Good morning all, before you read this, please understand it’s not a pop at the manager or the club, it’s more of a question to the board regarding our much talked about debt, so read on and ask yourselves the same question, I have only worked my figures out on what I have read over the years from Arsenal, I didn’t make this up.
ARE WE REALLY IN DEBT AND IF SO, HOW?
So in the Sunday Times Ivan Gazidas is being interviewed by Matthew Goodman and he talks about of our legendary debt, he says that £240 million is long term, taken out to finance the new stadium and the benefits of early repayment are open to debate. The remainder which is £120 million, was taken out to redevelop the old stadium and is due to be repaid next April but Arsenal are in talks with the banks about delaying it until the property market recovers.
THIS IS NOT AN OLD STORY GROVERS, IT’S BRAND NEW AND IT WAS IN YESTERDAYS NEWSPAPER.
Now this is what I meant by porkies told by Arsenal and the rate in which they keep changing their story, moving the goal posts is one thing, saying you have no goal posts is something else.
A few weeks ago our Ivan wrote a letter to shareholders explaining the myth of the debt and said that the Highbury Square deal was ringfenced and had nothing to do with the Football club. My, two weeks on and the story has changed.
When we first bought the stadium we did an upfront deal with Emirates of £100 million for 15 years of naming rights and a further £50 million for 8 years of shirt sponsorship, at the time as a marketing man I said it was a lousy deal, but as it was upfront and I understood they wanted to bring down the debt quickly. Which was £350 million, or so we were told at the time.
So that deal left a £200 million debt, which was more than covered by the Highbury Square development, Highbury Square they tell us will net us £240 million when it’s completed at the end of this year.
So onto the next porky, if you look at Arsenal’s advertising for the property project, it says 95% sold, if it is, why do we need to refinance it when the property market picks up, we already have the money? If that is, they told the truth when they advertised that 95% were sold.
Even without Highbury Square according to deals done we only owe £200 million and over the last 5 years we have spent nothing on players, won and received huge amounts in prize money, TV money and EPL money so really we should have no debt at all.
So where is it? Our stadium is named the Emirates and we have that on our shirts, so presumably they paid us, where has that money gone? As they still talk of re-financing the debt it suggests to me that nothing has been paid off as we still owe the same amount that we did when we first moved in.
OR AM I MISSING SOMETHING HERE?
Why do they continue to mislead us? Why is Gazidas treating us all like children that can’t add up, and why are we still in debt when we spend nothing on new players.
Please Arsenal explain, we asked for clarity and honesty a while back and the porkies continue, and on top of this you have trebled your income with gate money, not even mentioning the internationals, the pop concerts and the conferences.
There is something very un Arsenal about the way this board conduct themselves these days, notice how we never buy a player for anything other than an undisclosed fee, why? We rarely know what we sell a player for either, I mean what did Reyes cost and what did we sell him for?
One minute we have a lockdown and a united board the next Nina’s lobbed out, another minute PHW tells Kroenke we don’t need his kind, the next he’s the single largest shareholder, we call ourselves the Emirates stadium because we needed the money up front, then Gazidas tells the Sunday times we have a debt of £360 million, still!
How? We started with a £400 million debt, got roughly £150 million up front from Emirates, make £3 million a game, get £30 million a year from the EPL, got £40+ million from the ECL plus the Carling cup, the FA cup, the Youth cup and television money, not to mention all the small sponsors and of course Nike.
AND WE GET A SIMILAR AMOUNT EVERY SEASON, WE’VE BEEN HERE WHAT, 3 SEASONS? DO THE MATH!!!
Where is it all? How have we still got a debt? How long will these excuses go on for? It’s Ok being told we have to be frugal as we have no money – ten minutes after being told we have to move to compete with the Mancs and the Chavs, but will someone at Arsenal please tell us when this will all end and we can start acting like a football club again, you know, buying quality players, like we used to, before project youth.
Stop keeping us in the dark and feeding us shit, we’re your fans not mushrooms.
Le Grove is now smart phone compatible!
Pedro
Geoff
1st!
I’m Back Lol..
That was quick, sorry about the length it’s how I felt after reading Gazidas’s piece yesterday.
A Streetcar Named Cartman
Here Here. Some Clarity please.
btw what did u think of Gibbs next to Fab as the motor, with pace, technique tackling ablitiy and can cross?
Anything is better than what we have!
top 10
Maybe in 2 years Jay, but by then Coquelin and Ramsey will be better in that position, and Gibbs will be the left back by then.
LOL… i mean i know hes a left sided player…but he can win headers, 1.80 m (5 ft 11 in) and has alot of passion…. hehe
A, most likely. I see Ramsey taking that spot..and Merida to eventually take over Cesc.. but i mean for now if no 1 is brought in…
gibbs can attack as well as he defends!
effin brilliant post mate….
morning all. Marseille’s combative midfielder Lorik Cana has been granted permission to leave the Ligue 1 club this summer.
The 25-year-old is a target of many clubs around the world, most notably Arsenal, Liverpool, Wolfsburg and Spurs.
L’OM’s sporting director Jose Anigo admits that they will not stay in the way of their skipper if he does decide to move.
gilberto has told melo to join us….
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/a/arsenal/8123503.stm
You put a good arguement. It makes u wonder though, why not give to charity???
Geoff we got a £350m loan to build the stadium i think we paid a huge chunk off with the money we got upfront from the emirates
that is why the stadium debt is about £250m now and not £350m
Cana will fit in well with us as well..Come on sign a few arsene, make them earn their spots with talent around, and get rid of the dead wood next year if you want to keep the squad together this year.
Good point. But why isnt anything going to charity???Makes You think.
i get ur point re clarity though
Nah Jay, Gibbs is nowhere near ready to play centre mid for us, long way down the pecking order!! I agree I think Ramsey will ultimately be a mainstay centre mid, and it’ll be interesting to see how Merida progresses this season, though Ozyakup could come from under the radar and be sensational in the cesc role, he’s a real talent.
the signings will start for everyone now the confederations cup is over
Geoff, a little fact that the Arsenal board don’t like to advertise (although it is in previous accounts as it has to be), is that a lot of the original bank loan (70+ million) that was supposedly for the Highbury Square development was actually spent on Highbury House for the all the directors to have their luxury offices.
Yeah, for everyone except us.
GMR that’s more like it, so why aren’t we told that our money has gone on them?
Bring on the signings..
A i was saying it as a joke…as in let the LB stay there, and sign some1..
Ah ok Jay, I thought you were being serious, seeing as Gibbs used to be a centre mid etc and played for England u21 there for a bit the other day!
Morning Geoff.
Your post backs up what i was told a weeks or so ago and what i posted on here about the Highbury Square development. That it is draining ALL available funds away from the club, and that none of the revenues generated is going to pay off the Emirates Stadium early!!
well where this is smoke..theres fire A.
realistically..Melo or Cana/ – to be replaced with Denilson/Song/Ramsey if injured… sound good?
Geoff, I couldn’t agree more. I hate hearing about the housing market crash when 70+ million was dead money spent on themselves. Couldn’t they have used the conference facilities at the Emirates Stadium for a few years until Highbury Square was finished & sold off, then they could have used some of those profits building their offices. Our bank loan that we now cannot afford to repay would have been finished by now had that 70 million gone to Highbury Square instead of Highbury House.
It’s amazing how Highbury House is never allowed to be brought up though & yes I did try & ask that question at the AGM but it didn’t get past their screening.
I’d be very happy with that Jay, and summer spending ends there, sorted!
Indeed. Hopefully we dont loose any CB (he wont sell Silvestre and admit hes wrong, not that i want to keep him. Gallas Verm and Toure for spots and covering injuries, and enough creative forces up front and strikers in Theo/Vela/Arsh/VP/Ade is enough for me (If ade goes who do u get A? realistically..lol
we are very close to Serdar Tasci , another defender
also cana is ready to go , so is melo but he is a bit expencesive and dificult thing…
Must be amazing being on the arsenal board.im sure loads of cash going to their private bank acounts.seem they are driven by greed rather that winning
i think we’ll get the chamakh bloke as well when ade goes.
That will make an interesting post all by itself GMR!
Gunneroo sorry it took so long, you are now free to blog, welcome!
Geoff, nice post mate. I am not English and don’t live in England but I love Arsenal and I agree with you that we seem to have the same debt for a few years now. I also think that we should have lower debt, however you didn’t mention payments to the staff, board, players, contracts, wages…. I haven’t read the report from AFC but I guess they are huge.
Still, your remark is spot on and we are not being told something.
P.S. I too hate the “undisclosed” transfers!
oh fuck im not going to bite on this wheres the money subject going again …
but i will go one step higher and state our current board make the decisions ..they can float the funds, invest it into other developments around north London .. all buy fucking luxury cruise ships and we wouldn’t be any wiser ..
and shonky antics like several board members being sacked and other’s with huge cash reserves being put in place , ivan coming on board taking over the
liars job from arsene .
one thing for sure is this current board has never liked paying over the odds … STOP …
ill rephrase that .. this board has NEVER spent any MONEY ‘EVER’ on new players !!!!
.. and for me, that is enough reason for the average football fan to despise them !
i would take my chance with a rich sugar daddy
with huge surplus funds any day of the week over these penny pinching clowns ..
and yes they are penny pincher’s ..
and they are pinching from YOU!
Morning all, without doing “the day job” on the figures the only thing I can think of that can possibly keep the debt up would be the interest chargeable – this may be at a high rate so if the repayments made, per year, are less than the interest charge then the debt can creep up; additionally new loans taken out (the reasons for which will be kept secret naturellement). BUT- we were told a while back that Fiszman, Friar et al negotiated good rates of interest for us, so that shouldn’t be the reason.
If we weren’t so financially challenged we wouldn’t have a problem disclosing transfer fees – also if we were asa rich as Real Madrid we would offer Arsenal TV free like RM do their TV channel. RM are saying “we’re so rich we can afford to give you RM TV and we could get more fans that way. The way AFC act they’re pricing people out of being Arsenal fans – even those that should(and want to) be fans.
Noone as a forward Jay, Ade goes because we’ve got too many, though obviously if a Benzema was available I wouldn’t mind us snapping him up, but it aint gonna happen! I wouldn’t mind another right sided centre back, currently kolo is the only right sided one, with gallas, vermaelen, senderos, silvestre, and jd all prefering the left hand side. I do wonder if silvestre will go, I’m sure wenger would want to keep him around in an advisory sort of experienced head in the dressing room role, but seeing as he said he wanted to play regularly and it’ll never happen with us he could demand a move
We are even spending less now than at highbury.feel like we have gone a few steps back
Bozin that all come out of gate receipts.
Franchise and Dennis, we never get the same story twice and my point about the property is first they say it’s ring fenced then they say it isn’t, then they say it’s 95% sold, so pick one of them and there are two lies in there.
http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11670_5405427,00.html
this is good for us… milan will give it another 48 hours to sign dzeko then look elsewhere!
A whatever Silvestre did in the dressing room didn’t work did it!
Geoff, I have to commend you on that article. Brilliantly written and broken down exceptionally well. I’m even more confused now as to where the missing millions are.
You are still a cunt though.
A racist one.
Chary I’m not around too much today and Pedro’s not back until tomorrow so you may be held up, sorry mate.
Thanks Steve I worked on that one all night, loved your Madonna joke though.
Ok Geoff – no probs; this heat and lack of sleep has made me more laid back than usual.
Oh, and Steve you’re the best fascist on the blog !
Don’t start.
Good Morning Everyone
I read today that we are linked with a 30 million pound bid for benzema (that is if Adebayor is sold for 20 million or over)
Source is the News of the World.
Now i know this isn’t 100% reliable, but doesn’t it make sense? I remember benzema claiming he would love to play under wenger, and wenger has openly admitted his admiration for the lyon forward. IF adebayor was to be sold for 20 mil, only 10 mil extra would be needed!
Additionally lyon has apparently verbally agreed to give arsenal first choice over benzema if their demands are met.
Sounds good…perhaps TOO good?
nice post geoff
but didnt tht shirt sponsor ship was suppose to end by 2011/2012..new sponsor in next on so tht make 6 yrs.. imight be wrong
What do you mean it didn’t work Geoff?! I’m sure the youngsters like gibbs and most of the team learnt from his experience etc, it’s only in the playing side of things he’s lacking!
Geoff –
Morning.
You are forgetting about the building costs to build Highbury Square.
If you read the accounts we had 90 mill in cash, this has not been offset against any debt.
So we had 350 mill for Ashburton Grove- we received 150 in sponsorship for the, leaving 200 mill.
To build Highbury square it seems we borrowed a further 120 mill to build the flats.
I believe the 240 mill quoted is profit, i.e. the revenue for the flats will be around 360 mill, 750 units and just over 450k a unit.
The 95% sold, is 95% exchanged.
There are people who exchanged, who wont/ can complete.
We have a silly wage bill of 100+ mill a year, and all of the money we get for players, comes in dribs and drabs.
To me, once we sel Highbury Square, we wont have ANY debt, and will probably have something like 30 mill EXTRA for players.
well said
So Geoff, what are your thoughts on the money situation?
Are we being fed a line by the board so that Wenger can be given freedom to complete ‘project youth’ or has the money disappeared??
Has the club taken on too much debt under ridiculous repayment methods perhaps?
Maybe the loan agreement was at an extortionate level of interest on a fixed plan before interest rates and more importantly libors met an all time low??
I dont want another damn african striker.or 2 be honest,no more africans.after ade im done with them.take ade money and get a world class dm.we have alot of options for striker
anyways i heard a rumour that the official date for the gousing market is 6th May 2010
hmmmmmm
First of all, you didn’t consider the enormous amount of wages Arsenal pay. Today we pay MUCH MORE on wages than what we used to pay 6-7 years ago, when we won trophies with Henry, Bergkamp, Campbell, Vieira and Ljungberg. That’s shocking in my mind. And the wage bill keeps going up with new contract offers. To have players like Song, Eboue and Bendtner, we pay more than we used to pay only a few years back, when we had the best team in the world. Yes, the market has inflated, but it’s still unbelieveable.
And who said all the Emirates money was paid up front? I’m not sure it’s true.
But the main thing is, of course, Highbury Square. I don’t buy all that “ring-fenced” talk for one minute, this is the club’s biggest financial problem, and that’s why we are going to sell at least one more so-called high profile player (hopefully Adebayor) this summer.
sorry i heard that the offical daye for the housing market pick up is 6th May 2010
steve u r a tasteless fascist
Geoff, a little fact that the Arsenal board don’t like to advertise (although it is in previous accounts as it has to be), is that a lot of the original bank loan (70+ million) that was supposedly for the Highbury Square development was actually spent on Highbury House for the all the directors to have their luxury offices.
Do you have a source for this? I find that sum extraordinary.
Also if anyone could link to an article which says the Emirates deals were 150 million pounds up front I’d appreciate it. That doesn’t seem right to me.
There are certain legalities and machinations to businesses that deal with such large sums of money that I don’t fully understand, and that none of us really can understand unless we are privy to the business dealings of the club, and we’re not, because businesses don’t work that way, and I don’t think the club should offer complete transparency at all. THE MATH!!!!! is probably more complicated than you, as a layperson as far as I’m aware, make it seem. Apart from that I really couldn’t care less about the in depth details regarding how club is run financially, to be honest. I trust the judgement of those in charge because they, between them, have greater expertise in this area than I do, and frankly it’s just completely uninteresting to me.
I’m not really one to entertain conspiracy theories about the directors siphoning money from the club to fund their yachts or whatnot at the expense of the club and sacrifing our potential on field strength. Call me naive but I just don’t think it happens.
fuck cant i do without the typos
350m was the debt incurred for building the stadium…more money was taken on to develop highbury square (still being taken?)…that i think is the 120m that he is talking about..as to where all the money that we have made so far has gone, the financial statements released by arsenal show something close to 94m as money in bank…while im no expert at these things i think this they want to keep for emergencies or some of it could be tied up by some stipulations undertaken while taking the loan..we should be able to get a much better picture of the debt situation after april 2010 when the highbury square loan is due.. as for the loan on the stadium its a very long term one (25 yrs?) so the rate at which it is reducing is going to be very slow..I dont think there is any reason to be negative about this…while we may not be the most successful team on pitch we are still one of the best managed clubs financially!
This board is starting to fucking disgust me with contempt in which they hold the fans….
Just wonderig if we can get shareholders/ or the supporters trust to write to the board and request transparency with regards to finances. If we knew the situation fans (real fans) would understand and not have unrealistic transfer expectations.
Bergy..you mean get a world class DM like Essien…??
Hey ethan, meant to say well done for yesterday’s post. All things considered particularly the extreme points of view on the subject matter, it was a well thought out and balanced piece, imo……
Hill-Wood fitsimmonds and the rest are mugging us all off for there own gain
Also profits from transfers
Its time for investment and a new board if we want to compeat
Geoff , have you taken the annual wages to the tune of 100 mil into consideration in those figures ?
morning all…
where is the money eh?
Aus everything they said about the Emirates money will be in the Arsenal.com archives somewhere, they were bragging about how clever they were at the time.
I remember thinking I bet we could have got more from a brewer or Pepsi for a £15 year naming deal.
All I’m saying, is tell us exactly where we stand and what we owe and what they spunked the Emirates money on so we at least know what to and when to expect whatever is or isn’t coming.
Just tell us the truth instead of saying we skint or we have £78mil to spend on players, that’s all I ask.
Apparently , Usmanov offered the Board 100 mil to reduce the debt and fund a move for Benzema and/or Ribery.
The AST turn down the Russain offer of right share
Yes Arindam that comes out of gate receipts. Well more or less.
And Benzema will be the second coming of Henry if he joins us. Wont happen though. Have to make do with Ronaldo’s twin Chamakh.
AusGunner – I’m mostly in agreement with you.
I’m not one for this sort of simplistic analysis.
Ok, they do raise a few (good)?) questions…but the problem is in not finding the real answers.
Ps. There’s no way that any deal was paid in full up front.
isnt the highbury square 95% sold thing based on deposits that will be then paid in full when completed. And with the financial meltdown a lot of people will be unable to pay so until the flats are made and money is recieved we have to keep it tight.
70 million on offices GMR. That is pretty bad what the fuck do they have in those offices?
Apparently Gazidas said they were thinking over the Usmanov offer, he said they don’t want new big players because Wenger says we’re Ok. Go figure.
Who gives a shit what Usmanov offered, he’s a complete and utter piece of shit who shouldn’t have ever been allowed to get involved with our club in any way
Ok Sharkey, so why did we give our name up for 15 years then?
Then its a big sham. Where’s the cash , PHW ?
Seriously Geoff, what are the chances of any of us ever finding out “the truth”…??
I just accept thats the way it is….
