Other than that it was a good night! Well all I can say is we didn’t lose and that has to be a bonus in the Ukraine. At least it was an away game and in fairness if we were going to lose, that would have been the one we expected.
We should have put the game out of reach by half time, we were very wasteful in front of goal and I am really getting fed up with Ade’s inability to understand the basic rule of offside, Ade you need to learn it and quickly.
The penalty award was a joke, Sagna was backed into, it was never a foul, that said, if you get into a tangle in the penalty area, you’re asking for trouble. Sagna, you need to learn from that, but I think you were the one that was fouled and you are a great right back so I for one forgive you.
I thought the substitution with Eboue was a strange one, because I didn’t see how that would win us the game but having said that Eboue reminded me of what a good full back he really is.
Song to me is an enigma, I really can’t see what Wenger or some of our own Grovers see in him, I watched him hard last night and if he wasn’t giving the ball away, he was clattering into someone, I really don’t rate him and although last night I offered to eat my hat if he played well, my hat is sitting here saliva free and quite safe.
I think the scuffed shot that Ade had was going past the keeper, but I’m glad that Gallas buried it, that of course set us up for a thrilling three minutes of injury time but the cheating Ukrainians and the ref who couldn’t count ensured that we were treated to a thrilling 29 seconds of heart pumping throw on. So thanks.
I’ll take a draw at this stage and I think the result will serve as a toe up the arse in Europe, much the same as the Fulham result was in the Premier league.
Cesc has got off to a slow start and playing alongside Song couldn’t have helped, let’s hope Rosicky, Diaby or Nasri hurry back soon, what is it with us and injuries? Are they that injured? And why is it always us and not the chavs , mancs or scousers that get mass injuries?
Have a nice day Grovers, we didn’t lose did we?
gold. again.
2nd
first
Morning people.
Yup, at least we didn’t lose. That’s the important thing.
Bring on Bolton!!
third then
im gutted thought I was first
I thought Song did ok in that role, but I still think one or two of our players need a “minder” out there. Theo took a right kicking and Cesc always gets kicked all over the shop as well.
We need someone who’s going to say kick our Theo and you’re in row Z…..
Franchise……….sorry mate..
QoS……..maybe Silvestre’s gonna be that guy….
We have to take outr chances. Nasri was missed last night.
Could we cope with a midfield three of fabreas, Rosicky and nasri in Europe?
Or does Diaby/ Song need to replace Rosicky.
6th, relatively poor match… should have done better riding on our form
Well, it all got a bit bitchy on here last night… what a shame.
How was the game? The radio chaps were a touch negative this morning? Apparently Song didn’t look great and Ade was wasteful (Like your report says)?
Does Djourou need to start?
Bolton will be pleased with the performance of Kiev, we need to play quicker to get past them, and take our chances.
i still think wenger gambled with the creative elements of the team rosicky has been injured since january, eduardo is out until xmas….. we should have added one more versatile midfield player that can make things happen. we really need luck with injuries if we are going to do well this season
vieira, petit, parlour, gilberto, edu, parlour, song……….spot the odd one out.
Franchise, I think Vela will play more now that there are no internationals.
hopefully diaby will be back….. and rosicky….
and i rate song highly…. and same for sendy… just that u dont expect anyone to perform at his best in his first start. give him a run of games and he will be great.
Now wenger i know is keen to rotate and avoid extreme tiredness…. but i feel the pecking order shud be fixed…. if he is not convinced enough that song can start… let him play in cc and fa. and when denilson is injured he will fit right in.
The way wenger is planning to rotate… it wont help.
Song’s a good player – we missed him when he went off. Our problem last night was more that Cesc couldn’t get going.
Just heard that cock Robson (stuart) on talk shite and he said that Wenger was wrong to maon at the ref and time keeping.
Should had won this match, but most gooners would settle for a draw
I think the title shoud say “We was robbed, Kiev cheated….and The ref can’t tell the time” to be pedantic.
Slightly disappointing result rather than a catastrophic – still it could have been a home draw…like the mankskummers.
well spotted mark c
We should stuff them at the Emirates!
Big Daver, I heard that bit of Talk shite – Robson said he didn’t know what Wenger was moaning about and that Wenger often complains to the ref without reason.
It’s a disgrace he should be a regular on ArseTV – he;s a closet Shammer.
The whole Toure and Gallas partnership really doesn’t seem to work does it? I’d start Gallas and Djourou personally but I think we might see Gallas and Silvestre shortly.
Can anyone tell me what was wrong with Cesc yesterday?I could not see him on the field. Thought he is still mad at Wenger not making any decent signing throughout the summer.
Last night & last saturday showed the reasons why many of us have been concerned through the summer.
Other than the goal, Gallas was bloody ordinary at best. Two prima donna strikers & no DCM & poor central defence that was more than lucky not to have been caught cold. RVP attitude bothers me.
We arent gonna see Ro’sicky’, Diaby or probably Eduardo for most of the season, let alone WTF is wrong with Silvestre.
So we’re have to carry on with what we have. Can this squad seriously see out the season & manage top 4 at worst ?
I have to disagree on Song. His passing could be better (i dont thinks its as bad asw you claim), but the fact is he vas very efficiant in closing down the opposition. The team completely fell apart defensively when Song was taken off the pitch, and it took us 15 mins to get the proper balance back. By that time Kiev looked so tired they really didnt look like beeing able to pose a threat even if they wanted to. Song may not be elegant, but we might just need one of his kind to balance the team (we didnt really look to composed defensively against blackburn either – Denilson beeing even more of a defensive midfielder than Cesc).
cesc has been very quiet from the start of the season… he’s missing that flamini type player who gave him so much freedom big time. i knew we should have brought another winger… if theo gets hurt we are royally fucked
Double – while I agree with most of what you say you’d better explain why a 4 nil away win (last Saturday) has caused you worry so much. Lack of signings, attitude problems and lack of quality are obvious flaws in our squad of course though.
boring boring Arsenal
but what the hec! it could be worse, we could be the spuds…
As I said earlier a point is better than nothing but we need to win the home games and the others will take points off each other.
