Meritocratic managerial appointments | Winston Reid a target

by .

'This grass is a little bit short'

A fun day of football that worked for all concerned. Spurs were beaten by Newcastle who just can’t seem to sack Alan Pardew, the bugger always pulls it out the bag when his job is publicly put on the line. Then in the evening, United grappled a last gasp point from a resolute Chelsea side.

Is that the awakening of United? Doubtful, but it did serve as a warning. They played much better than I’ve seen them play in a while and they certainly played with an energy and tactical astuteness to make me think they’ll cause is problems when we play them in a few weeks.

Didn’t take long for LVG to start with the public slayings… this is him on Robin.

“He did a stupid reaction after the goal”

“You can be excited but don’t have to pull your shirt off.

Arsenal need to take the down time this week to get some freshness back in the legs. This isn’t an opportunity for more intensity. This is an opportunity for reflection on our performances. It’s a chance to assess our tactical failings. It’s also a massive chance to rotate some excitement back into our squad.

The two games we have coming up, in Hull and Anderlecht, are perfect opps for us to bring in some fresh blood. If you can’t rest your best players against Burnley, when can you?

United have quite a tough run into the Arsenal game. Palace and City. We have one extra game, which is a burner. But what can you do? The price of not bombing out of the Champions League is more games. As ol’ Brendan is finding out at Liverpool.

We have to bring in Joel Campbell, Lukas and Rosicky into the next game. Not just to inject freshness into our weary team, but also to give some motivation to the players on the fringe who will be massively important for the run in.

In other news, we’re starting hear the links to new centre backs coming thick and fast. The hottest name I can share is the name I mentioned in the summer. Winston Reid is appealing to Arsenal because he’s 26, he’s a contract rebel and he’s a leader for West Ham. He’d be a bit of a coup for me. No bedding in period, relatively cheap and eager to prove he can make it at the highest level.

It’s going to be tough landing a big name. People like John Stones would have been of interest before his price tag shot up to English premium levels. You can talk about Mats Hummels until you’re blue in the face, simple fact is, big clubs don’t sell their best players in January unless there’s a totally outrageous fee attached. I’d love to rely on our scouting network to bail us out here, but those guys are the reason we don’t have a decent offering.

If it were me, I’d just hand over the transfer dealings to Ivan. He nailed the WELBZ signing in a morning. Just give him a list, or better, let him compile his own list.

NO, have a competition on the website where everyone selects their favourite option and the most popular, we go big for? Crowd sourced transfer planning. It’s the future. It’s here. It’s so now.

There’s some talk about Pedro moving to us because he’s handed in a transfer request. Really can’t buy into this. The last player we need is Pedro. Top talent, but what’s the point in putting cash behind a position you’re fine in. We need a Matic and a centre back before we start entertaining the luxury positions.

Finally, Jurgen Klopp appears to be struggling at Dortmund. 6 loses in 10. Tragic. Looks like his pressing game has been rumbled. I raised the prospect that in 3 years time, he might not be the man for us. Some claimed that was fickle. For me, that’s a dim point to make. You have to constantly reassess who is working and who isn’t. Having a singular view of the world regardless of a change in variables is the reason we’re in such a hole at the moment. Football is changing rapidly, the weakest now have strength, the most adaptable are surviving and conquering…

What’s interesting with Klopp is that he had a winning formula and it appears he hasn’t adapted it. Sure, he’s been hit by player sales, but mistakes have crept into his set up. The injury pile up is Arsene Wenger like. That’s the problem with winning. It can make you arrogant and complacent. You have to always kill the formula, because in any game, once you have a winning technique, it’s dead. You need to constantly strive to improve. The best do it when they’re winning, the managers that don’t go onto Ferguson like greatness fail to adapt and die.

Will Klopp adapt? I hope so. He’s such a character and his passion is incredibly infectious. He has a challenge on his hands though, he can’t leave that until he’s masterminded the resurgence of Dortmund. I hope he does it then takes over at Arsenal.

