These are things the best players in the world can and do do.”

    Shit. You guys know we signed Ozil, right? Not a prototype for the most perfect player in the world, manufactured in a hidden lab in Ukraine? Can even Messi do all of that?

    And nice use of “do do” heh.

  93. Leedsgunner

    “When Ozil has the ball all of our players just stand 5 metres from him.no one ever makes run away from the ball.Look out for that next time.”

    … except Ramsey. Last year when he was in good form Rambo aways made those runs and Mesut picked him out. Hopefully this injury has give Ramsey a breather and the hunger back… because back early in February — man he looked jaded.

  94. Wallace

    Bamford

    the only teams with midfielders who regularly hit 20-30yd passes are the long ball ones – Man Utd & Chelsea. you’ll very rarely see an Arsenal, City or Liverpool(minus Gerrard) player trying them.

  95. Carts

    “You have world class professional players and top managers praising Ozil”

    *licks cheetos dust off of fingers*

    Most of us are basing our opinions on Ozil with what we’ve witnesses during his tenure, not from Football Manager. Or is what some of us have witnessed a lie?

  96. MidwestGun

    He’s the reason why we’ll cede possession to teams like Crystal Palace”
    ____________
    Sanchez leads the League in getting dispossessed and is top 5 in unsuccessful touches. Not Ozil. Perhaps you have your players confused?

    Fact is Sanchez, Santi, Ozil, and Le Coq are our 4 best players right now. Deal with it how you will.

  97. Dream10

    karim

    you don’t see that Ozil you love because our setup is a a problem. We have Cazorla and Coquelin in the DM area. We have Sanchez on one side when he does not want to be a winger (always wants to be on the ball centrally). Then you have Welbeck on the other side. Can play wide, but not good offensively. Finally, you have Giroud as the #9.
    Only Giroud, Coquelin and now Cazorla are in a position where they can be effective. Sanchez and Welbeck are not effective wide players.

  98. Ozy

    Gambon, those his exact words, huh? That he lost it?

    I do remember him criticizing him, with good reason. Of course you have to acknowledge that. But show me the exact quote where he says Ozil has “lost it” or in any way indicates Ozil is rubbish. If you do, I’ll bite my tongue.

    And why do you refuse to refute Romford’s argument of all the great players Real Madrid have sold? Because you do like that argument, the “why did RM let him go then?” Come on. Enlighten us.

  99. Goondawg

    Ozil is capable of “30-40 yard balls that spring players or switch the field, change the point of attack”.. But just because the media fawns over these type of beckham assists more than the simple fantastic ground assists which he is more renown for, doesnt make it any less important in my eyes. An assist is an assist end of the day

  100. blsany

    If we ever want to see the best out of Ozil.There is no place for the likes Wilshere and Ramsey in CM let alone Flamini and Arteta.Sanchez is one of the most selfish players i have ever seen.Giroud is a donkey,Per is finished.Welbeck championshpi level.Walcott -one dimensional.Ox -no courage,no end product.Wenger is a loser.Change all these players then moan at Ozil.

  101. underrated Coq

    Mesut Ozil is a wonderful player, no doubt the most talented player at Arsenal.

    I think what most people want to see is a bit more of urgency in his game. His languid style sometimes makes it seem as if he’s lagging in pace/tempo from the rest of the players.

    Compared to last season however, I do believe he has added a little bit of urgency to his game. And contrary to what Bamford10 claims, Ozil is taking shots from 25-30 yards( Theo scored a rebound from Ozil’s scorcher against Leichester).

    People should also be more accepting of the high possibility of Ozil never ever showing Sanchez-like urgency/ enthusiasm in his game. That is simply not the way he’s played football. And in my opinion, that’s not really a problem.

    You can’t have too many Sanchez-like players in a football team. It’ll all be frenetic and chaotic then. You also need calm players like Ozil to maintain balance in the team.

  102. gambon

    “Shit. You guys know we signed Ozil, right? Not a prototype for the most perfect player in the world, manufactured in a hidden lab in Ukraine? Can even Messi do all of that?”

    So why did we spend £42m on a player that can only do one thing…..play 10 yard passes (provided players make runs)

    is that not the most limited player in the history of football?

    Cant score goals
    Cant play long balls
    Cant tackle
    Wont even try to defend
    Useless in big games
    Bottler in pressure situations

    So what exactly is he good for?

    Assists and the odd goal against shit teams? Wow, what a bargain.

    And whats hilarious is that we declined the chance to sign Cesc to give this clown a sense of security.

  103. Crusaderrabbit

    Understand it’s hard to find stuff to write or debate about every week, but it makes little sense to me to argue on here about which player is performing or not (minus a few obvious candidates who shouldn’t be anywhere near the team).