Personally speaking , we really should stay away from Usmanov’s money. He does not have the best interests of the club at heart , quite evidently.
Steve – You are definitely Le Grove’s senior drunk fascist….
Morning, great post today, raising some serious questions to which I don’t believe we will ever get answers. Shame.
Geoff – Re 15 years. A deposit of X is followed by annuals payment of Y, adding up to the total of Z.
Ie. we did not receive Z as a cash amount already.
Duke 10.12. I think your spot on, saying we’ll never get the answers.
Sharkey read this from 2004
http://www.arsenal.com/155/unhoused-import-pages/latest-stadium-news/edelman-we-can-invest-in-team
Question All.
Is Etoo worth Man City’s offer…?? Is that the way we should be going, offer absolute mega deals to top players, and great deals to average ones like Bridge..??
At those prices I vote ‘NO’ to Etoo.
i am going to wait until the end of the transfer season before passing my judgement……
i feel arsenal are clearly in a strong financial position they dont need sell players yes they have debt but solely from the new stadium.in terms of which players wenger is going get i dought wenger is going for melo i just dont think he that good for 15 mill,1-2 players will brought in but probebly someone we dont know about
nah sharkey… bringing etoo does not make much footballing sense, but it does improve the club profile and other targets should be easier…
to play alongside robinho etoo.. probably tevez.. quite exciting eh?
Sharkey, I think Shitty said it was bullshit and they didn’t offer those wages. But the only was quality players will go to them is if the money is insane. They are the richest club in the world, and everyone knows this, so they will trying to get the best deals, be it when selling a player, or when a player signing a contract.
Geoff. What does that link tell you, cos it only tells me that its £100m over/for 15 years.
It doesn’t tell you how or when its to be paid.
Highbury House is also a restaurant, which is full before games.
If they spent 70 mill on that – nothing has been proved, then I am sure it can be seen as a sound investment.
It is an asset, (a building in London) and it must bring in a bit of cash as well.
Who actually has an office at Highbury House?
Half of the directors dont even like in the UK.
Get off the fence Choy. Good deal or bad deal…
Does the good outweigh the bad…?
Its like Beckham at Galaxy earning 50times more than a colleague..how good is that for team morale
Geoff – why have you changed your mind, you are normally bullish around money and Arsenal?
Everyone remember Arsenal is a PLC, they have to provide audited accounts, they cant hide money for yatchs that they buy each other.
The directors wages and share holdings need to be stated as well.
well.. he has won the CL how many times?
how many players in the current man city set up have won? so yes.. the pay is justifiable… same like ronaldo…
i think its a good deal..
eto and santa cruz flanked by robinho sounds daunting!!!
Choy – Eto is playing with Xavi, Inesta, Messi and Henry.
Does that compare with Tevez, Robinho, and Ireland?
Show me the Moneeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeey!
Citeh have assembled the best Strike force in the EPL for sure :
Eto’o , Tevez , Robinho , Santa Cruz , Jo , Bellamy – they wont be worrying too much about goals.
MF also has a bunch of decent players – Ireland, De Jong , Elano , Barry , Kompany (CB as well)
Def : Bridge , Dunne , Onouha , Kompany , Micah Richards, Zabaleta.
Its the defence thats iffy . If they can get a couple of good defenders ; they will break into the top 4.
Hope they keep Hughes for as long as possible. Under a Hiddink they would be the dog’s bollocks.
Fair play Duke if you say they didn;t.
I’m just bandtin gsilly figures about to make a pint, that spend spend spend is not the ONLY way forward, and I really think that Madrid will prove that this seeason.
Last night Brazil really benefitted from the difference in styles of play that left them a lot fresher than the Yanks. The Yanks played X no of games in Y no of days with a very high tempo pressing game, and often with a deficiit in mumbers.
Had they not run out of steam so completely, they may well have won last night
SIGN MELO, SING MELO, SIGN MELO, SING MELO, SING MELO
SIGN MELO, SING MELO, SIGN MELO, SING MELO, SING MELO
SIGN MELO, SING MELO, SIGN MELO, SING MELO, SING MELO
SIGN MELO, SING MELO, SIGN MELO, SING MELO, SING MELO
SIGN MELO, SING MELO, SIGN MELO, SING MELO, SING MELO
SIGN MELO, SING MELO, SIGN MELO, SING MELO, SING MELO
SIGN MELO, SING MELO, SIGN MELO, SING MELO, SING MELO
SIGN MELO, SING MELO, SIGN MELO, SING MELO, SING MELO
SIGN MELO, SING MELO, SIGN MELO, SING MELO, SING MELO
SIGN MELO, SING MELO, SIGN MELO, SING MELO, SING MELO
apart from santa cruz is pants choy! he’ll be bit part for city, could see him ending up like benjani, he was a really silly signing! Etoo flanked by tevez and robinho is scarily good though!
mark c they are not done yet…
i think they are the ones to watch this season..
Sharkey – If Eto’o fires Man City into the ECL then it is a good deal….
morning grovers…
i think the shirt+stadium naming rights deal is the biggest rip-off we should have got at least twice that amount.
i say we wait out a year for funds if the property is going to get completed this year. Alisher Usmanov will be the worst disaster to befall the club, trust me. It will be like letting Hitler take over your country because you don’t have a strong enough army to fight the Allies.
on paper they would be better than villa, everton…
well we’ll just see…
Mark I haven’t changed my mind! I don’t think Arsenal are a PLC either.
All I’m asking for is clarity. Sharkey they said at the time the reason for doing it was because the money was up front, also there was a lot of trouble at the time because they were also involved with Israel.
Anyway £100 mil was for both the shirts and the stadium, pretty crap deal if you ask me, perhaps that’s why they fired Edelman.
£100 mil is close to what Ronaldo will be earning and we did it for 15 years!
Anyway I really have to go now so you are on your own, no arguing.
A , Santa Cruz is really good as a targetman , better than our Ade. He is really under-rated.
Choy, they have not got Eto or Tevez yet.
Hughes will have a hard time keeping all of these stars happy.
They will do well, IF they buy the players they are linked with, and there is a happy camp.
Choy, Arindam….
They DO NOT have a balanced team. Show me a natural wideman other than SWP in that squad.
Hpw you would line up theor front six then….and please let me kow who would win th eball back for you, and track the oppsoitions full backs from corner flag to corner flag.
Re ‘Not struggling for goals’, we didn’t sruggle for goals either, that didn’t get us too far this season
Mark , both the deals are apparently just waiting to be rubber-stamped.
The problem with the debt is that we’ll never ever find out, theres no point stressing about it.
You make a choice – Either you want the club run as it has been historically, or you want someone like Usmanov piling cash in and putting debt onto the club.
The club will ALWAYS have debt. It simply depends on who’s running the club what we do with it.
At present we have old school types who see more in piles of cash than they do on 20-something players.
What dyou think a fella like Hill-Wood thinks of a 21 year old picking 100k a week?!!
Its the way Arsenal is and always has been.
Nice to see more people inexplicably linking Cana to us! haahah!
Whats peoples views on Melo – ive watched him in these confed cup games and he looks utter gash
DDm. no player does it singlehandedly…..
Lok at Arshavins 4 strikes at Anfield. Didn;t even get us 3pts. Its a team game.
Kaka over the whole of the confed cup..?? Outshone by Clint Dempsey, playing in an organised and balanced taem..?? Maybe not….but hopefully you see my point
Geoff, it sounds like a horrible deal, I thought the 100 was just for the stadium, and thought it was bad, if that includes the shirt also, it is truly horrible.
been watchin Melo for many matches… i think he can do the job for us. he’s strong, mixes it up, has a good passing range and is forever falling back to cover the back four…
Kunle, hear you loud n clear
I disagree Arindam, he had one good season and that’s it, he’s just another Benni McCarthy, overrated because of one good season despite the fact he was found out in the end, i’d much rather have Bendtner where he is now than santa cruz let alone how good Bendtner will end up! If they get Etoo and tevez santa cruz won’t play much for city, and even if they don’t I’d play Jo ahead of him although it looks like he’ll be off
Sharkey , hate to do this , but since you ask , I will lay it out for you :
————-Given
–Richards–New CB—New CB/Dunne—–Bridge
————-Kompany/ De Jong
–Ireland——-Barry————Robinho
—————Tevez
—————Eto’
That my friend is seriously good , whichever way you look at it.
Geoff 10.29. That lionk doesn;t saty the money was up front.
But I do agree that the deal itself was a shit one.
Thats possibly part of the reason Edelman is gone. I seem to recall a statement about ‘Arsenal never renegotiating contracts’, which basically accepted that the Emirates deal was a cock up…
Quick question re: finances
Do Manchester United fans give a shit that their club is 650million in debt????
mm.. how does man shitty line up
GK
….Back 4….
..De Jong..Barry..
…Ireland..
swp/tevez..eto/cruz..robinho
melo had to be babysitted by gilberto….
he only plays well in a two dm set up…
where does that leave fabregas?
So given that it seems that the Current board are completely untrustworthy,
How come everyone is so against Mr Usmanov who at least appears to be trying to find a way to give Mr Wenger the transfer funds to ensure we remain competitive.
If Melo does the same job for us as he does for Brazil Sagna had better learn to cross the ball.
Every time he gets it he looks right for the overlapping right back.
Thats a very strong point. I have always wondered why our debt figure never comes down and its been like 3 years with lots of income from various sources (like you pointed out) and virtually no spending at all (First We sell and then we buy and then we make profit too!!!). And only god knows where our emirates sponsorship money has gone. Board’s stand on this will not be changing. They expect you to pay the ticket prices, buy the shirts and enjoy some trophyless passing football. Thats it. And no questions please.
Good post by the way.
Be careful Geoff. “Big Brother is watching you”.
Brighty…they don’t but they will when the owners want to pack up and there are no buyers…unmanageable debt always comes back to hurt you and you don’t have to be an accountant to figure that out…at the end of the day, a club has to be financially viable.
Depends which Man Utd fans Brighty, alot of the most loyal and long serving fans gave a shit to such an extent that they created a new club!
choy, it leaves him in a better position than he is in now playing alongside Denilsong.
A , I have been watching Santa Cruz since his Bayern days – a player who the Germans rated in the top bracket. He was earmarked for greatness. Unfortunately , his career was blighted by injuries.
He did all that in a SHIT Blackburn side . He will only get better.
Geoff – Arsenal ARE a PLC – Arsenal Holdings PLC.
As for City. If they pull that off they’ll have a far better strike force than us. Also, someone mentioned they’ve got no wide players – that left footed left winger is pretty much as wide as they get (i cant recall his name)
If we dont do anything and city continue what they’re doing it’s bye bye CL football.
The club and manager need to realise now you have to spend. It isnt 1998 anymore when you can lose 10 games and win the title.
My point being that I couldnt give a shit how much money we owe left, right or centre.
I pay £2200 a season to Arsenal- I want to see the best players, good football and see us win trophies.
I couldnt give a fuck that x million got paid off by Emirates, x million to building costs, La dee fucking da – I aint an accountant. I am a football supporter.
So A, you’re against Usmanov and Kroenke or just Usmanov??
Kunle. How much would you pay for someone who’s basically Denilson, but just a bit taller.
Melo is too hot headed, he got his yellow last night for throwing out an arm….against a ‘less honest’ nations players they would have collapsed holding their face, and that would have been a straight red.
He’s decent…but not brilliant. I wouldn’t pay more than £10m for him.
Geoff u r right the reason we reason the deal was such a bargain was as a result of the up front payment we needed for construction costs to spplement the bank loans
Have you got £10m Sharkey.
Brighty , they dont because :
- they are cunts.
- they joined in the band-wagon last year. Or maybe the year before.
- they could care less. There’s always Chelsea / Citeh to support if the club goes tits up.
Pascal – there will always be someone who would invest…
Melo is almost exactly the same as Denilson.
I fucking pray we dont sign him, he looks utter, utter toilet.
Steve 10.38. So Melo’s one dimensional…?? I think he’s Ok, nowt special.
steve.. you are missing the point…
melo has to play alongside another defensive player…
he will look like shite if he plays with fabregas…
Mainly Usmanov steve, i’m pretty indifferent to Kroenke.
Arindam he did it for a season, and was then shite the next season, though obviously he was injured a fair bit when he wasn’t he was complete pants, early season Bendtner-like misses apart from he isn’t a young developing player
Someone raised a good point about Arsenal and debt and whether United fans care.
Of course they dont.
About time we got off our high horse about all that rubbish.
Do you support a team to compare balance sheets or trophies.
Forget about money – it will NEVER affect us as fans. I couldnt care less who owns the club. It makes NO DIFFERENCE TO THE FAN.
On watching the conf. cup how much would you pay for Melo if we didn’t need a DM like air?
Wow – amazing stuff on here today.
People are saying the board are untrustworthy!!!
What do you mean by that?
There is no proof they are taking money from the club, or examples.
All of the movements of funds, are held in the accounts.
People also think having 100 mill rights issue with increase the debt of the club !!!
Wow, so if the Shareholders put 100 mill of their money into the club, it just increases the cash, cash flow, balance sheet of the club.
They can use that to do whatever they want.
The club is currently worth around 650 mill, by looking at the share value, against the number of shares.
In three years time, the value of the club will be closer to a billion.
Some people here dont understand simple finances.
Sharkey – Agreed. However, i was talking to a Citeh fan the other day saying that the single type of player they have missed for many many seasons is an out and out goalscorer. They may now have two or three. If they get Eto’o (and Tevez) and they then can then ‘smarten’ up their defence, they will be a serious threat fella…..
It is quite possible that we have a £360 million debt because of the amount of interest we are paying on it.
I mean if you took out a mortgage a few years back for 100,000 and paid 1000 a month, 6 months later you could owe 105,000, because that 1k a month is only just about covering the high interest on the mortgage. Its quite possible that this is what has happened at Arsenal , and that our loans are on extremely high interest rate agreements.
Aruindam. Fair play that front 6 looks better than I thought it would…although I’m stil not convinced that they won’t get exposed down the flanks, or be in trouble winning the ball back.
Everyone in that front six wants to hog the centre of the park.
I think ter biggest problems will be off the pitch. Roque signs for £18m as a bench warmer !!
Also , Melo wouldnt really improve us.
Best scenario for us is to get Flamoney + 10/15 for Ade.
I’m sure Milan would be willing to do business.
Its another matter altogether if AW would let that happen.
watching the confederations cup whose wondering why we sold gilberto when we are so desperate for a dm
Tom – my point exactly. Could not agree more!
Tom.. Martin Petrov..??
Will they drop Robinho or Tevez to put a natural left footer out there and balance the side….??
Tom what do you mean of course they don’t – a fair few of their fans cared so much they created an entire new club refusing to step foot in old trafford!
Sharkey – Money doesnt matter to City, they can pay what they want.
if they dont have to balance books, how exactly will it cause problems off the pitch?
Arsenal need to smarten up their act and stop beleiving it can be done on the cheap.
Im utterly, utterly indifferent towards this team – couldnt care less who stays or leaves. Aside from 3 or 4 players we are completely average.
A&N , its the opposite , our loan rates are much lower than the market rates.
not me incesc, he’s so so slow and immobile now as he showed in the confederations cup. My only worry is that both he and Melo seem to do very little to prevent other teams just playing through the middle of Brazil, which is why I’m pretty unsure about Melo!
Nah sharkey, Robinho likes playing out left, Petrov’s city days are numbered
STeve . £10. Not on me at the mo…but give me an hour to nip home
Melo wouldnt improve us
WTF Can Arsenal fans ever be pleased?
Alonso is not hard enough
Melo is one dimensional
what do u guys want?
Yes sharkey thats the one! Martin petrov.
I dunno about how they’ll line up, all i know is that on paper they will be a better team than us.
And lets be honest – Our defence is an absolute joke
I pray we should be able to buy the said players and become grater again
i wouldn’t mind petrov… he is an exciting left winger… does fack all defending though.
Franchise Melo is dire mate. completely dire.
I havent been impressed by a single minute of his football.
Hopefully its all paper talk cos if we sign him id rather we played alex song above him.
…And i think Song is a player that wouldnt even get a game at spurs.
On paper our defence is ten times better than city’s tom…. I’d say on paper our team is superior to City’s still quite comfortably, and as a team as well, though obviously they’re gonna improve alot if they get all the players talked about
DDM True re o and o g/scorer. Problem with those types is that they have to be the main man, and dont do owt else for the team. If you have one of those plus a Robinho/Elano…you lose something in the team.
Ian Wright killed Smudgers career..not wholly a bad thing, but you have to tailor your whole team to that one player. Its a nightmare to manage the egos in that set up.
Who knows though ‘eh
Franchise , repeat slowly : C..A..N..A
All Melo did over 4 games was position himself in the centre and pass to Maicon all day . He was never present where it mattered – just like Denilson.
Gilberto was far better than him and a lot closer to what we need as Cesc’s partner. If his name wd have been Melo , we would be jumping up and down here all day.
NEXT.
Tom who do u want us to sign then?
I’ve seen enough to show me that Melo is a better player than our other DM options Denilsong
he is a strong powerful fucker. he didnt really look too good for Brazil but who did?
I dont know A.
Theyve got a better keeper
Our full backs are better.
Our central defence is really poor
Barry would waltz into our side
If they sign Eto and Tevez they would easily get a game at our place.
Cesc is better than theirs
And Arshavin.
SWP would get games for us…
AFC need to open their eyes. Last season we were extremely lucky that Villa ran out of steam. A repeat of last season this time round will see us 5th or 6th.
In some ways i think it’d be a good thing for us to drop out of the top 4. Might wake a few people inside the club up.
A , thats a Gunner talking , mate.
TOm- I mean off the pitch in the dressing room, ego’s, balance of team, cliques forming, player powerr etc.
InCesc (& others) . Gilberto was very poor in his last season with us. Hardly played, amd looked ead on his feet when he did. Brazilian system suits him…
Arindam i watched Cana a few times he is a good player but dont let his youtube vids deceive u.
if they didnt wake up last season tom i doubt they will ever do so
Morning Grovers,
Geoff you make a very good point, but I wanted to comment about the 95% sold issue. Is it possible that they have received deposits on most of the flats rather than the full amount until they are finished? I ask because I know some companies do there numbers like that. But I completely agree with you about lack of transparency and being fed shit from the board.
I mean forget the fans, but surely they have to tell the truth to the shareholders, isnt it illegal what they are doing?
Franchise Melo is shite mate!
What have you seen thats so good!?!
I dont know who id sign, but then im not a manager. Personally id possibly go for someone like Toulalan or even someone like Scott Parker. We dont need skill, we need grit there and someone with a good engine.
Id be 100 times happier if we signed Parker over Melo.
