So Arsenal fans… are you going to protest?

by & filed under Uncategorized.

You can’t hide from it, people are talking about it all over the web, in comment sections, on twitter… it’s the planned demonstration planned by Where has our Arsenal gone (WHOAG). It’s happening at 1430 on the 15th of May before the Aston Villa game. At the moment, rumours are that 200 or so Arsenal fans are going to meet, don black scarves and wander up to the ground to make a statement of dissatisfaction against the club.

I recently wrote that I’m not a fan of protest and pop up action groups. I still stand by that but what I am a fan of is people who actually want to do something. I’m a fan of supporters joining together to do something they see as for the better of the club and I’m a fan of giving everyone the choice to make a rational decision on whether they want to join.

From what I can gather, they are in the main marching against the increase in season ticket pricing. The group are not a collection of post 1996 Arsenal fans, they are in fact the opposite. Many of them have been season ticket holders since the 70’s, they’ve seen the dark days of Arsenal football club, they’re members of the AST and AISA but they want to take things into their own hands to let the club know they’re not happy about the way things are going.

Some of their ideas are very fair. They want the club to recognise that increasing the cost of season tickets is hitting fans hard, they want to offer the chance for fans to downgrade their seats, they want the club to allow fans the chance to have a season ticket holiday for a year, they want the away fans to be moved into the upper tier into the more expensive areas so there are more affordable seats for the faithful.

A protest about season ticket pricing makes absolute sense to me and that is a cause I’d absolutely back.

The trouble from where I’m sitting is the press release about the march lacks direction and clear objectives. They veer off into areas like commercial activity, corporate fan slagging, the manager’s lack of spending and sacking the Chairman. All debatable points on their own, but all they do for me is add confusion to the situation and they muddy the water.

A protest needs goals and objectives. If no one is exactly sure about what they’re protesting about, you allow the rest of the web to make snap assumptions. Many people are calling it a ‘Wenger out’ protest. Le Grove has dealt with people who make assumptions about our site without reading it and I fear that what is essentially a good willed movement is being tarnished by the very vocal and aggressive AKB.

This is the problem with new groups, it’s very hard to create an organisation when no one is fronting the group. I tried to contact them via their twitter account last night for a few words and I’ve heard nothing. That’s why my preference is go through more official channels like the AST. You know every statement made by them is carefully researched and rational. The AST wrote an e-mail to Ivan Gazidis the day after they found out about the potential hike in season ticket prices way back in February. Do you think it’s a coincidence the club has waited so long to announce regular season ticket increases?

I don’t like the factions that have been created at Arsenal this season, it’s really sad that we can’t all get along. It’s sad that fans are tearing lumps out of each other in the ground and it’s sad that groups like WHOAG have to set up in the first place. I won’t be joining any protest until there is more clarity around exactly what the goal of it is supposed to be but I do admire that a group of Arsenal fans are willing to take their grievances to the street and make a public point to the club.

What I’ve done is join the AST. I’ll be filling out the end of season questionnaire which goes directly to the board. I’ll then be attending the AST Ivan Gazidis meeting (June 13th) where he’ll take questions uncensored for an hour and a half from anyone who is a member. For all the criticism the club receives, there aren’t many CEO’s that would put themselves through such an ordeal.

We may have lost out way on the pitch this season but I strongly believe the club tries its best to involve the fans every step of the way. Globalisation of football is inevitable… if you want tradition, you’ll have to find another sport. For all the eulogizing about the game way back when… you did get what you paid for. Terracing was fun, but football violence wasn’t. Paying a tuppence for a ticket was value for money, seeing people throw bananas at black players was not. Knowing that you were likely to see your favourite players down the local after was nice… but seeing the power, pace and skill we have now is far more enjoyable.

Hopefully when Ivan Gazidis takes his hot seat in June, he’ll have snapped up a decent player and the fans will feel somewhat appeased. At the core of it, we all want what’s best for the club, we all want to be optimistic and we all want to feel our club is trying its hardest to be the best that it can be.

This summer is the chance for the club to unite the fans again, I just hope Stan understands that sentiment.

So… will you be protesting? Let us know in the comments!

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799 Responses to “So Arsenal fans… are you going to protest?”

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  1. wattsy65

    Don’t suppose 3?

    Good article, well reasoned, it just left me feeling very flat, guess it’s that end of season felling.

    Think I expected more from the Grove after the Bolton game, or have I missed a blog, and it’s all been discussed?

  2. ade

    Damn! I hate u dan! Shld ave commented b4 reading d post!

    I totally get your point pedro, and agree. They need to focus, and state with clarity what the protest is about. They also need to appoint a spokes person who can be contacted.

    In truth there’s a lot to protest about at my arsenal these days but name a club that’s diff, incld manure. Its the reality of the times.

    My protest however wld be about aw’s utterances…. Like ‘2nd is success’ when u avnt even achieved that 2nd!
    Great post pedro.

  3. charybdis1966

    Kushagara – you mean a “Boom..boom” post surely ?

    I’ll be at the Villa game and observing the protest….

    Oh(before I forget), and “I win in the battle between me and crypto-fascist-ology.”

    (Where is Sabeel nowadays, BTW ?)

  4. charybdis1966

    ..and a very considered. restrained post Pedders, old boy.

    You are right to point out WHOAG should clarify their objectives and stick to a few key ones otherwise a lack of focus could mean they don’t achieve anything.

  5. LAzer

    Another football season of countless nights ruined by an early kickoff, travel arrangements made around matches, tension, stress, disbelief, anger, frustration, numbness, and defeat.

    I guess part of the nature of a true fan is being a glutton for punishment. We will all be united when that kickoff whistle signals the start of another campaign, this much I guarantee.

  6. Tarquin Wetherby-Smythe

    A few hundred louts in black apparel certainly wont be any skin off my nose and I’m sure our chairman would agree with me! More worrying is the fact that the Salt Beef sandwiches in the Diamond Club have been rather under par recently. Hopefully the club will use the increased revenue from the season ticket increase to remedy the sort of catering mishaps which can truly ruin a match day experience.

  7. Fedor

    I will not be demonstrating though, I have had enough of what is happening but demos have a way of turning into the something other than what you are protesting about.