The football revolution is so exciting to watch. This is a real golden era. The evolution of the game over the last 5 years has been incredible. The smartest in the room are now disrupting the game. Football is starting to lose the dinosaurs, we’re starting to see meritocratic appointments that sit outside how great your career was. It’s so refreshing. Long may it continue!

HAVE A GOOD DAY

392 Responses to “Meritocratic managerial appointments | Winston Reid a target”

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  1. salparadisenyc

    Im not one for looking back, and Song is just that. Dude had a chance to bite the forbidden Barca fruit and leapt at it. Would rather Schneiderlin, Bender, Carvalho, Khedira and several others. Im still pissed Flamini is here, although it was fun a hot second.

  2. Jeff

    Another test for Rednapp. He must be absolutely dreading it. What if they lose again?

    Mid, on the weight of the law of averages alone, I’m going for a QPR win (without betting any money of course) something like 1:0.

  3. MidwestGun

    Jeff –
    Don’t know how it works there but for the most part even professional builders rent the expensive tool. It’s too cost prohibitive to own tools u rarely use. But we have rental centers everywhere, not sure about UK.

  4. Dissenter

    Nasri’s mouth/Salparaise,

    I don’t have anything against Song.

    Due to Wenger’s brinkmanship/dithering, we ended up with a concerted Attacking midfielder [Arteta] and a mediocre Flamini in two consecutive summer transfer windows.

    Song would have been the perfect re-signing. He returning from training week in-week out, with really elite midfielders at Barca. He wont have cost us anyomore than we sold him for.

    He would have been a great signing. He wont have needed time to bed in and he knows the Wenger way already. He can also play CB. Its a no-brainer for me.
    I’ll have considered the Barca experience a loan move.

  5. Jeff

    Mid,

    Trust me renting tools is also expensive. I rented a compactor for a day – wasn’t even delivered, I put it into the back of my car (with help because the things is very very heavy). The cost was £60. I only needed a few hours with it. But I don’t generally hire tools if they are small and are sure to be used again and again.

  6. nasri's mouth

    I think its unlikely Jenks will come back.

    But with a good season under his belt he’ll go for good money, and he’s lived the dream so it’s a win win for everyone.

  7. Dissenter

    I apologize to the omissions and typos in my last post.
    *converted attacking midfielder NOT concerted
    *He is returning NOT He returning

  8. nasri's mouth

    @Dissenter

    I think Song is a talented player. I think he also has the ingredients that a modern DM needs, (is he can pass the ball as well as tackle) which is why Wenger liked him in the first place. For me though he just didn’t have the dedication or the discipline for the role.
    Maybe he’s learnt that, or maybe he’s just got new team enthusiasm, but if we brought him back and he hadn’t improved, then in 9 months time we’d all be calling Wenger an idiot for doing it.
    Pedro also dropped some pretty big hints about personality issues too. Maybe they were just put out there to soften the blow of selling him or maybe he’s a divisive figure in the dressing room in which case Wenger ain’t having him back no way

  9. london gunner

    I find it funny how Pedro today has said exactly what I have been saying about Klopp but when I say I am an arsehole and everyone tries to cunt me off with sarcastic remarks. Well sorry boys I am right as usual so fuck you.

    “Finally, Jurgen Klopp appears to be struggling at Dortmund. 6 loses in 10. Tragic. Looks like his pressing game has been rumbled. I raised the prospect that in 3 years time, he might not be the man for us.”

    “What’s interesting with Klopp is that he had a winning formula and it appears he hasn’t adapted it.”

    Exactly what I have been saying that he has not adapted his gegenpressing and thus people no how to counter him. Its not rocket science I understand this yet the Klopp fan boys refuse to.

    Ps Pedro why can I not post comments?

  10. nasri's mouth

    @ London gunner

    Its too early to write him off I think, though if he hasn’t found solutions by the end of the season then I think we can say he has been over rated. If that happens I’m not quite sure what those people (*) who said signing Klopp was a no brainer will say. Probably pretend they always wanted Simeone instead 😉

    * includes me

  11. N5

    london, maybe read Pedros comments a few comments into the day where he states he’s not saying Klopp is a bad manager just that he’s having a bad time. Oh and just because Pedro agrees, that doesn’t make you right.