Geoff,re injuries,excuse me if i have made the point before,but we are now in a state of the art stadium with every concievable up to date facility,yet our medical staff are kept busier than any other club i know.Obviously eduardo is the exception,as with his horrific injury it will be a blessing in disguise,but i feel because the squad is so short on quality one or two players are coming back into the side before they are fuuly fit.Arse.com tells us nothing,except so and so will be out for a week and 6 weeks later they say the same thing.
We are clutching at straws with song,djorou,eboue none of them are any good,denilson plays pretty football but isn’t really a match winner YET who can turn a game and RVP to me is not the player he was,but hopefully he will regain his form.cesc has looked below par the last 2 games for one reason or another and ade remains ade.not intending to be critical,but we haven’t got enough quality players to step in,and that might be our downfall.Nasri was meant to be out for a few days,2 weeks ago,lets hope he and silvestre both feature against bolon,a team low on confidence which we should bet.
it’s frustrating following us at the moment but after 2 good results we seemed last night as a team who hadn;t played together for very long.
The first decent side we have played and we come unstuck DM looked woeful as id the CB partnership but lets be honest these are a reaccurance of the problems we have had for a while.
its alright AW sitting there with his hands in the air but like it or not only he can do something about our soft centre.
Just looked at the replay of the penalty the kiev playing is trying to rip sagna’s shirt off in full view of the ref,but on the other hand robin was very lucky he didn;t get booked for his lunge,he is old trait of a short fuse reappeared.
Gallas is such a poor defender when he has to lead, charging forward and raising his hand, leaving a high line to get in behind,miss kicking the ball for the goal, not a leader, can’t stand him
if we can get to jan and be in the mix for the title then im hopfull wenger will do some business… if rosicky is still out then he’s gotta get another nasri in plus the DM we are dying for
To be fair, basing on our past Eastern European travel, the result is acceptable although not excelent. I thought the MOTM should go to Eboue. He play with a lot of verve and very involved in driving forward during his short spell. Strange….. only he was performong. Walcott tried his best, but was marked by two or three thugs. Hopefully referres take cognisance f Arsene rants and would be more protective of him this weekend. Gallas was poor…he was at fault in the run up to us conceding the dubious penalty. The Kiev striker should have participated in the Olympics diving contest…sure bet for gold.
sorry i meant a blessing in disguise that eduardo will return.
You can’t expect Song to play amazingly in his first start, Denilson took a few games to get going so Song would be the same. He did a hell of a lot better than Denilson did in his first start, thats for sure. He will be good.
Can’t understand why Wenger didn’t start with Vela on the left with Cesc and Denilson in the middle though….I coulda made about £80 last night if Arsenal won.
Wenger was completely right about the referees time-keeping, there was at least 2 more minutes to be played due to time-wasting….
I thought Song actually did pretty well, broke up lots of attacks even if it was with niggly fouls. Did no one notice how we went completely to pot at the back when he went off? Hate Arsenal fans who just habitually get on someones back without actually looking at their overall impact on the game. Also, do not worry about cesc, I am backing him to put in a MoM performance against Bolton at the weekend.
Gallas was shocking second half, no awareness at all of who was around him but to be honest the whole team panicked when we went behind- standard prodedure for us. Thought it was pretty stupid playing RVP on the left, he hates defending and cant do it for shit, we should have rested him for the weekend and played vela there in my opinion.
We’ve got wingers – it’s just that they are all injured! Rosicknote and Nasri play wide.
Bear in mind that last night we were probably missing a qtr of the first choice team, except for some less than clinical finishing we’d have romped that.
I for one was actually not unhappy with the options we had on the bench either, we had Bendtner to throw on for Plan B and we had Vela who gives defenders a hard time.
I also think he brought Eboue on for Sagna because Sagna got booked when the ref got conned on the penalty. Wenger had a “like for like” option without having to walk the yellow card tightrope.
I’m feeling positive, a bit of tweaking is required but we’re not far away.
matt… wenger has said that vela will play as a striker… although our lack of wingers will probably force him into playing him there a few times
Cesc didn’t have a (good) pre-season so I guess he still in pre-season mode.
Like I said before the match I’d be happy with a draw. The team was collectively average no individual stood out and Gallas’ performance exemplified the performance of the team – inconsistent i.e. misjudging a bounce this minute scoring the next.
It is pointless picking out an individual for praise or bashing, prior to the goal Theo didn’t do much to be honest. Needless to say, clinical finishes (Ade and Fab???) in the first half would have made life a lot easier.
We tend to perform as a collective, we either either collectively good as in Blackburn/Newcastle or collectively mediocre as in Fulham/Dynamo.
Good morning all
having injured wingers is the same as having no wingers, only more fustrating
AW needs to look at the squad and sort the wheat from the chaff personally I think
Diaby – will never make the level we need also injury prone.
Eboue – will only ever be cover for Sagna
Denilson – will never be good enough for our first team only c/cup side
Gallas – is too similar to Toure only not as solid
Song – has yet to find his position
i know that, but seeming as he has spent the last 3 years playing on the left wing don’t you think it would make sense to play him there instead of van persie and put vp up with ade?
afc53, if you watched the ACN you would know that song is best at DM, he just needs a run in the team
I thought Song did the job he was supposed to do pretty well. I counted one badly misplaced pass but I counted more from Fabregas.