  8. Kushagra India

    Chary today I was on the verge but was enamored by Pedro’s writing Boom Boom was reduced to Booming…

  9. Kola

    Its funny when you say fans are fighting with each other. There is a saying in Africa that the husband who marries more than one wife dont want the wives to be friends so that he can control the situation in his house. That applies to Wenger, he is is a dictator and the only way he cant get his way is to divide the fans. And before anybody thinks i am negative about Wenger, i like him and i have actually supported with all my strength. He is a good manager but he is getting lost and doing things that shouldnt be done in a democratic world. The truth is that Gadaffi was once a very good and amicable person before he got power drunk. I am not comparing Wenger with him but the signs are there to be seen.

  10. WengersSweeties

    I think protesting is fine as long as it’s directed at the season ticket 6.5% increase.

    Saying that would anyone be ok with the increase if in return Arsene bought in 3-4 top class players this summer?

  11. Maximus

    Also, without clarity it leaves it open for people and the press to interpret their own reasoning behind the march, as well as allowing other fractions to join the march and attribute it to their own grievances and not that of the original group.

  12. arsene wenger z ***

    protest or no protest…………one thing is for sure arsene wenger will not be sacked! So arsene haters keep on wishing.
    I pedro rather than writting about a protest which only few support!!! U better write the loan players and the youngsters @ arsenal that will be called to the first team next season, our transfer.

  13. Queen of suburbia

    I think it interesting that for all the protestations that Le-grove is the epitome of all that wrong with arsenal fans. No protest started here.

  14. Franchise

    I will be joining the protest

    My chance for TV fame is finally here 😀

    just kidding

    I commend the dudes that are protesting. Only the privileged can get themselves heard at AST/Gazidis QA sessions

    AST cant exactly represent all the views of all the gunners in the world.

    Protest as long as it is violent free will be a serious wake up call for Arsenal and Wenger as a whole

  15. bernard (bade the gooner)

    morning pedro,
    direct & brave post there ….
    i think the purpose of the protest should be “wenger go out, or get out”. Go out & buy the needed players & get rid of the deadwood, or go our & let others do the job. Arsene already took the blame, very rightly, so will he draw conclusions or just stall again.
    some pundit I don’t rate usually said the other day that now it’s time for arsene to swallow his pride. It is the time for him to decide which way is he picking there

  16. charliegeorge

    The one and only way of garnering worldwide attention to this fiasco is to burn an effigy of this imposter outside of the stadium.

    I can’t think of a more powerful message to send this shonky manager and his beloved board.

    Perhaps QOS could lead the rally?

  17. Pedro

    Franchise, only the privileged?

    Are you trying to tell me an in demand free lancer like yourself can’t afford £2 a month or a £30 one off fee?

    Anyone can go to that meeting if they join the AST.

  18. Franchise

    I’m bored of moaning on the blogs

    we could lose our remaining games until season’s end and it wont spur me to say what i have already said several times before

    the sad part is my interest for all things Arsenal is dwindling.

    not enough EFFORT is being put in from board to the tea lady and I find it very frustrating

  19. Big Dave

    Next season will be even harder to win it, chavs will strengthen as will cityy, and Man u and L’pool. so if we do not buck up our ideas and change things around then another groundhog day will be upon us

  20. Franchise

    cost isnt the issue. A more radical approach is needed IMO

    we have had QA sessions before yet it seems the Manager and idiots like Hillwood still dont understand who is keeping the Arsenal in business.

    The very groups that spend their hard earned yearly to support the club

    QA is great but more action needs to be taken

  21. Albo

    Pedro – for the same reasons as you, probably not. At the moment it just seems such an amorphous movement, with no actual specific goal or manifesto.

    Also, I’m not massively convinced when people start eulogising the past in football. Or perhaps, more specifically, I’m not convinced when they think we might be able to return to that past. The soullessness and commercialisation of football is a genie that no amount of protest will put back in it’s bottle, and it’s certainly not Arsenal FC’s fault.

    Also, one of their main demands seems to be that the fans should ‘have a voice’, when as you point out, AFC is actually one of the best clubs when it comes to maintaining a dialogue with the fans. There can be no doubt that the AST, for example, have some genuine influence in some areas. Sure it is limited, but it is there…

  22. Confucius

    One for the statisticians amongst you.

    You can see where arsenal wages sit amongst not only EPL, but other leagues, but other ‘branded sports’ worldwide.

    I wonder if the players have received an average annual 6% wage increase (or more) for not winning anything when they renewed contracts in the last 5 seasons?

    As for the protest, much like ‘real world politics’, apathy and resignation to being shat upon is always going to be the default for the masses.

  23. TOMTOM

    Arsenal at a crossroads as fans turn on Wenger

    The footage of Arsene Wenger once again resembling Basil Fawlty as he threw a bottle of water to the floor in anger and frustration at the Reebok Stadium on Easter Sunday is one of the enduring images of the season.

    His petulance reinforces the view proposed a week ago by Harry Redknapp that Arsenal’s failure to deliver in key games has transformed Wenger into one of the biggest “nutters” among Premier League managers.

    Arsenal’s form in recent weeks, however, would have tried the patience of Job. Having played themselves into contention in four competitions, they have managed to lose all their important games and will once again end the season trophyless.

    Wenger seems alone in believing his team will grow organically into one that has the strength to consistently come out on top against Manchester United and Chelsea.

    His angry reaction to an interview by Cesc Fabregas with a Spanish football magazine in which the Arsenal captain appeared to criticise the club’s current youth-focused policy, suggested deeper anxiety; someone was touching a raw nerve.

    Wenger believes his policy of buying young players and nurturing them is compatible with winning trophies. He can also point to his own record of finishing in the top four of the Premier League in each of the 14 seasons he has been in charge. Over the 14 seasons before Wenger took over, Arsenal had finished in the top four on just six occasions.

    Wenger’s 14 years can be conveniently broken down into two almost equal periods of seven years — up to the 2003/04 season, followed by the period to the present day.

    Before the summer of 2004, Wenger was one of the most successful managers in English history, winning both the Premier League titles and FA Cup three times in seven and a half seasons.

    His teams married beautiful football with great resilience, and Arsenal reached their zenith in 2004 when the ‘Invincibles’ managed to go the entire season unbeaten.

    That summer, however, witnessed a power shift in English football, with Chelsea’s move to employ Jose Mourinho as manager.

    The combination of Russian money and Portuguese guile transformed Chelsea and in the space of one season they supplanted Arsenal as the main challengers to Manchester United.

    The Chelsea factor caused the leading clubs to re-evaluate themselves, with a rush to attract rich foreign owners with money, to varying degrees of success.