Brighty… have you ever thought about how you ended up shelling out 2200 per season ? the club is recovering it’s debt from you. if we were debt free, you would pay half of that.
it fucking turns my gut when Arsenal loses a match and misses out on trophies but i definitely do not want a club which i have supported for 2 decades to end up like Newcastle.
Jesus wept. Lads.
LORIK CANA IS NOT EVEN LINKED WITH ARSENAL!!
FORGET IT!!
Morning/afternoon..
NO! not the finances again… I hate these debates.
It is possible now that we have a decent man running our club he thought it prudent to play up our debt while we are negotiating fees for any new signings. Being honest about how great our business model is will only add an extra 25% to any player price when we enquire.
A I agree that Robinho will salways platy left, and thats exactly my point, even when the team needs a proper left footer out there, big names/egos/salaries wil get pickeed first. Its a nightmare scenario….
Parker over Melo
ur call anyway 
Tom whilst our defence isn’t great City’s is an absolute embarrassment. I’d take Given and Etoo certainly (though obviously they havn’t signed etoo yet) and De Jong as a DM, but that’s it, they’ve still got a long way to go, and I can’t see them gazumping us anytime soon. Utd could be under threat though unless Fergie spends very well this summer, they could well be the team in the most precarious position this season.
personally i would have alonso over melo but the alonso ship has sailed IMO
So, Melo is average, but Denilsong are…….fucking hell the lunatics are running the asylum!
Also diclosing fees is not the best idea look how it turned out for RM and Manure. They can’t get anyone for the right price. Also why do we care how much we got a player for, it can only be used as a stat in a financial argument.
Franchise – What has Melo got that you are so impressed by?
Strengh? Ive watched him in 4 or 5 games and watched him outclassed in midfield in all the games he’s played. He is shite in the tackle, even worse than denilson.
You can be 7 foot and 20 stone but if you cant use it,its pointless.
Ill point you in the direction of a certain Julio Baptista for evidence of that.
Sharkey i wouldn’t say it has anything to do with egos, it’s the style of play, alot of teams don’t have left footed left wingers nowadays. I forgot about robinho, he’d probably get into our team as well, though it’d be close between him and Arshavin as the left sided forward, i’d probably prefer our little russian though
Reo-Coker is for sale…I really wanted him when he was moving away from West Ham. An Arsenal fan also.
Pascal. You really think Arsenal will cut season ticket prices once the debt is cleared..??
Its simple supply and demand. If customers renew, there is no reason to cut prices.
Everyone on here who (rightly) moaned about ST prices/renewals has paid up.
Someone mentioned Toulalan.. is he getting released ?
I read a report on Serdar Tasci coming in.. don’t know much about him. help, anyone ?
Mayank when u pay over £1000 for the cheapest season tickets and u have to watch players like Denilsong featuring like 40 times in a season u wld want to know what the money is actually spent on
If denilson is better than Melo wouldn’t he be playing for Brazil. They always give youngsters a chance.
Duke I was a fan of Reo-Coker too, but he seems to have attitude issues and hasn’t really developed at all in the last few years
Lorik Cana may well not be linked to us, but neither was Sagna!!
i don’t think Reo-Coker is good enough for Arsenal..
mayank… join the club mate! total bore off!
i think melo is the target though cos wenger hasnt been linked with anyone else so it looks like he’s waiting for him, plus forientina havent said anything abut not selling him.
A – c;mon look at Scolaris comments especilaly about Cech haviong his goalkeeping trainer.
Plus, DRogba’s perfs for Scolari were a comoplete disgrace, then suddenly Guus turns up and Drogaba has arebirth.
That ego’s….likewise when Terry decided he didlt like Maureen questioning how well he was or wasn’t playing.
Elano kicked up a fuss lastseasioon aout not playing even though it was hard to accomodatae him and Robinho in the same team playing in the style that they do.
If your ego’s big enough you’ll want the pattern of play changed to suit you…
Franchise the fact is we know roughly how much every player costs so the undisclosed fee doesn’t really matter. Also like i’ve said many times the money is paid for the experience and not for having the right to run the team. If you’re paying the money that means you value the experience (good or bad) more than the money so it not a sacrifice. Getting a dollar for a penny isn’t a sacrifice.
I think Reo-Coker is better than Melo, also has PL experience. But I agree with A, hasn’t developed in last few years.
Tom his work rate, passing, physicality, passion etc etc
I wld have Melo without a medical
Reo Coker was dreadfull last year .
I wanted Barry or Alonso or Yaya but none will now happen which goes to prove whatever the financial
situation is , we can not compete in the market we are in .
Cygan , Tasci is a highly-rated young German CB , who can also play at RB . He has represented Germany at all the youth levels and has built up a good reputation for himself . Milan aaare also looking at him. He is a strong tackler and very much an Arsenal-type CB – he can handle a ball at his feet.
Sharkey I mean that Robinho doesn’t play on the left because of his ego, it’s because that’s his best position, and having a right footer on the left suits certain styles of play, not saying that egos don’t exist and cause bit problems in football!
Mayank, I think with the currency rate now a days getting a dollar for a penny would be a sacrifice
Franchise , Denilson will be better than Melo in 2 yrs . Whats the point in spending 15 mil for him now ?? When other alternatives are available.
My chief concern is getting a player who can complement Cesc. Melo does not fit the bill.
Thanks Arindam.. sounds like we could use him right away …
Arindam – “Denilson will be better that Melo in 2 yrs” hmmmm, i’m waiting…
Keep hearing about cimemas, gyms ect and developments in the surrounding area of the stadium.Is this where money is going. Is this all part of the cost of securing planning approval for the stadium. Just a thought.
Arindam i cant wait 2 years
and Melo in 2011 would be much better than Melo in 2009. he is only 25
Denilson is too lightweight even for a 21 yr old. i think it would always be a problem for him
Boateng is the one German CB I really want. He will be a STAR in 2 yrs. A proper World-class CB , he will be.
Fuck 2 years re centre backs arindam, in 2 years Bartley will be a world class centre back, alongside the world class centre back that is vermaelen!!
KOL
how do you know !?, come guys we don,t really know unless you watch other leagues week in week out .
we get linked to a player , go on wiki look at a you tube clip and geta hard on .
diaby could look the best player in the world on you tube but because WE see him week in week out , we know he can be completely shit
get the point !
A Lucio was a hard as nails fucker in this tournament
i was shocked that he could still perform at that level
best player of the tournament if u ask me
jules..i don’t think i could get a hard on on any clip of diaby..:-)
Can we win something the season coming up and not in 2 years please…
Told you he’s still quality franchise! I’d still love us to sign him, but can’t see it happening
We will Duke, i’m convinced of it
A 11.10. I hear ya re our misunderstanding
Fran.. with you on Lucio…he has been Brazil’ tower of strength. one of the best CBs in the world.
its a shame lucio wasted his time at munich
Also
how much can you read into a tournament where USA beat Spain and go 2 up v Brasil whilst everyone else is on holiday ,
just trying to get some perspsective here .
Melo may come and be awesome for us .Or he could well be a smokescreen for someone else .
the point is melo is not good enough to play dm all by himself..
he would get found out similarly like denilson and/or song.
if we sign melo he will be doing most of the defensive work,
denilsong as people are saying are two defensive players playing together, if only one of them play we look like shite most of the time,
melo is a better version of denilson, if he plays with fabregas, he will be found wanting.
neither can I A but imagine Lucio and Gallas at the back
A , Jerome Boateng is a quick , mobile 6′ 4” fucker who can play accurate long passes out of defence . I have watched him a bit – not on Youtube tho ; and he has stood out each time.
Reportedly , he will be off to a European giant after the U-21′s (where he was the best CB by a mile).
He is already good. No longer a prospect.
or Lucio Verm
glad you get the point Pascal !!
If we do get Melo i think we should shut up after that. If we don’t challenge the next season it means that stars can only be purchased for a big fee and we have to change our model. I doubt we’ll fail again though. all of arsenal’s greatest triumphs have followed disastrous season like this one.
choy u dont make sense with ur point.
mascherano plays beside alonso for liverpool does that mean he cant play on his own or vice versa?
under mourinho essien played with makalele does that mean he cant play on his own or vice versa?
ur argument is flawed
sometimes overcrowding the midfield area actually reduces a players ability of recent players like cesc, ballack, lamps for england have suffered this
Arindam.. 6’4, mobile..! what is the Grimster doing ?
I don,t know Choy , I haven,t seen enough of him to REALLY know as I don,t watch Serie A every week !
Spend, spend spend…??
Man City boardroom: We’ve had a chat with De Jong from Hamburg, and we can get hm for £2m in the summer.
We really need him now. We can have him now for £14m now. Go get him.
Is that how we’d really like to see ST/membership money spent…??
Should we also pay way over the odds to get someone whos not much better than what we’ve got..then watch them take six months to get used to the Prem*??
*Arshavin being a wonderful exception
Melo and Song as our DM options
and Denilson can then return to being a cesc wannabe
First off I havent watched a minute of the Confed Cup and know absolutely nothing about Melo as a player, so at this point wouldn’t really have an opinion on him 1 way or the other, were we to sign him. But I can’t believe some people are getting bent out of shape over their opinion of him in a minor International comp. Obviously everyone is entitled to their opinion, but consider this before you right the guy off:
What would you have made of any of the French team based on the last Euro’s ? But everyone would take Ribery now wouldn’t they ? Or Benzema ? Or Henry ?
The flip side of that is – what about positive performances in International Comps that have gone in the opposite direction:
Karel Poborsky ?
John Jensen ?
Jordi Cruyff ?
The other side of lots of peoples opinions on Melo is a preference for Cana – again I know very little about they guy and he might turn out to be exactly what we need, but honestly what do people Really know about him ? Lets face it you won’t have seen him playing in any International competitions !!
When have we ever had Makelele type DMs the reason we are scouting Melo is coz of his ability one the ball as well as his defensive tendency. A 3rd CB with stamina will hardly help our game. i don’t think we need a 6’3″ fucker who eats people like ronaldo for breakfast to help us play good football. Baptista is a good example of that.
Yes Pascal , the Grimster doesnt do Germany. If we have any in Germany , dunno what the fecker is doing.
Boateng has also played a fair bit at fullback as well.
the point is frnachise…
mascherano makes alonso look good…
and essien makes anyone else look good.
melo is not a mascherano or an essien, he is more of an alonso.
Arindam – great shout re Boatang.
He has been in the German U21 and looked great.
He COULD be the powerful CB we are after, and Vermalaen, could be the DM.
*sorry franchise
Adriam Boateng’s brother is on the books at Spurs though, surely he would have a word and tell his bro not to come.
Before we signed Arsh there was a post on LG saying that he’s not going to have the effect we are expecting off him. I think we as arsenal fans have become a bit negative concerning players. I think wenger is the man when it comes to unearthing gems(arshavin wasn’t unknown but hell we got our own messi for 17m) so i’ll trust his judgement.
Choy Melo is an Alonso Mascherano hybrid. He can pass, close ppl down , tackle, score, create etc
He couldnt have made team of the tournament if he was so shit
so r u saying Gilberto made him look good?
if wenger does buy i trust him to buy a class player..his success rate is phenomenal when compared to other managers when he actually spends some dosh…
wenger would not compromise on quality…
Duke , the manner in which he was treated at Spurs , it could well be the opposite.
was gilberto also in the team of the tournament?
yep franchise… gilberto made him look good..
if he was all that great, why would gilberto be playing?
has anyone noticed we have spent 30 million on players since january and wenger says he wants 2 more.
thats quite a lot…
Jules. I took from it that the key is a well balanced hard working team, with hunger has a good chance of beating more talented teams who are unbalanced.
Its why I don’t think Real Madrid will do that well..
Tom, I think you need to go and rewatch the confed final again. Melo is not and cannnot be in the same class with Deninlshit. If you compare with Alonso, then you are right, but you are still wrong because the Emirate has not been taken over by the Arabs. That boy singlehandedly won the midfield battle for Brazil yesterday and you need to respect the opinion of Gilberto after the match, saying that Melo is what we need now if we are to ever compete for any thing next season
no he wasnt
…………Khadim…………….
masilela…maxa…puyol…..lucio
………melo….Dempsey……….
Kaka……………………Bradley
……….villa..torres…………
i heard that wenger just came back from holiday yesterday and hence will only start his dealings forthwith….
Franchise , what’s the team of the tournament ?
Re. Melo :
passing – is off at times . And is often one-dimensional. Will be found out in the EPL , soon.
Also his positioning was as bad as that of Denilson. Most of the goals that Brazil conceded had me asking where was Melo ?
Only to find him wandering in the CM position and not busting a lung to close down the space.
Alonso’s pasing is top notch. I’m not convinced about his all round game (tackling/heading) as an out and out DM though.
Melo’s passing is nowhere close to Alonso’s, and I’m not sure that its that much better than Denilson’s ‘safe but predictable’ range of passing
choy its called choice of system
Dunga wants to play 2 DM cos of his flying full backs
*bursting
Well said Ryan L excactly my point .
Agree Sharkey
man city spent more on jo and liverpool more on johnson thna we did on arshavin and who do you reckon is better…
we arent that bad in the transfer market recently. Last summer was a disgrace but we seem a bit better of late…
franchise,
doesn’t that system sound like arsenal?
Sharkey Melo attempted 300 passes and completed 253 84.4% he cant be that bad
Alonso is a pass master no doubt
with ‘flying full backs’
its the same sideway passes that denilson makes franchise.
Franchise , if you go by such stats , Denilson was the best passer in the league last season.
Arsene’s favourite formation is 4-4-2 with 2 deepish CM one more dynamic than the other. the 4-5-1 was to help the CB not the full backs i think.
who is maxa?
yes exactly mayank… if we play a 4-4-2 with fab in the centre… melo is not te man to be his partner,
that is my point, he may look good in a two DM partnership, but where does that leave fabregas?
choy are we signing him as a creator or a DM?
he is a DM who is comfortable in possession and much stronger than denilson u cant even begin to compare them. the only way denilson would ever play for brazil is if their 1st team do a a busby
sorry Gaxa
We heard rumours and he asked me,” Gilberto told BBC Sport.
“I said it’s a fantastic club and if he’s interested he should go without thinking.
“He is exactly what they need – a powerful player with quality. If they got him it would be great because he is a player they need at the moment.
“I’m sure if they got him it would be a good signing. I have told him Arsenal is a great club and I am sure next season they will improve.”
I’ll take Gilby’s word for it.
we aren’t gonna be playing 4-4-2 though, 4-2-3-1 is the system we’ll be employing the vast majority of the time
Ryan L …..if you’d see more/some of it you’d know it wasn’t a minor tournament.
You do know that he USA made beat Spain to reach thefinal, and led Brazil 2-0 at half time…
Having said that, I agree that we can only speculate on players, and their impact.
Shevchenko £31m…..STILL a Chelski player !!
ooh harsh words… denilson will be there in the national team in about 2 years maybe sooner…
melo just started playing in the brazil team this year.. at the age of 25!!!
Choy – I imagine that Gilberto played with Melo so they could be the foundation for the forward thinking full backs and to accomodate the attacking styles of Kaka, Robinho, Fabiano etc – I think if putting Gilberto in the side was a slight against Melo, that Dunga would be able to just find someone else to play in Melo’s position instead !! As I have said I havent seen the guy at all but it sounds a bit harsh to write off his abilities based on the presence of an other particular player in the side !! Its almost like saying that Gerrard isn’t a good enough attacking midfielder because Capellio feels the need to put Lampard in their with him aswell.
yeap he was Arindam. he he lps us keep possession that is denilson but gets caught in possession too often cos he is a lightweight.
with all his good stats denilson he is still not rated in the league not to mention europe of international scene
are u advocating we sign a DM with 40% passing ability?
if we play 2 DM’s franchise.. he would probably be a good buy, but he is not good enough to play DM alone on his own in an attacking team like arsenal.
Franchise, I didnt find Melo any more mobile than Song ( who I ‘wd play over Melo as Cesc’s partner).
Mind you , I am looking for a prospective partner for Cesc next term , not who’s the better footballer.
Franchise. That Melo passing stat is of no use to me, none whatsover.
Absolutely none !!!
None !!!
choy age is nothing but a no. that is why luci at almost 33 was the best player at the tournament
some players who arent good enough at 21 are still not good enough at 30. its not a certainty that denilson would be good enough to play for brazil at 25 u know?
Ryan.. if we play melo… that would mean we need to play one of song and denilson…
if we play that way.. its alright, as explained by my point of playing two dm’s above.
Sharkey – I wasn’t really be-littling the Confed Cup – but saying that can you remember who won the last one ?? (without Google
)
All I was saying is, that history would suggest that judging players based on an International Comp isn’t necessarily a great yardstick. Especially one that is really only set up as a logistical experiment pre World Cup.
FFS we win the likes of Pompey with Denilson as a DM in a 442 Melo is much better than him at the moment. imagine what we can achieve with him
Franchise , Silvestre had 79 % passing accuracy. Go figure.
Denilson chalked up that impressive stat due to his 5 – 10 yarders. Not too many in the league do that.
Arindam if denilson didnt get bullied by over half of the premiership then we would not need a DM
Melo is what we want denilson to be IMO and Gilberto’s
Ryan 11.51. Touche !! 1-0 to you mate
so now u slating Denilson Arindam after saying he would be better than Melo in 2 years. U r killing ur points with that sort of approach
Not much , Franchise .
We need to free Cesc and for that we need a highly mobile DM who can do his running. Strength is also a MUST. Denilson’s passing [ 5/ 10 yarders ] would do, though .
I will bow to your more informed opinion Choy as haven’t seen 1 minute of the guy. But r u basing that assumption on only seeing him in a 2 DM style line up ? Does anyone know if Fiorentina play like that, as they have had a good season for them so I am guessing Melo must have been doing something right seeing as he is in the engine room of that team.
What that means Franchise is that I dont Melo that much.
* I dont RATE Melo that much
Franchise / guys
Go on newsnow at 11.24 , third gen have a good clip of Melo , despite what I said earlier about clips ,
melo looks the bolloks and puts more forward passes
thru on this one clip that denilson( son of batty) has done in his life .
he looks very good .
Hey Grovers,
Just wanted to say that Wenger should get Benzema, and get rid of Ade and Bentner, oh yeah and WE STILL NEED A DMF FFS!
but i do rate him and Gilberto does and if we are to believe the press then Arsene does
bollocks even . have a look
Sharkey 11.55 – your clearly a class act sir.
news now , 11.24 , third gen . watch
my take on Melo is thus ..we are not going to get a player of the quality of an Essien or Gattuso ever as i do not see Wenger shelling out 20m+ on a single player unless it’s a straight trade ( Ade for Eto’o etc )
he will go for a relatively unknown name who comes around 10m… Melo is a Brazil regular now. Anyone who is a first choice DM for Brazil can’t be that bad. He is no doubt physical, he can challenge and can win the ball… is he Flamster on acid ? nope. is he better that denilson or Song – anyday. who else is there for us at around 10m ? none other that Cana who i hear is finally getting the nod from his club.
he seems to be the best from what we’ve got on the radar unless you count the many overrated EPL discards who are being flogged at unrealistic prices…
the question is he better than song and denilson? maybe…
but will he complement cesc fabregas? i don’t think so.