Arsenal Tom you cant be really serious that you still believe everything wenger says. The list is endless lets not even go there. Just a comment not meant to offend you pls take it lightly
This was a perfect example of the fact that we have to introduce video technology to such high-profile games with so much at stake. We created a host of chances, enought to win the game. Kiev should NOT have had a penalty awarded, and if video technology was available, it would have taken the ref 30 seconds, if that, to view the incident and clearly see that it wasn’t a foul by Sagna. If that had been the case, then we would have walked away with a 1-0 win. And the extra-time added by the ref was pathetic….does anyone monitor the ref’s performance? He should be relegated to the Ukrain 2nd division games…if there is such a league??? And how did their left-back remain on the pitch? 90% of his tackles were a complete disgrace!!!
Anyway, moan over, it’s not a bad result really, showed good spirit to keep going and get the equaliser. We should be able to mount a strong challenge until December….and then Wenger needs to wake up and make atleast 2 new signings and get Rosicky and Diaby fit,asap!!! With regards to Eduardo, you can understand if he takes a little longer to come back.
We will destroy Bolton this week and Porto too!!!
Come on you Gunners!!!!!
Our biggest issue is we should never of let Flamini go Cesc & him could of dominated for years like Vieria & Petit would have!
Good morning all,
Geoff, nice post but I have to disagree with you on Song, he was far better than you give him credit for (IMO) As for the Pen, it was a Pen!! Granted the Kiev player had hold of Sagna’s shirt but Sagna had his arms around the Kiev player. Harsh pen maybe as some refs would not have given it but a Pen nether the less.
Some people got rather stupid on here last night and to be bitching about Wenger not spending 70M in the middle of the game was the wrong time and wrong place. I think some posters need to show some maturity (IMO). It was a shame that some got out of hand and resulted in name calling, really unnecassary. We could have and should have done better if Ade and Cesc had taken the clear cut chances presented to them as we were in control up to the Pen as Kiev were no real threat. Gallas, love him or hate him, did his job and as Captain kept us in the tie with his goal. We should have won but at the end of the day a tie in Kiev is acceptable.
Song was great at the ACN, but this is a different level. You can’t expect him to be great after 1 game, but there again, he doesn’t offer the same level of dynamism as Flamini, even though he can defend.
I’m personally happy with the draw. A win would have been nice, but it’s a bit of a graveyard for us.
Morning All,
I am surprised that Ade has escaped a serious slagging off this mornining. He was hopeless last night.
If we are to play a 4-5-1, there is a requirement for the CF to hold the ball, and provide an outlet for the pressing midfield. Ade did not do that. His control was dreadful, and he kept drifting wide.
Due to our and Kiev’s set-up there was no space in midfield, and if there is no-one to play the long ball to, we reduce an attacking option.
Great post. Disappointing game but not a disastrous result by any means. The only major positive was Theo – he was easily our MOTM and dealt superbly with being kicked all over the pitch. I didn’t think Cesc was bad, not at his best certainly, but he broke out some superb passes at times. Denilson was poor, with Song covering I expected him to provide far more creativity. The main worry for me though has to be Arsene’s continued persistence in the Toure/Gallas partnership. I’ve got to agree with Queen of Suburbia, all the signs seem to pointing to a future Gallas/Silvestre partnership. Silvestre said he came here to play, that Arsene see’s him as a CB, and that he’s looking forward to partnering Gallas, as they have done for France. I’m certainly not convinced that Silvestre is the answer, but it’s blindingly obvious that Gallas and Toure, for all their individual abilities, combine to form an ineffective, mismatched partnership with a complete lack of communication.
Hounddgog, I am pleased to see you here this morning. I feared the stupidity of a couple of children might put you off Le Grove.
Le Grove is rarely as annoying as it was for an hour last night !!
Morning guys i am just getting over some of the comments from last night it all got a bit touchy.Some people should try and get a sense of humour.My comment about Cesc and my wife was an old recycled JOKE.About the game i still find it strange that our back four who individually are all world class,still play like strangers
franchise i dont believe everything, but he doesnt usually lie about where players will play….. only that he’s gonna buy some good ones!!!!! lol
It must have been horrible last nite…pleased I missed it. long may today’s sanity continue
SONG PLAYED VERY WELL!!!!! Song had a 90% pass completion rate compared with Fabregas 76%. I know Fab may have tried more risky passes but Song’s job was to protect the back four. Almunia had one save to make (and the penalty of course), so Song did a good job. Unfortunately on these blogs (esp. this one and Arseblog) it is in fashion to criticise Eboue and Song, because earlier in thier careers they had a few bad games. But they are developing all the time and getting better ad better. Adams, Dixon, Bould etc all made mistakes too ad went on to become legends. LEes move on from the Song and Eboue bashing, please.
I’m another in the pro-Song camp. My gut feeling is that we’d have won the game if AW had used his substitutions wisely and earlier (before the Pen). Couldn’t disagree with David Platt’s comments after the game about the strength of our squad or the real value of the January transfer window to teams chasing the Premier or Champions Leagues – in that the quality players we should be getting will be very unlikely to move.
Hi Grovers,
I just want to apologise for what went on last night. It’s not often me and Geoff are not around to stop the kids ruining everyone’s night… it’s been sorted and the offenders will join the black list.
afc… my thoughts exactely!! flam is a huge loss… buy the fucker back in jan when milan are battling relelgation!!!
I agree that Flamini should have been kept around AFC53 but the notion that Diaby, Eboue, Denilson, Gallas and Song are not good enough and should be jettisoned is one I just can’t agree with.
Eboue has had an excellent start to the season,
Denilson except one poor game has scored once(I thought twice?) and assisted what 4 or five goals already,
Gallas is world class, prone to the occasional lapse but then name one centre back in the whole world who isn’t occasionally at fault for goals conceded. And he provides some important goals, last night being an example.