    Wenger’s response was to nurture his own young talent, with the club in the process of having to fund the building of the new Emirates Stadium. That approach brought him the FA Cup in 2005 — and nothing since.

    Where once it was a policy born of penny-pinching necessity, it has become his own particular badge of honour.

    The more money other clubs spend, the more Wenger seems determined to keep himself reined in.

    Since the ‘Invincibles’ season of 2004, Wenger is actually in profit concerning transfer dealings, with £10.8m in the bank, thanks mostly to selling Emmanuel Adebayor and Kolo Toure to Manchester City, while at the same time recruiting players such as Andrey Arshavin (£15m), Samir Nasri (£15.8m) Theo Walcott (£9m) and Thomas Vermaelen (£10m).

    Such frugality is remarkable, given the net spending of his rivals — Manchester City who have spent £435m since 2004; Chelsea £397m; Tottenham Hotspur £239m; Liverpool £142m; and Manchester United £108m, despite selling Cristiano Ronaldo for £80m.

    However, there is no need for Wenger to be so miserly now and the expectation from new majority shareholder Stan Kroenke will be that his manager will spend some money for key acquisitions.

    Wenger was non-committal yesterday, saying: “We have to strengthen the squad where it needs and make the right decision on that front. It (transfers) is always in my mind every day.”

    Arsenal also have a strict pay structure, which rules them out of certain high-level deals, but their wage bill is actually higher than those at Liverpool and Tottenham, although it is significantly lower than those at Chelsea and the two Manchester clubs.

    Some Arsenal fans are now openly calling for Wenger to leave, filling message boards and radio phone-ins with anti-Arsene rhetoric.

    For the critics, the first seven years of Wenger’s Arsenal career, and the magnificent way he has shepherded the club’s move to their glorious new stadium without losing their top-four status, is less important than the club’s current apparent acceptance at being also-rans.

    Wenger’s comment two weeks ago, when he said: “As long as you are second in the league, I am ready to sign for the next 20 years,” suggested he was happy to settle for second best.

    His behaviour on the touchline at Bolton, however, showed his desire to win remains as strong as ever.

  24. peman33

    good article, all we want is whats best for our club. the problem is that we dont really have a voice and no-one cares what we think. it doesnt take a rocket scientist to work out that raising the ticket prices by 6.5% for the loyal supporters during one of the worst economic crisis is gona piss off the faithful. the same applies for buying quality seasoned pros to replace the ones we lose each year, and to strengthen weak areas in the team. for 5 years everyone involved with arsenal has cried out for these areas to be addressed yet we have constantly been ignored. only one man at arsenal has a voice and that sadly is Wenger. its like supporting communisn, the more it fails the more stubborn the mad dictator becomes to make it work. our club has become autocratic on every level, and that is bad. democracy works because of checks and balances, and it is a bloody good thing, just look at the middle east atm, protesting (fighting) for democracy. that should be the aim of any protest discussed, all arsenal fans uniting to make Arsene and arsenal accountable again!

  25. charliegeorge

    I don’t think the 2005 F.A. Cup win had anything to do with the new policy. More attributable to the likes of Vieira and company, who got booted out at the expense of the new (and flawed) policy.

  26. sarge

    It’s pointless protesting with so few numbers and without a clear agenda. The club will dismiss it as the efforts of a few disgruntled fans and clearly a minority (nothing new, all clubs have ’em)and the rest of the fans around the club will look on it with amusement, a side show to the main event i.e. the game.

    There are deep issues across the board at the club – ticket pricing being only one. What about the staleness (particularly in the backroom structure) that is referred to as stability? What about the policy of rewarding young players with lucrative contracts that are not performance related but based on a risky strategy of expecting untapped potential to be fully realised in the near future? Why has the club got 18 players on loan? Why do we keep signing illegible players, putting them out loan to in order to meet immigration criteria whilst missing valuable development time with the club? What about the lack of diversity and breadth of our revenue streams that force the club to hike season tickets prices beyond the means of the average fan? Why can’t they introduce interim instalments to let fans breakdown their season ticket payments over the course of a season like they did in the mid 90’s (well, we already know the answer to that one) to name a few that interest me. These are the types of questions I would like to Gazidis answer. Not talk about players we want, because at the end of the day nothing changes if the manager and coaches still continue to make the same mistakes year-in, year-out. Same shit different players. Also the club needs a cohesive strategy across the ‘technical’ side and the commercial side they cannot be mutually exclusive. The technical side creates the brand (and winning trophies should be part of it) and the commercial side markets and sells the brand.

    It would be a shame if the club did hide behind a signing as a way of deflecting some of the deeper issues. It’s like throwing bread over the palace gates to the hungry mob. It placates but doesn’t resolve the problem.

  27. Albo

    Over the 14 seasons before Wenger took over, Arsenal had finished in the top four on just six occasions.

    That’s a very good stat for all the people on here who declare that our ‘rightful place’ is at the pinnacle of English football…

  28. Mark C

    I think the issue is a number of small issues that have led to fans wanting to voice their opinion.

    The 6.5% rise in ticket prices is a real issue that affects everyone.
    Then when you look at the performance of the team over the last few months you question why you have to pay extra for the type of football
    You question the players we have on our books and the salaries they are getting paid.
    As AST point out, the 6.5% increase could be covered by either better performances on the pitch or dross being cleared out, so extra revenue, or reduced costs.

    And then you have to question if you REALLY believe if Wenger (or the club) will actually buy the players we need. If someone said to me, look you will need to pay an extra 6.5%, but you are getting player, X, Y and Z, and we are getting rid of the dross, only have 40 professional players, then the pain of the extra cost might go away, as you would finally believe we would have a proper chance to compete.

    If the club can come out, and say, they are going to spend big and get rid of the dross, some of the unrest would go away. People have lost faith with Wenger as he keeps on coming out with the same lines, and they mean nothing.

    Personally if we could get a top coach in, I would be happy to see Wenger take a role on the board, and let someone else bring some new ideas in.

  29. Josip Skoblar

    Wenger should stay, but be told to spend on a few quality and proven players. We’re all agreed there. I feel that to replace Wenger now would be very risky and would prove counter-productive. How many (available) British coaches would do a better job? None. As for foreign coaches, only Maureen was successful in the EPL, but he had Abramovitch’s vast fortune to buy the experienced players that he needed. Maureen, like Wenger, is an exception: Houllier and Benitez didn’t win the League and Mancini will never win it.