    You get the cunting off because of comments like that, telling everyone to fuck off because Pedro kind of agrees with you, not because of your opinion.

  12. Ces1ne

    EMIRATESSTROLLER @ 16:21(?)

    That insightful comment about actual football just made reading thru all the petty arguements between the usual suspects worth it…….tips cap to you

  13. Ces1ne

    Sorry, it was EMIRATESSTROLLER’s comment at 16:24, not 21…….we really need a better way to reply on iPad/iPhone layouts

  14. N5

    In case you missed it London, from Pedro:

    “Love how the internet interprets comments…

    I didn’t say Klopp is a bad coach. I said he’s fucked up, now he has to mastermind a new system, address his player issues and sort his injury problems.”

    Not in the slightest is he agreeing with nearly anything you have said here. Black or White as Keyser was saying. He’s either great or he’s shit, there is no understanding as to why things are the way they are now, or why there were better last season.

  15. carts

    Read on Bleacher Report about Paul Clement taking over Arsenal. Not quite sure where that’s emanated from but what I can say is that the guy has been tutored by a very successful, well respected man in Ancelotti

  16. MidwestGun

    Ces1ne –
    Estroller is always reasoned, organized and thought out. Unfortunately, I don’t have the emotional patience he does. Hahaha
    but I always enjoy his comments and have told him so. So I agree.

  17. london gunner

    N5

    I never said Klopp was bad. Just that he was flawed in similar ways to Wenger. Arrogance/stubbornness ect. Hence why I think after Wenger it is best we have a flexible manager who can take on board input/opinions of others around him. I dunno people were very snide and said I was being reactive which was bullshit so I am just rubbing peoples face in it.

    Nasri Mouth

    This season can be the making or the breaking of Klopp. If he fails because his to dogmatic about his philosophy/style than I called him correctly however if he manages to evolve his style then his a top top manager.

    The best managers I suppose achieve greatness by facing adversity and finding new solutions. The ability to recalculate and change your opinion / stance and move outside your comfort zones is impressive and is only capable if you control your ego not your ego controlling you. Wenger of instance has probably a genius intellect its just the fact I feel his reluctant to admit his wrong and this find other solutions which he would easily find if he took the first step of admitting his wrong. So I think its an attitude/ego problem. Needless to say its a shame for him and us.

  18. Ozy

    “Well sorry boys I am right as usual so fuck you.”

    I like London Gunner’s style. This is a confident man right here. Never change.

  19. Jeff

    Carts.

    Here’s the link to that report.

    http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2246067-paul-clement-rumoured-as-eventual-arsene-wenger-replacement-at-arsenal

    I’m wondering if there is any credence in the story that Wenger will leave in the summer? It could be that they gave him a 3 year contract in order not to upset the players (though I can’t think why) but really he will leave after only 1 year. Could be something in it or it could just be plain old wishful thinking.

  20. london gunner

    N5

    Your misinterpreting my argument once again for the Nth time.

    1 I said Klopp had been found out domestically because he hadn’t adapted

    “Finally, Jurgen Klopp appears to be struggling at Dortmund. 6 loses in 10. Tragic. Looks like his pressing game has been rumbled.”

    “What’s interesting with Klopp is that he had a winning formula and it appears he hasn’t adapted it”

    2 I said Klopp was flawed like Wenger aka stubborn/ no plan B

    “The injury pile up is Arsene Wenger like. That’s the problem with winning. It can make you arrogant and complacent. You have to always kill the formula, because in any game, once you have a winning technique, it’s dead. You need to constantly strive to improve”

    3 I said his not a tactical fluid manager like fergie mourihno

    “You need to constantly strive to improve. The best do it when they’re winning, the managers that don’t go onto Ferguson like greatness fail to adapt and die.”

  21. N5

    LG, I don’t think you saw my reply to that, but Ozy and Sal wasn’t directing their comments at you, they were directing them at Pedro’s being found out comment, not yours at all.

    I understand why you feel the requirement to rub their faces in it, I would too if I was arguing against the grain, but Pedro agreeing, isn’t enough validation.