Diaby I fear for purely because I’m not convinced he’s been right since that horror tackle at Sunderland which frankly could have ended his career
and Song as I’ve said further up is an excellent player, with a better work rate he may well be the answer to our DM issues.
It annoys me when people say we need a clear-out just because we’ve drawn a game in Russia with a qtr of the side injured and others having played 4 games in two weeks.
There needs to be some perspective.
I have to disagree about our defence,
Firstly, prior to their goal, they only had one chance in 60 mins, and against any decent team, that shows a soild defence.
Secondly, wwhen we started to chase the equaliser and push forward, there was an inevitability that we would have gaps at the back, particularly when Toure goes on his runs and Song has been subbed. It left Gallas and Clichy alone at the back.
For me Gallas is a fine player. If we are to change our CB partnership, I would drop Kolo and play JB. BUt until we get stuffed, I would keep the guys we have.
I realise I am in the minority with this argument, but we look more solid than last year.
Paul, and it was a very good joke
Morning Big Raddy, Le Grove is a great site and Geoff dealt with the situation. In life there are always idiots that want to spoil something good. However, today is a new day and the adolecents are behind us! New question, are we ready for Bolton?
By the way I think that the Mancs are far more disappointed with their tie then we are with ours!!!
Morning Pedro, we all know it is not your or Geoff”s fault. No need for appologies, you guys do a great job so thanks for working so hard to make this site as good as it is.
Cheers Hounddog!
Well said QoS
And Paul, I thought your joke was very funny , and just proof of your commitment to The Arsenal
Houndog/Pedro nice one.I deal with far worse than that at work everyday
THE JOSE SONG
my name is Jose
I am the special one
no one can touch me
for I will beat thee
my name is Jose
I am the greatest
nobody like me
coz I win trophies
my name is Jose
I’m so so modest
I am a winner
I am the finest
[Chorus]
my name is Jose
I am the greatest
nobody like me
coz I win trophies
repeat 3 times…..
my name is Jose
no one can catch me
I am so clever
I am the special one
my name is Jose
no one before me
no peers beside me
they look up at me
my name is Jose
I’m off to Inter
they kneel before me
I am so Special
morning grovers,
lol what a game…….trrying to immerse my new canadian/maurtian girlfriend into the arsenal life by watching the game with me last night…should have bloody known better than to choose an eastern european fixture! we were no better or worse than when we always play there IT SEEMS. so at least we got the point.
bolton are gonna get it!!
Arsenal Tom – the only reason he went was AW nearly let him go to Birmingham then lets his contract run out he gets in the side & shows what he can do then he wants to keep him!! its no wonder he felt let down we all would he would have made a good captain I think
Pedro,
Is eltel08, the old El Tel? He told a fine joke last night
God you act like you know so much about football! But then say Cesc was playing alongside Song….Song was playing just in front of the back four, and rarely strayed forward, so are you saying Cesc was a second DM???, It was Denilson and Cesc together, Walcott on the Right and RvP on the left. Song did well IMO, for his first start in such a big game, where he was clearly told to cover the back line, which he did brilliantly, sure he clattered into a few people, but what did you expect him to do, give them a kiss?…Flamini used to clatter into people all game!!! Its what you want from a DM, not many players got past song the whole game, he kept his passes simple and didnt give much away.
Still it was a Cautious approach from Wenger and it reduced our attacking threat for long periods have 3 midfielders clustered in our half. Also would have like to see RvP and Walcott change flanks occassionally
saliva free and quite safe
LOL
Lets look positive we could have spent millions in the summer lost our two best strikers be eight points behind our main rivals and be bottom of the league
afc53, there can be no argument that losing Flam was a blow. But if we go back to the beginning of last season, who could have foretold Flam would become the player he did?
Had he gone to B’rum, I would have said fairplay, he is no better than Muamba, and AW obviously felt the same way.
That Flam felt rejected is inevitable. As was his transfer once AC offered a wage of over £100k a week. We were never going to match that.
It is easy in hindsight.
and what about everyones friend Eboue…. not sure why he came on but when he did PHEW some direct running, incisive passing, vision!
i woyuldnt expect anything less from our Pass-Master!
QOS I think all bar Gallas the others do not leave us much strength in depth
Denilson,Diaby & Song are only stop gaps because AW wont spend any money they would not be in any of the other top 4 sides, these are c/cup players
Eboue is only good for cover at RB & lets be honest he has improved this season only beacuse the last few hes been such a dissapointment
Frichie. First of all I do know a lot about football. Probably more than I know about anything else !!
Secondly, I agree that Song had a fine game. I hope he gets more opportunities in that position. If Nasri replaces Denilson, we have a much more balanced midfield.
Raddy if AW has to watch the purse strings so tight then why let young players run out of contract?
at best the start of last year he was a squad player but given the chance showed what he could do he was good in the champions league campaign the year before at LB
afc…again i agree mate… we showed no faith in him, he said if we’d offered him a new deal a year earlier he’d have signed no problem… he should have been given one after the CL final i think. and your spot on about a captain, the way he constantly shouted, clapped and spoke to players is another thing we’re missing big time, plus whenever one of our players was hacked he’d be staright over their in the offenders face
no argument from me afc53., but I repeat it is easy in hindsight.
Sure he showed what he could do at LB in the CL, but then refused to play there again! Not the kind of approach you want from a player in your squad. Listen to any other players…they happy to play anywhere and do what ever it takes to help the team.
well thankfully i wasnt involved in any bitchy girls stuff last night , i was sucking in the Zzzzz’s , stupid twat i am , i fell asleep !
anyhow got the game on Hard drive now and will assess how poor it truely is ! geoff – pedro ! you think Kiev is the toughest draw we get out of the 6 qualifying games ?? i beg to differ , i thought we should bury 4th draw seeds at home or away ! I haven’t seen the game yet and i do know they were probably the toughest 4th seed in the draw but still ! our squad was full strength . eboue came in !
so Le boss could of started him … only nasri out ..