    The latest developments (today’s Guardian):
    [Arsène Wenger will add to his Arsenal squad “where it needs” to be strengthened this summer. (…) While he will not top fees for marquee signings, he will be looking to add a few new players – potentially experienced ones – in the summer.] Patience and cheer up!

  30. Franchise

    we have seen our team capitulate in same fashion over and over and over and over again

    this problem transcends player signings

    the manager doesnt seem to know what he is doing anymore

    we dont need another 3 trophyless seasons to get him to prove this

    Stan has to give him one more season and that is it IMO

    we might finally get to address what we should have 5 years ago this summer

    he is saying we cant defend…. exactly what he said at the end of 07/08. in the summer he signed silvestre as the solution

  31. Stuart

    there is no reason for the likes of hill wood to be on the board anymore -IT IS NOT HIS CLUB ANYMORE – he sold his right to have a say in the way arsenal are handled – he is sitting on a free ride – get him out and get DAVID DEIN IN NOW – we have a huge summer and we need the best guy to help wenger and thats DEIN

  32. Albo

    charliegeorge – you’ve got selective memory if you think Viera was ‘booted out’. He had been angling for a move for a few seasons and that was simply the year Arsenal decided they couldn’t stop him going…

  33. arsene wenger z ***

    what the fuck, those of u who say u are going to protest, why?
    U all are racists the only way u hate arsene wenger is b/c he is french andits clear the english hate the french’s. History shows it.
    Not one news paper in england have the gut to say the arsenal way is the right way. Uefa says clubs should follow the arsenal way and they are wright.
    Look before the start of this season no one expected us to even be in top four, i think most of us would have be happy with a top four finish and cc cup trophy.
    We nearly did win the cc, and we did fight for the epl.
    The team needs to be strngthened but its not all arsene’s fault, i think i would blame the top players such as cesc,nasir,RVP, theo,arshavin,rosiky,clichy….for not showing any leader ship on the pitch, they are by far the talented players in epl but they seem to let down arsene and talk shit on the media, so its not only arsenes or denislon,almunia,diaby’s fault its also the stars u all love who show they are not up for it, some of the chances they missed against spurs and bolton is just so dissapointing.

  34. james



  35. Maximus

    At the Villa game, I think all fans should leave just before the final whistle, so when it comes to the lap off honour they can enjoy it in an empty stadium, in the same way they enjoy an empty trophy cabinet.

    It’s an insult to applaud the fans effort, when their own has been very questionable and all on the back of being millionaires at our expense.

  36. Moray

    If we are a serious business, I think the question needs to be asked of Arsene Wenger at the beginning of the season, what his goals are. And these should be clearly defined. He may say “judge me in May”, but judge him against what? In any normal business, you have to deifine your targets and strategy for the year ahead. It seems we are just floating around and redefining “success” or “failure” as we go along…

  37. Big Dave

    I think our longest spell without a trophy was 8 years? we are getting very close to that again.

    Not good enough

  38. charliegeorge

    “a role on the board.”

    That’s like making King Henry VIII an Emperor.

    Same shit, different title.

  39. Rob green

    Pedro – great post

    Why do you not want Wenger out???

    I would like to know why you constantly moan about him and say it had been the same for years but then you don’t want him gone

    By the way I want him out

  40. MatthewT

    Wenger has already come out and said that he is not going to change how he manages Arsenal. So why are we wishing or hopeing that he will ??

    Also the wording of his statement about transfers is pure Wenger, he will only strengthen “where it needs to be strengthened”. He thinks he has the best team he has ever had so he doesn’t think he needs to strengthen anywhere.

  41. Sabeel

    Boom Boom…

    i lose in the battle Me and Geography

    Absolutely agree abt,the fact,that a protest must have CLEAR objectives,and we have not seen a pamplet or something yet,which lists them..

    but dont u think,it is good to join,because we need to wait for another year or two to again have a real chance to protest..this window of protest will slip…becos we all will become blind optimistic people as soon as season starts

    something is better than nothing right?

  42. Franchise

    Albo in no other profession will a manager not be hounded for failing in similar fashion for 5 out of the last 6 years. in 08/09 we were never in with a shout in the league but we still fucked the CL and FA cup up in April.

    Smae pattern all the time

    IS the team progressing?


    we were up against one of the best United teams in Fergie’s era then and Chelsea were a much better team also.

    Now we trail both in the league when we had the easiest of run ins

    In any other club Wenger will be sacked come end of MAy

  43. Matt

    I didnt even watch teh game on Sunday. Was at a bbq round my parents who have just got rid of Sky )cheapskates). Even if they hadnt, I think I still would have stayed in the garden with a beer rather than go in and watch that shower of shite. As the updates were coming in on my phopne I actually laughed to myself when I saw that they scored in the 90th minute.

    WHat else can you do but laugh at this team right now?

  44. Albo

    Stuart – interesting that you say Hill Wood sold his right to have a say, but that Dein should be brought back? Surely Dein also sold his right to have a say a long time ago?

    Also, a lot of people seem to forget that Dein only sold up in 2007. In other words he was at the helm for a huge number of the decisions that everybody on here complains about…

  45. realistic tony

    We all want whats best for our club, we could accept 2nd or 3rd most seasons if we had a belief in the manager. If we felt he was doing all he could to win trophies in whatever style was effective and efficient and with a blend of youth and quality experience, then we would be content.
    Its the obvious fact that he (AW) will only do it “his way” and to hell with the consequences. This inconsideration of the fans is what gets fans like me very angry. Selfish, egotistical, arrogant and stubborn are just some of the adjectives i constantly use for him.Such a personality at the head of any organisation will inevitably ruin it unless there is some intervention. I hope that Kroenke applies that intervention.

  46. charliegeorge

    “The team needs to be strngthened but its not all arsene’s fault, i think i would blame the top players such as cesc,nasir,RVP, theo,arshavin,rosiky,clichy….for not showing any leader ship on the pitch, they are by far the talented players in epl but they seem to let down arsene and talk shit on the media …”

    And I’m the one who’s meant to be “barking.”

  47. Sabeel

    good 2 see back chary,am as sick as u r seeing the manures so lucky…i guess we are making there luck…sick,but its reality….

    weakest manure team for a while is winning the league,becos we dont have balls and mental strength in our defense..