    With Wenger in charge it’s all completely moot – like debating about how you should arrange your furniture when your house hasn’t got a f@cking roof on it. It’s completely impossible to realistically analyse our squad when it’s so badly trained and managed, and assembled. We’ve lost so many good players and indulged so many shite ones because of the way he runs the club like no other manager would – working out who we should have in the team and where under his regime is like trying to pick which meal you want from a menu that’s smeared in shit

  104. karim

    Dream

    Maybe then, but I hate when I expect him to lose the ball cuz he always does, the same with the shoulder challenges.
    Hard to thrive in this league if you lack the required fighting spirit imo.

  105. Romford Ozil Pele

    “Cant score goals”

    Well yeah he can as has been evidenced since his return. He isn’t prolific, sure. But then he’s never been.

    “Cant play long balls”

    Well yeah he can but then he’s not required to. The ball is kept on the floor more often than not but there have been various instances where he’s switched play. Again, baseless stuff.

    “Cant tackle
    Wont even try to defend”

    Well yeah he does. You just choose not to see it. Or he doesn’t do it enough for your liking.

    “Useless in big games
    Bottler in pressure situations”

    This is a team thing rather than down to one personnel. If he was this big bottler then surely it’d make sense for all his managers to stop picking him. If he was this big bottler, he wouldn’t have won titles/cups wherever he’s been, no?

    “And whats hilarious is that we declined the chance to sign Cesc to give this clown a sense of security.”

    Lol it’s funny you say this. You ask why Madrid sold Ozil but then never apply this same logic to Cesc. Ozil CHOSE to leave Madrid. He’s alluded as much. Cesc was forced out of Barca because he couldn’t adapt.

  106. gambon

    I think what is very much obvious is that there’s no place for Ozil is the team when we play big PL games, or tough CL games.

    he’s a bottler, a wimp, and a shirker in terms of responsibility.

    In the big games there is no room for them.

    So that for me means he should be sold.

    Sure Ozil can do well against shit teams, but so could a lot of players in our set-up.

    Give me a player that is 7/10 every day rather than Ozil who fluctuates from 9/10 down to 0/10 whenever its a big game.

    Its ridiculous to have a £140k per week player that cost £42m, that has to sit out every big/tough game….but thats exactly what we’re facing with Ozil.

  107. Goondawg

    Anti-Ozil camp firmly spouting bollocks again. We didnt spend 42 million on Ozil for him to score goals or make tackles. Even though he has added both to his game in his recent form, since coming back to injury. We spent 42 mill on him to create chances after chances. Pre-Ozil we were so boring, creating nothing, hardly scoring as much, but boasted all the possession in the world. We were starved of creativity, and we bought Ozil to turn that possession into gilted chances. And we have done that.

    The big games Ozil has been singled out as being useless in, I’d go as far as to argue, the whole team including the manager are equally as guilty of being useless. But Ozils price tag and body language makes him an easy target

  108. Romford Ozil Pele

    “Its ridiculous to have a £140k per week player that cost £42m, that has to sit out every big/tough game….but thats exactly what we’re facing with Ozil.”

    Lol we were shit in big games long before Ozil arrived so why you target him is anyone’s guess. You know very well that it’s a collective issue.

  109. Ozy

    Gambon, like to jump from argument to argument when you have no rebuttal, huh? Where are the Ballack quotes? I looked them up. I see him criticizing his attitude, body language, telling him to work harder, that he should have stayed at Madrid… nothing about how he’s “lost it”

    But that’s how you argue, I guess.

    As to him being limited, what exactly did you expect from him? You all claim to have been there in person for his every single RM game, Werder Bremen game (Dissenter calling him a goal scorer at WB – hahaha), Schalke.. when he played football as a kid with his dad in his backyard… why the sheer horror and shock that he won’t throw himself in for a crunching tackle? He should be clearing headers too, right?

    Shit, for 42 million, he should be helping Ospina out on goal. What the fuck is he doing? #LeGroveLogic

  110. Romford Ozil Pele

    “The big games Ozil has been singled out as being useless in, I’d go as far as to argue, the whole team including the manager are equally as guilty of being useless. But Ozils price tag and body language makes him an easy target”

    Agreed.

  111. Romford Ozil Pele

    Exactly. The dude was bought to create but now he needs to be Busquets and Messi rolled into one as well. Ozy, I like that one. #LeGrovelogic

  112. gambon

    Goondawg

    Joey Barton, Gylfi Sigurdsson and Stewart Downing have all created more chances per game than Ozil.

    In fact there are 11 players who have created more.

    Note that these other guys didnt cost £42m.

  113. Romford Ozil Pele

    “In fact there are 11 players who have created more.”

    Lol maybe because Ozil missed over 3 months of football.