No excuses , other than ade
well im off to watch the game , i hope i dont fall asleep again !
My point about matching AC’s wage offer …… if we do that then we set a dangerous precedent.
It is my understanding that if say Flam gets offered £110k a week, then Cesc’s agent will say WTF, as will Gallas’s,Toure’s and the other senoior players. They will want more money, or they will walk. Who wouldn’t?
I don’t understand you comment about strength in depth afc53….
Each of those players are at the start of their careers perhaps not yet their peak but with the exception of Denilson (who is playing his way into the first team) they are not likely to be first choice starters barring injuries. But when they come in, they demonstrate their talent and do fine.
To me that sounds like the very definition of strength in depth!
did he refuse? or did he say he’d prefere to play CM? we dont really knwo the truth, im pretty sure last year he dropped in at RB at times, its stupid that our ‘wage structure’ meant he wouldnt get extra cash, so instead we go and try and spend 10-12 mil on alonso and we’d have probably paid him 50k a week… which is more money down the drain
Frichie – yet we have Gallas as CAPTAIN who threatened to score own goals at chelsea & throws a strop at Birmingham
there would have been a long line of past & present Arsenal players ready to linch him for that
Excellent post Pedro.
Quite agree.
Except I blame any lampe of concentration and drop in performance to the incredibly disturbing and annoying female stadium announcer, who would just not shut up. I mean, was she re citing the bible, or asking everyone in the stadium to move their cars by naming each one individually.
Seriously, I think that it really disturbed the athmosphere in the stadium and definetly did not help the flow of the game. Or, perhaps it just bothered me.
Well, at least that was the last time we play in the Ukraine until next season, when we will inevitably draw Dynamo (or Rotor, or Lokomotiv or some other heavy industry machinery titled football club) and again play in Siberian conditions in Kiev (or some other Post Communist hell hole) again.
But hey a CL point away from home is rarely a catastrophy.
Gus.
Fair play Raddy but isnt that what we have done with Ade opening the floodgates?
I’m with you on this.
It is like the the Numpty who slagged off Nik B last night. We have a very young squad, they take time to develop, but some take more time than others. And all need first team action to achieve their potential
……….. like Flamini afc53
Ade (rightly or wrongly) was probably due a pay rise anyhow and I don’t think he got as much as Flamini was offered at Milan.
Hello fellow Grovers, I have to admit that I missed yesterdays game. But from the game reviews and the post this morning it seems that we could have been punished in a game that we should have won by 3or4 goals. I have seen this happen before and AW was complaining last season about us not killing games off. I just hope as was mentioned in the post it serves as a wake up call to the team.
Re ADE: He will always be caught offside, there is no point in getting all worked up about it. Believe I used to do that all last season, but its just the way he plays. I personally cannot understand why AW doesnt speak to him about it. Then again he doesnt seem to speak to THE PASSMASTER about cheating and diving.
Last comment a reply to QoS
Sorry Guys, getting in late on this debate.
Ethan, I am going to go along with Kiev being the toughest team. The other two will come to play… we like all that.
AFC, Ade is worth £80k in world football terms… he scores goals and he was offered similar cash elsewhere. Cashley Cunt wasn’t worth £80k, he was a left back and Arsene knew he has Clichy in reserve. Flamini was always going to Milan, he was treated badly by Arsenal and probably offered a huge signing on fee at Milan… a once in a lifetime op for someone who had a bit of Corsican in him… who can blame him?
Raddy, I don’t understand why people slag of Nikki B? He scores goals, he creates and he is very much a team player… oh, and he is only 20 years old!
Careful what you say about the PassMaster IA. He has vastly improved his attitude in the past 6 months, and he really did make a difference last night. A fine cameo appearance.
And it was a pen at Ewood……….
fenerbache away will be another toughy… a draw there wouldnt be bad either
Exactly. right Pedro, it amazes me that for several seasons now, any problems we have are pinned on the youngest players in the squad.
Yet in reality its the experienced ones who are always injured (Rosicky, Henry before him) or the experienced ones who aren’t performing at their highest level – I’m looking at you Gallas and Toure.
10 points will win this group. 3 home wins, and we top the group.
The others will struggle in Kiev.
Raddy – I agrre with you, Song, albeit a bit slow sometimes, stiffled anything coming through the middle, he even had the cheek to break any attack with a naughty but not nasty tackle – they didnt score from any ope play which shows that the defence did pretty well – and as you say, we went all out for a goal which in turn left us a bit open, as it would any other team (imho)
Where we went wrong is not taking our chances, if we had, the game would have been won by half time
We’ll finish on 14.
1 at Kiev
1 at Fener
3 home wins and a win away at Porto.
Do you think Cesc needs a rest from fotball ?
He has been lack-lustre so far this season
Raddy, he is due and injury… I just hope it’s not like the Pires one after he was overplayed…
ethangunner:
How did you manage to download the game mate?
And – they should have been down to 10 – AW is right, they tried to hurt Theo, many times and at least on e was a straight red card….. But none of us can change that, its a good point away from home – and i think we will top the group, and Kiev 2nd – they could cause a few teams a problem….
In the injury department I mean!
Raddy – QOS my opinions are from the frustration we have shown in the transfer market 3 years is a long time to wait for silverware and why everyone around you evolves we have stood still in my opinion the squad we have now is not as strong as the other top 4.
while we have some good youngsters Denilson in particular can we wait another 3 years for him to mature & maybe become the player he has the potential to be??