Franchise , what do you expect Bert to say .
Q : What do you think of Melo and the interest in him from Arsenal ?
A : He’s shite , as you guys have seen already. He made me do twice the work. He lacks mobility , as you muct have noticed.
Pffss..
Also , we havent seen any comments from AW to that effect. Could all be paper trash . And hope it is.
oh, and another thing, Melo LIKES to shoot from 20 yards out and packs a decent shot
Cygan , there are more leagues than the EPL and the Serie A.
Cygan and gets a stupid yellow after that.. which means he can’t put another crunching tackle.
Choy /KOL
go watch clip on third gen 11.24 news now .
complement cesc?????? cesc needs a player who has the attributes, quality and experience. Melo definitely does IMO
Cygan , remember Denilson’s scorcher against Newcastle (was it ? ) in the CC ?
The few times Melo took a shot from 20 yards – they never troubled the keeper. Wasn’t on target by a long way.
exactly Cygan. he shoots
i agree Arindam, maybe we should look to the Bundesliga..we need some German steel to reinfore us..any suggestions?
So did Gilberto , then (by your definition Franchise).
Not that I think so.
alright lads… nice debating with you guys as always…
have a nice day…
remember the answer is not melo
did you watch it Franchise ??
he is quality
Arindam – I think the flip side of your point is that Bert wouldn’t have recommended Melo as a signing if he didn’t rate him – he could have found some words to suggest that Melo is a good player but not what Arsenal need right now.
Cygan , we were linked to this guy . Havent seen much of him though :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_Gentner
ive seen it jules he looks very settled anchoring the midfield
just what we need.
The other day i was mentioning haw Barry for 12 mil was a cheap deal and that we should have bought him, EASYLY!! 12mil for Barry, what a bargain!!
alright lads…gotta go now. mellow mood. hasta la vista babies.
Alright .
Don,t fucking watch it then !!!!!!
waste of time ,
Ryan , Bert is too good a guy to do that.
Also , if he’s that concerned about us , I reckon he still has AW’s number .
cheers Franchise .
looks good to me , better than what we have now .
Ras – we couldn’t match what City were offering i.e. £100k a week for 5 years !! So total cost of Barry ends up being over £37million !!
Arindam – so you think that Bert is such a good guy that he would go as far as recommending a player to Arsenal all be it via the press but deep down not rating him ?
Geoff,
I believe you’ve missed a fundamental point in your financial analysis. The cost of building the apartments! Might I suggest £150-200m?
Ryan L. I try to be..
Out of Melo and Gilberto last night Gilberto was by far the better player. Melo did nothing to impress me at all. Gilberto was covering him and doing far more tracking and covering and distribution. I want Gilberto back on last night’s evidence.
I am not a Melo fan in the slightest.
I would rather take Veloso or Mbia than Melo and thats saying something. but clearly Cana or Inler would trump those players.
Franchise you’re right. Every arsenal-fan will see that a DM comes in. Than we are in for melo and everybody says that he is not good enough because he was shit in the confed cup. YOU CAN’T SAY THAT!!!!!!!
You must see more of him playing for fiorentina. He is a man who arsenal needs. He is going for every single ball and can tackle as the best. He is what arsenal need. I’ve seen him play against ajax twice.
And he was f***king good. HE IS WHAT WE NEED!!!!!
Matuidi would even be better than Melo. Also I’d rather have a european than a S American due to travelling to International games all the time. If you offer me Kaka then fair enough you accept it, but Melo?? No thanks.
yep dutchman…its not like he has been that bad at the confed cup and right now i can’t think of any other plausible option….
He is a hot head. lashes out and kicks people that have nothing to do with tackles. he gets booked all the time. we would have to play with 10 men and he would be suspected for important games. I am all for a hard man but not an idiot.
Ryan L I think what Bert says tio the pres may well differ froma private converstaion wioth Arsene.
I’m with Arindam on this one…what else can he say…??
We need a DM, and his mates a DM… W
hat would he say about Denilson if asked??? He’d tell us all he’s good enough for that role, ten mins after praising Melo
What I meant Ryan was that Bert would never criticise/slate a player , that too in the media. IF he didnt rate Melo , a phone call to AW would suffice.(assuming that he still loves us / wants us to succeed)
My typos…worse than ever today. !!
has anyone seen matuidi play? also i am disinclined toward another player of french african origin….
Rohan , he has been that bad. I mean Denilson BAD.
would anyone except this right now?
———–Almunia————
Sagna–Gallas—Vermaelen–Clichy
———— Melo————–
——-Fabregas–Nasri————-
Van Persie—-Benzema——Arshavin
Revelation , you missed Ribery (for Nasri) and Essien (for Melo)
why rohan?! I’d be very inclined towards a french-african central midfielder!
The fact (rumour) that Fiorentina want Senderos makes Melo a probable signing. I watched tha final last night. I always thought Gilberto was the holding midfielder. He was playing so does that mean Melo would have to play with Song in something other than 442 to accomodate Cesc? I know fuck all about tactics but I thought we wanted and alternative to song.
Reva I want
——–Almunia——–
Sagna-Toure/Gallas-Vermaelen-Clichy
——Cesc–New DM——
Arshavin-Rosicky-Eduardo
———-VP———-
Don’t care who the new DM is as long as they’re up to it, be it melo, cana, matuidi etc
after the ribbing the board has jus been given, i just think it would be funny if we they just well fuck you:
vermaelen £10m
Melo £15m + Senderos
Benzema £28m
Rohan. You’ve lost me too with that one..
Laters, Grovers !
I think dunga likes to have 2 holding midfielders and then lets the rest of them get on with attacking. But to be honest Brazil were easy to open up down the middle in the first half and that shouldn’t have been the case. I didn’t see Melo all over any USA player, snapping at heels or closing space. Thats what we need from our next DM signing.
reva, yes but benzema? dream on fella… put eddie in and thats 90% our team next year
i mean with all the rumours of bad blood in the dressing room and the french cliques. Also, with french being a predominant language in an english club..i hardly think we need another one..
Note i would not be opposed to him coming if he really is good.
just my honest opinion.
Arindam & Sharkey – yep I agree that Bert is a class act that would never slate anyone. I just also like to think that his integrity would also allow him not to recommend a signing that he didn’t really believe in. I think its possible for him to make a positive comment about his team mate without then recommending him as a great signing, that’s all.
You are right re Denilson he would no doubt say great thinga about him, but I think thats a slightly different case in that he is already here and Wenger signed him.
a fit eddie imo isn’t that far off from a young and still learning benzema
Ryan Gilberto didn’t phone up the press to give an opinion on Melo, he will have been asked specifically about Melo because of rumours of him going to Arsenal, it will have been more “do you think Melo will be a great signing” – “yes” than “what do you think of Melo” – “I think he’s awesome and Arsenal should sign him”
Rohan imo a fit eduardo>benzema currently
A, you’d seriously leave out nasri and a proper front man to stick vp up top instea dof eduardo? and a rosicky that’s seen no football in 18mths? erm.. i’ll stick with mine thanks…
——-—–Almunia————
Sagna–Gallas—Vermaelen–Clichy
——————-Melo————–
————Cesc––Nasri————-
Van Persie———–——Arshavin
———-Benzema/Eduardo———–
It’s not impossible… You just all want it won’t but, hey the board might just suprise us..
Wishful thinking season number. 05… We’ve got to, at some point, throw some money on the tablre and say “boys we’re still here, now what!?”
Why should it be inconcievable that we could quite easily
Spend
Vermaelen 10m
Melo 15m + Senderos
Benzema 28-30m
-
Adebayor 20-25m
Senderos p/ex
Shouldn’t really a club of our size, be able to do that after 5 years of scrimping and saving?
Geoff, you made a valid point and it’s not just a case of being ripped off, it’s also about ambition.. And, we at the moment just don’t show any.. It’s all well and good bringing in cheaper diamonds and polishing them, but it takes time and some turn out to be nothing more than shiny glass, that cost a lot of time and money…
Surely, we have got to make a few clubs think “oh, hang on” ..Instead we’ve got the villas, evertons and city’s thinking… “We can do them”…
More than anything i just want to see a let’s got for it sprlurge rather than a half-arsed attempt at staying in the top 4.
Great post Geoff, surely they would have to be at least honest with the shareholders?
Eduardo has the capacity to go on to be in the top 3-5 strikers in the world.
An absoute class act that guy.
Melo is one of the best buyable DM around i really do hope we buy him
yep sharkey, a born finisher if i ever saw one….
infact i’d rather we spent the 30m on de rossi from roma and didn’t get a striker or melo.. Job done!
at best eduardo would be like a robbie fowler great goal scorer but not as exciting to watch as a torres/henry etc
as far as he scores who cares
Yes i would reva – vp is a great player but he slows down the play too much if he plays deeper than as a forward. Leaving nasri out for rosicky because rosicky was one of the best attacking mids in europe before his injury, and he will have had an entire pre season in terms of football etc, just like everyone else.
Benzema would never happen anyways, it’s like saying we should try and sign pato or whoever, it’s completely unrealistic
sell adebayor buy de rossi… not rocket science..
In answer to today’s post, it seems fairly obvious that our Directors and/or shareholders are pocketing vast sums in dividends. If not, then our honourable M.P’S are getting in on the act somewhere? Ask the Daily Telegraph to investigate!
Fran…..I’ve stayed out of the CDM debate as I do not know enough about Cana or Melo……..I want us to sign one of them (or Matuidi) tho as we could do with replacing Flamini.
Have you seen much of either to compare who is best and if they would a) suit our game and B) cut in the EPL ??????
i agree there A,
We have eduardo, bentdner, van persie, vela, arshavin and, walcott all vying for 2 places even if we sell ade (which, like 95% of every arsenal fan, hopes happens.)
In which case, why settle for a melo, when you could use the dosh to get a de rossi?
I agree Geoff. (besides the suspect French that is haha) But they are continuously taking the piss with their contradictory statements. I understand the idea that they do not like other clubs to be aware of their relative strength in the transfer market. But just a little bit more clarity would be nice. Do we have 13M or 25M to spend?
Wardo ive seen Cana on a few occassions i must say his youtube video is the best piece of marketing ever. he didnt look as exciting (obviously) still a player that would definitely improve us. as for matuidi aint seen nothing but a goal from him. Melo ive seen for Brazil like 6 occassions i watched him against Italy live at the emirates in February i think that was his debut. he is what we need IMO
to be honest, now i’ve calmed down, i don’t want benzema as i actually want to see more bendtner, vela and eduardo in all honesty… I don’t want to betray what i actually support rather then get caught up in the chip chop rag/championship manager fairytale….
But i don’t to see more of denilson and song for 40 + games a season. They are not yet ready (no they are not shit) to play in top tier games in the champions league and against top game opponents..
Therefore, why settle for a melo, when we can make a statement of intent?
But i don’t *want
what statement should we make then ReVe?
dennisdamenace Says:
June 29, 2009 at 10:03
Hey ethan, meant to say well done for yesterday’s post. All things considered particularly the extreme points of view on the subject matter, it was a well thought out and balanced piece, imo……
—————————————
cheers hombre!!!
ReVELAtion Says:
June 29, 2009 at 12:47
to be honest, now i’ve calmed down, i don’t want benzema as i actually want to see more bendtner, vela and eduardo in all honesty…
—————————————-
so are you also into self mutilation ?
Even if melo is more realstic than de rossi:-
al
bak-bill-verm-gael
de rossi/melo
cesc–sami
vp-ed-arsh
bench from: fabianski, gibbs, toure, eboue, djourou, denilson, song, diaby, walcott, rosicky, bendtner, vela
I’d say that was pretty fucking good!
240 million when we complete Highbury square,that is another porkie.
Hello Grovers,
http://www.sport.co.uk/news/Football/22418/Pending_Tasci_deal_encourages_City_Toure_bid.aspx
de rossi if we are to judge by the tournament was averagish
good player though
cheers Fran…..I haven’t even had the chance of watching any footie recently !! Mrs has set DIY jobs and I’m currently installing our bathroom which has had loads of probls incl flooding in my frontroom…
fcuking women…just cause the footie season has finished !!!
De Rossi @ Francise…
why are we going to spend 30 odd mill on a striker when, (even if we do sell ade), still have:
Eduardo, Bendtner, Vela, Van Persie, Arshavin, Walcott
=Why not sell adebayor and use the money + whatever was going to go on melo and buy someone really top, top class to play alongside cesc so we can play the arsenal way a 4-4-fucking-2
i really don’t want to play 2 defensive midfielders in a 4-2-3-1….ideally i want cesc 2 be one of those 2 midfielders….attacking is our strength and we should play to that.
ethan… yeah it was a nice piece mate… your clearly just a racist though
Fran re Eduardo, I agree, thats why I doubt he;d ever be no.1, cos he just ain’t ‘exciting enough’, and yep, Torres and TH14 were two I had in mind, that would have kept him at no.3.
Have you noticed that when he scores a good goal, he just don’t seem that bothered. That one off his heel hardly got celebrtaed by him….coldest striker I have seen in a long long time….
i’m not judging any1 by an end of season toy cup…
Brazil and the yanks took it the most seriously and they we’re in the final. South africa, although good, just weren’t quite good enough..
honestly , do you think nik b – vela and RVP will win us silverware this season ?
REALLY ?
i think both vela and nik will be good given another 2/3 seasons … but next season we really need a class strike option ..
and its as simple as this , if we dont get one ..
we will win FA again !
(ps:the FA doesn’t stand for the FA cup either!)
Anyone heard of Serdar Tasci?
AT
if it makes you feel better i didnt like pascal cygan either
somehow i dont think any white people will get angry with me either …
funny that
Fran – Re Cana, I sometimes watch him and think his agent made that video.
But like you, I see a lot in him that would be of great benefit to us. Constantly pointing, telling people where to run, what to do, controlling his teams tempo. Could be a great signing…
de rossi is class and we need class in the centre of the park to play alongside cesc, not have a ball winner to hold his hand.. I’m starting to get sick of this 4-2-3-1, 4-1-2-3, 4-5-1, 4-3-3 bullshit! We Play 4-4-2:
Al
Bak-Bill-Verm-Gael
Rock-Cesc-De Rossi-Arsh
VP-Ed
is nice…
Micky – its well documented that Arsenal directors take no dividends!!
we need to scour Portugal ! Brazil and Argentina for skillful cheap players …
even Chile and Peru !
Uruguay and Italy Greece .. Israel .. Mexico etc..
there are some shite hot players there and transfers will be reasonable ..
i dont think wenger is as clued up as he makes out .
sure there will be some work permit issues ..
but if most play for international teams im sure if ‘song’ can get a pass for exceptional talent .. someone who is really talented should have no problems
i repeat this,..i think rosicky is going to play an immense part next season…
i was watching a game last night and i realized how much we missed him..he is our only all action midfielder who can play across the middle…
why not ethan? A fit eduardo can get you 20 goals a season as can van persie, bendtner will weigh in with 15 and vela and walcott should muster up 10 between them… Plus goals from midfield through arshavin, nasri and a fit rosicky… I don’t think goals have ever been or problem…
It’s defending set pieces and defending as a unit…
Rohan, Hopefully he can come back to full fitness fairly quickly. But obviously, it may take him some time to re-adapt
nah reva, we USED to play 4-4-2, now we play 4-2-1-2-1!
rohan, untill rosicky has seen a full pre season, a few games in the stiffs and carling cup it is highly unlikly he is going to get an extended run in the 1st team…
He has missed 18mths of football, How is he just going to waltz back into our starting 11?
i think we can play a 442 with melo if u ask me i wouldnt say there is much of a difference btw melo and de rossi. melo in his first year in serie A was fiorentina’s best player and in most ppl’s team of the list. he earned his brazil call up
Yeah ReVELAtion, He will need to be re-integrated gradually.
well that’s bollox A.. I want to see 4-4-2′s.. We should be going to grounds thinking we can win because we have the better players and better team….
Al
Bak-Bill-Verm-Gael
Nasri-Cesc-De Rossi-Arsh
VP-Ed
Bench From: Fabianski, Toure, Djourou, Eboue, Gibbs, Denilson, Rosicky, Walcott, Diaby, Song, Ramsey, Wilshire, Vela, Bendtner.
I agree. A 442 has always been the most balanced formation. In my opinion, Arsenal are no good at trying to adapt to other teams game. We ought to go out there and let them try to keep up with us, just like we used to
RUMOR TIME
Antonio Valencia flew in last night to complete his dream �16million switch to Manchester United – and end Sir Alex Ferguson’s wait for a first signing of the summer.
# Samuel Eto’o will become the best-paid player in Britain when he signs a staggering �200,000-plus-a-week contract with Manchester City.
# Liverpool boss Rafael Benitez has beaten Barcelona to the signing of Spanish teenage sensation Jesus Fernandez.
(thats a top fucking player right there !!)
# Hull manager Phil Brown insists his attempt to sign Michael Owen is not a publicity stunt.
# AC Milan yesterday confirmed they contacted Arsenal over a deal for Emmanuel Adebayor.
# Everton are interested in Marcus Berg, Sweden’s goal sensation at the European Under-21 Championship
# Sir Alex Ferguson will return to work today with his hopes of signing Lyon striker Karim Benzema in danger.
# Mark Hughes mega spending spree is set to rocket this week with a �50million double deal for Samuel Eto’o and Carlos Tevez.
# Bayern WILL NOT SELL RIBERY – hands off issued !
Fran, team of the list?
lol Duke
team of the tear i meant oops
ReVELAtion
you are probably right that we wont get anyone ..
but then ill be right at the end of the season when ill tell you i told you we would win FA this coming season .
I mean you get torres saying he needs a good partner (top draw ) if liverpool are to win anything …. yet we are all happy to see nikb and gamble on dudu playing a whole season …
sorry as far as solid plans go , i can see which one has flaws and what one doesnt ..
man shitty are going to have a starting line up of eto’o and robinho …
and we are going to go with dudu and nik b ..
hmmmmmm , not to sound a tad bit jealous but i know which set id prefer …
Yeah Ade will need to be replaced if we sell him, and we will need a consistent finisher. Nik Bendtner may turn out to be that, But i wouldn’t gamble on it
***** team of the year
i think a partnership of bendtner and eduardo up front could work wonders..i don’t know where that puts rvp though…
Rohan, Fighting for his place hopefully
It’s a bit strange ol’ Fernando saying he needs a partner when i thought Gerrard does a more than adequete job playing behind him in their much maligned 4-5-1.