    See how Klopp gets on this year and with his transfers and then we’ll know. We’ve given Wenger 8 years, lets give Klopp at least two.

    Also as I was saying yesterday, Bayern are the German Celtic now, so I don’t see anyone pressuring them, but I would expect BvB to be in the top 3.

    NM, I have to admit your 50 shades comment really made me laugh.

  22. N5

    “Your misinterpreting my argument once again for the Nth time.”

    I don’t think I misinterpret it, as much as your change in tone when being challanged confuses what your original point was. I agreed I had misunderstood you opinion on Theo vs Eden, but your opinion on Klopp being unable to adapt is conjecture, not fact.

    If he isn’t chaging his tactics, then why is this? is it because he stubborn, stupid or just waiting for things to click? We don’t know, but again as I said before, if after 2 seasons we have the same then fair enough, but Klopp is 9 games in to this season, neither of us has been validated yet.

  23. carts

    Jeff

    Yeah that’s the one. If there’s any truth to that then its a Very random at that.

    The parallels drawn to Moyes aren’t fair as I feel PC has far more experience given the fact that PSG, Chelsea and Madrid bring far more pressure.

    Id be open to the possibility of PC. The winning mentality that he has acquired + seeing first hand how best to deal with big personalities is immeasurable.

    The guy, without doubt, will come with fresh ideas

  24. london gunner

    N5

    If I’m writing a market report or trying to make some form of potential sales forecast I can’t always wait two years or indeed have years worth of data to analyse on a particular product/service so I use a sample period.

    Thing is Klopp may have come second last year but evidence of the decline started to rear its ugly head as his finishing way of the pace of Bayern points wise. This year is the escalation of that. I’d give him till the end of the season not so much to rectify problems but show evidence of attempting to find new solutions.

    Its just like Wenger say hypothetically he signed Schnerdlin in the summer and he turned out to be a flop I would find that hard to hold that against Wenger because on paper his looking for a new solution to an old problem ok it didn’t work out that time but the rationale behind buying said player was sound, in this (hypothetical) case he is simply unlucky. So its not so much instant results I am looking for from Klopp this season but rather evidence of an overall change from what seems to me as a dogmatic attitude.

  25. Jeff

    Carts,

    Yeah, Paul Clement has a lot of experience but not much in first team management. He’s mainly been an assistant. Very hard to tell but then again Wenger was pretty much a complete unknown so perhaps they are trying to repeat history.

    It’s a little bit of a risk but if they did select him I wouldn’t say no though of course my preference would be a top class manager who’s had CL experience coaching a first team.

  26. Emiratesstroller

    Interesting announcement just published by Jorge Bird. Messrs Bellerin,Hayden and Akpom have been promoted to first team squad.

    In one respect this is good news that we are promoting youngsters to the first team, but I do hope that Wenger does not use the excuse of promoting the first two not to buy at least one defender in January.

    Akpom might be a good replacement for Sanogo. Frankly he looked far better
    when he played pre season both in 2013 and 2014.

  27. Ozy

    My femme fatale, my darling fraudulent angel, once caught her changing the batteries in her halo, receipt for her wings and everything that she paid for and the address to the factory where they made those.

  28. Emiratesstroller

    Midwest Gun

    The key is to ignore all the personalised attacks you read on thread and focus on football matters. I have had only one occasion to react to some of the ‘bullshit’ that does appear. The person in question was clearly unstable and was eventually excluded by Pedro.

  29. nasri's mouth

    @Emiratesstroller

    Might depend on whether Wenger thinks Hayden is a better player than xxx, where xxx is ultimately going to only be our 4th choice CB.
    As yet I don’t think he’s mentioned Hayden at all, so my money would be on a new recruit.

    I’d also put forward the view that while Monreal hasn’t been ideal and should not be considered the long term solution, he’s probably done no worse than said hypothetical xxx had we signed him in the summer.

  30. MidwestGun

    Aargh. So much for bet. Lol. Disappointed in Guzan. Beat to near post on second goal. Friedel who is doing the commentary keeps giving his friend Guzan a break by saying he had very little chance. Disagree Brad.