3 years down the line if we have another 3 years minus any silverware will Cesc be there to spearhead the new Arsenal???? personally I dont think so he has ambition and I cannot condone him for that is this matched though by the board & manager
I don’t see the two things as mutually exclusive though.
Provided our more experienced players also play at a high level and stay reletively injury free, we won’t need to wait 3 years for trophies and we can still develop our young talents at the same time.
There is only one position on the park that I am unsure that we have the right mix of squad quality and that is the Central Midfield role that Flamini plays in. But so far Denilson has done well there.
Big Raddy- I am just stating facts about the Passmaster, it doesnt mean I dont like him. In fact I was betting on him to score in the weekend and I know all he needs is that first goal. I think he is the clown of our team but that doesnt have to be a bad thing.
cesc just needs to get match fit and used to who he’s got next to him… he probably a bit wary going forward cos he’s not sure like he was with flamini there
I am going to stay positve, we had our kick up the bum early against Fulham – and I agree a couple of players are not at their peak yet, Bac and Cesc – however, last season we started at a mega pace and faded away, maybe this season, it will happen the other way around – Ade and RvP HAVE to start putting away their chances, otherwise it is time to give Nik and Vela a run, or at least one of them – even Simpson would have buried one or two of those last night
I’m just kidding IA….. but I agree all teams need a jester. The Sperms have about 30 of them !
Homer or Bart , Rico?
Good Morning Pedro and all.Can I give my opinion without a riot
I watched kiev vs arsenal, we should have been 2-0 up at half time with sitters for cesc and rvp, we slept the opening half of the second half until they dived and got the penalty, it was like a kick to the teeth. Adebayor needs to step up, or he will be taken over by other young strikers like Bendtner or even Vela. Eduardo will certainly get his place back with RVP playing slightly off him. IMO, Eduardo is as talented as David villa, he’s a fox in the box with good all round skill. I digress, back the game, I felt Gallas made up with that goal for his glaring errors, some of which were unpunished by poor kiev forward. Also, I think Walcott is coming of age. He needs to improve a lot more to justify the place. I’m still waiting to see our starting line-up with everyone fit. I assume the formation should either be 4-1-3-2
————–Almunia
Sagna—Toure—Gallas–clichy
—————Song/Diaby/Denilson—————
Rosicky/walcott/Eboue–Cesc/Denilson–Nasri/walcott/Rosicky
———RVP/Vela—Eduardo/Adebayor/Bendtner
or 4-2-3-1
————–Almunia
Sagna—Toure—Gallas–clichy
——–Song—–Diaby/Denilson—
-RVP/theo/Eboue—Cesc/Rosicky——-Nasri/Vela——
———–Eduardo/Adebayor/Bendtner
Song should always play, he will give defensive shield, and we need to build our backbone with him, it should always be Song-Cesc as DM-AM down the middle. Or, we need to play 2 CM like Diaby and denilson together. Cesc-Denilson is too light weight, and too attack minded. Kiev game, he only made one bad pass all game, and that is all.
As and when Rosicky returns, play him in any of the midfield positions, save DM. He might be a sicknote pain-in-the-ass, but he is quality.
Also, I’m not sure of Bendtner’s improvement if Adebayor is in here, because he is looking so rusty every time he comes on. Strikers like bendtner lack pace, and hence would be a lot more effective if they could be given at least 30 mts to measure the space, and pace of the opposition back line. That way, they can clock their speed, and timing of their runs to optimal levels. Hence, it’s going to be difficult to big Nik. He’s obviously talented, but he’s considerably inconsistent. This is only a thing of his age, he will be a great striker in future if he gets his temperament right. I’d loan him out to a mid-table team when Eduardo returns. I believe either Adebayor or Bendtner will be sold out next summer.
Also wish to see more of Jack Wilshere, he’s going to stun a lot of people when he breaks into the first team. One of the best 16 year olds I’ve ever seen.
In all fairness, I’m optimistic as every other football fan. I’m glad we stick to our principles, and our style of bringing players to our system. Though it would not bring us quick glory, it’s much more honourable than using a cash machine to steal 30million pounds ready made goods, from Robinho to Berbatov or what have you? Go Arsenal!
Last night, RVP should have proved to Arsene how bad a choice he is at left midfield. Play himat right.
And we better get adjusted to Song as DM, that’s the way forward for defensive stability. Cesc will adapt, and so would denilson/diaby.
If you tell us the Spuds are a top 4 team… I can’t promise anything Kelsey!
If you have an opinion about the club, rest assured, the kids from last night are gone.
Oh by the way, Am I turning into rose tinted AKB? I hope not. I think Wenger made lot of errors as aforementioned: RVP at left, and also, poor subbing. Bendtner needs time. OF course, he scored against spurs and villa in the death, but that happens once every 10 times. Also, Vela needs to play a game ASAP.
ade is our 1st choice striker, if eddie plays it will be with him rather than instead of him for the most part. theres no pace with eddie, rvp or nik b
Song is more of a Gilberto/Makalele type of DM than a Mascherano/Flamini/Gattuso type.
But i’ve said this before, I’m not totally convinced that you need an out and out DM when you have the ball as much as we do, provided your MIdfield is effective at screening the defense.
Neither Vieira nor Petit were the Gilberto or Flamini type and they were effective enough.
our team has evolved since then tho QoS, we play fast moving football and need someone who fits with that, we need a DM with plenty of energy, i like song and hope he gets a run starting at bolton… he’s a pretty big lad and that game should suit him to a tee
Football has trends – Tom, when people keep saying that we need a DM they talk about either of those types of players i mentioned above.
My point is that isn’t the only way. And Denilson/Cesc was dismissed as too lightweight…which I don’t agree with. I seem to recall the two of them taking Chelsea’s Millionaires apart in the Carling Cup final a couple of seasons ago.