  48. TOMTOM

    You cant blame RVP for this situation,his performances have been excellent since coming back from injury and if not for him we would really struggle to make the top four

  49. Albo

    Well Franchise, in any other profession being at the head one of the top 10 companies in the world (or top 3 or 4 in the country) would be seen as success. It is a peculiarity of sport that success is measured in trophies – trophies that will often go to clubs that are quantifiably less well run, with less quality in it’s ‘work force’ etc…

  50. Franchise

    for all the Jack and Scesney development we’ve raved about all season we havent done better than when the likes of Denilson and Almunia were in their previous positions in the team

    1 win in how many is our current run

    Not good enough, never will be no matter how you try to gloss it

    Next threat is our top players will be seeking moves elsewhere

    It looks like Cesc is already gone in the head.

  51. leon

    from business stand point that wenger does is very smart he buys players at 15 keeps them in reserves for a few years the they sign prefeshional contract at 10-15k a week if you look at players like song dj bretna fab flamster ect all at the club since there 15-16 none of them on great money.he rearly buys players at over 22 or older because of the wages.i garantee players like chamakh kos and other defender is only on around 30k week were as if he went top cb he would have pay them at least 50-60 k a week

    at the same time he makes sure he just good players in the team to finish in the top 4 and they get thier champions legue money,and every single season he sweet talks the fans particualy the season ticket holders so they will renew.thats whats all about people

  52. Moray

    Confucious, that wage table is really very interesting. It seems Valencia are in 68th place, despite being completely bankrupt, ditton Portsmouth in 72nd, and two-bit teams like West Ham, Bolton, Sunderland, Blackburn etc are all on this list. Surprising to see the Spuds so low in 110th.

    What really pisses me off is that we know Wenger has been using clever accounting to overpay our dross players in order to avoid having to spend money on transfers. If the sponsors weren’t on such a good deal, I think they would be steaming….

  53. arsenal4ever

    so Albo you want to wait even longer? It is your right but to tell fans each year we will strengthen and nothing happens is simply a shit lie. I for one have enough of this bullshit nonsense. If it is with or without Wenger I dont care. I want only the good for AFC nothing else. Who is manager I dont care as long he shows ambitions to win something. There is a life after Wenger. Wether it will be better or not it has to be seen.

  54. Pedro

    Well, had a bit of a twitter debate with the guys behind that website.

    They have no info on support… no web-hits, no paid memberships, no merchandise info

    They are annonymous… so no one is fronting the campaign

    There goals are muddied. They can’t define what they’re looking get out of it.

    There biggest success seems to be that a journo backs there cause. Not fan backing… journo backing.

    Seems a bit dodgy to me…

  55. Matt

    How is it a peculiarity of sport that success is measured in trophies?

    Sport at the highest level is ALL about winning, or certainly should be anyway.

  56. Franchise

    Albo like how certain I expect night to come that is the same way I expect your AKbious stance

    let me inform you that there comes a time when stagnation which is what we have achieved means P45 (sack letter)

    its not like we have failed because of different issues this season

    Same thing every fucking year for the last 5 years

    Ive had this argument with other AKBs on this site 2 years ago. Tell what changed since then

    stupid cunt of a manager is still fooling himself weekly in the 2nd half of the season

  57. charybdis1966

    Yeah, good to see you’re still around Sabeel, the way the football’s going I’m looking forward to watching India play cricket over here later this summer.
    I was in a bar when the Cohen goal went in and all OI did was start to giggle to myself hysterically while the rest of the bar cheered and clapped.

  58. Gunnerpete

    think this article says it all. We have to believe that Arsene took on the crap end of the stick to get the stadium built. The vast money raised selling our top players must have reduced our debt by 30% at least unless the money has gone elsewhere? Now after yet another humiliating season of failure ie; Failure to produce a squad that has enough quality to cover for our traditional major injuries. Failure to buy top quality when needed for 5 years. Failure to accept that certain favourite players bottle it in big and small games home and away. Failure to employ a defensive coach to iron out the fatal flaws that twice has lost us titles when defending leads were needed. Finally failure to bring in UK spirit and pride to fight for ‘our’ club when all about us (especially the press) are hoping for our team to fail. Failure to buy UK players for the same prices who are better than the foreigners purchased ie: Johnson (brum) Smalling (Manure) Johnson (City) Baines(Everton) Cahill, Jagielka, All better than AFC squad players.

    Now a miracle turnabout is needed but not expected ie; Arsene has to have a clear our first week after season end….Almunia, Denilson, Diaby, Rosicky, Eboue, Clichy, Squillaci, Vela, plus at least 6 loanies who everyone accepts will not even make our bench. This will take guts..has AW got it?

    Buys should include players know to be Gunners…Tarrabt…Richards…(Smalling if they can buy from us why not the other way around?) add Cahill and Jagielka and pay for them all by selling Cesc.

    The team for next year could look like this:


    Sagna..Cahill…Vermaelen.. Gibbs

    Djourou Wilshire Koscielny

    Walcott RVP

    Yes I know our present CB’s are listed as MDF but both are quick, both big, both skillful and both can attack. What would you rather have ? another 4 tip tappers who pass 20 times without a shot and a defence that CANNOT defend or a fast skillful team that no forward line would like to face. Another big advantage would be that IF we have major injuries we have a squad that can cover all areas.


  59. Albo

    Yes Matt – and that is peculiar to sport, as opposed to business. Someone earlier said that Wenger would have been hounded out of his job if he worked for a big business. I was simply pointing out that in big business, keeping a company consistently as a market leader (but not THE market leader) would be praised, not vilified.

    Arsenal4ever – you’re putting words into my mouth there. I didn’t say I wanted nothing to change, and never have said that.

  60. Stuart

    The best way to protest is for NO ONE to attend the villa game and have an empty stadium apart from the villa fans

    it would be interesting to see how they would announce the attendance for the game

  61. Sabeel


    same here,i was clapping that cohen goal after the shock of that goal,becos it would prove to stan that we lack a lot in the team..

    Stan needs to recognise that,if he doesnt,he is another puppet….

    In Summer we WILL know if Stan is another puppet of wenger or Not,by seeing
    1) wether transfers happen
    2)getting Dein/or as much strong personality for deins rols

  62. gambon

    “Over the 14 seasons before Wenger took over, Arsenal had finished in the top four on just six occasions.

    That’s a very good stat for all the people on here who declare that our ‘rightful place’ is at the pinnacle of English football…”

    Stupid comment.

    In the 7 years before Wenger joined we won the league twice, the FA Cup & League Cup.