  31. carts

    Jeff

    Good points. Ideally, a recognised manager would be my preference too. Only one I can see happening is Klopp or Garcia. The other genuine managers are either comfortable where they are or unlikely to leave just yet.

    We’ll see what develops.

  32. Bamford13

    Arsene’s Nurse

    “Keyser is a contrarian troll. He gets extreme delight in starting pointless discussions that have no end product, no conclusion.”

    Exactly. Why some on here continue to read or reply to his posts is beyond me. Utterly pointless.

  33. Dark Hei

    Paul Clement appointment is risky for a club like Arsenal. A big club isn’t the stage for young managers to develop their reputations.

    Players are less likely willing to join a club if their manager isn’t a big name (see Moyes-United)
    Players are less likely to listen to a fresh name.
    Fans are less likely to give relatively no names any patience to stand on their feet.

    Even if Wenger leaves an incredibly young and talented squad (let’s face it, he is doing his successor a favour any way you look at it), such a transition is possible only if the AM takes over, like Tito in Barcelona, not a new face.

    My first pick will be Carlos Ancellotti. He can work with big names, he can work with difficult boss, and he is very adaptable. His style is to work with the players he has and then come up with the style. So I hope Athletico win the La Liga again, which means old CA will almost certainly get the sack.

  34. Jeff

    Bamford,

    The answer to that is really simple. For fun. When you know exactly how someone is going to reply and what they are going to say even before they say it – the temptation is too great not to indulge them. I don’t do it often.

  35. Jeff

    Dark Hei,

    I don’t know about Ancelotti – I wouldn’t say no but would he be suitable for Arsenal and would Arsenal be suitable for him? Let’s not forget he failed at Chelsea and although he’s leading the pack at the minute – he does have a very rich crop of talent at his disposal so you would expect him to do well.

    A club like Arsenal isn’t going to buy £80m players and won’t be dishing out £300k wages per week to anyone. What we need is someone more adventurous than Wenger and more ruthless as well. We’ve gone too soft in the middle – too many favourites hanging around the club adding next to nothing, not being moved on (replaced) quickly enough and I don’t just mean those who are injury prone either.

    We need to find a manager that wants to win – someone with a burning desire to bring home trophies and sustained success. I don’t believe the current set of players aren’t good enough to win major things no matter who manages them but over time the new manager should be capable of replacing some of the dross for more “effective” players. They are just all too comfortable under Wenger and don’t always feel the need to give everything. Despite Arsene telling us we have mental strength it is obvious we have very little which is why we always seem to fall over in the big matches.

    Someone like Simeone or Guradiola would be my top picks but would they want to come to Arsenal? That’s the big question that worries me. We might in fact have to opt for an unknown (like Clement) and hope that he turns out good.

  36. Gregg

    Ancelotti is one of a group of career managers. I wouldn’t say he failed at Chelsea given that he won the title with them. In fact he hasn’t ever failed in terms of winning trophies. He’s made a rather successful career out of it.

    That said Arsenal will be looking for someone to take the project to the next stage and stick around. Not sure Carlo fits that bill.

    As for Clement ? I would guess if we’re serious about luring him then the sensible approach would be to bring him in the summer as assistant with view to taking over at some stage. I doubt there’s a lot in it all tbh

  37. Jeff

    Gregg,

    Perhaps failed is a strong term but he was replaced by Ambramovich for not winning anything in his second and final year at Chelsea.

    One problem with him is that he doesn’t seem to stick around for more than a couple of years. Before and since Milan, he’s spent no more than a couple of years at any club and he’s managed 7 so far. In any case perhaps I’m just nit-picking and if the option was there to replace Wenger with Ancelotti , I’d go for it no problem at all.

  38. Le Prof

    Jeff

    ‘Let’s not forget he failed at Chelsea’

    Yeah that’s right Jeff winning the league (scoring the most goals in the process) and cup double is a huge failure.

    You should try and turn the bullshit tap off.

    Thought you would of had enough especially after last night when Keyser had you in knots. not able to answer the most simple question put to you

    You struggle to grasp most things football and have an obsession with Arsene FC not Arsenal FC.