Qos, we don’t need a Song type if we keep 100% possession. I’m convinced we need Song after newcastle, and blackburn games (fulham is one-off IMO, and the whole team were shaky defensively until song came on). Against newcastle, Eboue’s godawful pass got intercepted by Jonas gutierez, and he easily shrugged off cesc, (denilson was not in our half ffs), and he once again exploited clichy’s left channel (As with most teams incl. kiev last night), and crossed the ball through clichy’s legs to owen, who would have scored if not for terrific block by their own ameobi. Cesc-Denilson were again extremely poor defensively against blackburn. Remember emerton down the left with a cross down the middle for the midfielder run, who was inches away from tap in? Yet again left free by Cesc-denilson, and in other chance, santa cruz made a late run from midfield. Denilson and Cesc weren’t even in the picture with some of the blackburn midfielders in our box! Against blackburn, We were lucky defensively. Song’s inclusion into our system will be difficult for attacking, but we better sort defensively as it’s not easy to outscore your opponent.
Yet we won both those games handily…
Song and Eboue are now maturing and will be great players for Arsenal. Why do we keep bashing them everytime….
I watched Man U fans yesterday when Ronaldo got to the ptch and everyone was applauding him….even after bitching around with Real Madrid in the summer.
EVERY TIME ITS EBOUE THIS , ADEBAYOR THAT AND SONG …IS IT BECAUSE THEY ARE AFRICANS AND SOME FANS BEING RACIST believe us Africans can not deliver……
WE SHOULD STOP THIS NEGATIVE BLOGGING ABOUT OUR PLAYERS…..ANYTIME ANYWHERE..WE ARE A TEAM(as FANS) AND WE ARE ARSENAL!!!!
Have you read Kanu’s comments on how Wenger mentored him and the appreciation he still has for Arsenal.
Morning all, a last word on last night, when I read their comments, I gave them one last chance, they didn’t take it so I slung them off, done deal.
They came back and starting bleating about forums annd free speech etc, but they won’t be back.
If someone has to be blamed, blame Pedro, I was drinking.
It seems most of you don’t agree with my opinion of Song, well I’m right and you are all wrong.
Bolton next up and I can’t wait!
Kenyan, don’t be boring. The race card is so weak.
It’s because Song, Eboue and Adebayor are perceived to be the least gifted/infuriating in the team.
It wouldn’t matter if they were English, Spanish or Chinese… if they’re not up to perceived level Arsenal fans expect, they will be criticised.
Arsenalkenya you are way out of line are you actualy calling us racists?
Kenya you wouldn’t be sticking up for Song, Eboue and Ade because they’re from Africa by any chance would you?
Song isn’t good enough, Eboue rolls around too much and Ade is always offside, not to mention he’s a greedy bastard.
Knocking players is all part of the fun, it’s what we call banter!
Qos,
Once again, it was more of a three ma midfield with diaby playing in the left center midfield. It was Diaby-Denilson-Cesc as a triad which worked. I’m convinced that Denilson is fast improving to a good player, but along with Cesc, their positional awareness and their tracking back isn’t always of the highest quality, IT will be punished in the highest level. Perhaps, a misconception of this would be the word ‘light weight’, but you get the drift. And by the way, Petit was very much like Edu, defensively positioned, and not involved in setting the tempo to attack at different stages of the game, which I believe a certain player named Vieira mastered.
HAHA HA HA ……
I HEARD YOU ALL…BUT WE SHOULD GIVE THEM A CHANCE TO MATURE AND THEY WILL BE STARS!
AMEN…..
I don’t think there is any anti-african bias on here Kenya….
I find one or two folk overly negative sometimes, for example picking invidual incidents in a game we won four-nil to suggest that we need to ditch certain players but I assign that to that fact we all have different opinions on how we should be developing the side, which is fair enough diversity is the spice of life and all that.
Kenyan is overreacting. As we’ve seen today, Qos rates Song, I do, Geoff doesn’t. As for racism, a certain blogger has a section in his podcasts mocking eboue. Speaking of who, I’ m slowly feeling secured with the ball on his feet. As for TT, I hate him. But he’s a decent enough player who is improving on other areas like first touch and control, and but can’t learn the offside rule to save his life. Interestingly enough, his control and finish from offside positions is sublime, and superb, only to be ruled out by the ref. Haha..I’d rate him a bit less than Pedro, but far more than Ethan does. As you see, we all have our opinions, and no one at grove is going to slag you off for expressing it.
Raddy – Always Bart
Bolton – at home next, start with Vela and RvP…… That would shock em,
Ade, Eboue, couldnt give a stuff if they were from Mars (
) They are still pretty pants at the moment!!
Gooner07, there is no doubt that I am an Adebayor fan boy…!
I don’t like him as a person though…
I think we will see how the squad rotation works this season. There is little doubt that we ran out of steam last year, so with Song, Denilson etc improving, we will be relying less on a fixed starting 11. Our CC team of 2 years ago are now pushing for !st team places, and we have more options.
I would always play Song against midfield cloggers, but probably not against teams with real pace.
It is horses for courses
rico my sweet we are away at Bolton
kelsey – blimey riley, silly me…..
Raddy, whats happening, I agree with you again, Song will be just the ticket for the ‘ lets just play 11 in the midfield and stop em’ games, but those teams who play football, we need to be positive and very attacking to keep the oppo in their own half
Pedro,
I know. By the way, I’m slowly becoming an Eboue fan.
Big Raddy,
Song will be tested by Gerrard/Lampard, and I think he will be best measured with his performance in big games. I believe he is good enough to play DM for us. I’m convinced because he looks composed, and calm winning the ball from brazilian worldclass forwards/midfielders, and quality midfielders in both the competitions (olympics and ANC) I’ve seen him play. I’m sure Arsene knows that. Song will soon win over the critics. If song is injured, with diaby injured, we don’t have decent CDM choices to play in a 3-man midfield.