Even so, they probably need better flank options than kuyt (natural sriker) benayoun, reira and pennant.
Silva would be the more likely out of the 3 Fernando mentioned in that newspaper article. But having just spent 18m on Johnson, to get him (silva) they’ll have to lose one of alonso or mascherano to fund the deal…
we don’t have those problems.. It’s not like we have to chose between cesc and nasri… Adebayor out, de rossi in.. simples…
it’ll be van persie and eduardo, bendtner and vela will go as options 2. Still pretty shit hot to me.. Then there’s arshavin and walcott. Like i said scoring goals is not the problem!!!
and that (vp & ed) willll score shed loads provided we can get someone much (not just a bit) better then song and denilson in there next to cesc.. I vote for de rossi
honest bill – no adebayor doesn’t have to be replaced…
pick 2 from vp, ed, vela, arsh, theo, bentdner.. Quality choices imo!
Reva we are going to games thinking we have better players so gonna outplay teams, we’ve been signing players who fit the barca system not 4-4-2, and been gradually moving towards that system, and it’s gonna be our main system this season, like it or not! It’s more attacking than 4-4-2, not less
Fran
we play 4-4-2 with a man in the hole behind the front man. That is arsene wenger’s way and the way we have become accusstomed to when it comes to success.. When have we ever played with a target man in a 4-2-3-1, 4-1-2-3 or 4-5-1? Oh yeah in europe and the last couple of years culminating with winning fuck all…
ReVELAtion, admittedly they all look very promising, but none of them are proven, prolific goal scorers
For me Rohan….any two from those 3 will make a good combination.
They’ll rotate and all get to play. Bendtner as 3 or 4th choice, playerd plenty of games last season
even the season with flamini and hleb we played 4-4-2 and we we’re very close.. Adebayor thrived off of partners like vp and ed.. he’s useless as a target man and so is betndner, who is fanastic in a team’s build up play… Why are we trying to move away from what made us successful?
i dont think we are reve but i think wenger has finally understood that different situations/games etc require different tactics.
i still believe we would play 442 next season mostly anyway
neither were henry or anelka bill….
Who’s to say van persie, arshavin, bendtner & Eduardo cannot muster up 60 goals between them.. I say they can, and once again, WE DO NOT HAVE PROBLEMS SCORING GOALS!
We need a leader in the middle enxt to cesc.. yes melo is a bit of a big lump and can play, not really a leader is he.. I’d rather have Cana, being a captain and a bruiser, instead of Melo.. But i’d rather someone WORLD CLASS and that is where De Rossi comes straight into it.
Sell Adebayor and use the money wisely
Rev, well said mate.
De Rossi is over rated mate
I’m not saying they can’t Rev, I’m just saying it’s a gamble. And as for problems scoring goals, we had a few games last season which tell a slightly different story.
It’s all very well scoring as many goals as Man Utd, but those games in which we score 4 goals, tend to skew the stats slightly. I’d rather win 4 games 1-0 than win 1 in 4 games. (obvioulsly a simplified example, but you get my point)
De Rossi was outclassed when we played them. Roma struggled all season, he also looked very average at the confed cup. he isnt as world class as u believe he is
honest if you play with 1 up front you will have problems scoring goals…
Franchise, De rossi is not overrated in any shape or form.. he’s a winner, a battler, scores goals (from outside the box) and can play… If you think de rossi is over rated i do not know what to call melo and cana after some of the superlatives i’ve heard about them on here…
roma are shite.. we should be pumpelling teams like roma.. we got lucky!
Yes if you play with one up front you will have problems, but since we sometiimes do, I would prefer if we had someone suitable to be that lone striker
so based on a 2 legged tie against arsenal and an end of season toy cup you are telling me franchise that he isn’t as world class as i believe.. I’d rather go with what i’ve seen collectivly over the last 3 or 4 years…
does anyone remember 2 hoofed balls up to Eddy against Everton? He is a class finisher and was improving before his injury. I hope ade fucks off
We shouldn’t ever have to play with 1 up top and if we do it’s because we’re playing barca away…
de rossi is just another good DM imo reve
he isnt better than the likes of melo, yaya, senna etc that is my point
also if that’s the case franchise, after watching the confed cup fabregas is absolute shite then…
he’s better then all of those above in my opinion, but different opinions is what makes us human…
Reva 4-4-2 WAS wenger’s way. We’ve only started playing the barca system last season, and we’ve been signing players that fit it for a long while, and it’ll continue next season.
What on earth does a target man have to do with that system – the whole point of the system is that a target man can’t play in it, all the front three have to be fluid and interchangable, able to play in any of the front 3 positions and drop back into midfield as well, it’s 3 up front not 1 up front, the most successful and prolific attacking team in Europe in Barca play it, it doesn’t cause problems scoring goals in the slightest!
oooooooo is the u-21 final today? COME ON THE BOYS!
yeah but barca have a team to fit around messi, etoo and henry…
We build around fabregas…
If, in any case were true A, With the so called players we have at our disposal and are going to sign, explain to me in a line up how we’d mirror barca? Because we should originate not imitate… Bring back the 4-4-2 i say… A lot of manager’s have dissapeared up their own arses i think…
de rossi is a lot like totti..he is a roma boy through and through..he is not going to leave..
A Barca have been playing that way most of the last two decades. its their style
we can play like that is if we worked hard at it but wenger ball over the years seems to have a different dynamic
our 4-3-3 is much different to barca anyways but if we get a good DM then we can play two creative midfielders and 3 up front
hey i’m all for a:
al
bak-bill-verm-gael
???
cesc-nasri
vp-ed-arsh
i would though, still prefer:
al
bak-bill-verm-gael
nasri-cesc-???-arsh
vp-ed
in 4-4-2 arshavin, theo, rosicky, nasri, vela all have to play out of position, they don’t fit it. Arshavin and theo, and vela to an extent are neither midfielders nor forwards, they’re in between, and 4-4-2 doesn’t allow that position to exist. Likewise nasri and rosicky are better in the centre, but more advanced than is possible in 4-4-2, so they’re forced out wide, which also isn’t ideal for them.
Quite simple how we mirror barca, cesc is a younger carbon copy of xavi, nasri/rosicky = iniesta, arshavin = messi, eduardo/theo = henry, vp/bendy = etoo
——–Almunia——–
Sagna-Toure/Gallas-Vermaelen-Clichy
——Cesc– Coutadeur——
Arshavin-Rosicky-Eduardo
———-VP———-
franchise, i don’t think you cna mention melo and the likes of yaya and senna in the same sentence……(yet,that is)
Well said Geoff! Bravo!!
swap vp and eduardo and yeah it’s just how i’d picture it..
Still, they are however, not messi, etoo, henry, xavi and iniesta..
yep A, but barca have yaya, who the hell do we have??
if we would be playing 433 like barca my preferred starting line up wld be
…………Al…………..
Sag……Gal….Verm……Clichy
…………Melo
…………
………Cesc……Rosicky……
Theo………..VP…………Arsh
A, what number you got on the back of your barca shirt btw?
how can vp be the pinnacle of your attacks A and Franchise? Nonsense… If it ain’t eduardo or bendtner it’ll need to be someone else oh yeah we seem to have forgotten we still employ adebayor!
You guys are funny.. Rosicky waltzing back into the starting 11 just isn’t going to happen.. For all i know i’m probably better than he is at this point..
why cant I? Yaya just had his first outstanding season for a bigger club. Melo also just did at a mid table club in Fiorentina.
As for Senna much more experienced than the other two but they could all do a job (for us) if needed
there is no mathematical formula to derive who would click the best
they are all capable players who can do their jobs without fuss
VP has good runs that is why i picked him. Bendtner
are u kidding me? if we are going to play that formation we should definitely discourage lumping the ball to the CF. VP as a starter for me over eddie
yes, they can franchise… But is it really the solution or just another part of the equation?
in terms of what is realistically gettable that is with our normalish ambition re transfers then Melo for me
another £15m player
Bendtner is better than a target for “forward lumps”.. That’s a bit harsh. Vp obviously would start in front of eddie at current, yes… BUT, not as the focal point of my attack.. He’s best utilised as a 2nd striker or on the right wide of a 3 like for his national team…
That’s why i’d play eduardo infront of him.. Vela and Bendtner are focal points also as will walcott be one day. Players like Van persie, Arshavin and Nasri need to be involved in a game constantly or their threat is nullfied..
http://goal.com/en/news/11/transfer-zone/2009/06/29/1353255/le-mans-mathieu-coutadeur-has-agreed-terms-with-a-mystery
so is this our man..looks like it
lol @ Franchise, we’re not going to bust that 15m marker are we.. Even tottenham have spent more than us in one go.. AND that was for Darren Bent of all players..
It makes us look such a small time club in the market, it really does…
so then u offer him 70k a week then u bench him?
Franchise i meant “eduardo in front of”
VP
–Ed
4-4-1-1 or 4-4-2
ReVe remember its £15m incl add ons
its a forbidden boundary to cross it seems
He 9Robin) is a goal scoring dennis bergkamp.. The boy is abolsute class on his day when he plays there…
we all know senderos is a right off, we’ll be glad just to clear the wages… It’s a sweetner…
i know i was just saying if 433 barca style was the future then that wld be my preferred starting line up
TV doesn’t have a squad number yet. I hope Willy is staying
can’t we sell adebayor for 20m
25m + senderos & Eboue for de rossi..
they’d be up for it
so do i goonermichael because he is our best defender.
Luis Fabiano’s agent Jose Fuentes knows about Milan’s interest in the Brazilian ace, but he has not received any phone call from Via Turati as he compares his man with some of the best strikers around.
Milan’s number one objective still remains Edin Dzeko from Wolfsburg, but on Saturday Adriano Galliani revealed he was keeping eyes on alternatives after the Germans played hardball over the Bosnian. Those players are Arsenal’s Emmanuel Adebayor, and Sevilla striker Fabiano.
Galliani revealed he has already asked Arsenal about their man, but it seems he has not done the same with regards to Fabiano who claimed it would be his dream to play for Milan.
“I know about Milan and Galliani’s interest, but I have not had any official contact with them. I have heard the news on the radio and in the papers, but there has not been any official request,” Fuentes told Sky Sport Italia.
“Like Manchester United
and Barcelona, Fabiano would join the Italian side. Any footballer would be happy to join such a major club. Milan are a major world club.
“At the moment he is a Sevilla player, but I cannot say that he will be there next season. He is on the same level as Zlatan Ibrahimovic, David Villa and Adebayor.”
Major hype has surrounded the player’s €30million buy-out clause, and his agent has confirmed Milan would have to pay that amount to sign him from Sevilla.
“€30m? Yes, that’s correct. The club would have to spend that amount to sign the player. I don’t think Sevilla will sell him for anything less,” added the agent.
You probably think I am an idiot, but I think we could end the summer with Benzema, Melo and Tasci!
With an outside chance of getting the Hitz also….
Arsene make it easier and sell him for 25mil euro’s.. That’s about 20m stirling these days, no?
not an idiot PDT, not at all…
We all want the best, i mean, i want to sell adebayor and buy de rossi…
The majority hope we’ll sell adebayor and end up with melo and a cf to replace adebayor such as benzema, hunetlaar etc…
The reality is we’ll end up with vermaelen and chamakh and the board will be grinning and banging on about profit margins whilst we’re battling it out with villa, spurs and everton for a europa cup slot
if we have a net expense of 30million i am a happy man
Afternoon All…
holiday…but just had to make a quick comment…brilliant Post Geoff….
have a great summer All Grovers and Gooners alike
tom
Samuel Eto’o would have to perform a sudden turnaround if he were to accept Manchester City’s offer and leave Barcelona rather than stay at Camp Nou for one more season, according to his agent.
The Cameroonian striker is reportedly the subject of a €30 million bid from the Premier League’s nouveau-riche club, and stories in England suggest that a deal has been done.
Josep Maria Mesalles does not see it like that, however – and believes that Eto’o is more inclined to remain at Barcelona for the last year of his current contract.
“If there is not a 180-degree turnaround, then he will stay with Barcelona,” Eto’o's representative told ONA FM.
According to Sport, Eto’o is unhappy with the way that he is being forced out of Barcelona and his agent Mesalles hinted that he could decide to stay just to upset the club’s plans.
That would then allow him to leave under the Bosman Ruling next summer and earn even more than the €10 million-per-season on offer from Manchester City this year.
President Joan Laporta has stated that he would like the players to stay, but he also recognises that coach Pep Guardiola wants Eto’o out and a new striker in to build his strikeforce around.
While the rumours continue, the former Real Madrid and Real Mallorca star is still on holiday after flying back to Paris having played in a charity game.
That’s been put to bed then…
wenger already said no to chamakh..
… like during the winter.. he never said no about arshavin…
i think that fergie might pounce for huntelaar and robben/sneijder…it is just a sneaking suspicion of mine.
i hope he meant it choy
Don’t think sir alex would take robben. Huntelaar and sneijder in a double swoop would make sense.. Throw in Valencia and Alexis Sanchez and i’ll say that about makes man utd done for the summer… A Ribery, Aguerro or Villa bid might surface also..
In other news, Arsenal manager Arsene Wenger is mulling over a move for hoffenheim stiker demba ba, to replace wantaway striker emmanuel adebayor …
Can we just forget the idea that Arsenal play 442?
We have NEVER EVER played 442 under Wenger.
For proof of this, watch Bob Wilson Meets on AFC TV, and watch the Bergkamp interview, where they go in depth into formations and the various ones we’ve played under Wenger.
The ONLY time we played 442 was when Jeffers was at the club.
Other than that, we havent played 442 for a single match.
so what have we played then?
I hope Chamakh is a wind up. Ive never seen a worse finisher in the french league. The man is absolutely dismal in front of goal. 10 times worse than Adebayor/Bendtner and that takes some doing
4-4-1-1 is practically a 4-4-2 in my eyes..
we’ve always played 4-4-2 stop talking bullox
we always played a variation of 4231. Bergkamp himself said he played in attacking midfield with Henry on his own up front.
They discussed 442 and it is a formation we’ve NEVER used!
in 98 it was back 4 with Vieria and Petit in front of them. and in 2002/04 it was Vieria and Gilberto.
Never, EVER 442.
Reva. That is absolutely incorrect.
Dont beleive me? Listen to what Bergkamp and Bob Wilson say on the tele. its on all the time on AFC TV.
I suggest you watch it.
Chamakh is cack.. I wonder how many kiddies would love to have 13 chamakh on their backs
I watch a fair bit of French football, or did at least until Setanta died. And my word Chamakh is a laughable figure. Terrible terrible striker.
He’s culpable for some of the worst misses ive ever seen.
if it were that way, we could mould every formation in the world to any other calling them alike…
the point whether a second striker plays in attack and not in midfield is where this debate is going to end up..
i think we need a left winger more than a striker.. unless rosicky has a blinding season
it always looked like a 4-4-2 in where they just roamed around a bit to me…
Romford Pele–Paddy–Manu–Overmars
—–Den10
————–Nico
Freddie—Bert–Paddy–Bob
——Den10
—————Thierry
we need one more signing imo to bring a buzz around the club…the benz would do it.
i’d rather de rossi did it
Its not really a debate about what formation we played. As far as im concerned if Dennis Bergkamp – who was PLAYING in the team, and Bob Wilson who was coaching us, say it, then its gospel!
What, like “Stuart taylor is one of the best young english goalkeepers in england” I never believed that
Id love De Rossi, id also love to screw Megan Fox.
Put it this way. There’s more chance of me hanging out the back of Megan Fox tonight that there is us signing De Rossi.
when we played roma in the champs league de rossi was shown up by the fast pace of our play. i’m not sure if he could cope in the prem. Melo looks good- a more mobile, attacking version of gilberto with good passing.
you know what: just pay 8 million and get the flamster back..
he’s proven and he is just what we need…..
For those interested the Arsenal holdings accounts are independantly audited and published, as with all publicly listed companies.
You can find them here
http://www.arsenal.com/the-club/corporate-info/arsenal-holdings-financial-results
It turns out that we do have a little bit of debt after all.
Yes Tom, But there’s less chance of me becoming the cure for cancer and i’ll cling to the hope that you’re a good looking fucker with good contacts
AJG he’d be able to adapt, he’s a world class player… I’m sure he’d be able to hold his own..
De Rossi is the closest thing to an absolutely perfect player for Cesc to play alongside out there.
However – He is like Totti – he’ll never leave Roma.
that’s propeganda home website bullshit for those who’ve got to much time on their hands…
I refuse to believe we can’t spent money on par with the likes of anyone except man utd and chelsea in this country, with our income versed against our expenditure.. It’s all bullshit…
We should be able to fork out 30m for de rossi without even having to sell adebayor with all the scrimping and saving we’ve done over the years..
We aren’t exactly going to win footballing awards for having managed our debt the best way in line with the other g-14 clubs are we? No, we’re just going to remain potless and just about even…
Rev. We’re skint pal. Have you not realised?
442 definitely
we started playing 451 in 2006 CL
exactly tom… Yeah, but tom they are in the europa cup and every time he plays for them and comes against english opposition in the premier european competition (which he isn’t in) they get obliterated…
Plus it is also world cup year… He isn’t a shoe in to start for the italians, there are competition for places…
I don’t think it’s that unaccetainable
we might well be skint, but we’ve probably got the most money bar chelsea and the mancs..
Plus totti is too old now and no one REEEEEEEAlly tried to prize him away, did they…
Franchise – We never ever ever played 442.
Dont trust me. Listen to Dennis Bergkamp on “Bob Wilson Meets”.
it suprised me too….
Reva
Calling that rednose cunt “sir Alex” is a no no.
Please call him by his proper title “alchy”
sir drinkalot is passable
maybe slur drinkalot because he slurs all his words when he’s drunk (90% of the time)
hat trick
“The news came as Madrid confirmed they have reached an agreement with Valencia to sign defender Raul Albiol for a reported £12million.”
Surely we should have got him.
Spain have a 25% tax rate but Italy are on 50% so we stand more chance of getting a player from Italy
Really GM, I didn’t know Italy was on 50%. Is it the same also only for the rich the high tax?
GM,
soory mate the tax rate in Spain is 18%.
Reva 14.30
“At the moment he is a Sevilla player, but I cannot say that he will be there next season. He is on the same level as Zlatan Ibrahimovic, David Villa and Adebayor.”
If I was Fabiano and my agent compared me to AdeNuff, I would not be happy !!!