  39. Dark Hei

    Jeff

    I am very sure Wenger still has the desire. He shoves JM, kicks plastic bottles etc. But I feel he might just not have it anymore. Let’s see how this season pans out. The club has already started to change the infrastructure bit by bit.

    Perhaps I am just conservative. But I will stick with a tried and tested name with European pedigree who isn’t prone to destabilising the club. Sounds like a simple criteria but there aren’t that many like that around.

    Let’s not forget, Wenger came in as a fresh face and it took him quite a few seasons to get his handle on European competition. The new comer will not have that luxury in the modern era.

  40. Jeff

    Le Prof,

    You seem to appear out of nowhere, spout out some drivel and disappear again. Are you even worth responding to? At least Keyser perseveres. If you were to follow what was said without the obvious bias running through your veins you would have noticed that it was not a “win” or “lose” debate. I was trying to coax out of him the answer to a very simple question which you yourself may also want to answer (if indeed you are not Keyser himself or some forgotten previously banned and resurfaced troll user). What was that question?

    Has Wenger contributed to our downfall or not? In other words could we have done better with another manager given all Wenger’s obvious shortcomings which I listed? He unwillingly answered it with an analogy of being shot and stabbed (Kroenke and other owners) and Wenger’s influence was a mere grazing of an overgrown toe nail. So, if you are clever enough to decipher what that means, you can tell he was actually saying we could not have done any better under a different manager.

    That was the end of the debate and then he flipped.

    Now, what is your answer to the same question?

  41. Jeff

    Dark Hei,

    I agree totally. We definitely need someone who will hit the ground running. If I’m honest, Wenger really ought to have gone say around 5/6 years ago. He could so easily have moved to another top club or managed an international side – however he chose to stay. He didn’t want any other challenge, i.e. I don’t think he has enough ambition in himself to seek different pastures to taste new problems. He is very comfortable but now time has taken its toll.

    We haven’t won anything major in ages and to simply say it’s all because of other things (as some do) is just loyalty for loyalty’s sake. To cut a long story short, I think the time might be drawing close but I don’t know whether he’ll go before the end of his current contract. If I was a betting man I’d say 60% no and 40% yes.

  42. Jeff

    TYAG,

    Yeah I don’t know what his problem is. He seems to appear like a jack-in-a-box, make a weird noise and back in he goes. Don’t want to say too much in case he’s suffering from from some sort of a mental problem – you never know.

  43. nasri's mouth

    @Jeff

    While we’re on simple questions, could we have done worse with a different manager?

    As Im busy and can’t wait for a reply, I’ll answer it. Yes. We could have done worse.

    So there you go, we could have done better, we could have done worse, but its all dull guesswork

  44. gonsterous

    I think the main questions all AKBs fail to answer is…. Is Wenger the right man to take us forward ?? The answer is a very simple … NO !!!

  45. Wallace

    “Has Wenger contributed to our downfall or not?”

    downfall? we are where we we’ve been all Wenger’s reign. behind Man Utd. only change is Chelsea & Man City spending a billion quid each over the last 10yrs. if you think a better manager would have won us some titles in that time while having a budget of about 10m every season….i dunno, Mourinho might have been able to, but he’d never have worked for a club with such limited resources.

  46. Emiratesstroller

    I have looked this morning on transfermarkt at the average age of players in squads of leading clubs in EPL and Europe and it makes quite interesting reading.

    Barcelona 26.3
    Real Madrid 26.4
    Paris St Germain 26.5
    Bayern Munich 26.6
    Borussia Dortmund 25.4
    Juventus 28.5
    Roma 28.0
    Chelsea 26.7
    Man City 28.9
    Arsenal 25.9
    Man Utd 25.3
    Liverpool 25.8
    Tottenham 26.3

    Leaving aside Serie A which has traditionally been the destination of older players who are no longer in most cases in their prime it would seem that the
    prime age for clubs in the other major leagues is between 25-26 average.

    Interestingly Man City’s squad has an average of 28.9. This suggests to me that
    they may be past their best and in line for a major rebuild operation providing that UEFA’s fair play and the club owners allow them to do so.