    In the last 7 seasons we’ve won 1 FA cup (very luckily)

    It really doesnt help when unabitious fans only care about top 4 finishes, and entry to a competition we cant possibly win.

  63. Moray


    Arsène Wenger says the last seven days have encapsulated Arsenal’s season – a campaign full of promise that will ultimately end in disappointment.

    A last-minute Tamir Cohen header effectively finished Arsenal’s title challenge as Bolton recorded a 2-1 victory on Sunday to end the Gunners’ 16-game unbeaten run in the Premier League.

    The defeat concluded a miserable week for Wenger and his side that saw crucial points dropped on three separate occasions.

    “We have taken two points out of nine and we should have taken nine. That, a little bit, sums up our season,” said the Arsenal manager.

    “We were leading against Liverpool until the last second, we were leading against Tottenham and on Sunday we were close to winning and we lost the game. It sums up what has happened since January.

    “I do not want to blame the players. I believe the players have an outstanding attitude [and] it’s a shame they are not rewarded. But we have to accept it and go on.

    “It’s very unlikely [that we can win the title] but the size of the Club means we have the pride to fight and that is what has to inspire us.”


    fight [faɪt]
    vb fights, fighting, fought
    1. to oppose or struggle against (an enemy) in battle
    2. to oppose or struggle against (a person, thing, cause, etc.) in any manner
    3. (tr) to engage in or carry on (a battle, contest, etc.)
    4. (when intr often foll by for) to uphold or maintain (a cause, ideal, etc.) by fighting or struggling to fight for freedom
    5. (tr) to make or achieve (a way) by fighting
    6. (Individual Sports & Recreations / Boxing) (intr) Boxing
    a. to box, as for a living
    b. to use aggressive rough tactics
    7. (Military) to engage (another or others) in combat
    fight it out to contend or struggle until a decisive result is obtained
    fight shy of to keep aloof from
    1. a battle, struggle, or physical combat
    2. a quarrel, dispute, or contest
    3. resistance (esp in the phrase to put up a fight)
    4. the desire to take part in physical combat (esp in the phrase to show fight)
    5. (Individual Sports & Recreations / Boxing) a boxing match See also fight back, fight off
    [Old English feohtan; related to Old Frisian fiuchta, Old Saxon, Old High German fehtan to fight]

    Anyone see a definition here to match what we have been doing these last few weeks?

  64. WengersSweeties

    We’re gonna have 2 years of Wenger whether we like it or not.

    Personally I haven’t seen Wenger look this deflated and angry before.

    I would never protest on having Wenger sacked or asking him to leave. That is stupid.

    But (perhaps this is naive of me) I do have the feeling this will be the summer the fans get their wish and the correct changes are made at Arsenal.

    I think we’re see Pat Rice leave and a new assistant installed and I believe we’re get what we’ve wanted and see the squad improved.

    Whether is will only be papering over the cracks remains to be seen. I still think there’s deeper issues with the way Wenger plays with no tactics, and players are rewarded with big wages whether they win lose or draw.

    I still think with the investment of top class players that have a winning mentality in their blood will be key but only time will decide what will happen for sure I guess.

  65. Queen of suburbia

    A typical comment by the moron that is charlie george:

    And the worms in the solar plexus of the ultimate warrior crawl and crawl, the highest mountain, the lowest valley, the vegimite factor of twelve pushing along the train to it’s final destination, the green painted door and the hole of doom that sits the monster within my soul, within your soul, within all our souls!

    Fucking barking.

  66. Josip Skoblar

    Franchise says:
    April 26, 2011 at 10:09

    Albo in no other profession will a manager not be hounded for failing in similar fashion for 5 out of the last 6 years.

    You’re wrong. A few examples: bankster, politician.

  67. Albo

    Franchise – bottom line is you picked a poor parallel. If a manager had kept a company competitive over several years despite the entry of HUGE new competitors into the ring (Chelsea, Man City etc) then he would be rewarded, not fired.

    I’m not arguing that the same holds true in sport, I’m simply pointing out that your parallel is flawed…

  68. Moray

    I remember distinctly at the end of last season thinking that Wenger was on the verge of a nervous breakdown. It was inevitable that he had realised the error of his ways and would have to spend and buy what we were lacking. Needless to say, it didn’t happen. And we had 30 mill in the bank. and now we are back to where we started, many years ago. I don’t see how or that it will change.

  69. Robbiec1123

    I agree. Waiting for them to walk over and give a pathetic half hearted clap above their head is pointless. All go before the final whistle.

    Black scarf doesnt make a statment to me. Alright its not the time if year for a scarf but near on all scarfs are black i dont think it will be noticed. Black and white instead of red n white

  70. TOMTOM

    Wenger wont spend in the summer. The likes of Sunderland,Villa,Newcastle and even QPR will spend more. The only way Wenger will spend is if Cesc leaves and even at that he wont spend all the money we get for Cesc as Wenger must always balance the precious books.

  71. Queen of suburbia

    Anyway ignoring the Spud.

    There will be a time when Wenger is no longer up to the job. Then that will be the time for protest.

    I’m still convinced that a few wise signings will see us win things.

    There aren’t many managers that I would rather see spend the money than Wenger. Will he won’t he? Hard to tell.

    He certainly isn’t going to say so before the end of the season.

  72. Albo

    gambon – actually it’s not a stupid comment at all. It shows that we were a cup winning team rather than one of the consistently best teams in the country. And that is a fact.

    It is a stat that specifically counters the assertion on here that we have always been, and always will be, at the very pinnacle of English football.

  73. Franchise

    Albo u think being in the top 4 is being competitive as a stand alone stat?

    if we were as competitive as we ought to have been we would have at some point topped the league in the last 8 weeks

    look at how many chances we fluffed

    we were just flattering to deceive and being 3 points behind a chelsea team that like 8-10 weeks ago was 10 points behind us proves my point

    Easier run in my ass

  74. Albo

    Pedro – I agree that a protest, even if it’s only a couple of hundred people, is far more in the interest of journos than it is in the interests of AFC or it’s fans.

  75. Moray

    Albo, you have to factor in the huge expenditure. What we don’t spend in transfers, we make up for in salary. It is all smoke and mirrors. You would have to ask what would provide a better return – 10m less spent on propping up our largely unsuccessful youth system wages could have made the difference in signing a Cahill instead of a Squillachi. It is all about bad business decisions. and not only that, we will be forced to sell Fabregas at under market rate, as he wants to go and is now an injury case, we will lose Clichy and Nasri for cheap as they are near the ends of their contract, Arshavin ditto as he is getting on, and then have to buy at the height of the market…or not, of course.