From yesterday for the ice cream kid:
Stu,
We have two boxers,one of my favorite breeds,really lovable dogs.however they historically suffer from stomach complaints,diabetes and joint problems which in your dog’s case may be arthritis.This is very common but usually with older Boxers,that are at least 5 or 6 years old,and being a male it is imperative that the weight is carefully monitored as overweight can lead to serious problems.IMO you should always only give dry food and the occasional dog treat.Kelsey.
sorry not soory, the tax rate is 18% for everyone.
Rohan, do you go to games???
I wouldn’t take that little cunt back if they paid me.
When will you people realise that people that leave on their own volition will never play for our club again??
It’s galling enough paying shit loads of money to watch wank players, paying to watch cunts that have chosen to fuck off for the lure of the lira would really stick in the fucking throat.
haha, i live in the uae and there ain’t no bloody tax system here..:P
Hello kelsey.
You o.k old son?
Rohan, that’s why you are happy to take cunts back that i wouldn’t piss on if they were on fire.
The 25-year-old has been sidelined since the 2-1 FA Cup semi-final defeat to Chelsea, in which he injured his groin. He has subsequently not played in the Gunners’ last four fixtures.
Should he be given the green light, it seems that Wenger will have no hesitations in playing the former Feyenoord star.
“We played 4-4-2 at Portsmouth on Saturday and I think we look more threatening that way,” Wenger is quoted as saying.
“Maybe we will play with two strikers against Manchester United — but the way we line up depends on who is available.
“When Cesc Fabregas plays behind the striker, as he did at Old Trafford last week, the striker looks to be a little isolated.
“But when we play with Theo Walcott on the right, he is more of a winger than a midfielder so the rest of the side need to be more defensive. So it is important we get the balance of our team right.”
The French tactician has also insisted that those players he names on the bench could also play a key role in deciding whether they can overturn the 1-0 deficit from the first leg to reach the final in Rome later this month.
“We will not win on Tuesday with 11 players, we will win with 14,” he explained. “The substitutes will play a crucial role.
“No matter who starts, what is important is that everybody is focused so they can help the team to qualify for the final.
“There is no doubt that United were sharper and more threatening in the first leg at Old Trafford last week.
“But what we need now is the added sharpness you often get from the advantage of being the home side.”
OLD, Steve, no older.
Bloody hot here about 90 degrees and 80% humidity.Not much to talk about,it’s all speculation,but all eyes will be on poor Theo tonight.Lone striker role against the germans,no easy task.
Tom u r the first person to come out to say we didnt play 4-4-2. i dont know what berg said but wehen he played and when he didnt we always went for 2 forwards and 2 wide players. he was definitely one that like playing in the hole but that doesnt stop it from being a 4-4-2
yep steve i understand what you are saying, but i can’t really think of anyone else who will fit our midfield that perfectly.
yeah, he probably does not deserve a second chance, but we still don’t know the whole story regarding the finances so i will reserve judgement.
arsenal started the 451 thingy in 2006 CL run
he has always been a 442 manager
Is that cotadour a good player???????
And demba ba is really class, isn’t he?????
Kelsey, it’s fucking baking here. I just spent 3 hours drinking on the bank of the Thames in the sun.
Franchise, wtf was that on about at 15:35???
Fucking oddball.
Rohan, reserve nothing. That little judas cunt chose to leave so let him stay there. If he came back i’d fucking slughter the little cunt.
steve its just smthin i cut and paste from an arsene article where he said we are more comfy attacking when we play 442
Tom seems to think that we have never ever played 442 under wenger
bloody work….what have I missed.
Just had a quick scroll through……i Agreed with Tom !! Think we should sign Chamakh as he’ll fit into out 442 system.
Yeah, forget the fact that he is fucking shit wardo.
based on yesterday’s game Melo would score a few goals over a PL season…he got off a good shot at goal early on plus a decent attacking header from a corner…
Franchise
i dont think we are reve but i think wenger has finally understood that different situations/games etc require different tactics.
———————————————
when did arsene figure that out ?
by leaving AA out of the FA game , and giving him 2 weeks rest ?
or during the C.L games we got knocked out of ?
he has yet to prove anything different IMO…
Let’s just sign any cunt that fits into a system. Fuck quality, let’s go for quantity.
hey Steve…how goes it ??
I know he is mate…just on a wind up !! Tom was banging on the other day bout him. And today I’ve seen him banging on bout us never playing 442…….
hence the “he’ll fit into our 442 system”
looks like I wound you up instead Stevo hahaha
a few years ago he did ethan in 2006
wenger was always 4-4-2 or bust. arsh out in fa cup was a political tactic not a game one
**** not a technical one i meant sorry
Who is that cotadeur????? And is demba ba class??????
demba ba is in the same class as chamakh… The cack class…
I want a bit of quality, i’m sick of these “who the fuck are they” players… Last season no-one wanted melo, cana or hitzlespergers.
we wanted cana last season..but yep i get your point revelation..
Reve…”who the fuck are they” players like Paddy, Petit, Eduardo, Sagna…
I’ll stop there…. its a pretty long list.
There’s no guarantees with ANY signing
Oh and I wanted Cana last sesaon…but wasn’t reading LG back then…
Chiellini was got fave on LG until he started olaying 90mions in front of our own eyes. Why buy Vermaeln for £12m when you can add £m and get Chiellini…
Its all quiet on that front now
Corr: Hot fave not got fave
Sharkey once upon a time getting “who the fuk are they” players worked cause they were cheap.. Nowadays they cost upwards of 15m….
I know there are no guarentees with signings, but i’d feel a little bit more confident if we signed a de rossi or a hunetlaar/benzema as apposed to a cana and chamakh.. That’s all i’m saying…
I hope we see more of wlshere next season,agree?????
wardo, sorry son, drinking in the sun sends me loopy fucking loo.
preferably not dutchman unless it’s in pre season, the carling and fa cups
i’ll repeat what i said earlier…if wenger buys a player, i trust that the player is quality. imo quality is something wenger would never compromise on.
it is his reluctance to buy that annoys him..
what like cygan, stepanova, vivas, luhzny, upson, wright, jeffers, wreh, boa morte, pennant, adebayor, bischoff, silvestre, diaby, song, eboue etc.. His track record isn’t as good as he likes to think
revalution, why???? Would you like to see how he sits on the bank. He must play!!!
no probs Steve….. cant wait to get out and have a beer or two tonight.
C’mon Gibbs and Theo in the U21 final…..
P.s. how good was Gibbs’ pen. He looks mustard to me….
i like wilshire, great prospect, but that’s all he is, a prospect… He has the potential to be an arsenal great, but it isn’t his time yet.. He’ll get a few more 1st team games than last season, but i expect them to be in the domestic cups..
i expect to see a lot more of ramsey..i see him getting around 15 starts…
Reva, so you think Adebayor has been a bad buy??
Have you ever heard of economics???
Also, he paid fuck all for Eboue and he was a fucking good full back.
Have a look at what was spent on Pennant and come back to me.
Same with Upson, how much would he get for Song??
Luhzny done a jon for a couple of years.
Re-evaluate and tell me how much Wenger has wasted.
Bearing in mind that he bought the likes of Overmars, Petit, Vieira, Henry, Anelka, Cesc for next to nothing.
wardo, cool as a cucumber. I like the look of him. Even after he made that mistake against the mancs, the crowd were up for him. A very good sign indeed.
Well done steve… you’ve killed the blog
Reva..16.18 No worries mate. We’re all after the same thing.
I’m just fearful of the Arse wasting wot little money we do have on some tosser who’s no better than what we’ve got.
Part of me says it becos we are so critical of our own playersm but wet our pants when we see a 2min clip of ‘the next big thing’.
What was up with Cesc sitting on the bench on his todd at half time yesterday ..??
Rohan 16.21. I’m with you on that one, I just saidthe same to a mate by email.
I’m not convinced by Melo at £15m..but if Arsene is, then I’ll back his judgement.
Sorry Tom, i have an anti-bollocktalkiing mechanism built in.
Shame I can’t adhere to it myself sometimes. Anyway, i’m off so the blog should be a live and kicking
Reve 16.24. Decent players in that list:
Vivas, Luhzny, Upson, Wreh, Diaby, Song, Eboue.
Not gonna argue all day about this, well not on myown tme anyway
Of the three current ones, I despair of defending Song anymore to anyone who cannot see that he had some very good games for us over the last 3mths of the season.
Anyone should be able to see that Diaby has talent, its his application and decision making that are the problem. Cost us c£3m.
Eboue. In the run to 2006 CL Final, there was no RB in the world that any of us would have swapped him for. Cost £1m.
The three others 30-40 caps for Argentina, Russian/Ukraine captain, and Englands third choice CB. No duffers there.
I don;t even think Cygan was as bad as everyone says..he became a scapegoat and got given no slack.
No Senderos on that list btw…one less for me to defend – cheers Reva
vivas was poor for us. whatever about argentina..
he was better for us than veron was for united.
even now, eboue as a right back is not all that bad….as a back up he is great.
Freduardo…”whatever about Argentina”…?? Wot, are they a second rate national team then…
For me Vivas was OK for us. Good utility player. Good signing IMO.
Yeah i’d agree with that Sharkey. He was undoubtedly not as good for us as he was for Argentina, but he was a very reliable and useful backup player, likewise luzhny
Vivas was a steely little f***er weren;t he…loved hom from day one. Like you say, not a regular starter, but very reliable.
Luzhny took a little longer to grow on me….
the situation with ade i s tipical of alot players thes days they have 1 good season and it goes to there head,players like giggs and scholes are very rear who are great team players and stay with same club for life,for me all players showing that kind of commitment and they just put ade and players like him to shame.
i am very eager to see if diaby bucks his ideas up to his credit he has not gone holiday he working with trainer to build stegth up and improve which is a step in the right direction and i am sure he is awear he needs to step up with risicky wor king on fitnness too diaby will have improve to first team chances.i would like eboue stay as squad player he is good right back cover but if wants first chances that will never happen at this club,i dought there will be any one going in midfield as delinson and song have done very well especaily when cesc was injured,i feel they both have come under very unfair critizme and it clear will only add to midfield is very happy with midfield for most part,i am hoping for 1 more midfielder and a new striker and ade gone
well i never liked vivas, probly embittered because of the leeds goal at the end of the 99 season. but i wouldn’t call him a good signing, but thats just my opinion. when i hear of us signing a hard nut argentine international, i would hope for better than vivas.
I think this is a great post..! the board think we are crazy and can’t add up simple numbers..they’ve been feeding us this crap for some time now..
Freduardo. Fair olanate.
I was racking my brains for a Vivas incident that I weren’t happy with.
Yep, it was him filling in for Winterburn…got caught out in a way that Nigel never would have !!!
Evening all: Another top post guys. Arsenal are all about contradictions, as one minute we are not relying on CL money yet we’ve managed to compete in every competition since Wenger took over. So where has all that ‘extra’ money gone?
Just watched Ade’s goals from 07-08 on ESPN.
A few ovbservations :
ALL goals had a certain level of difficulty. None were simple tap-ins. Some were outrageous – chest down a ball at about 8-10 feet in the air and volley home. And above 50 % were from edge of the box , or even outside !
And 90 % of his assists were from CESC. Those 2 love playing together.
Also Rosicky looked class in the few glimpses in the build-ups.
Hope all 3 start next season for us.
He does score some good goals arindam, but even at his best his overall game left alot to be desired. Cesc, Rosicky, and Arshavin interlinking will be a joy to behold next season, maybe even nasri if he could be fitted in as well! along with vp, eduardo, or bendy up front. so many technical clever players though I REALLY don’t want ade to start games because he hinders them, though i’d be very happy for him to still be at the club as a plan B.
A, that’s the problem with Ade, he was always seen as a plan B, and with that we play 4-5-1 most of the time. I don’t blame Ade though, that down to Le boss.
A , a slick overall game , but no end-product wont be fun.
Remember the 06-07 season ? Hleb and co. trying to pass it in ? I fear without Ade , we may try to do the same.
We really need a guy who can mix it up – which explains AW’s interest in Chamakh. I’d rather keep Ade than have Chamakh as his replacement.
what do you mean truth? Ade was bought as a plan B, but because of injuries to VP he turned into our plan A last season, and did very well, which fucked up everything this season and buggered up his attitude etc as well. If he does stay i’m sure it’ll only be as a plan B, wenger knows that he doesn’t have it in him to link up with the likes of arshavin and contribute to the fast flowing football
I don’t believe there is any actual interest in Chamakh arindam. I’d rather look to the football played in the 03/04 season as what we should be aiming at, by all means have someone on the bench who can offer something different and mix it up if needs be, but NEVER from the start, or we’re completely wasting the talents of Rosicky, Arshavin, Cesc etc
As a combo , the few games that ADe and Dudu played up top , they looked MAGIC.
That would be my first choice pairing for us.
Arindam. Old AdeNuff clips can leave you a bit misty eyed I know.
How many of his goals were instinctive finishes..? I reckon most of them were (from memory). Yeah he scoredloas ofgoals, but for me he’s never shown even technical ability to really ‘think the game’. You know the way that some players outwit a defender.
With AdeNuff its all instinct and/or power..?? We should email ESPN and get them to extend the tape to show all his chances…could end up as a 3 or 4 part special though.
Corr 18.33 Fair play mate
Fair point , A.
But that would work in the Liga.
In the EPL , if you play Arshy,Cesc,Rosicky,Dudu all in the same team without someone like Ade – teams will get away by parking the bus. It would be fun to watch , but we will find it hard to break down sides that DEFEND.
Ade ahead of VP arindam?! Please tell me you’re joking?! They did create goals, long balls up to ade and flick ons etc, but they were far from magic, purely because ade doesn’t have it in him to produce magical football. Magical moments and goals, but over any 90 mins he’ll give the ball away and disrupt the more talented and intelligent players’ passing moves so much even when at his very best, though it’s ok as long as he scores the goals which counter his negative impact on the football. However with the players we’ve got now we don’t need to sacrifice playing good football with having someone who can mix it up, that’s just a plan B.
A, what I mean is that the plan b became the plan a. If he stays Wenger will start him for most games
The problem there is that our plan B striker is our best paid player.
I am keeping my fingers crossed that AC Milan turn to him in a couple of days.
And thank fuck Etoo has turned down Man Shitty, good for football as a whole and good for Arsenal, as with Etoo and Tevez, they would have been banging on the door for 4th place.
Sharkey , apart from Zidane most other greats were also instinctive players .
PLease note that this has got nothing to do with Ade , who is also instinctive and that isnt a bad thing , imo.
How many in the world would have scored the one against Villareal ? I cant think of any.
I disagree arindam, because we did that in 03/04. Granted some teams would succeed in nullifying us with their anti-football, but that’s exactly why we have ade as a plan B to bring him off the bench to mix it up. With the players we’ve got now though I really don’t think many teams would succeed in nullifying us. Rosicky, Cesc, Arshavin, Nasri, VP, Eduardo all firing will break down more or less anyone
One player who could definitely have scored the goal against Villareal is Peter Crouch arindam! After that alot of top players could have done.
I wouldn’t say ade is instinctive, quite the opposite in fact, he completely lacks strikers instincts, which is why he finds himself in the wrong positions all the time, and miss kicks the ball, not to mention the offsides.
Eduardo is an instinctive finisher, ade is quite the opposite
A , I am not really convinced until I see it in action. On paper it looks good, but I am not sure if that side will break down teams that park the bus [ around 70 % games].
All that we know is that our best chance to win the league in a long time came when Cesc and Ade were at the top of their game and working in tandem. I would go with that and build something around that , rather than cream about something that hasn’t been implemented yet ( ie. Rosicky -Cesc-Nasri-Arsh-Eddy-VP )
pat let city bang on the door for 4th place, it’ll be the likes of chelsea and utd they’re fighting with. Utd could genuinly be in a fair bit of trouble next season, they need alot of new players, and it’ll most likely be a season of transition regardless. They need to replace Ronaldo, Tevez, Giggs, and Scholes, probably Hargreaves too, and Nani has shown he’ll never be up to it as well. Fergie has a fair bit of work to do this summer to get them in a position where they’ll be around the top of the table again next year imo.
WE CAN FORGET ABOUT LE BOSS BUYING MORE THAN 3 PLAYERS
Real Madrid’s returning president Florentino Perez appears utterly determined to continue making use of his chequebook as he wishes to strengthen his side with just top-notch material.
After splashing out nearly £150 million on Cristiano Ronaldo and Kaka, Real Madrid have spent a reported €15 million to sign Raul Albiol from Valencia and continue being linked to several other players.
Wenger, who was one of the names in the frame to be installed as Real Madrid boss, has now confirmed why he turned down the chance to guide the Spanish capital club.
“Real Madrid lean towards football-spectacle, but there is another dimension: the success of building a team with a style, a know-how, a club’s own game culture, of youngsters,” he told Dauphine Libere.
“That is what I have chosen. I am in a project of a construction of a young team. I want to stay until the end.
“I enjoy watching my team play the football that I love.”
The French tactician has also warned Real that a summer of hefty spending may produce an undesired effect.
“Signing more than three players is to take a technical risk. We enter an area of incertitude.
“But if it works, they will make a lot of damage,” he concluded.
Arindam imo the most integral part of that machine by some way was Hleb, and he’s gone so it isn’t a case of building anything around it. It wasn’t Cesc and Ade in tandem, it was Cesc, Hleb and Rosicky in tandem at the start, and Cesc and Hleb after that, and ade was just benefitting from the amazing creativity and opportunities they were providing for him, he was far from integral to our play.
Peter Crouch ?!?
Good one , A. Is it the same one that will e plying his trade with Portmouth next season ?
A , none from our team could have done that. And I cant really imagine/remember seeing too many others from around the world doing that.
There was never a chance of that happening anyways Coadsi, and thats a good thing imo. Fuck another period of transition.
ade has his good points he has ability but there alot players out there like that who has some phsycal presence and can header but we need a team player not someone who is going strole around pitch and running his mouth all the time.there is nothing specail about ade he is good player but a long long long long way before he can become a great player like henry
Arindam. Perhaps ‘instinctive’ isn’t the best word to describe what I’m tryng to say.
Think of ‘cool finishes’ from top strikers…with clever play, bit of disguise etc.
AdeNuff has his qualities, but a sharp mind is not one of them. The longer he has to think, the worse the outcome.
I’m not rying to murder the guy, but he will never be top top striker whilst he lacks the intelligence that would improve his concentration, which would then raise his technique and other aspectys ofhi sgame.
He’s just not game smart.
He’s a great Plan B, but I’ll be happy to see the back of him asap
Yeah Arindam – Crouch has scored a lot of goals just like that or better in his career…. Exactly my point too, it doesn’t mean that he’s a great player, because Crouch does it on a more regular basis than Ade, and as you say he plays for Pompey! Eduardo could certainly have scored that goal as well, but he’s the only one in our team, I can’t see anyone else scoring it.