  47. Jeff

    Gonsterous,

    It’s not even a 50-50 question. Could we have done better under a different manager? That’s the question and the context under which it was originally put yesterday was since the oil men took over – so let’s say in the last 10 years. My contention is that we could have won the league probably a couple of times and possibly 2 domestic cups as well.

    One example is the way he threw away the league in January of this year. We were top and playing well but needed obvious reinforcements to see us through the difficult matches coming up later in the year. So what did he do? He signed Kallstrom. The league was ours for the taking but he literally threw it away without a fight. That is the sort of thing I’m talking about – he cannot take us to any other level and it has been like that for the past 5/6 years at a least.

    Rather than acknowledge that there might be a problem and accept that we might in fact be carrying a faulty manager, they keep harking back to the invicibles and the doubles and how it was all scuppered by the arrival of the oil men as if somehow that is enough to mitigate and explain EVERYTHING in the last ten years. I just don’t understand the undying loyalty he commands.

  48. Bamford13

    Mouth

    Any competent manager could’ve done better than Wenger has. Any manager who signed a class CDM and CF two years ago — or even this summer — would have Arsenal in a better place today than Wenger does.

    The only reason Wenger hasn’t done these things is his idiotic commitment to frugality and to certain substandard players (Arteta, Flamini, Giroud, Sanogo). Any manager without these idiotic predilections would’ve done better than Wenger.

    Please don’t try to convince us that it’s a 50/50 proposition.

    Every proper manager would outperform Wenger.

  49. Thank you and goodnight

    Could another manager have done better? It’s all guesswork as Nasri’s Mouth rightly said. The better and more important and relevant question to today and his next 3 years, as gonsterous rightly asked is….

    Is he the manager to take us forward, into a new era…..

    For me that’s a big fat resounding NO.

  50. Le Prof

    Jeff

    ‘We haven’t won anything major in ages’

    You are deluded. Do you remember last May? Im sure you do you, you probably spent it complaining we ‘only’ beat Hull or we ‘only’ won 3-2.

    The people that were there haven’t forgot trust me. Suppose its easy to forget behind a computer.

    ‘Has Wenger contributed to our downfall or not?’

    You have to be trolling you can’t be serious. Please clarify ‘downfall’?

    You do nothing but amuse me. You lack the football knowledge to even debate about football itself so you’d rather focus your time on Arsene FC.

    Le Prof is like a fishing rod for very predictable people like TYAG another Arsene FC obsessive

  51. Le Prof

    Jeff

    ‘My contention is that we could have won the league probably a couple of times and possibly 2 domestic cups as well.’

    When exactly would this of happened Jeff?

  52. Bamford13

    Le Prof

    One tawdry FA Cup win in nine years? That’s success? For a club of Arsenal’s stature?

    Please. The only one deluded here is you — and those sad souls, like you, who are satisfied with this rot.

  53. Jeff

    Le Prof,

    You’ve decided to engage today. Good. It means they are allowing you more time in the ITC lab.

    How’s the colouring in going? You must post some pictures of Alice in Wonderland so we can all see the kind of world you live in.

  54. Wallace

    “Could another manager have done better? It’s all guesswork as Nasri’s Mouth rightly said. The better and more important and relevant question to today and his next 3 years, as gonsterous rightly asked is….

    Is he the manager to take us forward, into a new era…..?”

    this is a more sensible question. use of the term ‘downfall’ is half-witted.

  55. Jeff

    For degenerates like Wallace and Prof here’s the definition of downfall:

    “A loss of power, prosperity, or status.”

  56. Jeff

    In case you don’t know what degenerate means here’s the definition for that too.

    “Having lost the physical, mental, or moral qualities considered normal and desirable”

  57. Le Prof

    Bamf

    ‘One tawdry FA Cup win in nine years? That’s success? For a club of Arsenal’s stature?’

    Why was the reason you started following the Arsenal Bamford seeing as you’re quite new to all this?

    Was it the trophies or was it something intangible that forged your commitment to the club?

    It’s obvious by the way.