  114. Carts

    Look, some of us can defend Ozil till the messiah returns, but proof of the matter is he doesn’t offer anywhere near enough outouts for £42m.

    You can tell a lot about the Ozil debate based on the for and against arguments. I don’t remember this kind of debate around Zidane, Cesc or any other top CAM or player.

  115. Goondawg

    Ozil is our most talented player. So instead of getting rid of the less talented and buying better like Giroud / Welbeck / Walcott / Arteta / Flamini / Mertesacker / Gibbs / Gks we should get rid of our best player. Joke

    Would Ozil still be regarded as shit, if we had a team of more quality?? Would having an inferior player than Ozil, suddenly make the aforementioned players become World class? Somehow, I dont agree with that logic

  116. Goondawg

    Joey Barton, Gylfi Sigurdsson and Stewart Downing have all created more chances per game than Ozil.

    HAHAHAHA

  117. gambon

    ““The big games Ozil has been singled out as being useless in, I’d go as far as to argue, the whole team including the manager are equally as guilty of being useless. But Ozils price tag and body language makes him an easy target”

    The guy cost more than any player in the clubs history, he earns more than anyone.

    You think this is some socialist bullshit where everyone has the same expectations?

    Ozil either needs to do more, or earn less….which one?

    What a stupid post. So Ronaldo should be able to look around the Madrid team and work out that the average player scored 4 goals per season and put his feet up 2 games into the season once he reaches this benchmark?

    A CEO of a business should roll in at 9, leave at 5.30 cos thats what the factory staff do?

    Ridiculous logic.

  118. Carts

    “Anti-Ozil camp firmly spouting bollocks again. We didnt spend 42 million on Ozil for him to score goals or make tackles”

    “Anti-Ozil camp firmly spouting bollocks again. We didnt spend 42 million on Ozil for him to score goals or make tackles”

    But that’s the thing though – we could’ve got someone for half the price – both salary and transfer fee – who would’ve provided the same outputs.

  119. Romford Ozil Pele

    “but proof of the matter is he doesn’t offer anywhere near enough outouts for £42m.”

    The market is a shitfest, this is what happens when you have people like David Luiz going for 50m euros. Money is so big nowadays that you have to pay over and above. Considering what others have gone for, he’s well worth the money. We bought him on the last day of the transfer window… Maybe we need to be questioning our illustrious leader as to why this was the case. When you’ve left it until the last minute, you only have yourself to blame when you pay over-inflated fees.

    “I don’t remember this kind of debate around Zidane, Cesc or any other top CAM or player.”

    Well when Zidane was playing we didn’t have blogs/forum. Football wasn’t scrutinised to every detail like it is today. Technology/social media play a massive part. We now have access to players/stats etc 24/7 so yeah there will be more scrutinising of certain players.

    Also I remember back in the day when Cesc was here and Ozil was at madrid, people used to say stuff like Cesc isn’t even in the same ballpark as Ozil. People are very knee-jerk, change opinions daily. It’s the modern world we live in.

  120. vicky

    I do not think LVG, Mourinho, Pochettino , Pellegrini spend hours thinking how to stop Ozil when they play against us. Listen. Wenger is generally very generous in praising our players. If my memory serves me right, he has not been effusive in his praise for Mesut either. Yeah, he does make good passes but overall does not quite make a huge difference to the team. In big games, he goes completely missing. How can a supposedly world class player go missing against big teams ?? He has a decent tally of assists but you can’s say he has won matches for us on his own. Cazorla has won matches for us, Sanchez has won matches for us, even Rosicky has despite being 34-35.

    He has talent but got to say he does not do enough. And regarding the argument that ROP made that since his arrival, we have gone up the table…. well I would argue that’s more down to the fact that we have a near fit squad, a half decent DM in Le Coq, absence of Jack and anyway we generally perform well in the 2nd half of a season .

  121. Ozy

    “Wenger, spend more money, you cunt!!”
    “Wenger, 42 million for Ozil?! That’s too much, you cunt!”

    -Spend 42 mil on Ozil-
    “The price tag determines ability! He’s not worth that! He’s shit!”

    -Spend £9.6 million for Giroud-
    “Why is Giroud so useless?! 15 goals isn’t good enough! Why isn’t he world class?! Let me ignore my own mentality of what his price tag would imply his abilities should be, fuck him!!”

    -Barcelona sells Fabregas-
    “He’s so fucking good, we should have bought him back.”

    -Real Madrid sells Ozil-
    “Why did RM sell him? He’s rubbish, that’s why”

    #LeGroveLogic

  122. Romford Ozil Pele

    “The guy cost more than any player in the clubs history, he earns more than anyone.”

    We’ve been over this. Did he ask to be bought for £42m? Ask Wenger why we left our business to the final day of the transfer window.