A , you would do well to go back and watch all of Ade’s goals from that season [ alongwith the build-ups ] and you will have a very different opinion.
You will realize that they weren’t 25 tap ins after being spoon fed. Also Hleb was no where around when the goals were scored , bar 1/2 . Also around 50 % goals were due to Cesc by-passing the opponent’s midfield using his lovely chips.
Perception is a KILLER , my friend.
‘afternoon, y’all
I must agree with the opinion that whilst Ade’s 07/08 season goals were not just tap-ins, he was enjoying immense service from THAT midfield…
just think about it: Hleb pulling two players on himself, yet somehow managing to dribble and pass, Rosicky’s and Cesc’s intelligent runs and passing – this all created acres of space for Ade, which we did not see too much this season, did we?
all these counter attacks being slowed down, with no one willing to take responsibility did my head in…
Catch you guys later…i’m at home, and I’m not being paid a cent to talk shite/football with you guys now.
Back tomorrow when the meters runing again….
6 against derby
I know Arindam, Hleb created and manufactured all the moves, he didn’t play the final ball, or get the goal or assist, but very few of the moves could have occurred without his involvement. He was by far the biggest loss this season just gone, and the reason why we created so little in alot of games prior to Arshavin’s arrival.
My point is , if Ade can swallow his pride and accept rotation with RvP and Eddy – he will be a massive weapon in the League.
When in doubt , ask a simple question – What would the opponents think about Ade leaving Arsenal ? They would LOVE seeing that happen.
Just as we loved MAnu losing ROn and Tevez , etc.
A please go on aclf and show most of them pricks up?
there are somany good strikers out there so i am not worried about losing ade at all,for me players like berdkamp,henri,gibbs and scholes but ade to shame and it looks as if ade wants to leave
“Hleb created and manufactured all the moves” – You make the twat sound like Zidane.
I’d take Hleb back in a heartbeat for 7 million. It’ll improve Rosicky and Cesc as they seemed to love playing with eachother.
huh kirby?
i agree with that arindam, we would be useful if he was prepared to play a bit part role, AND he realised that he wasn’t the bollocks so still needs to work his arse off, but I simply don’t see that happening.
Opposition fans would LOVE to see vp, cesc, arshavin leave, they’re pretty indifferent to Ade from my experience
there are somany good strikers out there so i am not worried about losing ade at all,for me players like berdkamp,henri,gibbs and scholes but ade to shame and it looks as if ade wants to leave
????
Arindam imo last season he was as integral to our play as Zidane has ever been for anyone. Our entire system relied on him, as was shown by the fact we could only operate at about 50% when he wasn’t playing, and shown in his absence this season. IMO if we’d won the league last year it would have been down to Hleb more than any other player.
Arindam, his head has been turned a long time ago – fucker scored hatful of goals and all of the sudden he got way too big for his boots and started thinking he was TH14…
if he is to stay, he would have to became humble servant to the supporters and invent celebration of goals of somehow apologetic nature and use it for the large chunk of the season…
can’t see that happening, so thanks, but no thanks – Wenger is way too soft to sort him out, IMO…
I dunno about now Pat – Arshavin and Nasri have come in so there’s no space for him anymore. The team was built around him, and he was ridiculously integral to us, but he left, and we had our period of transition and have moved on, we couldn’t go back to the system we used with Hleb now
oh nothing A just you cant have a debate with anyone on there. I thought you would be more capable of showing them up with your knowledge, because most of them believe our squad can do no wrong!
My experience tells me different , A.
They rate Ade quite highly. More than Eddy and RvP.
Manc freind of mine was surprised when I told him RvP’s stats for the season.
A, Rosicky and Hleb are both miles better than Nasri if you ask me. Nasri is the disappearing type. He did it for L’OM and he disappeared too many times for us as well.
Arindam who rates ade over vp?! I’ve never spoken to a single person who thinks ade is better than vp?!
Oh ok kirby, is that a blog then?? I don’t go on any other blogs other than here
I’ve seen some United and Chelsea blogs and Ade is a laughing stock on there.
even when you make a positive comment they call you doomers!
it just gets to me that people can be so blinded and rude when they get found out dont worry about it, i’m just hot and bothered.
RVP is the one player United fans would like from Arsenal, if they could choose, according to most of them/
Now that you guys dug up some old memeories – I rated the twat. I really did.
If he had a shot on him , he would have been in the top 3/5 players in the world. Just like Iniesta is now.
ANd yes , I absolutely loved and adored his fluid style. BUT , he turned out to be a twat.
pat
sorry hleb for a wenger was very poore and inmy opinion very much luxury player at hi stime at the club he had very little assists and scored evon less,nasri already has proven to be alot more effective not better just more suited to the prem,nasri has proven that can play anywere in midfield and workd alot harder, as for risicky i have alwyas thought risicky was alot better than hleb,risicky only problem is his fitness he will score 10 goals aseason easily and a ton of assists
I think Hleb was properly replaced only when AA23 came, bringing Hleb’s ability and much, much more…
Hleb used to terrorise fullbacks with his pace and dribbling skills, usually a CB or a midfielder tried to help out leaving space for Cesc & Co.
yeah good i think i’m gonna stick here from now on, it was the first one i blogged on!
nasri scores goals.. i think more than hleb did in all his career at arse … in his first season.. i would take him over hleb any day of the week
*memories
Yeah I agree with that Pat, but it’s only because he’s still adapting – Hleb went missing all the time in his first season as well. Arshavin is better than Hleb, so there’s no way we’d build the team around Hleb again, and Hleb only really works when the team is built to his strengths, as shown by his horrific season at barca!
Nasri has had a superb season imo, considering his age, and it being his first season in the prem, i wouldn’t say he’s now at a level below Hleb and Pires were when they first arrived and had difficulties adapting early on
Bye , fellas !
Yawn.. So did we sign Benzema yet? Anyway i was thinking that if we do replace Ade with a top striker how will be line up will some of the players accept being benched w/o Ade i imagine us lining up like
Al -fab
Sagna-Verm-Gallas-Gael – Song,djouruou,eboue(?),gibbs
Rosicky-Fab-DM-Arsh – nasri, walcott, vela, deilson
RvP-Dudu – Nick, vela, walcott
there’s obviously a bit of silver lining to Hleb leaving us: had he stayed we would MAYBE have bought Nasri as his understudy, but not Arsha…
a
with aa,nasri,risicky means there is nowere for hleb who was very ineffective at the club he played 1 game and did nothing next 3 games and that same whole 3 years ,in season aa has completly elepts anthing he did in 3 years and at barc were is he nowere
how is walcott doing ?
1-0 Germany…
Leon..what do u think abt Reyes? !
Germany scored…
disagree completely leon, i don’t want hleb back, but he was far from ineffective, he almost won us the league last season, and although individually arshavin is a better player, and will be amazing next year, he still isn’t as involved as much or running things as much as hleb did, he was massively underrated by alot of fans and the british press imo, which is shown by the fact the best team in europe wanted to sign him
Germany has just scored, they look much sharper than us at the moment. Walcott is playing out on the left and seems to be running into blind alleys.
not toooooo badly choy, lively but hasn’t had anything come from his runs, could make something happen though. Milner should have been booked for that dive, though it was lovely footwork before
Milner’s obviously been learning from Ashley Young, Agbonlahor, and Heskey. I wonder if Martin O’Neil actually teaches players to dive
A, BBC actually rated Hleb a lot. From the match analysis(s) I watched, they were always raving about him.
I absolutely hate people who go by stats. if you watch football and know football, you know who is good and who isn’t. Stats don’t mean shit.
Truth theo is playing right through the middle, not the left
actually that could be true pat, i remember them going on about him having a 100% pass completion rate against villa, but overall the opinion of him in england certainly amongst fans seemed to underrate him massively imo
Germany wer absolutely dominated by Italy as well. Good thing for England is that they don’t have to play Italy. I think they’d get a thumping. England don’t have anyone of Giovinco’s or Balotelli’s level. Walcott isn’t even close.
xees
another very gifted player but very imature he was very inconistant at times tons of ability but has tossed all away i dont evon which club plays for now
athletico madrid leon, was on loan at benfica this season, but they don’t want to sign him permanently, and athletico don’t want him back so no idea where he’ll go!
Last I heard that Everton were in talks with Reyes
I remember going on a Villa forum a couple of weeks ago, when they were linked to Hleb, and they were nearly creaming themselves at the thought of him going there. Coming out with stuff like “Barry who?”.
That masterclass he put on at Villa Park is obviously still fresh in their minds.
a
hleb has ability but had only 1 good seas on but he was not willing to put foot in and for someone who has so little assists he needed to put shift in for the team and have more assists and that did happen often for him
I disagree leon, he actually had a very good work rate, people just didn’t mention it. Hleb if we hadn’t lost Rosicky and Eduardo and therefore won the league last season should have gotten pfa player of the year imo, alot of ifs there though! I still think he should have been shortlisted ahead of Cesc
I would still take him back for those games at Old Trafford and Anfield. His ball retention and dribbling was priceless there.
The team we have at the moment gets dispossessed too easily when pressed.
Germany seem to have better idea how to play: pass, pass, pass, bang…
England seem to be pussyfooting around and get bullied back to their half a lot – now where have I seen that before?
it’s pretty much how todays XI would look in the game vs The Invincibles in their prime…
and yes, Richards is having a shocking game so far – nowhere to be seen when the first goal went in and leaves tons of space…
fuckin’ hell, some tackle by Gibbs…
True Paulinho, but I still wouldn’t have him back. With Rosicky, Cesc, Arshavin, VP, Eduardo and Bendy we won’t have those problems
check this out:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/606/A53828021
good laugh, this
leon, stop bringing up assists. There would be no assists for players like cesc if it wasn’t for Hleb. Hleb was much better than Cesc that season. Damn it I hate stats people. Do you not know the game of football? No you really not see what he brought to this team?
I can’t wait to see Rosicky in action!
pat
he was a winger so thats pretty important and taking shots on goal is pretty important too,did he play better than cesc i dought it but cesc is 21 20 at the time hleb 27-28 for me if your playing for top 4 team a winger should be scoring at least 6 goals a saeson and at least assistants to score he did not do that enough he was winger or attacking midfielder
yea opinions on hleb are surely divided..even though he didn’t score many and event didn’t get a lotta assits, but his ball retention and possession was something we could use..we used to kill teams off with possession and for that he was really important..and he could use both his feet to open up defenses with his “pre-assists”
..
leon..AW is one of the best known stat Guru’s so there must be something in Hleb’s stats !
nice dabate but i have to work
i think we lost at OT and lost one at anfield and drew the other one…
lets think about it this way…
the opposition let hleb have the ball .. coz they knew he wouldn’t shoot!!!
Lets just say that Hleb was involved in more goals than Nasri. EVERYTHING went through Hleb.
“a football game is played for 90 minutes, then Germany wins”….
2-0 Germany
Fuck me i could of saved that
Nah Choy, let’s think about this way (the way it actually happened)
The opposition tried to get the ball off him, failed, and left space for others to run into. When Hleb passed to them, they exploited the space.
Without him there, there is no space to exploit.
Choy, Hleb v. United:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEtaNKo0E6U
Hleb alone could have gotten us 5 more pts. in the last few games of the season. Against Wigan at the JJB, 1st minute, sent Ade clean through and he missed. Tied that game 0-0.
Against United, sent Ade through again when it was 0-0, Ade missed.
Against LPool: He did something that no other player than Messi could when he dribbled past 4-5 players and we were denied a clear-cut penalty.
Nasri is shit compared to him when comparing overall value to the team.
England has no offensive threat whatsoever…
England’s lack of real strikers is a real problem through out the whole national system, from U21 to the senior team…
i like the optimism paulinho…
fact is when the going got tough he chickened out..
he was technically very gifted, but didn’t do anything with it.
“He was instrumental to everything Arsenal created”
Ray imo it’s the complete and utter lack of any technical ability or creativity in midfield. Pearce plays with essentially 3 defensive mids, it’s ridiculous. At this level theo can be amazing, and frazer campbell and agbonlahor are also very useful at this level if there’s any service at all. Cattermole/Noble/Muamba/Gardner lack any sort of passing ability whatsoever
Choy, then you obviously didn’t watch him close enough. He was our best midfielder that season, closely followed by Rosicky and Flamini
After Lineker, Shearer and Owen, what have england produced in real goalscoring players?
And don’t say Rooney, he’s not an out and out goalscorer like the 3 mentioned above…
choy when the going got tough he was amazing, liverpool in the league in the last minute, and in the champions league, and against utd etc etc. Hleb was our best midfielder and most important individual player last season by some distance imo
But he did Choy
Many players in the current Arsenal side are very happy to drop off the midfield and receive the ball when there is NO ONE around them to pressure them, like Nasri, like Denilson, even Cesc as well.
Not many players had the balls and ability to ask for the ball when surrounded by two or more players high up the pitch. That’s the difference – it’s not just what he did it is the context in which he did it, the situation.
That’s why to say he lacked balls is a myth. To keep asking and then commanding the ball at arenas like Old Trafford and Anfield took guts as well as unique ability.
Maybe Rooney can be when played in the correct position. He has 10 goals in 7 games for England right now
Walcott has zero striker’s instinct.
Are we getin all misty eyed and nostlagic about efdfin Hleb again???
Jeeez, he’s gone, was a frustrating mutha fucker, with great close control, had a blindin 6 month spell in 3 seasons…
Nasri? A fan-fuckin=tastic team player who is a lokkle dynamo…. Sure knock one over your dream boat Hleb, but dont do it while slating Nasri, FFS.
No offence!
Nasri is not starting XI material yet. Arshavin and Rosicky are better.
I wouldn’t mind getting rid of Theo if we get paid good money for a typical overhyped englishmen. His progress has been in a 2 year stall. He has learned nothing
Spain has Torres & Villa
France has Henry & Anelka
Germany has Klose & Podolski
Sweden has Ibrahimovic & Larsson
Holland has van Nistelrooy & Huntelaar
Italy has Toni & Acquafresca
Who do England have?
Rooney (like i said not a real out and out goalscorer)
Walcott (not there yet, maybe he’ll get there…)
Heskey (you gotta be kidding me)
Crouch (yeah right)
Agbonlahor (i have my doubts…)
Defoe (must i go on…)
disagree totally pat, he’s certainly starting X1 material, though not building the team round him material, and not as good as arshavin or rosicky, but still a very good player in his own right
Howz Theo doing?
Good evening grovers
thing is Pat that what worked with TH14 does not necessarily have to work with TW14 – apart from a few good runs ending in quality LOW crosses he had little effect…
should have played him on the left to develop his shooting rather than crossing, IMO…
A, I meant not starting XI material for us when everyone is fit.
Rooney 10 goals in 7 games????
Walcott is going backwards these days….
toni and aquafresca ray?! one who’s 32 and scored 16 international goals, whereas rooney doesn’t count despite scoring 24 goals at the age of 23?! and aquafresca who hasn’t yet made his debut?!
we’ve got one world class forward in rooney, and after that we don’t have much, a few players the level below, the likes of defoe and crouch.
Spain, Argentina and Brazil have massive strength in depth in terms of their forwards, they’re the only three countries who are that far ahead of us though, along with maybe France.
Özil is having fun today…
3-0
Loach has been pants, Joe Lewis should’ve been picked ahead of him.
It’s not how many goals you score, it’s who you score against and in which competition…
How many goals has Rooney scored in the World cup or European championships?
Portugal have no good forwards.
Dutch have great offensive players playing around Huntelaar, so thats just as good as having world class forwards.
Sweden would have made it better in this final…
Berg would have scored at least 2….lol
this keeper is absolutely shit…
where does he play, Spurs?
Something completely off topic, how many here cringe on seeing ‘could of’ etc. being used freely on the net by native speakers without it being considered wrong. Is it just me?
bottom line, England will never win any WC or EC for a long time…
Overall, I though Italy were the best team. They were really, really unlucky against the Germans, who they absolutely dominated. Hit the post twice, cleared of the line three times.
England are lucky they avoided Italy
Portugal play a 4-3-3.
Queresma–Ronaldo–Nani
They also have Hugo Almeida and Simão who are both pretty good imo.
4-0 BTW
4-0, this is getting ridiculous…
so what you’re saying Pat is that would they have met Italy it would have been worse than this…(4-0)…lol
At least till the Arsenal class graduates Ray.
He’s only really played in one properly Ray and he scored 4! 2006 world cup he was playing fucked, and we didn’t qualify for 2008! Compared to the likes of Toni he’s far better, it’s just that he’s world class so he’s able to play in other positions, but is still quality as an international forward. I do agree though we don’t have the equivalent of say pazzini in italy, who i’d compare to someone like kevin phillips.
We don’t have the non-world class but prolific domestically forwards we used to and other countries have, but Rooney is world class so we have one world class forward, Spain have 2 world class forwards, Italy currently none, France i’d say none because Henry is good but no longer world class, and Benzema isn’t world class just yet, Portugal have none, Germany have none, Brazil and Argentina have a fair few though
Walcott may as well have stayed at home growing his goatee.
He better not be paid more than 50k a week. He shouldn’t even be paid as much as Song.
I’m sick of waiting for Theo to improve. Song, Denilson both improved. Theo and Diaby, nothing. 1 more season. If he doesn’t improve, get rid of him.
Overall Sweden were the best team, Italy were lucky against Sweden when they won 2-1, England were lucky against Sweden…
Sweden was the only team that really wanted to play offensive football!
Yes Ray!hahahaha
Samir, thats why they can’t score to save their life and will probably not qualify?
Ray, Italy played the whole game with 10 men against Sweden, did they not?
I wouldn’t say ronaldo is world class at international level, in a utd team built round him he was, but he doesn’t have an amazing goalscoring record internationally. Nani is an embarrassment, and quaresma is just tricky with no end product
I blame Capello for not turning up by missing his flight… the silly bugger! What a tonking we have been given by the Germans tonight!! Not so clever now eh Pearce!
Hi! Mayank, spot on. I have noticed it as well, but decided to shut up, since my English still needs improving.
I watched Poland-Sweden before the group stages started. That was a very good game.
*needs to improve.LOL.
Pat theo improved alot this season, he was never going to be good in this shocking u21 team, because he makes clever runs, and there’s not a single player on the same wavelength or capable of picking him out. He got 8 goals this season, his movement and final ball have improved greatly, although obviously not the finished product yet he’s come on leaps and bounds. Diaby has gone backwards though
I can’t say you’re right about Rooney Pat, cause he’s a Man U player, and i wouldn’t mention a Man U player as a world class player on Le Grove, it’s not proper…
Siemanko (‘ssup), Maciek
Maciek, I’ve come to realise that’s its a British English phenomenon. I stayed shut on it ’cause i’m prone to spelling mistakes and didn’t want a ‘could of’ user on my back LOL.