  76. Franchise

    Josip Skoblar i’ll rephrase. In any proper organisation where accountability is important, no manager would survive 5 years of similar failings

    Accountability in this context is relative to what each manager should be accountable for in his/her respective industry

    so in a law firm it would be no. of won cases. in an assassin organisation no of successful kills etc 😀

  77. Albo

    Franchise – to be clear, my point was not that we should regard our past seasons as ‘successes’. It was simply to say that business is very different and that as a result your parallel wasn’t particularly helpful. That’s all…

  78. WengersSweeties

    Albo –

    gambon – actually it’s not a stupid comment at all. It shows that we were a cup winning team rather than one of the consistently best teams in the country. And that is a fact.

    It is a stat that specifically counters the assertion on here that we have always been, and always will be, at the very pinnacle of English football.


    Hold up there a minute Albo, we are a club that is rich in history. We had 10 championships before Wenger came along and we’re the European Cup Winners Cup Champions and reached a final after winning that.

    We are a club with high expectations and rightly so.

    That should always be remembered when considering Wenger.

  79. Franchise

    Queen of suburbia I agree too. Wenger should go sign the obvious for a change

    IMO he is obsessed with unearthing unknown talents or buying unexpected players

    FFS Koscielny cost us btw £8m and £10m it is rumoured. Vidc cost United £7m

    the difference was Vidic had proven himself to have something special as a member of the Serbian back 4 that had the best defensive record in 2006 world cup qualifiers. Also had league title and cup from Russian league

  80. Voodoo Chile

    I wish the fans would start supporting the team instead of protesting against the board. Might encourage the team to get some results…

  81. sarge

    Spending is not answer to the problem. If he continues to coach his half arsed ideas about how the game should be played then we will still be having this conversation same time next year. Until the so called coaching genius realises that we are only in possession for about 55% of the game and learns to set up a team off the ball then we are gonna continue to leak silly goals against counter attacks and set pieces.

    The first bit of business of the summer should be to let Pat retire and sack Boro and either promote internally (Bouldy) or bring in a younger coaching team with a more rounded skill set than just attacking ideas in their locker.

    The dynamics are stale and all wrong if this team wants to improve. Signing a few players will not change it.

  82. Albo

    WengersSweeties – we are one of the great clubs of English football with one of the proudest histories. I am simply countering an opinion (that I assume comes from fans who only came to know Arsenal in the last 15 years or so) that we have a god given right to trophies and league titles year in year out…

  83. Maximus

    I disagree Albo

    In this ‘business’ as you put it we are not Market leaders or amongst them at the moment.

    In business Market leaders are the ones who are dominant in gaining the largest Market share and produce large profits yearly.

    Whereas the Market leaders in football are defined by their dominance of the game which brings trophies and not how much profit to produce.

    The fact you compare the goals of a football club similar to that of a business is ridiculous, I suggest you look up the definitions of sport and of businesd, the only similarities is that they both want to be successful in what they do, but in each case, success is determined in completely different ways.

    I genuinely think we’ve lost our identity in terms of we don’t no if we want to be a football club, or solely a football club as a business.

  84. Franchise

    personally I would sign
    an experience GK that can serve us for 2-3 years
    a replacement for Clichy (I like Baines),
    find a partner for Vermaelen (Cahill or Hangeland)
    a partner for VP up front (Cavani or Falcao)
    Defensive midfielder (Mascherano or any other antichrist of a player)

    5 at a minimum

    I will play most of the lower table sides with 2 upfront especially when we are at home. We need to be more flexible with formations

  85. WengersSweeties

    Bringing in Bould to replace Rice is a must this summer.

    Of defence needs the wise words of a master and who better than Steve Bould?

    That would only improve the set up in my opinion.

  86. sarge

    Being in the top 4 has only become a benchmark since Uefa changed the Champions league qualifying rules. Before that it meant jack shit. So, moving the goal posts doesn’t suddenly and conveniently make it the equivalent to winning a trophy

  87. Josip Skoblar

    Anyway, we’re talking about football results, not economic or business results. So by all means it’s relative failure. Besides, don’t forget there are many competitors and only one league champion, one cup winner, etc. I went through the 1970s and back then we had long spells without winning anything. It doesn’t mean I lack ambition for AFC, I’m just a realist.

  88. WengersSweeties

    Albo –

    Fair enough Albo but I think Arsenal fans have been more than patient and have paid good money and traveled with no return from the club, just a 6.5% increase on ticket pricing for their trouble.

    Don’t be confused with a ‘God given right’ and being ambitious.

  89. Albo

    Franchise – I agree re signings. For me the most frustrating thing is that our youth policy has to some extent been a success. Building a 1st 11 that, I think most would agree, can give any team in the world a run for their money on the day, for less than the cost of Torres, is a great achievement.

    All we need to do is augment that strategy a little. The impact that even just a couple of proven top class players could have on this squad would be enormous. THAT is what is so frustrating…

  90. Moray

    Here is my 6-step summary of what I think needs to be done. It’s not rocket science:

    1) Proper coaching, particularly defensively
    2) Strong leadership on and off the pitch
    3) Stop the moaning and whingeing about perceived or actual wrongs
    4) Play players in the right position
    5) Buy decent players in the positions we need
    6) Get rid of the dross and injury-cases

  91. Franchise

    VP IMO is designed to play in a 4411. he has done well as a lone striker so far

    I would keep Arshavin, NAsri, Walcott, Little Jack can also play LM

    I remember when we played 4411 with Hleb and Rosicky as wide men and Flamini and Cesc in the middle with Ade and VP up top

    That has been our best league campaign since 04. Unfortunately we capitulated again. Arsene should have topped up than January

  92. gambon

    The thing that really highlights how poor wenger has become is our embarassing defence.

    in 2008/9 we conceded 37 goals.

    Wengers response: “We werent strong enough defensively, we must improve that”

    In 2009/10 we conceded 42 goals (Great improvemt Arsene)

    Wengers response: “We must improve defensively”

    This year, 36 in 34 games so far, on course for 40/41.

    Wengers response the other day “Defensively we arent stable enough”

    So this is a guy who has highlighted 3 years running that our defence is a problem, who has seen us give away 2 goal leads for fun, yet he clearly has absolutely no idea how to rectify it…..people really want this guy to stay?