    You started following us at the wrong time mate you missed the upside, arrived too late on the yield curve.

    The commitment is for life and if you’d followed football for more than what 7-8 years you’d probably realise football goes in cycles.

    Jeff

    ‘How’s the colouring in going? You must post some pictures of Alice in Wonderland so we can all see the kind of world you live in.’

    Thats Jeff right there…bamboozling me with his football knowledge…as always

  58. Thank you and goodnight

    @Jeff

    Wallace might not say a bad word against wenger, but he’s not a degenerate mate. Bit harsh.
    Le prof on the other hand…..just ignore the mug like I’m going to and another poster on here. I’ve yet to meet a rabid AKB who knows what the fuck they’re talking about.

  59. Wallace

    Jeff

    “For degenerates like Wallace and Prof here’s the definition of downfall:

    “A loss of power, prosperity, or status.””

    we’re as rich as we’ve ever been. are you saying our status in Europe has fallen? if so, when were the glory days?

  60. Jeff

    Wallace,

    If our status is the same as it was 10 years ago, why aren’t we winning the league every few years and appearing in CL finals or semis? Of course our status has dropped.

  61. Emiratesstroller

    Jeff

    I don’t think that that the League was there for taking in January as you suggest, but we could have certainly made a better shot at it than we did.

    You have to factor in that we would have probably lost most of those away games even if not as badly as we did.

    The major problems with transfer window in January are:
    1. Few top quality players become available and in most cases only if you are
    prepared to play inflated prices OR the player is nearing end of his contract
    and seller wants to extract a transfer fee.

    2. Most of the best players are Champions League Cup Tied. Therefore
    Arsenal will be reluctant to buy someone who is unavailable for key games
    particularly if they are then required to de-register or offload other players
    in squad.

    Nevertheless I agree that there were better options available than Kallstrom
    particularly since he was injured. The fact is that Wenger has failed to address
    in three years the defensive/holding midfield position and two years a full
    complement of centre backs.

    The striker situation was only resolved at the end of this summer’s transfer window AFTER Giroud suffered long term injury.

    It is Wenger’s failure to ANTICIPATE problems and the LATENESS OF HIS REACTION when he does finally recognise that we need replacements which is
    the major problem.

  62. Jeff

    Wallace,

    Yes I agree with everything you said except:

    “You have to factor in that we would have probably lost most of those away games even if not as badly as we did.”

    With the right reinforcements, the probability of that is reduced. If we had a better manager given the same situation, the probability is greatly reduced.

  63. Jeff

    TYAG,

    “Is he the manager to take us forward, into a new era…..”

    If this question was asked five years ago, what would your answer have been? Do you not see that it boils down to the same thing as asking could we have done better under a different manager – unless of course you think Wenger has been a “success” in the last five years?

    Suppose he stays for another five years and wins nothing. Would the right question be the one you asked or the one I did?

  64. Thank you and goodnight

    @Jeff

    5 years ago my answer would of been the same mate. I’ve wanted wenger out for at least 6 years now. Yes 5 years ago I might not have been so aggressive in my dislike for wenger, but I still wanted him out.

  65. Thank you and goodnight

    @jeff

    My opinion is that a new manager couldn’t have done worse. But again that’s just guess work as we could never be 100% certain. Look at scolari at Chelsea. Now be honest when he was appointed he could have envisaged him being such a failure, what with his stock being so high in the world of football at the time?
    So yes, although I think another manager could of done better, it’s all guesswork really.

  66. Jeff

    TYAG,

    The word guesswork implies a binary probability – e.g. tossing a coin. That what the Wenger people like us to assume so there is no culpability. However, I think we both agree that the probability of faring better under a different manager (given what we know of Wenger and the history of the last 10 years) is a lot higher than merely 50%.

    The Scholari analogy is not fair because he’d only been in the a short while. The length of time Wenger’s been at it provides less margin for error when trying to surmise what would have happened.

  67. Jeff

    Sorry Emirates, I just realised it was Wallace that said

    “You have to factor in that we would have probably lost most of those away games even if not as badly as we did.”

    It was you and the reply above was therefore to you not Wallace.