Italy had Balotelli sent off after 30 minutes, (after he’d already scored their first goal)…
All i said was that Italy was lucky to hold on to their 2-0 lead…
sorry to admit it but i put a bet on Germany to win by at least 2 goals…(easy money)
Mayank, i too have noticed spelling annoyances but i too said nothing because….whats the point. People dont listen.
Ray it depends on who you call world class, somehow calling Ronaldo the best is okay but saying roy keane is right is not. For me its quite the opposite.
So….whats everyine talking about?
I think that Özil in Germany is a really creative player, good skills, great vision and if he starts to score more he will be world class!!!
Hello SUGA3. Jak się masz?How are You? Are You pleased with our transfer? Do You think that we do need another one, or more?Potrzebujemy jeszcze wzmocnień?
Ozil now has the task of replacing Diego at Bremen. Good luck with that.
Stu its like saying ‘I of two hands’ or ‘Arsenal of the best youth team’.
Walcott is defenatly a lot better for us than he is for ENG U21′s…….
Cheating swedes, though i liked the way the ref hid the red card from balotelli
Let me explain about Rooney…
He’s a Man United Player so i will never admit to him as being world class, (just cause of that)!
I am not a native English speaker, but these ‘could of’ and ‘should of’, etc. do make me cringe indeed
but whatever – there was an idea to introduce text message style spelling to schools, nothing comes as a surprise…
Yes Mayank but no matter what we say people just have a habit of it and we all know its hard to break a habit.
A, Balotelli looked like a brat there.
What you mean cheating, Balotelli made a late kick at the swede, of course he made it look worse than it was but we all know everybody does…
Mayank- it just shows us that Le grove is a really great place to learn not only about football.
Maybe its the non-native speakers(like me) who are most affected by it.
Everybody except arsenal players. Right Ray.
Maciek, I do believe that we have some serious reshuffling to do – still think that Diaby, Ade and Silvestre should be goners and some 3 further players brought in: Cana, Tasci and a striker (please, not Chamakh)…
Yeah balotelli is a complete idiot, loses his head all the time. No Ray not everybody does, cheats do, though there are far far too many cheats in football it doesn’t make it right and doesn’t mean that everyone is a cheat
at least Marcus Berg scored the most goals (7!!!)
A record of the U21 Tournaments of all time!
Guys. Is there any quality player in English squad(aside frrom Theo, Gibbs and Hart)?And yeas this question include the spuds players.LOL.
Ade, Diaby, Silvestre out.
Pogrebnyak/Janko/nobody, Denisov, Juhasz in.
That would probably be a surplus. More money in that out.
nah suga3, Cana and Tasci maybe, can’t be doing with another forward
Did the spuds even have anyone in the u21 squad? I dnt think so. HA!
Platini doesn’t look happy…lol (French & Germans, you know…)
I dont think Tasco would move now, especially with the WC coming up He needs first team football and we cant offer him enough of that.
SUGA3 don’t mean to butt in but i really think that if we buy too many new players we’l be building a team indefinitely. The players will take time to bed in casting us silverware next season which will cause at least one of our established stars leaving. I think if we just get a CM that’ll do. Even with Ade leaving i think we’re okay but i’d like a replacement.
yes SUGA. I feel the same. Cana, another cd( Zapata or Juhasz from Anderlecht, or another nig, strong, tall defender) and a winger. If Ade goes, then give more chances to Nick B. Eddie and RVP can score 20 plus goals each one.
*Tasci
i’m off to celebrate my betting win…Cheers Grovers!
Mayank 21.24. That ‘of for have’ is a pet hate of mine!
*costing of course…
So……..how long until the proper football starts again?
Im sick and tired of waiting to re4ad something, witty, or insightful or vaguely interesting… Thats it, one more year, then we get rid of Pat!
Joke!
Yes Stu. They do have Danny Rose.
Maciek, trust me, 90% of people here in London will not see the difference between your first post and your correction
15th july or did you mean PL… I don’t want to count THAT..
fair point, no striker purchase is required, unless it is Benzema – I know, I know
there was a debate here on who would be better Melo or Cana – still Cana for me, we need a nutter, Melo is just too mellow, lol…
I think the full England team have a fucking great chance next year, obviously that is of no consequence to most on here… But, I said it, nonetheless… Capello is a superb coach and has shown this with England already, IMO…
Stu, is Denisov defensive mided? Also, who is this Janko fella. Even I don’t know him. As for Juhasz-he is CLASS!
Mayank actually Sharkey. Maciek and I really shouldn’t blog together.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XFbObuOefFg
a little bit like this Vermaelen clip, but it should give you some idea of this Juhasz dude…
Thanks Sharkey. I have improved but still make some stupid mistakes. I know that You British people( especially English)care a lot about you language. Also I really love the cockney accent. Mine reminds me only the first four letters.LOL.
Maank it must be well past your bedtime.
You should of looked at the two posts Maciek made at 21.30 and 21.31.
If you’d of done that then you wouldn’t of earnt yourself a yellow.
Full apology in perfect Anglaise por favor..??
Maciank?? 4 letters…?? Que amigo….
People who teach you English, understand it and care about it, native speakers are never taught it, they just pick it up from whoever’s nearest.
Is it the same where you guys are…?
LOL. Mayank. I have noticed it too. I really think that our “stage names-LOL” don’t look very similar but I have been proved wrong.
Maciek, well as far as i know he is fairly defensive. He plays CM for Russia anyway so he must be decent at it.
Marc Janko – 25 years old. 6’5”, left footed. Striker for Red Bull Salzburg and was amazing last season. Click my name for a clip.
I thought its was about mine @ 21.48 and 21.51. I am a bit of a narcissist. And btw its way past my bedtime!
What the fuck is Wenger/Gazidis playing at???? OMG! WE are geting further behind, yet again!!! FFS! Blackburn have signed their THIRD player so far this close season….
Oh woe is us, woe is us…..
tu;
Is this Tasci fella any good then???
Oops! I mean Stu!
Maciek and Mayank.
People mix the names up because they both start with “Ma” and end in “k”.
ENot everyone pays close attention to the name. More of a clance and assume its one or the other.
This Germany U21 are not great when pressured high up the pitch so England should have played full press high up the pitch, Pearce is inept tactically. Also why are still relying on Charles Hughes’ coaching manual by always picking players with pace, power & height but no technique & intelligence.
Theo’s game just like Ljunberg’s game requires player with visison and exceptional technique next to him ala Bergkamp,Pires, Cesc, Rosicky & Hleb. There was one forward movement he made and the midfielder delayed the pass until the defender was close to him.
MG, hes ‘aight. Not seen much of him but anyone playing for the full german team at such a young age cant be half bad.
Sharkey. My mistake. Sorry, and didn’t want to make any sort of mess/disorder. I was talking abot the word cockney. And it’s first 4 letters. But it was a very bad joke.I didn’t want to be abusive, it’s not my style. I have always thought that English people really care about English language. They seem to love his language. I like British accent too.
Thanks Stu
Sharkey. Here in Poland( my native country) it’s the same case.
I think the English hate american english more than they love their language. But i could be wrong.
Thanks Stu. Denisov, Zhirkov and Akinfiejev, and Pogrebniak and we are sorted.
You guys learn the queens English, here very few people use it.
Try to read Small Island by Andrea Levy, that’ll explain/reveal a lot. Great book that.
I think it shoud be on the national curriculum here in the UK
Love the English language…god only knows what you guys make of post match interviews from English players.
Cesc’s are better and clearer than most native speakers
Maciek, Mayank, Stu et al ….thats me done for today.
Back tomorrow
true that, Sharkey – languages were taught at a pretty good level in my high school (native speakers, foreign exchanges, etc.)…
The good thing about English is actually the fact that it wholeheartedly adopts words from many languages to enhance itself. It was a rebellious when it began and is the peoples language now.
Well Sharkey. There are players like Richards, Beckham,Bentley etc, but for example look at Carrick,Schols, many English jurnalists. They seem to make many interesting and intelligent interviews. Just my humble opinion.
I’m off too.
I used to struggle to understand guys like Gerrard and Carragher
is it me or Gerrard sounds a bit more, ahem, ‘southern’ nowadays?
Night Sharkey!
I’ve just realized how many strikers ManCity have.
Jo, Sturridge, CHad Evans, Caicedo, Bojinov, Robinho, Vasell, Benjani, Santa Cruz, Bellamy.
Possibly Eto’o and Tevez on the way as well.
Yeah SUGA. I have noticed it as well.
Night Mayank!
I am just thinking whether it is him watering down his original scouse accent or me getting used to it, lol…
I’d say it’s him, but I’d like to hear native speaker’s opinion on this
Pat, this means they can play formidable 0-0-10, lol…
To be fair pat Hughes and Jo don’t get on so he’ll be off in the summer again, sturridge has signed for chelsea, evans isn’t good enough for the premiership at the moment, Vassel and Benjani are pretty pants, and caicedo could be good but he’s still pretty raw.
Still Robinho, Bojinov, Bellamy, Santa Cruz, along with Tevez if they sign him isn’t bad for a team outside the top 4! Etoo has said he wouldn’t go to City hasn’t he??
Etoo wants to leave on a free next year and pick up a transfer bonus just like Ballack and Flam did…
still, Barca could sell him to anyone like cattle if he holds out for too long…
I don’t think it has anything to do with money, Etoo is just saying he’s gonna stay because Barca want to sell him and he’s pissed off with them so doesn’t want to cooperate!
fair point, A, but I just don’t think he’d be sniffing at some extra £10-£15M or so or would he?
I dunno – if his decisions were financially motivated i’m sure he’d bite the hands off the City offer, which would gazzump anything he’d get in signing on fees next summer…. I’m on his side to an extent, Barca havn’t treated him well at all, they tried to get rid last summer, he stayed and was amazing, then they try and flog him immediately as soon as the season finishes
Franchise
a few years ago he did ethan in 2006
wenger was always 4-4-2 or bust. arsh out in fa cup was a political tactic not a game one
——————————————-
more like sheer stupidity if you ask me , but thats another topic …
yes he changed game tactics since 06 because of your mate ade !!!… he was deluded enough to think that having ade upfront in a 4-5-1 works ! just the same as most of you were deluded enough that he was a great player .
we had a great creative midfield that season who had enough skills and ball retention to make the system work ..
wenger has held onto the 4-5-1 out of desperation , hopefully i agree he now knows the system is useless and doesn’t play to our strengths .
it shows me he was waiting for ade to come good and when that didn’t surface he gave nik and even RVP brief stints in the position to see if
he still had that formation as an option ..
and answer is : – NO !
id prefer to see a 4 -1- 3- 2
with 5 defenders or 4 defenders and one sweeper/DM
and 5 attacking players with cesc in the ACM role
theo and nasri out wide .. and RVP – AA up front .
i suppose thats fine whilst everyone is fit , but this team needs experienced depth …
I dont mind more debt if we buy some quality players, the board is always goin to lie
the board are feathering their own nest’s ….
with a public companies money !
and unless your one of them you will never truly know where the money is being filtered ..
id prefer 1 owner , at least then you know there aren’t any split interests ..
but i can tell you highbury was not built for 120 mil … you couldnt build a warehouse for that price .. so more money came from somewhere !
THE MOST AMAZING THING is…..
, if geoff is correct that Ivan said we loaned 120 mil to fund the Highbury re-development , then why is the Highbury development ran under another company name ?
its like borrow from AFC’s coffer’s, to create
a totally separate business enterprise .
something smells like fish there, if you ask me ……..
and its not my fingers after a night out down walking street either !
ethan, I am convinced you are right – the board is feathering its own nest.
Who owns the highbury development corporation? Looks like the board is siphoning off money two ways :
1. Paying board members expenses – same way as Gillet/Hicks are charging their trips to England to Liverpool.
2. Loaning money to the Highbury redev corp where they get to do whatever they want without scrutiny from the supporters.
We should have never left Highbury.
1 thing’s for sure …
we know the board signed a lock down with krankie until mid 09 -a NO TAKE OVER lockdown , which is the same time the flats where supposed to be ready and sold off ..
co-incidence ???
this told me straight away that these 2 gigs aren’t ran totally separately as people have been saying on here !..
besides where could any of them tight ass plonkers get enough financial backing to do a venture of that size if not using Arsenal as collateral for the loan ..
they are using my old ground ! the ground i saw my 1st ever arsenal game in as a retirement fund .. these pricks sicken me that they have run this club into debt 1stly , i dont see the debt being any different to the debt that man U or the chev’s have .. the only difference is
they win things and get more prize money,fans and merchandise sold as a result of it ..
as as for the bigger sterile ground , who fucking cares really ? do any fans see the money of a raised revenue ??
id rather be winning trophies and still be in highbury personally..
but im sure you cant build condo’s on it and play football there too !
bassem
we both had the same thoughts at the same time
Don’t know if we could have continued to compete at Highbury without the additional matchday revenue.
But our manager still coaches the team like they were at Highbury and didn’t have the luxury of the wide Emirates pitch. That’s why we don’t we don’t know how to cross, that’s why Theo runs into dead ends and that’s why we will never buy a real Wenger will never buy a real winger.
this is the facts of the matter are…..
# this is a big club ..
# this club so clearly needs a quality injection
(and has for 4 years)
# it is bad management to ignore it …
You know at least leeds bought the players and failed .. at least you can give them credit for something ..
my point is the problem is so huge you cannot blame just wenger any longer …
ill tell you how it went down ..
wenger was told by the board to continue to do what he does best
(during the new stadium proj.)..
buy and sell at a profit ,situation normal .
but then the chev’s came in and changed the goal posts .. man U followed suit then so did POOL …
time has proven it was the right thing to do .
inject money into the club with a better class of player .. and we as a result have won fuck all ever since …
you can try and argue with me , but those are the facts.
but our board (who are the money men ! )
opted for option wenger instead of buying quality..
and you the fans now blame him because its his baby !
well he might be the parent , but im sure he would of preferred to have adopted a better class of player than he did . but that takes money .
so again for the hard of hearing wenger hasnt got the funds .. and he NEVER has been in charge of demanding his own transfer kitty ..
And they drummed Dein out the door because he saw the future and they were too hidebound to see it.
Dein wanted to sell out to Le Kroenke. Who do the board want as the majority shareholder now?
morning all
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/2507468/Andrey-is-Shavin-a-laugh.html
fuck me, that is some lazy journalism – a whole 5 lines of text, lol…
then again, not much shit stirring quotes flying around now that AA sacked Lachter, eh?
If Gazidas had a hair on his arse, he’s sue them, last week Arshavin said he wanted to end his career at Zenit, so if he wants to play for Barca next, how fucking old will he be.
It’s not lazy journalism, it’s bareface lying sue the cunts.
PDT
precisely .. Dein was a legend , he saw the next step that needed to be taken to remain competitive and they axed him for it …
then after throwing all there toys out of the crib realized it wasnt a bad thing after all !
dein is holding back for something thou !
he had chances at other clubs but didnt take them recently …
i hope day we will see him return ..
i still think he and the russian are waiting to strike ..
Geoff, technically speaking, his desire to finish his career at Zenit does not contradict this ‘statement’ – if he was to go to Barca anytime soon, he would still be able to finish back at home…
but this is what 50% rip-off tax does to the Prem: apparently, he is not happy earning less than agreed (mind you, he took a pay cut to come to us) it will be much harder – or 10% more expensive – to attract world class players to playing in the UK…
SUGA3 you don’t really believe they pay 50% tax do you? Any good lawyer would have that sorted, especially as he is an overseas resident.
I don’t believe a word of this Barca shit, he was probably asked if he would have enjoyed playing for Barca and he may have said yes, who wouldn’t.
At the end of the day, like Ade, Barca didn’t even bid for him.
4 goals at Anfield doesn’t make a summer!
sorry ethan u r so wrong the first ime we started shaping 451 was in the Champions League with Henry not Ade
lets face it , if your a footballer the pinical of moves would be barca – real – AC – Juve – Man U – money clubs like the chevs – man shitty ..
so if he was thinking out loud then it probably is correct ..
its like saying i currently drive an astin martin
(Arsenal ), im glad i sold the mini (zenit)
but id really prefer a Ferrari or Lamborghini
What’s wrong with driving an Aston Ethan? What are you calling me a poof?
fran
more like the last time it worked was TH14 in a 4-5-1 !!!!!!!!!!!!!
Geoff i dont know which way you swing
but i know id rather a Lamborghini Diablo VT 6.0
any day of the week
Ethan I quite like the new Ferrari, I think it called the Californian.
Morning all,
Geoff, totally agree, stupid article which is just a small paragraph of lies or his quotes when he was still at Zenit last summer and we weren’t even in for him.
ethan, Dein wanted to move to Wembley and have no personal stadium, how shit would that have been? Dein also cares only about Dein, or he wouldn’t have sold his shares, but sat on them and maybe went partner with Usmanov, while he was buying other shares. Also Usmanov and Dein are not together any more, so don’t hold your breath.
Commend Leeds for what they did and tried? It must be a joke, I would rather be in our position right now than in theirs. I don’t think you will find another Gonner on LG who will agree with you on that matter.
Geoff
if you watch top gear the ferrari FXX is the fastest lap trail to date ,
thats the new one i think ….
wheres my mate GG9 ?
heres some more walking street magic
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MngLJumKifM&feature=related
this place is in bangkok , SOI cowboy , the 1st gogo street to exist in thailand ..
you have to love the … nostalgia
Gnarley went on holiday!
Duke spot on mate, if Dein had cared about Arsenal he wouldn’t have sold his shares, the sharing Wembley with the spuds would have been shit as well.
If any of them had a brain they would never have re developed the North and South stands, they would have looked at re building them in stages to fit in 60,000, what a waste of money, building something and then tearing it down a few years later.
I sat down with a director of Arsenal once and implored him to build in Kings Cross, a 100,000 seater, and Camden offered them grants, wankers knew best eh?
New post!
duke
its better to try and fail , than not have a go .
so if you think every arsenal fan is in that mold then i think its you who is mistaken !
say what you like about dein , but since he has left this board of directors have become a fucking bunch spineless lying fairies !
Geoff
agreed on the lawyers reducing the amounts of tax paid, but still if you fiddle with it to reduce the 50% due it is still highly likely that it is going to be a tad more than when the same type of lawyers do their magic to reduce 25% or 40% due…
still, it is just disgusting shit stirring aimed to increase number of people visiting the site, IMO…
the ‘quote’ itself is not that clear – probably something in the mould of Cesc’s family supporting him in case of the move to Real…