Morning Grovers,
I think its safe to say we wont be seeing RVP on the left anymore, wouldnt you all agree? He seemed upset playing there. Didn’t Hleb hate playing there too? I also got a strong feeling JD will start against Bolton instead of Kolo to deal with that prick Kevin Davies. JD is a must for me. I dont think its a coincidence that we have looked most comfortable so far this year when he’s in there. Also, Sammy Nasri, for all his flair and attacking ability, he also does a disciplined job in helping Gael out (something RVP couldnt do cos he simply aint a midfielder). The same goes for Theo on the other side. He puts the shitters up everyone when he’s going forward but lacks that defensive side to his game thats why Bac keeps getting exposed.
My name is Pedro… and I’m an Eboue fan… there, I’ve said it to?
It’s like an AA meeting!
Eboue is the same as Ade for me, I don’t like him as a character… but as a footballer, he is improving.
i with pedro on ade… hes a good player and without him we’d have allot less options
Well we all appear to have our own opinions as to who is good who is pants and who has potential My view if wenger is building a team for the future i.e. two years on,nothing dramatic is going to change,he will then retire or go upstairs or most probably take the job already offered to him as president of PSG,having believed he has a team capable to compete with anyone and basically leaving it on the plate for the next manager.As for now,we can only play with the players available and therefore eduardo and rosicky are out of the current debate.Add to that diaby and rvp are injury prone.I see a call for wilshere,yes a fine talent in the making,but do you honestly think he will see much first team action now.Vela will make cameo appearances as walcott did(and remember last xmas wenger was thinking of loaning him out.)Arsene scrooge wenger will never splash the cash and to try and compete in 4 competitions is not plausible.He has already stated that the two cups are not important to HIM.League wise we have started ok our european away record has never been good,2 wins from 9,so one could say a draw was a fair result.my opinion is that we are woefully understrength if we are looking at the present,and just one or two experienced quality players would have boosted us tremendously.I don’t think wenger knows his best team,but camaflages it by saying he like his players to play in different positions.time will tell,48 hours to recover before the bolton game,who are not the team of old and let’s hope the boys are motivated and not too jet lagged.
I say bring back sol cambell
I thought Song had good positional play last night.
He made loads of fouls, but did not pick up a yellow ala Makelele.
He is not the problem, Fabregas was off sorts last night, so our sharp passing was not in play.
He needs to learn to play with Denilson, Song etc, he is used to Gilberto and Flamini.
Adebayor had a shocker, but I doubt he will be dropped for Bolton.
We could go with a big team, include bendtner for Van Persie, Djourou for Toure and keep Song in there.
We would have 4 beasts of players, all over 6 foot 2, and should not be out muscled.
Pedro, completely agree with the view on Flamini but I am a bit confused over the Corsican reference. What am I missing?
kelsey
our european away record has never been good,2 wins from 9
wheres that stat from?
BARCELONA star Yaya Toure has revealed he turned down a switch to Arsenal in the summer.
The Ivory Coast international — brother of Gunners star Kolo — was earmarked by Arsene Wenger to fill the void left by Mathieu Flamini.
But when the Arsenal boss contacted the midfield powerhouse, Toure told him he was not ready to leave the Nou Camp after just one season in Spain.
He said: “Wenger, as well as my brother, told me to join Arsenal during the summer but I answered them that I was happy at Barcelona.”
Toure was a regular feature under Frank Rijkaard last season but new Barca boss Josep Guardiola has preferred Sevdou Keita so far this term.
That has led to renewed speculation Wenger could make a second bid for Toure in the January transfer window but the African is ready to bide his time.
Toure added: “We cannot play with 12. I am very good physically but we must respect the decisions of the coach.
“I am a professional and, if I do not play, what I must do is help the team. I will be patient.
“Competition is good. We have two players of great quality and this position is key to the best team in the world.”
London, his mum is Corsican.
Arsenal Tom,that was quoted during the commentary last night,meaning our last 11 european games.
Song just needs more mobility and needs to stop the ball-watching at times. Once or twice last night he let one of theirs just drift in behind him and they played classic Arsenal football around him, Denny and Cesc. Hopefully with a run of games he will improve on these things. I have faith in him. I hate when we fuck up but i always remind myself of the ages of some squad members to prevent any blood vessels from popping. People like Billy G, Kolo, Ade, Eboue, Sagna, RVP, Almunia, Rosicky and now Silvestre are the experienced heads in the team, so we can give them flak and it wont be unjust. They should know whats expected of them and schoolboy errors/misses is something the younger guys have to make, not them. Thats why me, personally, i have more time/patience for the younger lads. AW put it all into perspective with what he said after Theo’s hattrick for England. He stated that Theo is only 19. We bought Titi when he was 22. Imagine what people like Theo are capable of? Song will never be an Essien or a Paddy but he may well develop into one of the most fearsome DM in the world with the right guidance. If Denilson can keep his place, his fitness and his form, he may well make the Brazilian squad for the WC. He will be 22 at the time. Now just getting in that squad is an achievement on its own considering people like Senna, Mehmet Aurelio, our very own Eddy Goals, DECO and a few other great ballers had to change nationality in order to play at international level. I get really annoyed with Nikki sometimes too but i cut him some slack cos he’s a baby still at 20. Maybe because he’s a big lump we forget that easily.
The point i’m trying to make is that we have never put out such a young side so we can expect to see silly errors by the younger lads. It will only be a problem if they are still making those same errors when they are in their mid 20′s. Billy G, being the captain, and oldest member of the entire squad now that Bert has gone is the last person you wanna see making silly errors. When he bundled in that goal last night, i just threw both arms in the air, and screamed “yes, you owed us that Billy”!