    What will happen next season? Wenger will say he will improve the defence, we will concede 40 goals….rinse & repeat until he gets thrown in a loony bin.

  93. GunnerWin1

    Wenger has achieved what he has set out to do…!!!
    He is a like a politician canvassing for votes just before an election. Leading everybody on by saying the things they want to hear. He will not buy any proven players as it will go against his philosophy. All Wenger wants is to tell the world of football “I told you so…these youngsters could do it!!!” Every single Gooner who believes Wenger is the coach to take us forward is completely and utterly deluded. Arsenal does not belong to the fans, as much as they would love you to believe it, it’s not true. This club is Wenger’s play thing. He is a spoilt kid wih a favourite toy and nobody is going to touch it or take it away from him. The sad truth is Wenger will be the downfall of this Great club and we the fans will be left to pick up the pieces and each other. Pushing Wenger upstairs won’t work either as he will help appoint a manager in is own image and one with the same philosophy as he. My fellow Gooners I think it’s high time that each and every one of us think hard and search deep within our Arsenal loving hearts for an answer to the next question…Wenger in or out? I know my answer to that question. What is yours?

  94. Franchise

    Josip Skoblar that is why the failings is as a result of not improving on our position

    this year the league was oh so very winnable and we fucked it up with the easier run in

    United have even dropped more points than expected when many were doing their run in calculations

    we could have been top if not for the crazy draws we have had at home of recent and not being able to hold on to a lead against Liverpool (unforgivable) and Tottenham

  95. Matt

    Cracking point Sarge. If top 6 meant champions league football then the same Arsenal fans who think Wenger is still doing a great job would be happpy finishing 6th every year!!

  96. eleanor

    Protest at what?

    How the combined footballing knowledge of a couple of hundred Wenger-haters and part-time ‘experts’ thinks it can solve a problem way above its pay grade?

    If any of you had a fraction of the expertise of Wenger you’d be out there Aladycing your way through the Premier League in a heartbeat. The fact that your not is enough for me.

    You were spitting bile at the start of the season and here you are still spitting it.

    Doubtless you’ll be just the same at the start of next season’s campaign.

  97. Franchise

    Josip Skoblar if it were one year under consideration then Wenger doesnt deserve the criticism. It has been 6 years

    6 years

    He dismantled the Invincibles too suddenly IMO

  98. Stevo

    Just wondered why nobody is mentioning the fact that fourth place is not done and dusted yet.I can only see two more points for Arsenal,draws with both Villa and Fulham,certain defeats against Stoke and Utd mean that City will get third.I realise Spurs have difficult games against Chelsea,Liverpool and City, but its not certain that they will lose them all,plus they also have two gimmes at home to Birmingham and Blackpool.So a slightly worrying scenario, anyone agree?

  99. Moray

    gambon, he buys players in a panic at the end of the transfer window. not just Kozzer and Squillachi, but Silvestre and the Campbell resigning. We can’t expect to improve with panic signings like that. And then they get no time to play together before the real games begin. We are not poverty-stricken, just cheap.

  100. Albo

    Franchise says:
    April 26, 2011 at 10:53
    personally I would sign
    an experience GK that can serve us for 2-3 years
    a replacement for Clichy (I like Baines),
    find a partner for Vermaelen (Cahill or Hangeland)
    a partner for VP up front (Cavani or Falcao)
    Defensive midfielder (Mascherano or any other antichrist of a player)

    5 at a minimum

    I will play most of the lower table sides with 2 upfront especially when we are at home. We need to be more flexible with formations

    I agree with most of that. However, if we’re looking at what Wenger might realistically do (as opposed to our hopes of what he might do) I reckon we really need 1 defender, 1 striker and maybe a midfielder. I think at keeper we are fine, and actually I think our central midfield could be covered by promotions. Frimpong and Coquelin are, for me, good enough to understudy in the middle of the park (with the latter particularly useful as he is also cover at RB).

    1 world class CB and 1 more world class striker would transform this team though.

    And I TOTALLY agree about 4-4-2 against lesser sides.

  101. WengersSweeties

    Just playing a Youtube of Arsenal vs Parma in the Cup Winners Cup. 1994.

    Interestingly we play the same formation as today’s current team.






    Just thought I’d throw that in there.

  102. sarge

    Gambon. Couldn’t agree more. Sunday morning defending every week,. But it’s not just the back 4, it’s the whole team. with Wenger, it’s like knowing you’ve got a hole in your roof but you rather catch the rain in buckets rather than fix the roof.

  103. Josip Skoblar

    Agreed, the man’s made big mistakes but it remains hard to win the EPL with the likes of ManU, Chelsea, Liverpool and now ManCity. With foreign money, the ELP has recently become a very competitive league. Each year 6-7 clubs have a chance of winning it. Compare that with Spain, Germany, the Netherlands, Scotland, France… it’s always the same usual 2-3 suspects there. Mind you, ManU (almost) always end up winning it 🙂

  104. Franchise

    Albo GK is ok but he is too young IMO

    he will be a great no.2 to have

    his time will come but at 21 im afraid he will cost us on a few occassions because of his inexperience

    his a big shot stopper which is a nice to have but he isnt commanding in the area and his decision making is suspect mainly cos of his inexperience

  105. Stuart

    albo – dein got kicked off the board b’cos he predicted that if we did not spent the £££££ then we would win sod all!!!!

    the board didnt like it and they got rid of him, but he is the reason why kroenke and usmanov have an interest

  106. Matt

    ‘You were here spitting bile at the start of the season and here you are still spitting it’

    I think the people who were ‘spitting bile’ at the start of the season were doing so because Wenger once again refused to resolve glaring problems with the team and knew where it would leave us at the end of the season. The fact that we have yet again pissed away any chance of winning anything this season surely shows that these people were right!?

  107. MoW

    good stuff Pedro. thoughful.

    agree it would be nice to see a clear agenda from the protest first.

    but isn’t reality different. protests often require a bunch of strangers to team together and air their views collectively, and it’s always going to hard to distill collective thinking into one concise list of points.

    whether its about arsenal of Mubarak; public prostests will carry a wide variety of views. that’s the way it’s always been.

    instead i reckon people should simply go if they want, and claim their own point. make your own plackard, paint your own signs, chant your own slogans. doubtless there will be loads of different views and some of them conflicting, but the important things is to get the viewes out there, get them in the media, on the TV, in the minds of the club. media coverage and further debate will then be able to pick apart the detail and figure out what the real agenda is.